2nd date too soon to sleep with him?

[Tiddlywink222]

I’m normally very sure of myself with this sort of stuff but been out of the dating game for a while!

Met a guy on OLD in December. Chatted a lot. Had a phone call before meeting for over an hour - all good. No red flags.

Met IRL just before Christmas. I live quite far away from him, he offered to pay for my train fare and hotel if it meant we could be more relaxed in the evening and not worry about missing my last train back. Sorted that, all fine, 5* hotel… made it clear there were no expectations and all under my name. We had drinks and then dinner at a very nice restaurant. Got on really well, really relaxed and fun. I haven’t dated anyone seriously for nearly two years as I was heartbroken after my last relationship and this is the first time I’ve actually felt a bit of a spark with someone else since.

He stayed with me in the end as it got late, but we didn’t have sex and he didn’t push it. Kissed a lot, stayed PG 😅 Had breakfast together, he made sure I got home safely. All fine.
I think it should have felt too much quite early on but it didn’t at all, weirdly. I offered for him to stay he wasn’t pushy about it.

He went on holiday straight after Christmas and has messaged me every day, not in a weird intense way just general chit chat, flirty but not overtly sexual. He’s made it clear he’s interested and wants to see me again.

This weekend we’re supposed to meet up for a second date. It’s clear we had a lot of chemistry previously and tbh I want to sleep with him but worried second date is too soon, despite talking for over a month now, and quite a lot of investment both sides given distance. I imagine he’d be happy getting me somewhere to stay again.

I wouldn’t sleep with him unless things were exclusive but I feel it’s too early to ‘insist’ on that without it coming across like I’m pushing for something really serious. I’m not, I just don’t sleep with people casually.

Thoughts? I’m worried I’m overthinking this. I don’t get the impression he’s out to use me, but I feel like I’m out of practice and don’t want to be naive.

Assuming you were genuinely interested in the girls in question, did it make a difference when you slept with them?

No, but...
I had just got out of a tough marriage. The type that MN does not really accept men go through. I was not ready to settle down at all.
I am a good looking man, in very good shape (boxing and rugby), very successful. When I was ready to settle down, I was not on the dating market for long. Equally, when I was on the dating market it was because I was not ready.
I did not pretend I was ready, indeed I did not foresee getting married again. The dating market is a depressing place (as much for men as for women I assure you) as an attractive, mature person looking for a relationship will not be there long whereas those who are not like that will linger on the market.

I always think the sooner the better, if the chemistry is good. You can be more free in terms of what you do as I find I'm more inhibited the better I know someone, it's like the emotional investment makes me cautious about asking for x or y as I'm worried I'll look freaky... If you don't know them that deeply it's easier to just put it out there so to speak. If it turns into a relationship then you're set up with a brilliantly uninhibited honest sex life. And if the sex is terrible well at least you know before you get emotionally invested! I had sex with DH on the first date before and after we had lunch and 8 years on no regrets.

Regarding your actual question I would say you sleep with him when it feels comfortable and natural. Whether it is 2nd or 3rd or 4th date isn't going to matter in a bigger picture if it's going to work between you two.
Regarding letting him pay just let him if you feel comfortable about it. My now DH never let me pay since the very first date and 6 years down the line he is very much the provider and protector and for me that's important.

Thank you, I don’t feel uncomfortable with it and I don’t feel like it means I owe him anything in return. I think he likes taking on a more traditional role and that’s what I’d prefer long term anyway.

I've only read the OP's posts due to a crappy migraine but have done more dating than I care to recall and get an impression that you don't feel fully at ease and maybe a bit over invested hence having an explanation for everything on here.

I've no idea why people are derailing by talking about being a SW etc. you didn't even have sex so may wish to consider some careers advice on another thread if this was your plan 😉 it's happened on one of my threads (diff name) so don't take that personally.

On the basis of first para I would say wait a bit. Accept the date at his. Have another nearer yours even if it doesn't have as nice restaurants. Essentially reel back the pace to a point where you feel equal and are comfortable to say what you want to happen. If that's 'i wouldn't be looking to sleep together if there's anyone else on the scene or you're still looking. No problem if you prefer to wait, I just like get to know someone one at a time at that point' then so be it.

Fine to have sex any time. That's not the point. But only if you're comfortable with it on your terms.

I could be incorrect but think you're giving super confident vibes but feel a bit wrong footed. Look, it's only been one date. You don't have to decide what happens yet, even if you did get close before. There doesn't have to be a progression every time you meet. Fine if there is. I just get a feeling you're not quite sure. Fine too to drive home afterwards.

I get an impression he likes things to be convenient for him and you are finding ways to explain this, making yourself a bit uncomfortable in the process. Please consider carefully whether this is the case. Either way, put yourself first. You've only just met

They aren't equal if he's paying for not just dinner, but also hotel.

How far a distance are we talking? If you want exclusivity, then it sounds like you want a relationship. In which case, consider if your lives are compatible because otherwise, it's a non-starter, likely not to go far and you could get hurt in the process.
Also bear in mind that there is often a reason some men prefer long distance ( so they can see a few at a time without getting caught).

