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Original poster

Proxy body dysmorphia!

121 replies

Donostiera · 03/10/2023 11:55

Is it possible to have body dysmorphia for someone else? That's kind of a joke but I have an issue in that my husband genuinely thinks I am fat. I'm 43, my BMI is 22.5, most of my clothes are size 10. I have some flabby bits, wobbly thighs (always have had) nice tits (ditto). One DD aged 12. My husband is 60 and our sex life is less than it used to be. Has been for about 4 years. DH was having erection problems and prescribed viagra (I guess he was 'brave' to go to the doctor) but the implication about all of this seems to be that it is ME becoming less attractive that causes the issue. This conversation comes out every now and then, causes a lot of upset, then gets put back in its box. I've never been anything other than kind about the ED, which obviously isn't great for anyone but with the blue pills things are 'fine' in that department. But the idea that it's my fault just seems so bizarre - he has told me straight that I'm not attractive because I'm fat. Btw I weigh a little less than I did when we got married 16 years ago and about 8 kg less than a year or so before we got married (we've been together 20 years). I guess it is less nubile and firm flesh though. The conversation happens once or twice a year and then he is sensible enough to back off because he does genuinely love me and I him. It makes me feel both pretty terribly miserable and angry - it normally gets precipitated by him criticising me for eating too much (hold back on that beef; that pasta will go straight to your hips - low level carping). I really love food and wine and am a good cook, very interested in different types of food. It's a hobby / interest. We've always shared that interest but for him it seems less now - he says his appetite has decreased and in this (and some other areas) I see him more reluctant to try new things these days. So anyway, he calls me fat and wants me to restrict what I eat or to exercise more - solely in order to meet his aesthetic standard. I'm very healthy and quite fit, mostly from running around a massive garden / housed / DIY project, walking, swimming, yoga, not a gym bunny by any means but healthy. And it just makes me furious that he makes me feel guilty for not conforming to this standard he has, which seems to have changed over the years. Why should I do stuff I don't want to (work out, not eat pies) for an aesthetic ideal I don't share? But he says that not taking his wishes seriously is disrespectful. He also concedes that his view of my / women's bodies is probably not correct in an absolute sense but that he can't help it so it would be kinder of me to try to 'make an effort'. As I know what MN is like I'll just say his idea of porn is chainsaw videos on YouTube. There's nothing untoward going on there. I do love him very much though he has a tendency to criticise me in other areas, though mostly this one. I run a successful publishing business and am intelligent, but have probably quite typical mother derived self esteem issues that I've worked hard to get over and I really feel that giving in on this 'fat' question - I mean agreeing with his view - would be detrimental. Our daughter is 12 and still a total innocent nymph but one day soon she will become body conscious and also start to fill out. She already notices when he picks on me for 'flab' or 'eating too much butter' and I have taken this up with him. I think he now tries harder not to express this kind of thing in front of her. He's a good man, really. But this is so weird and seemingly intractable without me just deciding to become someone else. I could try to become a gym bunny and to diet but I don't bloody want to. So if I did it would only be for him. He thinks this would be loving and self actualising (or something), I think it would be weird and self-destructive to change for this one reason. I haven't spoken to any friends about it except once by angry drunken (me) WhatsApp chat after a particularly harsh episode. Friend, quite naturally, expressed the view that he was being a twat, hence my not talking to others because I want to protect his 'reputation'. But if he genuinely has this perception I guess it's more complex than twattiness. [sits back; awaits MN verdict of A-grade twattiness]

OP posts:
Beamur · 03/10/2023 11:57

That isn't dysmorphia. He is just being a twat.

Shlump · 03/10/2023 12:00

Nah he’s being a twat. So rude and disrespectful. Misogynistic whether he accepts that or not.

You stand your ground, don’t even think about eating a bite less or exercising a step more than you want to. It’s your body, and your life to enjoy.

I think you should put your foot down really. No more comments, no more suggestions. He is setting a terrible example for your child who is at an impressionable age. It needs to stop.

gwenneh · 03/10/2023 12:01

He's a good man, really.
Good men don't treat people they love like this.

gerrithedom · 03/10/2023 12:01

He's deflecting the blame on to you because he can't get it up.

He's a twat.

MagpiePi · 03/10/2023 12:04

What's his body like?

AutumnFroglets · 03/10/2023 12:07

Is it possible to have body dysmorphia for someone else?

No. But you do have a horrible husband who is deflecting his problems onto you.

