Family court system - what a mess

[TitaniumTess]

Feeling sad....been to family court today....and honestly..how much evidence of abuse do they ignore......

Big carpet....all swept under it....out of control....

They've rewarded the abuser with more access..I don't get it.

I am still traumatised from my experience of family court and I struggled with it for such a long time.
Mine was in Covid times so each hearing there would be a really long wait and all online.
At first I paid for a lawyer and barrister and it was too expensive and I couldnt afford so I did the last couple of hearings on my own.

The second to last hearing was by far the worse. It was a female judge and she spent most of the time bickering with my ex while I waited for my turn to speak and say my peace. She barely let me speak at all, I didnt get any of my points across. The other thing that really upset me as days before (well in time) i had emailed over my bundle and due to an error her end, she didnt get this or my Position Statement which she advised me about at the start of my hearing. So I was already at a disadvantage through no fault of my own and she didnt care and carried on regardless. I was upset as I had worked hard on it and she hadnt even read it.

She did not give me any platform to speak, I was only able to answer direct questions she posed me as she obviously spent too much time bickering with my ex and wanted to wrap things up.The hearing was meant to be 90 minutes but it seemed done and dusted after 45 mins.

She ruled on something that basically traumatised my daughter and I for several months. She made us drive every second weekend to a meeting point (100 miles) to meet ex (Who worked at this meeting point so he was already there, no effort on his part).Not only that, (which I was ok doing), but she said I had to be there by a certain time too (4pm) as DD finished school earlier on fridays at 2,30pm, If I was late, ex was not able to wait and would continue home and I would have to take daughter to his home, a journey that would take 5-6 hours (one way). Every second friday. Also not to mention poor DD having to do a ten hour round trip every two weeks and she didnt want to and CAFCASS had also said it wasnt recommended.

The time was completely unrealistic. I work on fridays and judge was asking us to do this on one of the busiest UK motoways and make a certain time in the middle of rush hour. I tried to argue this with the judge, she dismissed my concerns and said my work can let me leave early on those days (Friday being my busiest day at work). I also said the one way journey to the agreed point can take up to 2 hours at least and she disputed that. She stated she was familiar with the motorway and felt it can be done in an hour and a half. She told me my choice was either do that or do the whole drive (essentially 10-11 hours round trip in one day for me), the choice was mine if I couldnt make the time she had put forward.

Ex of course lapped this up being the abusive prick he is. I asked him after that if I was late for the 4pm meet would he be able to wait, he said no.

Since that hearing there was at least two occasions where I got there too late despite leaving on time and he had gone (and we are talking no more then 15-30mins late) so I had to drive 11 hours in one day. (after working all day) I spent a lot of the drive crying and on the way home my leg was in agony and shattered. I feel awful for my DD and wish I had hidden how distressed I was to her.

For pick up, it was agreed to meet at same pick up place on Sunday by a certain time which as I dont work Sundays wasnt an issue.

it got to the point I had to get my work to write a letter for the next hearing stating I would not be allowed to leave early on every second fridays.

There were times my DD was crying in the car as she didnt want to do the long drive, or didnt feel 100% and I felt i had no choice. My ex was making so many threats.

There were other things where his abuse was enabled throughout the whole process but this stood out the most because of how stressed DD and I were every second friday for a long time. DD could also definitely see my stress when I was driving trying to make a bizarre time scedule and it wastn fair on her. Stressed if she wanted the toilet etc, or dwadling.

Juge seemed to think ex was being fair agreeing to be at this meeting point but not listening to me when I said ex was in this area anyway due to work - which she would have known had she read my Position Statement.

The final hearing all that was put to a stop but it was generally a horrible experience.

I know there are much worse stories but this one part of the process really impacted us.
I tried to complain after but that proved too difficult so gave up.

Even if you ‘win’ in family court it means nothing.

My partners ex is abusive, this was recognised by cafcass and custody changed accordingly. We were reassured that things would get better.

But the ex’s abuse has only ramped up. Even if she saw DSS only once a year she would spend that time alienating and emotionally abusing him. Nothing stops an abuser, they find ways around the system.

I'm so sorry. I'm also traumatised from it. I had similar power games played for several years with pick up and drop offs. It was obviously him trying to make my life as horrible as possible and not caring at all about the impact on DC.

I could also write a long amount about it, but I'm sure you can imagine the details. Two things really hurt me - my ex's nasty behaviour and the court condoning his behaviour. The second is significantly harder to deal with. I feel completely betrayed by the judicial system.

