DD wants to cut ties-Says her childhood was toxic

[SadandStressed3]

This is long, so my apologies.
I’m in a horrible, stressful situation with my 19yr old daughter. Basically, she feels that she had a very unhappy childhood and now doesn’t want to have a relationship with us (apart from us continuing to support her at university and keep her during holidays from university 🙄) She does not keep in touch whilst away and when home, spends the entire time in her room. I’m just going to give a brief overview so as not to drip feed.

She is the eldest of 3 with a 5yr gap and essentially says she feels like we ruined her life by having the younger two. Apparently this meant no time for her and less holidays. She said she had to listen to us saying we couldn’t do stuff because of money but yet we chose to have the younger kids. She said it was toxic due to arguments and stress. There was an awful 2yrs after the youngest was born where I had hideous PND but still had to try and cope as we have zero extended family and DH was working away through the week. There’s 18mths between the younger 2 so DD would have been 7-9yrs during this time.
When she was Y5 we put her in for grammar entrance (she’s exceptionally able academically) She passed and went to an all girls grammar. She hated it and we let her move to the comprehensive for Y8. She hated that too but still came out with 4 top A’levels.
There has been lots of teen drama and she was under CAMHS for a year. This was counselling and I was called in for the last 10mins of each session to be told how awful I always made her feel. How she was belittled and unloved and how the younger two were treated more favourably and how I gaslit her. She complains that the younger two have more relaxed rules on bedtime and internet use (probably marginally true but not by a significant amount) She’s also very angry that family holidays can now be more teen focused whereas when she was their age, we had to accommodate younger kids. To me this is all just what happens when you’re the eldest. Every year, I’ve made sure her and I had a weekend away just us. I’ve also taken her shopping for clothes and when she was 14, we completely redid her bedroom allowing her to choose and putting in a make up desk etc. If anything, she’s probably been over indulged a little.

It breaks my heart that she refuses all contact when away and lives by this narrative of having had a toxic childhood. I work in child safeguarding and thus deal with kids daily who really have experienced toxic situations and it frustrates me and upsets me so much to hear DD say such things. Half of me wants to support her and acknowledge, as I have tried to, that there was a very difficult period when her siblings were young and the other half wants to tell her to stop wallowing in self indulgent MC bullshit. Obviously the latter isn’t ideal and I do push that away. As things stand, she’ll finish next year and we’ll never hear from her again and I’m desperate to sort this out beforehand. Well done if you’ve got this far. Any advice is very welcome.

Seems like a pretty mean thread on a sad situation.

OP I'm glad you've left the thread behind for now, I read the first few pages and was shocked at some of the posts. MN used to be so supportive but sadly that is increasingly a thing of the past.

I filtered to see your replies only and can see you felt you had to reply to people and justify yourself and how upset that made you.

You have made way more effort with your daughter than I made with my eldest. My youngest was a nightmare when younger and took up most of my time and attention. I suffered PND after him plus me and DH lost our jobs and I was incredibly stressed and struggled to cope. I continue to feel guilty about the impact this will have had on my children. Eldest used to get very angry with youngest for being difficult and he found it frustrating that he would spoil family holidays with tantrums etc. But now youngest has grown out of that, eldest is fine and it's all water under the bridge. He occasionally made comments that youngest has had more privileges eg devices given earlier, more relaxed on rules, things being unfair, but I've always just made a joke of this 'we practiced on you first' type thing and there are no hard feelings.

For whatever reason, ASD or just personality, your daughter has had a different response to my eldest DC, despite everything you've done to maintain that connection with her. Those weekends away, 1:1 activities, making an effort with her room etc - I didn't ever manage any of that. I just got lucky with my DC's personality and response.

You should feel proud of everything you've done to support your daughter through her difficulties and reach out to her where she is. I'm sorry that I don't have any practical solutions to your situation; my heart aches for you as I feel you've been very unlucky here. I hope she softens as she grows older and understands better.