@Sweden99

While I’m pretty certain the below is true for men I can assure you it’s absolutely not the case for attractive mature women. I can give you a list as long as your arm of women who got that exact description who lost interest in dating after being messed around by men acting like kids in a sweet shop. And so many older men are only interested in chasing women 15/20 years their junior despite having very little to offer.

It’s no wonder so many attractive intelligent older women now choose to remain single rather than be dicked around by men.

as an attractive, mature person looking for a relationship will not be there long whereas those who are not like that will linger on the market.

A man paying on a date doesn't make them unequal. Doesn't matter how lavish. Whatever the OP is feeling that makes her balk at saying she doesnt want to have sex without exclusivity is the problem. He can of course say he is not ready for that but she needs to be in a position to feel confident to express her requirements.

Thanks - I didn’t really feel the need to explain matters until the reaction the other way, as just found it surprising it was considered entitled or that I was being paid for sex.

I guess it’s more for me, I feel comfortable taking things further but second guessing myself given all the societal conditioning that says you must wait. And just been out of the dating game for a while.

i think more than anything the fact I’m even bothered means I quite like him. And that freaks me out a bit more than the having sex 😅

I’m perfectly happy to say that tbh I don’t think I said otherwise, just wouldn’t want it to come across as trying to push for loads of commitment as that’s not my feeling or intention. Just health wise especially even using condoms I feel more comfortable being exclusive.

would feel weird if he was also shagging other people.

My own experience was it was a pretty grim experience. I start dating around my own age and met lots of women who thought I should be honoured to fund them and their kids and be grateful for consideration for the privilege.
I would not be surprised if dating is grim for women too, for the same reasons it is grim for men.

I gave up on it too, as the fine women you know did also. The ones who stay no matter what are the ones who expect a partner to swoop in and do everything for them or cannot cope without someone else.

I’m quite a lot older than you (past the pregnancy age) and I agree that I wouldn’t want to be sleeping with anyone who was still pursuing other women or actually having sex with someone else as well.

Ive seen some on here say you can’t demand that In the early stages - er yes you can

There are good ones out there but sadly they’re outnumbered hugely and so they’re the ones who either get snapped up immediately or give up.

Ive heard horror stories from men about women online and I could tell you plenty from me and my friends experiences.

Its a shame there’s not an easy way for the good ones to find each other rather than the aging through far too many frogs on the off chance there’s a solitary prince among them and giving up.

So that means you stick your hand out and be grabby with every bloke you agree to date, they have to pay for you as you can biologically have kids?

that’s the worst excuse I’ve heard, men have to pay for me. I can have babies.

You know it’s not going to be long term, he will get what he paid for and end it, or at least get you to start coming to his and having sex for free.

go into a relationship as an equal op. Don’t be havering on about having babies and pregnancies ruining your body so a man has to pay to be with you.

I shagged my husband on our first meeting, met through FB.

I asked him for sex, he said shouldn't we wait? I asked him if he fancied me, he said yes. I said yes. We both agreed we would like to see each other again and wasn't going to be a one night stand. Spend the weekend together. Married 3 years with a daughter now.

If you know, you know!

@toomanyleggings
I couldn't agree more, and a mistake I have made in my life too.
And now since separating from DC father, I started off like that, but have built myself up slowly and now quite different.

What is it about a man offering to pay for stuff that offends you so much?

and all I said was it was a fallacy to pretend men and women are the same. Not that I should ‘be paid to be with because I can have babies’.

more that it might make sense for things to ‘appear’ a little ‘unequal’ in their early stages of dating given it certainly will be later down the line as women will inevitably end up more vulnerable. Not always but it’s common.

I think we probably haven’t had enough time of evolving into online dating. Basically in online dating you both know you want to meet for one do it’s not appropriate to be the coy maiden of yesteryear. In online dating people should put in equal amounts of effort and payment especially as women have jobs like men do.
I prefer to meet men in the wild so it’s a different dynamic to putting yourself on a website and saying ‘I’m available’
Not saying there’s anything wrong with that, but dissonant then to try to play ‘hard to get’

And of course it’s nice for the man to offer, but grabby to accept. I had a friend who did similar and let a man post for her train fare to London and really thought less of her for accepting.

This doesn’t make sense, just because I’m single doesn’t mean I’m available to any guy that happens to ‘like’ my picture 😕

Well then it wasn’t a genuine offer and shouldn’t have been made.

OP, MN is weird AF about men paying. I don't understand why. It could correlated to the amount of awful relationships posted about.

In the 'real' world the man makes the effort until such time you go from dating to seeing each other. You should offer to go halves on your dates and he shouldn't accept.

I wouldn't date a man who didn't make an effort. It's the beginning and lovely to be romanced. If you chased him and paid for him he'd either run a mile or be one of those cocklodging guys you read about on here with the woman being the high earner and losing her dc in their divorce.

I would say there is definitely a line of men paying and then you feeling obligated to be with him or have sex with him. They can trap you with money. I would only insist on paying my way on a date where I knew I'd not see him again. I don't need to go on dates to get a free dinner. After 3/4 dates you should start deciding dates and making plans and paying a bit more.

Also, men do judge you for shagging them too quickly. As much as you will hear I shagged him and he stayed for years, again in reality most men will not go further than casual if you shag them too quick. Depends whether you want casual or not whether to shag them quickly or not!