Should I trust that my DH has changed?

[NCcaughtinit]

NCed for advice.

DH and I have been together for 18 years, we have 2 children 7 and 5. To cut a (very) long story short, our relationship has been horrible since our children were born - he left me to it for the first year of elder DDs life (I went back to FT work at 5 months but did everything at home too despite a non sleeping baby) and then quit his job as DS arrived 2 years later. Hasnt worked since but also just totally checked out of family life, we have a full time nanny and then on weekends he would berate me if I wanted to do anything away from the kids as he needed time alone. Dismissive of anything going on in my life (I had post natal anxiety with my first and have had all sorts of work challenges etc) and just totally focused on how I wasn’t doing enough for him. When I look back on it it was just awful and I almost can’t believe I put up with it but it was a sort of boiled frog situation. Anyway, the inevitable happened, I got too close to a man from work and kissed him one night (which yes I know was horrible and wrong). Turned out that DH had been suspicious of me and was scanning all my messages - he ended up finding and reading my diary where I wrote about it. It led to a huge blow up where he went absolutely crazy and burnt my clothes etc. In the immediate aftermath I changed jobs and sort of calmed things down, but he was doubly awful to me and after a couple of months of that after yet another hideous joint therapy session I just lost it and said I wanted to divorce as I wasn’t prepared to be treated like this.

me actually walking away (not for someone else, for me) seemed to act as a bucket of cold water for DH and he suddenly sort of snapped and completely changed his tune. He is now much more considerate, leaned into family life (though it must be said not very good at it - I am still very much keeper of the mental load but at least he is doing things) and is actively hunting for a job.

We are now 12 months on from all this. the problem is that I am struggling to let go of the idea that he will let me down again when he goes back to work. He is aggrieved by this but I can’t help but feel like it’s easy for him to make these changes now when he literally has nothing else to do. Job search is taking awhile as he is very senior, and I feel like we are just stuck in this hiatus in the meantime.

so my question - has anyone’s DH radically changed and stuck to it? Or am I right and this is just a temporary improvement? I don’t really want to separate but I know I won’t survive another period like the last time and I’m fearful of it which is making me keep my guard up.

You've posted before and got exactly the same reaction (unless there's another poster whose clothes got burnt after she kissed someone else.) No-one on here is going to advise you to stay in a marriage which is so clearly over. Go and see your solicitor, make the break, work through the shit and get your life moving again.

You know, I saw something on TikTok of all places that really resonates with your post @NCcaughtinit

The woman was saying that women always try and fix the relationship before it gets to the point of no return; men only try and fix it once it's gone past it.

Ask yourself if he could do all these things, why he didn't do them when you were drowning, when you needed him, when you were unwell?

IMO he's pulling out all the stops now because he doesn't fancy having to look after himself.

I don't think he has changed and I think you have fallen out of love with him, which is completely understandable considering how horrible he sounds.

I'd divorce under these circumstances.

I don't know why the hell you posted. You don't want advice. You want validation. You are not going to get that here.

You have no intention of being proactive in any way and you are nothing but defensive of a lazy bastard who hasn't worked in 5 years, has treated you like crap, and won't take any responsibility for your children! You are deluded that he has, or ever will, change.

The fact you have a nanny and he doesn’t work oh wow I’m speechless at that.
the fact he burned your clothes!!!
This guy is a psychopath and he won’t change ever, what he will do in a few months time or maybe further down the line is use this as a stick to beat you with and berate you when he thinks you’ve softened towards him, he will turn on you at a moments notice and push in your face that he did this for you that for you. He won’t change and I personally feel you’re in danger tbh.

Bloody hell. I rarely post on these boards but fuck me your post is so scary - your dh is vile and he will always be vile. He brings nothing to your relationship at all and this will be doing untold damage to your kids.

Please get out and stay out.

@NCcaughtinit. If you ignore every word that's been said on this thread; if you take only one piece of the good advice the PPs above have offered you, let it be this one.

Do not under any circumstances undergo counselling with this man.

No need to leave?
No need leave a nutter that won't.let.you.leave?

That is your reason!
The guy is a fruitloop. Get out of there.
Whats the slternative? Stay and presumably, keep sleeping with, your jailor?