Original poster
Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:07

Shlump · 03/10/2023 12:00

Nah he’s being a twat. So rude and disrespectful. Misogynistic whether he accepts that or not.

You stand your ground, don’t even think about eating a bite less or exercising a step more than you want to. It’s your body, and your life to enjoy.

I think you should put your foot down really. No more comments, no more suggestions. He is setting a terrible example for your child who is at an impressionable age. It needs to stop.

Thank you for this. You're right of course.

OP posts:
Original poster
Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:09

MagpiePi · 03/10/2023 12:04

What's his body like?

Edited

Skinny, slight older man's pot belly. Nothing that revolts me... I still fancy him, and enjoy sex/intimacy because it's about love/connection (just as long as one of these fat-shaming episodes hasn't happened recently)

OP posts:
PaintedEgg · 03/10/2023 12:11

that's nagging - and in this case, its a form of persistent emotional abuse and manipulation intended to lower self-esteem of the target and make them more reliant on the abuser

SleepingStandingUp · 03/10/2023 12:14

He's projecting his sexual failure onto you.

Oh if only you were more this and less that then my penis would be a wonder wand of pleasure!!

Bollocks.

He's still prepared to have sex with you despite him being so sexually un-attracted to you. What a hero.

Who instigates sex?

Farmageddon · 03/10/2023 12:15

This guy sounds horrible, I think he's projecting his ED issues onto you. Maybe he's ashamed that he can't get erections as easily now (because of his age) and is trying to ensure his younger wife doesn't leave him.

When you got together you were 23 and he was 40, clearly there was a power imbalance, which he is trying to keep going. What a prick.

Original poster
Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:16

PaintedEgg · 03/10/2023 12:11

that's nagging - and in this case, its a form of persistent emotional abuse and manipulation intended to lower self-esteem of the target and make them more reliant on the abuser

Now that is interesting - I hadn't thought of it that way, that he actually doesn't want to drive me away but is scared that I'll leave him (due to his age etc) so at some level wants me to think I'm fortunate that he loves me 'despite' this. It's really hard to unpack everything. I think someone can be a twat about a particular thing or set of things without being a twat overall. But I need to find some way for us both to make peace with this (non)issue.

OP posts:
Farmageddon · 03/10/2023 12:17

OP, would you be happy if your daughter's future partner treated her this way when she grows up?
Do you think it's acceptable for a partner to be so cruel about someone they are supposed to love?

pastaandpesto · 03/10/2023 12:17

What have I just read??? Honestly OP this is just awful behaviour from him, and I think you are (unconsciously) minimising it.

You sound like the epitome of a well rounded, successful and generally together 40 something woman and with his 60 year old pot belly he should be pinching himself every fucking morning because he can't believe his good luck. I am utterly incensed on your behalf.

And how DARE he project his appalling misogynistic values on to your DD.

GilbertMarkham · 03/10/2023 12:18

I agree it's about his ED.

This is one of the reasons it's a bad idea to partner up with men 17 years older than you.

The other possibility is that he likes young/younger women ... And that's why he went for one nearly 20 years younger for him. And when he says fat, he actually means (as you say) not nubile, firm, youthful.
Again this is why you don't partner up with men 17 years older than you. Maybe they 'like em young".

Anyway a skinny, pot bellied 60 yr old with ED is on no position whatsoever to to be calling a not fat 43 yr old woman fat.

You're actually thin. (And I say that as a skinny person).

PaintedEgg · 03/10/2023 12:18

Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:16

Now that is interesting - I hadn't thought of it that way, that he actually doesn't want to drive me away but is scared that I'll leave him (due to his age etc) so at some level wants me to think I'm fortunate that he loves me 'despite' this. It's really hard to unpack everything. I think someone can be a twat about a particular thing or set of things without being a twat overall. But I need to find some way for us both to make peace with this (non)issue.

Show quote history

i would bet my money that this is not the only thing he is a twat about - just one that is so out there you were able to spot it through the rose-coloured glasses

and while yes, it is about keeping you in check, it has nothing to do with love

Original poster
Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:20

SleepingStandingUp · 03/10/2023 12:14

He's projecting his sexual failure onto you.

Oh if only you were more this and less that then my penis would be a wonder wand of pleasure!!

Bollocks.

He's still prepared to have sex with you despite him being so sexually un-attracted to you. What a hero.

Who instigates sex?