Sending you a massive hug. You're not alone x

Exactly this

@Krest I had the same. I was expected to work around my ex shift work. The fact that ment I struggled to work was not important. I had to do half the travel too despite ex getting free travel with his work and it was him that moved away

The other thing that really upset me as days before (well in time) i had emailed over my bundle and due to an error her end, she didnt get this or my Position Statement which she advised me about at the start of my hearing. So I was already at a disadvantage through no fault of my own and she didnt care and carried on regardless. I was upset as I had worked hard on it and she hadnt even read it.

This was someone in a position of power and influence not doing their job.Imagine the equivalent sort of negligence from a doctor.

What a horrible experience.

It's horrible reading these stories. One of my close friends is going through this now. I always wonder why the courts act in this way. My thoughts are:

1. Courts minimise past abuse/ and potential for future abuse. They don't see it as a hugely serious issue. They think abusers will change or that the abuse wasn't that bad. For example, if one party (let's say an abusive father) says "I won't do it again" then that's enough for the court to give them another chance
2. The "equation" is different in the court's mind. If the Dad is awarded 2 overnights per week then the mum thinks "this is a lot/too much - my child is at risk of abuse", whereas the courts think "2 nights per week is not a lot, the child is spending most of their time with the mum. Oh, and it's only fair the mum does the drop off."

Mums have 0 tolerance for abuse, whereas the court seems to think abuse/risk of abuse isn't that serious.

Another thing that infuriates me is the fact that abusers were often abused themselves. So by forcing this contact we effectively are increasing the number of abusers in our children's generation.

My own ex had an abusive father.

I worry for my son more than just that he's forced to see his abusive father. I worry what he is learning about how men should treat women. I worry for my daughter what she's learning women should accept in relationships by how he treats her compared to her brother and how he treats his partners in front of her.

It's just going to get worse and worse the way our society handles these things. Violent porn, young girls pressed into things they don't want to do, Andrew tate, trad wives, misogyny and violence all over our tv shows and films. Etc etc etc. It's like the world wants this trajectory for our children's future

I've had 15 court hearings (5 x different court cases) in total and finally come out with a no contact order, regarding my children seeing their father.
The whole thing was pretty wild tbh!
The end result was the right result. But it was very clear to me through out what a fine line we were treading. So yes the family courts do get it right some of the time. But my God how it didn't kill me getting there I will never know!!
I think (from my experience) the first real hurdle was getting the judge to see it wasn't just a custody (or what ever they call it now) despite. Abuse had taken place and I had solid evidence of this! Because of the serverity of the aligations my solicitor was putting forward, the judge ordered a cafcass guardian (not an officer). The guardian also had their own solicitor.

The guardian was amazing. I think with out her the aligations wouldn't have been taken as serious.
Social services were again rubbish (I should have put a formal complaint in). She was taking extracts from the communication book we used (went between me and my ex) and saying I was telling the children too much, that I was alienating them from their father etc etc. Only thing was she hadn't bothered to look at who had written these things, .. it wasn't me but my ex. He had even signed it!!! She got all that wrong then didn't bother turning up at Court!!!

I think I also got lucky that I used the same solicitor throughout! She was very fearce!

The last point I wanted to raise was that my ex's general behaviour soon deteriated. He was writing to the judge/court/solicitors etc and being abusive. He did podcasts, FB statuses, instergram, you tube etc talking about our court cases. It became more and more clear how disconnected and removed from reality he was. In a sad way this helped my case I'm sure.
However I can easily see how it could have taken a completely different route. The whole ordeal was terrifying

How much were your legal fees for 15 court dates?! And how much was it for just the first time you went through the process?

If you couldn't afford it what would have happened?

Financial abuse is so common alongside other abuse. It's wrong that the minimal justice isn't available to those who can't afford it. And even then it took you 5 times through that hell.

You are amazingly strong your children are so lucky to have you.
I'm so glad it worked out in the end for you and your children are safe!

Sorry to everyone who suffered via the family courts.

In my case, my ex used the court to further his emotional abuse. He would play on the wording, allege that I had breached it, constant threats, withheld daughter, made numerous unfounded allegations, got the police involved which massively traumatised my daughter, had me driving 11 hours in a day on more then one occasion because he would refuse to return her.

I remember one time he told me on a Sunday at 3pm he wouldnt be able to return her after his weekend contact (bearing in mind he, who moved, lived nearly 300 miles away. He would do things like that, tell me at the last minute so not the day before, or the friday, and so too late to organise. I would have no choice but to drive and pick DD up, we got back at 3am both with school and work the next morning.
I felt so let down by my judge. To be fair the judge in the final hearing was good but I think thats because I kicked up a bit of a stink as best I could about the previous one and the fact my position statement hadnt even been read. I had letters from my work backing up the fact I could not leave work every second friday 3 hours early and the fact CAFCASS had stated that much travelling for DD so frequently was not in her best interests.

