Do I have kids or get divorced? I'm lost.

[GammaRay01]

My marriage of 3.5 years has been pretty miserable - plaugued by arguments, depression, chronic resentment, rejection, anger, etc. We have had loads of counselling and are now, on DH's ask, about to get started with a new counsellor, for a new perspective / plan (DH didn't feel our counsellor of 1.5 yrs now has been good). I have agreed but a part of me inside is wondering if we have reached the end of the road; I feel lost and I feel unsure in what I want anymore - do I want to stay married to DH and try to have the family I have hoped for; or do I leave now and not bring kids into what could eventually be a divorce anyway but with kids involved? I am 35 with a confirmed low egg reserve (my mum hit menopause by 40). I could concieve naturally at the moment though (but need IVF due to DH's infertility) and it feels like a divroce now might mean I never have kids. I may take a few years to recover and assuming I somehow meet someone i can trust again, my fertility will likely have tanked by then. How do i make a good decision / find myself a path, with such high stakes?

DH (36M) is a kind individual and a good man with several good qualities, but I just feel we have been awful in what we offer each other (ie. we bring out the worst in each other) and in how different our visions / world view seems to be. I am also shocked at some of the incidents particularly in the last 2 months and how much he is able to hurt me (was ready to walk out in the middle of an IVF round, was ready to walk out again recently because of an argument with his sibling which the sibling started, etc). I just feel differently towards him lately - like I love him but I am not attracted to him; I am bracing myself, I am guarded and aloof. He is being loving at the moment and is trying to make an effort (he has stopped IVF though because of the arguments and says he needs the time plus counselling). I just dont know what I am even doing anymore. Feels like everything is on pause and there is no end in sight. I want to find it in me to make an effort again and work on my marriage.... but I am so tired and so lost right now.

Making matters worse, lately, i also find myself attracted to a guy I barely know (I've said hello a couple of times at our local store). I find myself fantacising about romance /relationship with this guy a lot. I know this is just trouble and I dont want to cheat at all; I just wonder if the "lost" me is trying to find solcae somewhere...

Then it sounds to me like the therapist WAS very useful and you should have your answer on what to do next.

actually I think he sounds domineering and a bit of a bully, he just does it covertly by psychobabble and manipulation .

rather than hitting you to get his own way, he feels sad / get depressed / reneges on things that you have agreed / withdraws his co-operation / says spiteful things .

tell me Op, does he withhold attention / love / sex to punish you / when he is sad ?

If you say even the slightest thing that he doesn’t like ( eg please unload the dishwasher ), does he turn it into a huge row that goes on all night ?

Then run. Quickly.

@Tiddlypomtiddlypom but is there any perfect family? Dont families always come with their dynamics?

This is as far from normal family dynamics as you can get OP!

Being in therapy for 1.5 years of a 3.5 year marriage is not normal.

@TUCKINGFYP0 rather than hitting you to get his own way, he feels sad / get depressed / reneges on things that you have agreed / withdraws his co-operation / says spiteful things .

I think yes... above does summarise how I have felt about how he behaves.

tell me Op, does he withhold attention / love / sex to punish you / when he is sad ?

On this one... yes and no. Yes I dont get sex, attention, love, etc when he is sad but I dont know its a deliberate act. I think he genuinely doesnt feel like any of that when he is sad or depressed and I guess I can understand that.

We barely have sex anymore. In the last 3.5 years, that has steadily declined. We have sex maybe once in a month or two in the last couple of years (when we were trying to concieve, I was tracking ovulation days, etc so there was a bit more effort every month on certain days, but once we found out about the infertility and IVF, it slipped back to the rare occasion).

@GammaRay01 I also have a low egg reserve, I only found out at 32 once I was no longer with my emotionally abusive ex and with my current wonderful husband. Mine was much lower than yours (AMH 2) meaning that I was past the point of being able to conceive with my own eggs. After 4 years of infertility we are now finally pregnant using a Donor Egg 💕. Sometimes I wonder if I had tried to get pregnant earlier with my ex how that would have played out, I would likely have been able to conceive at that age (27-30), however I know 100% I would rather become a parent with my current husband, even though it's not by using my own eggs. I know it's very hard to have this low egg reserve information when you're in an unhappy relationship, I might have been tempted to try too. But trust me, going through IVF is hard enough (and not guaranteed) even in a stable happy relationship, let alone parenting with someone who you're in constant conflict with. Personally I would separate, freeze embryos using donor sperm and give yourself a couple of years to meet someone else. I met my husband only 3 months after I left my ex. It might work with someone new or if not you have your embryos as backup.xx

There is absolutely no way I would want to bring a child into this situation. Dh and I have a really strong relationship (together 15 years and married for 12). We had literally had one argument ever before we had dc (about planned spending on a joint holiday - nothing even particularly interesting or volatile!). Having children is very, very hard on a relationship and even strong relationships crumble under the pressure. If you want a child, I would have a child alone with a sperm donor. Then you get to call the shots, make the decisions for your child, and not bring them into a life full of drama. You're in the easy days of a relationship still, so there is just no way you'd survive having a baby together.