Sex mostly instigated by him now because he has to be 'in the zone' and is naturally embarrassed if he's not which is awkward. I absolutely hear what you say, and agree. But as the behaviour is almost undoubtedly an irrational and slightly pathetic front, it would be good to find a way to get him into a better place so he doesn't have to be so defensive. Given that I love him and think that twatty behaviour doth not necessarily an unredeemable twat make...

OP posts:
Shlump · 03/10/2023 12:20

I guess the other interpretation is that he is upset bout getting older. It’s too painful to face up to that fact that his body has changed and doesn’t function as it used to, so he displaces his anger and criticism onto you. It’s more comfortable to dislike something by about someone else than to dislike it in yourself.

Or it’s him trying to maintain a power dynamic, control you etc. Very possible.

It can’t be allowed to continue, it’s so toxic. Lucky for your daughter, you sound pretty great. I hope you manage to find a way to stop this.

Original poster
Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:23

Farmageddon · 03/10/2023 12:15

This guy sounds horrible, I think he's projecting his ED issues onto you. Maybe he's ashamed that he can't get erections as easily now (because of his age) and is trying to ensure his younger wife doesn't leave him.

When you got together you were 23 and he was 40, clearly there was a power imbalance, which he is trying to keep going. What a prick.

I think on the power front it's slightly more complex because in terms of background etc he has always felt inferior. So yes he's my superannuated bit of rough. Gets better doesn't it?! Seriously, I have multiple degrees and he has done extremely well in his career after a rotten start and not very much in the way of formal education early on (HNC, now a chartered engineer)

OP posts:
EscapetotheShatto · 03/10/2023 12:23

What's he like on your birthdays?

GilbertMarkham · 03/10/2023 12:23

The negging theory is possible too.

Could be excusing his ED by blaming you and/or negging you because his age and ED make him think you might be offski.

pastaandpesto · 03/10/2023 12:25

twatty behaviour doth not necessarily an unredeemable twat make...

I just don't agree with this. Occasional, in-the-moment thoughtlessness - of course, we're human. Over the course of a long marriage it would be completely unrealistic to expect neither party to act like a dick from time to time.

But this is so different from that. He knows how hurtful his behaviour is, yet he's doing it anyway. He's either deeply deluded or bloody nasty. Neither are good options.

Original poster
Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:25

GilbertMarkham · 03/10/2023 12:18

I agree it's about his ED.

This is one of the reasons it's a bad idea to partner up with men 17 years older than you.

The other possibility is that he likes young/younger women ... And that's why he went for one nearly 20 years younger for him. And when he says fat, he actually means (as you say) not nubile, firm, youthful.
Again this is why you don't partner up with men 17 years older than you. Maybe they 'like em young".

Anyway a skinny, pot bellied 60 yr old with ED is on no position whatsoever to to be calling a not fat 43 yr old woman fat.

You're actually thin. (And I say that as a skinny person).

Edited

Thanks for your kind words. The 17 years older thing is done. Naturally everyone warned me at the time (not about this specific aspect). But he has been a pretty good husband and very good father thus far. And is much more self aware than my narrative makes it sound (because actually, deliberately, I'm trying to make this about me for bloody once, and not about keeping the peace and protect him from being deemed a twat)

OP posts:
gwenneh · 03/10/2023 12:25

twatty behaviour doth not necessarily an unredeemable twat make...

Correct, but this is more than twatty behaviour.

SleepingStandingUp · 03/10/2023 12:27

Donostiera · 03/10/2023 12:20

Sex mostly instigated by him now because he has to be 'in the zone' and is naturally embarrassed if he's not which is awkward. I absolutely hear what you say, and agree. But as the behaviour is almost undoubtedly an irrational and slightly pathetic front, it would be good to find a way to get him into a better place so he doesn't have to be so defensive. Given that I love him and think that twatty behaviour doth not necessarily an unredeemable twat make...

Show quote history

I'm not screaming ltb, but I wouldn't be dealing with this by pandering to his delicate sensitivities
He's willing to sacrifice your health and wellbeing on the idea that YOU'RE the problem.

Next time he wants sex, I'd be saying "look, I don't feel comfortable. You have to medicate yourself to be able to push yourself into having sex with me because you're not attracted to me. Imagine if I had to get drunk every time we had sex to make you attractive enough to get aroused? Neither of us want a sexless marriage, I refuse to lose weight and be underweight just so you'll be attracted to me so perhaps we need to consider an open marriage. For us both.

At least you'll know where you stand. He'll either buck up his ideas or be willing to screw over your marriage for imaginary sex with a nubile woman on her 20s