Friends son converting to Islam and expects her to as well

[ithinkitsdone]

Hi there. I wondered if anyone has any advice.

The situation is my lovely friend is a single parent, has been for 15 years.
Her son is now 22 and is a very dominant type and quite controlling of his mum eg
if we are together, he will come and stand between my friend and I and talk at us, putting his hand in our faces so we stop and listen to him. He has put his hands over his mums mouth to stop her saying a word until he is done. I have told him to knock it off but he can get aggressive so his mum has asked us to just go along with it.

he sets the rules for the house.
He decided he was boycotting Christmas last year (which she loves) so she was not allowed any decorations or have visitors or celebrate the day with family. She wasn't allowed to cook Xmas Dinner and had to spend the day at home with him.

He will want to speak at her hours, following her around and wont let her go to sleep until he is finished even if his lecture lasts until 4am

He is converting to Islam and has told her that the house will now follow and obey the teachings.
She wants to respect his new religion but he has now said she will need to wear a hijab around home and he will ensure she converts too.

She knows his behaviour can be out of order but I think after years, she doesn't see that he is controlling her life.

She is v protective and loyal to him of course but has also said she can't take anymore.

We are worried about her but don't know how to sensitively talk to her about it.

The religion conversion is a smoke screen for controlling his mother. If they went to visit any mosque, he would be told that you cannot make somebody convert.
It's impossible to know what, if any, mental issues or special needs he may have. But it doesn't mean that your friend should have to endure this.

Absolutely what @qazxc said.

I had a friend convert not long after 9/11 when converting was rare and very controversial.

I asked her about the dodgy groups of aggressive young men hanging outside our local mosque and she explained they hung around outside as they weren't welcome inside.

Unfortunately it's those groups of loud, misogynistic men that get the most attention.

Andrew Tate has converted to Islam now, hasn't he?

Fits with the lectures on women.

I think he's following his "leader".

Indeed. It sounds like this man has the potential to be radicalised. You would be doing everyone, including your friend a favour by reporting him to the police. Use the 101 non emergency number.
Specifically for your friend though, would she talk to a domestic abuse advisor? Because this is absolutely domestic abuse.

Yes of course it’s easy to type. Just the same as it is for you.

I understand that people posting that he might be radicalised / neuro diverse / mentally ill etc are trying to help. But the problem with speculating as to possible reasons for the abuse can end up sounding like excuses for him and reasons for her to stay and fix him.

“ How can you throw out your child who is ill? Would you do that if they had cancer ? “ etc .

So the first priority for this lady is to get him out. Not to get him a diagnosis and fix him. Or discuss religion or his views on women. Or if he’s an Andrew Tate wannabe. Or work out how she “caused the problem”.

The way to do that is not easy but it’s to talk to the experts and make an escape plan . Pp have linked to various support agencies. It’s not something she can safely do alone.

None of his actions are tying in with the religion he's supposedly converting to so aside from all the other red flags re abuse she can take the religious element out of it because this is an abuse issue and his MH one. As PP have said no muslim woman I know wear a headscarf in the house in front of her sons and I'm pretty sure other posters have confirmed the no compulsion in religion thing already

Oh lawks. I had to sort kids out and evening classes and came back to a lot of posts!

I did not mean to offend anyone by including what my other friend asked around ND. I was not trying to link ND with all this so I apologise if I was clumsy.
I am planning to contact the Acts line tomorrow and ask for support and advice.

I don't want to start unpicking my friend and her background / parenting. She is a wonderful woman who has had to cope with an awful lot and done so much.
He was not always like this but the past 3 years, it has become more extreme.

I am fearful for her. She shouldn't be living like this. Its tricky to broach any notion of abuse with her but I am thinking of how I can give her information on support available and I'm going to call domestic abuse helpline for advice too.

We are going away for a weeks holiday in March and if things haven't changed then that will be a time to talk properly.

Thank you to people for advice and suggestions.

OP, I also believe your friend might be in more danger than she allows.

She might be thinking 'he's my son, he'd never harm me' but a substantial number of women who are killed by men they know are killed by their son/step son/son in law.

His behaviour is deranged, we all know that. Your job is to get your friend to see that. Not easy at all.

He sounds as if he has a mental health or personality disorder and his behavior is very worrying , she needs help .

Throw the fucker out -go down the prevent route and involve the police-DV and coercive control.

At what point did I say there was a link? Stop looking for a reason to get offended.
Firstly, they were my clients and it was from my experience. They behaved how the OPs pal's son was described.
Secondly, two of my children have autism and to be quite honest I'm not the most NT of people myself. Doesn't mean my house is raging with misogynistic incels because all people are, shockingly, individuals. ND people aren't all nice, nothing to do with their ND, just some people are arseholes. What does make the OPs friends DS sound ND is his inability to realise how inappropriate he's being, especially the lecturing of others on women being bitches.
Not fucking typical of someone who can read the room.

Please stop looking for ways to simply have a row over absolutely nothing. Surely it gets exhausting for you.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC10732311/

As a mother of 2 autistic sons I'd actually rather we recognised their vulnerabilities in society and worked together discussing the issues autistic men face with being so impressionable.
ND makes the world a much harder place to navigate, surely accepting that and the challenges faced for ND folk is useful as opposed to discriminatory here?

