Horrible end to date and now I feel awful

[Lemonxx]

I’m not sure posting here is the best idea but I’m too embarrassed to talk to anyone in real life and I’m not sure if I’m being over dramatic to feel the way I feel.

I’ve been dating a guy for just over a month now and things were going well. I told him I was keen to take things slowly which he seemed on board with. We met yesterday at a bar close to his and were talking about a tv show we both wanted to watch so he suggested we go back to his to watch it. When we got back to his he kept trying to initiate sex which I said I didn’t want to get carried away and reiterated that I wanted to take things slowly. He kept persisting and in the end I froze. After all that he was struggling to ‘perform’ and I kept saying that we should call it a night and take a break but he kept carrying on anyway. We didn’t actually have proper sex but he kept trying and did other stuff and now I just feel very humiliated and teary even though it was my own stupid fault for putting myself in that situation and looking back I didn’t even explicitly say no or ask him to stop and I’m not sure why. I should have been clearer.

I’ve barely slept all night and can’t face going into work today and just feel generally anxious. I haven’t heard from him since but as I was leaving last night he blamed me for him being unable to perform and said I didn’t “help him out” but I just felt so pressured and uncomfortable and didn’t want to be in that position in the first place.

I don’t know what to do now because I feel like I’m being stupid but I’m just so upset and keep replaying it in my head.

This thread is giving me the rage. Hope OP is OK and able to ignore the idiots on here

@Janieforever

It’s not a clear no though is it. Not if they carried on. I understand what you’re saying. But it wasn’t a no, it was a suggestion.

It's hugely concerning that you don't see the below as clear enough that someone should stop pushing for sex. It's hugely concerning that you don't view them doing so as sexual assault.

Do you honestly believe that based on the below, this wasn't a sexual assault? Would you tell a daughter that? That the below wasn't clear enough indication they didn't want to have sex? That a guy who continued pushing for it despite the below wasn't dangerous?

"I kept saying that we should call it a night and take a break but he kept carrying on anyway"

"When we got back to his he kept trying to initiate sex which I said I didn’t want to get carried away and reiterated that I wanted to take things slowly. He kept persisting and in the end I froze."

I'm gonna shout louder for the victim blamers and rape apologists at the back...

When having sex/sexual contact with another person: ANYTHING OTHER THAN A YES IS A NO!

Please ignore anyone here who is alluding to the fact you did something wrong. It is very common to freeze in this situations and it doesn't make you weak.

Yes perhaps not the most sensible decision but it doesn't matter, he obviously presented as not a sex pest to you, and you felt comfortable enough to go to his under the guise of watching tv when he had ulterior motives. Unfortunately men can be absolute assholes in this regard and I totally disagree with the comment above that women should be raised to be strong and confident in this situation - everyone is different and some people freeze or worry and can't just call someone out like that. I'm exactly the same. It's ridiculous victim blaming mentality and they wouldn't say it if it was a friend of family member of theirs.

He didn't listen when you indicated you weren't happy with continuing. He has now lay blame on you. Honestly, OP, he is a prize creep, you should feel no guilt and just put this behind you and find a man who will listen when you say "not yet".

I agree. It’s making me sad and angry in equal measures that there’s people out there who still victim blame women for men’s appalling behaviour.

Like those poor ickle men can’t help themselves and their cocks and it’s absolutely the woman’s responsibility to change HER behaviour otherwise just expect to be sexually assaulted. Fucking disgusting

It is not victim blaming to advise OP not to put herself in that situation going forward. I would say the same to any woman who experienced what OP experienced (and what I experienced myself, a few years ago).

I began my post by saying what had happened was not OP’s fault - how on earth is that victim blaming.

If a male friend was attacked walking through a park at night and I advised him not to put himself in that situation again - is that victim blaming too? Or is it sound advice.

You're not stupid for watching tv with someone you've been getting to know and have built up some trust with . He ignored your boundaries and sexually assaulted you

It is everybody’s responsibility, man or woman, to keep themselves safe. Advising a victim of a crime to take measures so that they do not go through that experience again is in no way victim blaming - it is sensible advice.

Why is that so hard to understand?

The man is an abuser and a fucking creep. OP can protect herself from his kind going forward by taking certain measures. These two beliefs are not mutually exclusive.

But how do you know if someone’s ’absolutely trustworthy?’ In many cases, like in ops, you only realise someone isn't safe when they do something like this. Also, not saying no in a situation like this has nothing to do with self confidence. Freezing is a very common response to sexual assault.

This - not much more to say except please don't see him again x

Absolutely 💯- this isn’t a random stranger, this is someone that the OP has built a level of trust with.