Purple

Thank you.
3 of the court cases were regarding child contact. The first 2 x court cases (4 hearings in total) there was evidence of abuse but at a lower level. I can understand why it all got tangled up and it was made out that it was no more than a toxic relationship.
The last court case was very very different, it was made clear there was abuse from the first hearing. This was before anyone had seen any evidence. I remember the judge saying "this is the hight of child protection, one of you are abusing these children". It was dreadful, obviously my ex was claiming I was also abusing them. Through time and solid evidence, and witnesses, it became clear what I was saying was correct and that I never abused my children.
Yes 100% he was financially abusing me, that was also discussed in court.
I received legal aid for some of it, then my situation changed and I paid for the remaining amount. I don't honestly think it made much difference if I had the money or not. My solicitor did legal aid work then sew me as a non legal aid customer, the service she provided was exactly the same. I guess the difference was that I occasionally used a barrister, which I guessing I couldn't have used if I had only legal aid??. I was in court/remotely approximately every 6 weeks for a year at this stage.
Talking about finances the children also had a legal aid certificate which I belive paid for the cafcass guardian and possibly their solicitor? I think that's just what happens when it gets to that serious level that the courts order a guardian and other stuff.
I have since represented myself in court (non molestation order) . I used a charity to help me fill in the paper work and guide me through the process, but represented myself in court.
I'm not at all implying the courts were perfect no not at all. There were some key players, namely social services, who did a dreadful job. I also had a barrister at one point who didn't get it at. The case was meant to be seen by one particular judge, but needless to say that didn't happen. I sew one judge twice but other than that it was always someone different.
I think (from my experience) it's a massive mixed bag, how it's going to go.
I think having very good evidence of abuse is really hard to come by. I think it's often not clear cut.
As someone else said going to court and getting court orders doesn't stop the abuse. I was still receiving abusive emails, text messages, what's app messages. Let alone the social media campaign he set out. The abuse towards myself and my children was also not physical.
I think the issue with the family courts, doesn't start with the courts but also with all the key players. Eg, a solicitor should be legally obliged to finish your case. Sending a different solicitor at the last minute is unexceptable, its something I hear all the time.
Social services and cafcass should be more accountable. It's unexceptable to write incorrect reports and there be little or no way of challenging it.
Also cancelling a hearing at the last min, again so so stressful and costly, where's the accountability? Maybe more realistic time scales should be set, then if a report isn't ready by x time, the financial implications fall of the organisation who was supposed to supply the report. Judges should take on a case and see it, though, to the end. Why is it common practice to arrive at court and find your case is being seen by a different judge??? All these inconsistencies just adds to the trauma and stress of it all.
Going to court felt like stepping into a different world to me, I had no control and was beyond terrified. When your having to revisit that every 6 weeks for a year, on top of parent two traumatised children and still deal with an abusive ex, that's grounds for real long term trama. Then at the end of it all your expected to give evidence. The questions went on for an hour and a half!!! It was probably the biggest trama of my life, and that was with a favable outcome.
Ps sorry for the essay!

Following…

I feel like you are writing my life story, reading this. From the social services, to the different judges, all of it.

The only difference for me was that I had a judge who was terrible. At first she was no-nonsense and stamped down on the other side's tricks, but then, having rules outcome A (in my favour) instead of outcome B (in his favour), a later court date she actually penalised me for not following outcome B. My barrister (5k cost) did not front her up with the fact her judgement was for option A, and my solicitor concurred; they can do that, apparently. Nobody holds them accountable. I then had to pay HIS costs, which were more than my own. This judge asked to follow the complicated case through to the end but I don't know what happened, we ended up with different judges and then finally it all came together. I was SO thankful that we switched judges.

My ex-husband was absolutely supported regarding financial abuse and control. A decade on and he lives with our sons the majority in a property worth over 1 million, complete with hot tub and swimming pool. Meanwhile, despite working, my home remains a three-bed private rental as I can't afford to buy.
The courts failed to recognise coercive control and glaringly obvious abuse on so many levels.
At least now I don't feel constantly scared and belittled.

Going through this right now. It’s a sham. Have so much evidence of what happened and the holes and lies in their statements. But because you don’t get to produce that til final hearing I’ve had to drop part of the case and we’ve been sent to mediation when we’re poles apart and very unlikely to agree as she won’t even admit incident happened any more. So frustrating

They always sweep it under the carpet and assume we are lying. I went through it and now thank fully my dds are adults. He’s done untold emotional damage in the years since to them but they seem ok and well rounded adults.
I'm sorry you’ve been through this too