Partner doesn't want to get married

[Applejel]

My DP has been open from the start of our relationship that he doesn't want to get married. His parents never married (now separated) and pretty much no one in his family is married and he just says it's not for him. I was married and divorced before I met him and I wasn't too bothered about remarrying, particularly as DP has children from a previous relationship and I had more assets coming into the relationship than him and I wanted to make sure that what I had earned went to my own children.

Fast forward some years. My DSC have come to live with us full time, DP and I have had two children together. Where we live wraparound childcare is non-existent/very difficult to come by, I'm currently on maternity leave so right now we're fine but we will need to sort something out for my return to work. There are nurseries for our younger shared DC, but no wraparound childcare for DSC. After discussing our options it's looking like one of us will have to give up work or go part time and as DP earns double my wage it makes sense for it to be me. However I do not want to (and nor will I) give up my job or go part time if we are not married as I know I will then be in a very vulnerable position. So far when I've raised it he's said that I've always known he doesn't want to get married, which is true bit our situations has changed now. I find hard to explain why I now feel I need it without it sounding really grabby and like I'm after all his money but the reality is that if I stop working or go part time then my earning potential will be diminished. If we were married then I would feel like our money is properly shared regardless of who earns it and if things went tits up then I wouldn't be in as vulnerable a position. It feels so unromantic to want to marry to feel financially secure but having already been married, marriage itself has lost it's romance for me but practically speaking I think that in our situation it's important that we are married.

I agree with @poetryandwine , and it's funny how cool, laid back and liberal they are....until they're not.

His parents never married (now separated) and pretty much no one in his family is married and he just says it's not for him

Yes....and it's clear whose interests he's looking after here...and it's not yours, that's for sure.

I can understand why people are sceptical or not bothered about marriage, but I once had something like this used to justify a very luke warm if not sceptical attitude to it. It wasn't said explicitly like this of course, but what he was doing was using his parents' standard to negotiate mine down, but just because his parents thought it was ok, doesn't mean I had to as well, and it doesn't mean you have to either.

Do not let him put this on you to find a solution, they are his kids too, so if you are going back to work then it's on him to find and agree a solution too.

I went back to work after dc and I'm so glad I did. A few years after our youngest was born he had an affair and we split. I'd have been left high and dry if I'd not continued to work. Regardless of how much your dp will say he'll not screw you over in the event of a divorce, stand firm and insist it's as much his issue to resolve as it is yours

Somehow men are put off by 'marriage', but not doing practically EVERY SINGLE THING that mimics one, apart from signing that piece of paper. Living with a woman, having kids, using her for financial and emotional labour.

The ship has fucking sailed.

Time for him to put his big boy pants on. And be a real father to his children.

Unfortunately, men like this expect women to " volunteer" all child care, housework, taxing DC around, doing their laundry , cooking, homework and taking time off when DC are sick, on holiday etc. It is not "paid " work and therefore, if he can find a mug who loves his DC, prepared to bend over backwards for them, and do all this for free then it's a win win for him, because it also means he doesn't have to split his assets or pension.

Men are practical. They want a woman who is prepared to service him and his DC so that he can save and spend his money on himself according to his wishes.

Why share his assets if he can find a woman who does wife work out of love, IE , no cost to him?

Your kind and generous nature is being used by him for his own ends. You are being used but you're in love so you can't see it for what it is.

He will use emotional blackmail and tell the DC it's your fault if they can't get to do what they want to.

He seriously saw you coming and the type to scoff at marriage taking you for an absolute fool.

How utterly humiliating for you to be nothing more than an unpaid skivvy for him and his DC.

I'm not sacrificing myself for a relationship he doesn't see as being worthy of commiting to.

Hold that thought OP

Somehow men are put off by 'marriage', but not doing practically EVERY SINGLE THING that mimics one, apart from signing that piece of paper. Living with a woman, having kids, using her for financial and emotional labour.

Yep, it’s called ‘having your cake and eating it’ , all the perks of marriage but none of the commitment

Absolutely this!

A nanny or an au pair with him paying for it - do not give up your financial security! This is not a man who truly cares about you to even ask you to do this without any kind of security.

Well that post took a weird turn at the end...

@Coffeepot72
Hold that thought OP

Thank you, I'm definitely keeping it at the forefront right now. The supportive messages on here are definitely helping with that.

Look we get it, we do! I was a very happy SAHM for years in a very happy marriage. Its lovely if you can afford it and your spouse is supportive—and nothing goes wrong! But people get divorced, they leave, they get injured or laid off, sometimes they die. You simply can’t afford the luxury of dropping your career in order to enjoy this precious time with your children.

As I think someone upthread suggested you could get around this by having him pay you, snd all the associated costs, as a high priced nanny. Put boundaries around the work you do and be strict about it.

Most of us would be happy to quit our jobs, but we have to support ourselves. This guy already has one failed relationship with a mother of his children; he has shown he is happy to use you at the expense of your financial security, and he has a pointless and juvenile reason ("i just don't do marriage") for evading responsibility for his entire family.

No way in hell would I trust someone like that, no matter what he says or promises. Even if he said he's pay me a nanny's fee during school holidays, i wouldn't believe it unless the money were deposited in toto on January 1 for the entire coming year.