Fuck that

There not a therapist out there eh can stop am abusive piece of shit to stop being one op. You can't therapise basic human empathy into someone that doesn't have it. No one can.

This has to be a wind up.

@NCcaughtinit have you posted about this before? And he committed some sort of sexual assault as well as burning the clothes? Sorry if that’s outing/wrong … maybe there’s more than one psychotic clothes burner on mumsnet 😫

In your situation I wound definitely keep the nanny on and make plans to leave when gets a new job (not make plans to stay if he gets one). Once he is working (a) he won’t get better, he will blame everything on work stress and (b) he will have less of a claim to be primary carer and split more likely to be equal. If you leave now you risk losing everything - assets, access to kids etc.

You will need the nanny for co-parenting support when you split as he will be a total cock. You also want to mitigate the loss of another loved adult in your children’s lives.

I’ve been through a similar split with a controlling fuckwit and he also refused to leave. We did nesting which is not advised with an abusive man but it was the only way to get him out of the house. He’s v lazy so over time I did more of the childcare in the house and eventually he got a girlfriend and wanted to live the single life in the nesting house. I’m now in the family home fulll time and he’s in the nesting house - although we are yet to negotiate formal asset division. Predictably he is being an arsehole about that. I’m not in the UK and here you need to be separated for 2 years before you can divorce. 14 months to go 😫

Has he considered that a more equivalent hurt would be if you’d actually cheated on him solidly for multiple years in a row? That there is nothing at all comparable about your behaviours as it stands?

I mean, I think he is clearly an A grade asshole who gave you nothing and left you to drown for years and years. And still is about refusing to leave etc. So in my view it’s very unlikely to be salvageable. The most important thing is you be strategic. You’re married, how could you not get half the house? Does it matter it’s not in your name? (Genuinely wondering, no expertise) As soon as he has a job you reassess. And remind him you did everything plus a job for years so there is ZERO excuse for him to not continue to be an active parent.

@Endoftheroad12345 ive not posted before and he’s not assaulted me. My therapist told me apparently burning / destroying things is not uncommon which is a scary thought.

thank you to everyone who posted. To those who think
i am deluded etc - maybe I am. But if you are living with someone who has had a huge personality change it’s hard to know what to make of it. I wondered if anyone had been through similar, that’s all.

Well I am glad to hear that @NCcaughtinit !

I don’t think you’re deluded. It takes a long time to extricate yourself especially when there are young children involved. It took me years. Mine are similar ages to yours.

I think once you are out of the marriage and free of him you will probably start to see that things were much worse than you can really acknowledge right now - that was certainly my experience.

I’ve recently started a new relationship with someone who is absolutely lovely - so caring and kind and affectionate- and initially it made me quite sad as it really brought home how loveless and awful my marriage had been.

Lots of people have been through this, I see them post here all the time. when called out, abusive men behave well and start to do the right thing... temporarily. Once you're reeled back in he'll go back to his shitty ways.

Ps. Have you ever looked through his phone or diary? I suspect that you would see that as a huge violation and would never do it but I bet if you did you'd find out that he's been spending all his spare time with another woman.

He’s at home all day and does F all…and so is the nanny? What?

He pays for his share of the nanny through his savings - but these are your savings, too. You’re paying 75% of her wages, not 50%

Since you’re married you’re just as entitled to the house as he is. It goes in to the marital pot along with savings, pensions and any other assets. Surely your solicitor has told you this.

He’s abusive and controlling. Don’t have joint counselling with him. You should never have counselling with an abusive man.

His uselessness and the fact that you have to give him a detailed explanation of all minor tasks before he can grasp how to do them, is strategic incompetence.

He’s got you exactly where he wants you. You do everything, there’s very little expectation of him, he’s been frittering away the marital assets for 5 years whilst pretending to look for work. You are afraid to leave because he will go ‘nuclear’.

This is a very toxic dynamic for your children to grow up in.

I bet if you did you'd find out that he's been spending all his spare time with another woman.

Possible but not necessarily. I know plenty of men who are just so lazy they would happily sit and play on their phones for 5 years. Not that this is much better.