Some of the replies on here are so shocking to me. You can’t accept or validate nasty behaviour from anybody - I don’t care if it’s your mum, your friend, your sibling, or your child. And that’s exactly what it is - begrudging the lives of your brothers and emotionally battering your mother is nasty. The daughter must learn that just because your feelings are hurt, you are not justified to act and speak however you want in normal society. Imagine if we did - society wouldn’t function.

I hear my step daughter and her friends gob off regularly about their parents. Would love to know where they get their ideas from because they are SO off the mark. The younger generation from this admittedly very small subset seems to totally lack respect, empathy and kindness, for their parents and for each other. Terrifying.

So sorry you have some lunatic comments on here OP. Remember that you are a whole person, not just a mother, and you deserve a basic level of kindness and respect that we all do. Sending you love and thoughts because I imagine your poor heart is broken after the years of sacrifice that being a mother entails.

if you want practical advice…we told our step daughter to leave and live with her mother when she was 15 because we don’t tolerate vile behaviour. It isn’t much to ask to be treated with the same respect that you give. Young people appear to feel owed so much these days and do absolutely nothing for it. We have been a much happier and calmer household for it and it was the best thing for our younger children (although her poor mother is at her wits end)

@Scattery
That's a really thoughtful post. The DD is unhappy and looking to find meaning and reason for how she feels. Sometimes it's no-ones fault.

You don't validate behaviour, you validate feelings. According to OP, her daughter feels belittled, unloved and gaslit. It's possible to make someone feel heard and understood without agreeing to everything they're saying and you certainly don't need to condone their behaviour to do it.

Have you thought about hypnotherapy for your daughter it can be very relaxing and teaches you how to relax and put your troubles in a box and put it away. I took my daughter's to a hypnotherapist and he was great with them and even gave them exercises after. Good luck

Rtft

This has all clearly got a bit lively. My few thoughts for what it’s worth: none of your kids will have had the same parents or the same childhood, OP. That’s just people and relationships for you. Legitimately, the eldest might well have a completely different memory of her upbringing than you - no one’s ‘right’ or ‘wrong’. Although she’s 19, there’s every possibility what’s playing out isn’t adult stuff at all, but belated childhood stuff. As such, she’s not going to respond to adult to adult reasonableness - or be very reasonable. You also sound like you had a very rough time when your children were small. I’m sorry you felt school counselling was a pile in on you - it shouldn’t be like that. Reading between the lines, your daughter does seem to have had a tough journey, too. Much as it feels unfair, try and keep the lines of communication with her open - be prepared to listen to her no matter how unfair it feels from your perspective: these are feeling states, not logic. It’s not fair, of course, for her to expect material support whilst telling you she wants no relationship, but it does sound more an acting out of feelings than a gesture of cynical entitlement. You could seek some therapy for yourself.

I agree with you, and to clarify agree feelings such as these need to be voiced, but this is different to validating this 19yo ignoring her family all term time, swanning back in as she pleases in the holidays while telling them they’re toxic, begrudging the fact that her brothers were literally born and then expecting everyone to just accept that - no no no

I would like to put money on it being ASD, too. I genuinely think your daughter has misunderstood situations along the way and continues to, causing her angst. It’s not her fault but nor is it yours. You sound like a bloody good mum. Some of these comments are horrid. I hope you’ve taken strength from the kinder comments OP, go easy on yourself x

OP says she wants to build a relationship with her daughter again. Her daughter feels belittled, unloved and gaslit. It's worth OP trying to understand and listen if she truly wants a relationship with her daughter.

I think we’re getting at different things here - I agree again, what I didn’t agree with was all the OP bashing that was happening. If you read her posts, she has done exactly that.