ND people come in all shapes and sizes, they're not all rain man, they're not all sat at home watching Mr tumble at 40, they're all late diagnosed tiktokers.

Ignoring that ND people are capable of bad as well as good makes you entirely ignorant of the plight of ND and how we can best support those neurospicies when they don't behave appropriately.
If op's friends son had been more carefully monitored and her reaction hadn't been to dismiss her sons potential MH/ND or at least looked into it, maybe she'd not be forced into a religion she didnt want to join. He might just be a massive arsehole, lots of people are, but there are signs there is behind the scenes something else potentially occurring in this lad.

Good point.

This isn't about religion, and I don't see where Prevent is relevant. He's not been radicalised and nor (as far as we know) is he radicalising others.

He clearly has obsessions, very rigid thought, and is abusive. And all of that was going on week before this latest obsession. There is something very wrong with him.

I don't know where the answer lies, but it isn't with Prevent. He wants to control his mother, that's all.

This is not about religion at all, I don’t think he’s in anyway radicalised. It is simply a creative way for this man to continue exerting control. The only reason he will have converted is probably because he has bought into Islamophobic myth that Muslims are inherently as misogynistic as he is. I highly doubt he’s particularly genuine.

This. He sounds like he's got the Andrew Tate version of Islam.

She can't throw him out and she can't see she's being abused, because she's being abused. And while it's hard enough from a partner, as a single parent there's multiple other layers of emotional complication here.

If you don't get answers/help tomorrow keep calling. The more this guy is on the police radar the better. He's actually dangerous.

Of course he is mentally unwell, and she is completely batshit for indulging this as she has. It’s absolutely baffling. Thats not being a good mother.

Lovely hes found religion but You need to contact his new mosque & ask to speak confidentially to somebody regarding domestic abuse (they'll want to know first for privacy reasons so should have somebody willing to make an appointment with you even if you have to press whoever answers the phone) & really ask them to please have a word about respecting his mother & the home in which she raised him as you have just as much of a loyalty to your fellow mother as she has too her son. (Muslims get this so dont be affraid to push it through the system till you find the right person)

Everything about this is incredibly concerning, OP.

the putting his hands over the mouth of someone who is speaking? Standing between you to assert dominance? What a jackass.

Honestly, I think you need to be very careful
and look out for your safety here… she can deal with her kid…

She should be concerned about what will happen to her if she doesn’t make him leave. Weird. Op, again, protect yourself and ensure that your friend isn’t relaying to her
Psycho son that her friends are onto him.

This.

Is there a way you can get her out of her house alone for a couple of days? You’ve been given a voucher for something, a celebration for something, anything her son can’t attend. Away from him she might begin to see the reality of the situation.

I was thinking along these lines. If he’s converted to Islam he needs someone within that community to talk to
him, like @Jk8 has suggested. It might be the only person he’s prepared to listen to. He really needs to speak to a therapist but at his age he’d have to consent and from what I’ve read about his behaviour really doubt he’d do that.

As others have said, your friend is in extreme danger. She is at high risk if he stays in her home but also if she were to kick him out. This would anger and most likely provoke him and if the primary target of his rage and anger with the world is his mother he would be a serious threat as he is familiar with her daily routine and places she visits. A restraining order would be of zero use bc it sounds like he ignores/ is incapable of following societal norms. Sadly I doubt the police will get involved proactively unless he is violent or threatens her physically, but he sounds very much like he is a ticking time bomb and it is only a matter of time before he goes off. He would make a very frightening BF/partner. He sounds obsessive and clearly needs a new focus on something constructive for his mental health and well-being that will make him feel good, not only about himself, but the world around him. Removing internet access would be a start but obv easier said than done. If your friend won’t admit there’s a problem then I’m afraid things don’t look too hopeful for her. Emotional ties would never allow her to but if he won’t listen to ppl within the Islamic community, the best thing she could do for herself would be to move far away from him and to break all contact. It won’t happen but she is definitely not safe. Good luck trying to protect her OP. Speaking to specialists for their advice is definitely the way forward and contacting the police to flag him on 101.

Men who harm people outside the home often have a history of abusing family members in it. This young man sounds very worrying.

@ithinkitsdone

‘but he has now said she will need to wear a hijab around home and he will ensure she converts too.’

His issue is not Islam, it’s his own controlling and abusive manner. Even us practicing Muslims don’t wear a hijab around the house! And Islam clearly stipulates there is no compulsion in religion. This is mentioned in the Quran and is one of the enduring principles of Islam. One cannot be forced to become Muslim Under any circumstances . It has to be at one’s own free will.

Prevent might put a stop to him imposing his own made-up Islamic understanding on her, but she needs help controlling his abusive behaviour that existed before he converted to Islam. That is not going to go away whether he’s a Muslim or not.

Just on a practical level. Could your friend sell her house and move? I know it sounds extreme but it would solve a lot of problems. Then she could see if ( from a distance) she could get help for her son from authorities. She would be safe though, if she didn't give him the address. Just a thought.

@ithinkitsdone has her DS behaved this way his whole life? Or did these behaviours arrive with puberty or after?