Do not quit your job, and indeed, start looking for a better-paid fulltime one. It seems you are going to need it.

I do agree that it doesn't have to be marriage, if he's got some specific phobia about that. Talk to him about having equivalent financial protections. Taking out half of his pension and it going to your own pension pot etc. If he can't see that this is fair then you know where you stand.

What is your current housing situation, op? Is it in both your names?
I know it's been mentioned, but worth repeating to bear in mind your pension. Vital to keep this going if you are unmarried.

Yes it's in both our names. I have a larger share and had a legal agreement drawn up to protect that. He has argued that if I stopped working or went to part time, he would be paying the full mortgage himself but that I would still have that share even though he's paying it off so would be benefitting that way. But that wouldn't balance loss of pension contributions.

We didnt get into it too much tonight, he started work at 5am and finished late tonight. I want to talk it out but I think I may now wait until the weekend to make sure I'm getting his full attention as at the end of this week he is up in court as a witness for the prosecution in a criminal case against DSC's mum (relating to why they now only have supervised contact). I don't want to let it lie but as important to me as it is, I think right now isn't the right time and we stand a better chance of a decent discussion once the trial is over this week.

Blimey, this is a bad position to be in! I dont understand why you are involved in his DC after school care. That is for him to sort. You go back to work and put your children in nursery. They are his and his ex s children, their care is down to them.

OP, he doesn't want to marry you. Fair play he's not led you on. I understand you not wanting to "strong arm" him, then accept his decision.
If the roles were reversed in this example, the majority of posters wouldn't be advising you to marry him. He's told you; so now decide what you want from this long term relationship. Good luck

I want to thank everyone who has left supportive comments and advice. Some have been blunt but it has helped me to feel sure that my feelings are valid and so I feel more confident in setting my boundaries and where I am drawing the line. Some posters have suggested different things to consider which I will think through and look into but I do know that I am absolutely not going to allow myself to be in a vulnerable position financially. As I said in the previous post, I am going to wait until the weekend to have a full discussion with him about it all so that gives me a few days to mull things over.

I'm quite happy not to be married so I will happily accept that decision, but I'm not leaving the workforce and staying at home to watch his children from a previous relationship (or even if it was our own children) without the financial protection of marriage.

Does he think that childcare is your problem to solve? Or is he accepting it's his responsibility too?

Think of it this way, he wants finances to stay separate, fine, but in that case, he can't have his cake and eat it, which means he is independently liable for all costs of your DSC.
If you did not exist and he was still on his own, how would he have managed to look after his DC's full time while working? He simply would of had to move where there is childcare wouldn't he?
I think the answer is to move where there are more resources and if the DSC's have to move schools, so be it. How old are they, you said years later, and 2 new DC's down the line, so are they not approaching some independence? Imagine living down the road from a school, how easier that would be?
You say you can't get a bigger house easy as everyone wants rural as more are wfh since covid? Well good, your own house should sell well, then move near a big town. If its a further treck to their DM, does that really matter when it's an EOW supervised visit only?
Your DP needs a mindset of how would I sort my DC's needs if I was on my own, rather than a "oh my DP can just cut her work hours down and give me free care" - which is clearly wrong.

He does but in all honesty I'm the type of person that when he's looking into childcare options and says he's struggling to find any then I can't help myself but then start to look to see if I can find anything. I'm like this is all areas of my life though, not just him. When we had the au pair it was him who paid her once we got her but we were both looking. I know other posters have said the whole 'men like this will have you doing everything' but in all fairness to him he actually does more than his share of housework, he's very hands on with family life and the children.

what a hell of a time you have been through OP, with the criminal case, maternity leave etc. Sending strength.

Just step away from the problem. He needs to find the solution, not you. You can push your decision about stopping work down the line a few years until your DC start school. Be supportive, but make it clear that this is his problem to solve.

They are 7 and 9. Your suggestion is actually one he has made and I was initially keen but then backed out as I wasn't massively keen on the area we would be moving to if we did this but it could be a solution.
I think you're right about him needing to think more about what he would be doing if I wasn't around, I have thought this myself in the past but then at the same time I think to myself, 'well even if we're not married, we're a partnership and a family and we help each other out ' but it's knowing where to draw the lines around that so that I'm not being taken for granted and not left in a vulnerable position.

You really need serious help dealing with the fact that you are involved with someone who AT BEST will slightly factor your needs into his calculations but really prioritizes himself and his children. The hair splitting he went through over the mortgage payments should make you realize that he is not a fundamentally generous person. When it comes down to it what is his is his and what is yours is his. How can you have shared children when he is nickle and diming their mother and exploiting her as an unpaid servant?

Hang on so when the baby comes you'll have at least 5 children? You mentioned children from a previous marriage. Plural.

And children from his previous? His children are only 7 and 9 and yet you're about to have his third?

So at least 7 children (when the new ones comes) involved here. Ok don't marry him.

I'm sure you know once married a previous will is void and everything you own goes to your spouse. You can make a new will but can be contested by the surviving spouse.

Don't marry him, go back to work. Let him pay for a nanny. Make a will and leave it all split between your children and leave him nothing.