She did nothing wrong.

The only true consent is enthusiastic consent. Not saying no does not equal consent. Not fighting him off or trying to run away does not equal consent. It's also well understood that freeze is as common a response to immediate danger as fight or flight is. Indeed, freeze tends to be the most common response when the victim has no clear avenue of escape nor feels remotely capable of winning if it escalates to physical violence. That's why women so often freeze when they are subjected to sexual assaults, just like the OP did. Freezing is not consent.

Sexual activity without consent is sexual assault. Penetration without consent is rape.

It really shouldn't be hard to understand.

It is completely disingenuous to suggest that confidence is not a factor here. These men prey on women who have low confidence, are agreeable/people pleasing, or who have low self-esteem. Which is why building up one’s confidence (or other women’s - daughters, students, friends etc.) is absolutely paramount when it comes to keeping yourself safe and avoiding/shutting down this behaviour in your life.

Totally agree, @Usernamen

You poor thing, he noticed you weren't keen and instead of putting it away, he blamed you. He sounds awful 😖
Take care of yourself. You did nothing wrong. Xx

Again, freezing is a very common response to sexual assault, no matter how high your self confidence might be.

Walking through a park at night and being attacked by a stranger is nothing like going to someone's house to watch TV and being sexually assaulted by them.

But to he honest I also think it would be spectacularly unhelpful to tell someone who had been attacked walking home that they shouldn't put themselves in thar situation again. It is completely lacking in empathy, unsupportive and patronising as it implies they aren't grown up enough to make their own risk assessment.

The only reliable way women can keep themselves safe from becoming a victim of sex based crime is by having nothing to do with men in any circumstances. I can't believe that's what you mean?

You did nothing wrong.

Cut contact.

He has at the very least committed sexual assault (although having sat on a jury, the defender would be able to create enough doubt so you wouldn't get a conviction - what a shitty world we live in now).

I am no expert, but enthusiastic consent is a standard by which a normal person/sex ed would go with. But the law doesn't. The law has a bit that says something like "reasonably believed" that you consented.

Anyway your best bet is to completely ghost him. Don't get into any argument. Either that or just say "This didn't work out".

it was my own stupid fault for putting myself in that situation and looking back I didn’t even explicitly say no or ask him to stop and I’m not sure why. I should have been clearer.

Don't you dare - this is NOT your fault, you said "no", he didn't listen or respect that.
THIS IS NOT ON YOU - yes, I'm shouting - you did nothing wrong

Do you have support in real life?

Men like this need naming and shaming as a warning to other women.

I’m sorry to hear it, OP. I imagine that many of us have been in similar situations or done things we deeply regret afterwards, due to their behaviour. I once let a married man that I had left in a pub to get away from him into my house because he was making a racket outside in the middle of the night and I felt bad for the neighbours. What an idiot! And yes - things happened that shouldn’t have done. I bloody well learnt from that one. Never again. Still feel bad when I think about it but I have forgiven myself for not being stronger and resisting more strongly.

Not all men are like this, the guy was an idiot. It wasn’t your fault, but you will have learnt a bit more about how you react in certain situations and you can use this knowledge to sharpen your ‘this guy’s an arsehole’ radar, making sure you have an exit plan, etc. I think if you have an exit plan you are far less likely to freeze. Just make sure you do actually leave!

I wish the world was different. I’m teaching my boys about enthusiastic consent. That’s a good way to put it.

Be kind to yourself. Seek help, therapy if you need it. Pp might not agree but I’d advise to not see yourself as a victim since that road could lead to a sense of powerlessness. You were a trusting woman but now with a bit more steel and higher standards.

You poor thing, that was awful. I had similar experience when I was young and can still remember how dreadful and humiliated I felt.

He should not have tried as you'd made it clear you wanted to go slowly, and said "Let's not get carried away". It was a sexual assault but whether or not you could prove it, I don't know but doubt it.

The man was horrible, adding insult to injury by blaming you for his ineptitude. What a low-life creep. I bet you are not the only girl with whom this has happened.

It's a fact that there are some horrible people about, , but most men are not like that, thankfully, Lemon.

You will move on from this, older and wiser, Lemon but if you need help to process the experience other than sharing with us, there are organisations which offer a counselling service to people who have been sexually assaulted. I am sure you know that.

I hope that talking about it here has helped and wish you well. x

As others have said I’m sure many of us have been in this situation I know I have loads of times when younger, I never classed it as sexual assault or rape though personally and I do agree about not going back to a man’s house unfortunately they will see that as you wanting sex. I wouldn’t report this as you wouldn’t get anywhere i would just block him and move on