Now, there I disagree. Someone asked if OP had validated her daughter's feelings and OP talked about her daughter calling herself ugly. OP didn't comment on validating her daughter's feelings about anything else - and specifically, not in relation to validating her daughter's feelings of being belittled, unloved etc. Her OP is quite dismissive about that and makes it sound like her daughter was attacking her. When she was a child in therapy. It doesn't sit right with me.

She also says she has never belittled her daughter but does also admit her daughter says she feels belittled. It suggests invalidation. That's not a good route to go down if you want to rebuild a relationship.

You made justifications for your poor attitude and behaviour when you had PND but without disclosing what actually happened

What a disgraceful thing to say. Poor attitude and behaviour? Fucking hell, the OP had PND.

People with PND can still behave badly (I should know, I did). The point PP is making is that OP has told us she has PND but not explained how she behaved toward DD in this time, which might be relevant to how DD feels now.

She's not ASD. She sounds like she's otherwise functioning. An obsession with "fairness" (to themselves) is also a feature of narcissism. I bet your daughter isn't obsessed with supposed fairness towards others. I am sick of personality disorders being misdiagnosed as the more palatable autism.

It seems like you're desperate for there to be a diagnosis to avoid facing up to the reality that she's just entitled, privileged, selfish and has a victim complex. She's upset because she has unrealistic and immature expectations of a perfect childhood, and is childishly blaming you for everything wrong with herself and her life.

Stop. Indulging. Her.

Look after your own needs OP. Take yourself away for a relaxing weekend. Let her deal with her issues with a therapist if she wants.

Ignore the unpleasant replies on here, they haven't walked a mile in your shoes, yet they seem incredibly knowledgable about you and your daughter.

CAMHS is definitely not where you are referred to only if your child is severely mentally unwell. It's a broad spectrum that is referred there (yes, I have first hand knowledge). I don't know why posters are talking about it in such reverential terms, I don't rate it at all ( unless you think a therapist telling my DS that he needs a treat for sitting with his head on the table in a massive strop is perfectly fine. He didn't get his treat btw, firstly because he behaved like an arse, and secondly, because he mocked the therapist and rubbed his hands together afterwards and said 'Well, where's my treat then?').

If ever my eldest berates me for having the audacity to give birth to his brother, he will be getting extremely short shrift. With knobs on. And he can pay for his own bloody therapist

Your daughter might have some underlying issues but I think you have done nothing wrong . If she is a capable young adult then leave her . Make sure to tell her your door is always open and you love her unconditionally.
Personally she comes across as very self centred, I don’t think it’s normal to resent your siblings . How is she doing with them if it ok to ask

Replace "had PND" with "were ill enough to be under CAMHS for a year" and see why I'm horrified about how many posters have talked about the DD, in a forum in which she cannot give her version of events nor defend herself.

She's not ASD. She sounds like she's otherwise functioning.

I seem like I'm "otherwise functioning" right up until I'm not.

Whilst posters have suggested autism, you have, without meeting this girl, declared that she isn't autistic like it's a fact. How breathtakingly arrogant of you.

i wonder from your post if she’s neurodiverse OP. It’s only relevant as it might help understand and work through her behaviours. It’s sounds like she’s struggled socially and though out school and at home with connections to her siblings.

CAMHS is definitely not where you are referred to only if your child is severely mentally unwell. It's a broad spectrum that is referred there (yes, I have first hand knowledge).

Referral is one thing. Being under their care for a year is quite another.

I don't know why posters are talking about it in such reverential terms, I don't rate it at all

That's irrelevant as to how ill DD was.

I don’t think it’s normal to resent your siblings

My NT sister knew exactly how to push my buttons and trigger a meltdown and she did it on purpose by her own admission. She's grown out of it now, but at the time I really hated her for having that power over me to make me feel that bad and being willing to use it.

So I'd say that it's actually quite reasonable to resent a sibling who basically trolls you for the lols.

My DS was under their care for approx a year and a half. My previous post is my opinion, based on my and others that I know, experiences.

Sounds like he had a really bad time of it. I hope he's OK now.