Thank you @Endoftheroad12345 . That does make me feel quite sad. I think my problem is that he is being good at the moment. If he’d just been like this all along then it would be fine. But there’s just this lingering feeling of resentment and mistrust. Either way I can’t do anything about it now so am just trying to breathe through it all, I suppose.

I don’t think there’s someone else - he is honest to a fault. And I’m not even sure I’d particularly care at this point, it’d probably be the final death blow in terms of not giving a shit about me but at least things would be clear. But no I don’t snoop through his phone or diary.

I was in a very, very similar situation when our kids were similar age to yours and it got to crisis point. DH did actually make changes and they stuck, so it can happen. He completely pulls his weight and is a great dad, and that’s 8 years on. Good luck x

@SpringboksSocks oh god so it can happen. What was the turning point for you? Did it take you awhile to trust it was real change?

No, I don’t think he has changed for the better permanently and here’s why: he’s had 12 months since your last blow up to mend his ways and in all that time, he still hasn’t found a job (ANY job) and continues using strategic incompetence to ensure he takes enough of the load to look like he’s helping but not so much that it would be genuinely helpful. So you’ve still got the lion’s share of the work.

You say you want to stay because you want your kids to have both parents. Having both parents together is not good in and of itself; it’s good when their relationship is good. Do you want your children to grow up in a dysfunctional household? Because that’s what is happening at the moment. As a PP mentioned they are seeing how he is treating you and will grow up thinking this is normal and OK; it isn’t.

Will he get a job?
will he want his family enough to continue to pretend to have changed?
Will he lapse?

OP go with your gut. I know of fathers who have got much more involved as the kids grow and are more “fun”. I think the person he was is his true self. Whether he can keep the mask on remains to be seen, particularly if he does get a job.

He seems to be drifting- no job, half hearted at home etc would he have had burnout? Or depression? Either way, the root cause needs identifying or it will happen again.

I mean, are you gonna change? Cheating is cheating. He's a prick but if this was the other way around responses would be mega different

Really this.

Cunts really really enjoy ‘cunting’ - he will be profoundly resentful that you made him give up his hobby, and he really will be planning his payback on you.

When you think about it, do you even regret that kiss or was it a moment where you got to feel normal again, and confirmation that it is him.

@Vocaladvocaat the problem is that my gut tells me that it could be ok if he can get himself back to where he wants to be professionally. He is far more invested in that than family life (and he’s not alone as a man in being like that). He was definitely burnt out after his last (very high pay, very high stress) job which was I was so supportive of him taking 12-24 months off to recover. But he also has a bit of a problem making decisions of any nature and I think he just got trapped in that cycle. And unfortunately took it all out on me and the family. He is in therapy and am hoping to hear a bit more of the root cause analysis you reference.

@fuckssaaaaake yes I have changed. I won’t put up with his behaviour anymore. If it happened again I would leave, not go outside the marriage. I’m not proud of what I did but I am also at peace with my behaviour and I don’t feel guilty about it as I look back and see what stress I was under and just think I was an idiot for not bringing things to a head before things happened outside.

@fuckssaaaaake ,

I don’t totally get this thread.

To me, the OP’s (10 years older) husband semi retired with plenty of money, after a big career which paid for the OP to have the lifestyle she wanted.

Now OP has her own career and finds her husband a bit dull, so had her head turned and, for some reason, is desperate to get him back to work. There is almost zero (even residual) affection on the OP’s posts and the reason to stay together seems financial and outward appearance.

If the sexes were reversed, reactions would be very different.

Regardless of blame, however, this is a deeply unhappy and dysfunctional relationship and it serves no one well to try to continue it.

@Newbutoldfather honestly - fuck you. In no way has my DHs big career paid for my life - we have ALWAYS been 50/50 on EVERYTHING financially with the exception of our house deposit even when his earnings were 10x+ what mine were (I have now caught up as I’ve got older). I have worked FT for my entire life, I went back to work after my mat leaves when my DC were 5 and 6 months respectively. To cast this as some kind of set up where I’ve taken all the gains of my DHs career and am now casting him aside is just beyond offensive.