Yes they do.

But you can choose not to create new and awful ones by bringing children into an already difficult dynamic.

He’s not choosing you. He’s choosing his mum. He’s looking for a new therapist to affirm that choice, and make you agree. It’s very much not good news and you don’t have time to wait.

I was the child of two parents who brought out the worst in each other (and finally divorced when I was mid 30s). It was horrendous and did me emotional damage which can never be undone.

End your marriage.

@NoSquirrels i was talking about his family when i said "but is there any perfect family? Dont families always come with their dynamics?" ... as someone said i should run from his family's dynamics.

The more you post the more I think the man sounds like a controlling, manipulative monster. He's using his toxic family as an excuse to treat you badly, "I can't help my behaviour, I'm such a victim, my life is just so hard".

It could even be true frankly, but mental health issues or psychological damage are NOT excuses for treating you badly.

I would suggest you seem one-to-one counselling rather than couples counselling. Couples counselling is not advised for people in abusive relationships. I also think it's interesting that he doesn't like the current cousellor - has he/she started to suggest that his behaviour is a problem?

It shouldn't be this hard. Walk.

If you desperately want children and embryos are better than eggs, why not freeze some embryos with a sperm donor?

@Manichean It wasn't him that had an argument with his sibling. It was me. It was me (in front of him) and his sibling had started it.. and I requested them several times to not go there.

Just stop, it wouldn't right to bring a child into such a relationship. everyone has problems, but even think of bringing a baby into such a poor dynamic is selfish, IMO.
I'm sure you want a child, but I don't think this is the way.

Perhaps what you really need is not joint counselling, but individual counselling.

I'll suggest again, in case it got lost: solo parenthood.

Your desire to have children is understandable and I personally relate; however, not in a relationship that's in this state.

@tattygrl thank you. Yes i have thought of solo parenting and I must admit i am terrified. I have no support network - my family are all abroad; i have a small group of friends but not the kind i can really lean on for extensive support. Financially, I am a good earner but i have safety net of rich family, etc; my income and my savings (which aren't huge) is all i have. I worry if i will even be able to buy him out of his share of our home (and if I did manage to, how big a change that would be for me financially and a huge lifestyle adjustment). So to bring kids into this solo is a scary scary idea.

Correction.. I DONT HAVE have safety net of rich family, inheritance, etc;

Well done for admitting that you stay and put up with the crap and are considering staying and putting up with more crap if that is your only perceived chance of having a baby because you think that you may be the problem - meaning any future relationship with an adult or even your own child might be doomed.

Doubting yourself makes you stay where you are no matter how bad it actually is or how bad it may be in the future. It makes you overly optimistic. You live with dichotomies - we love each other - we bring out the worse in each other. It is always 'we' not 'I'. You also become enmeshed.

You need to separate 'we' from 'I' and the relationship from becoming a mother. As long as you see him as your only/best chance of becoming a mother you are handing him a powerful means of control. As long as you think you may be the problem he would still have this power if you became a mother with him.

I know.

And I was pointing out that you’d be perpetuating generational dysfunction by bringing a child into this existing extended family.

Kids aren't an entitlement. I could want be a doctor but I haven't the qualifications. You're currently in a unhealthy relationship with someone who brings out the worst in you and vice versa. Not only would you be a fool to have kids, you'd also be selfish.

I'm glad you recognise its probably a bad idea. But it scares me that you'd even consider it.

He can be nice but not to you
He uses sulking & silent treatment to get his own way,
He has "baggage" that makes this OK apparently
He has unilaterally decided to stop trying to have a baby
Come on, you know he is not good husband or father material, & will carry on the same behaviour with any children, its who he is & it works.
There are other houses. You can sell. Dont get stuck in the sunken costs fallacy
You need individual therapy & extricate yourself fast

Yeah, the thing is, it sounds like it’s mostly him, but it’s probably is also you to a degree, but not in the way you or he presently think.

The toxic family that he won’t acknowledge as dysfunctional and puts ahead of you is another huge red flag. Do you want them having access to your future child away from your supervision?

The problem sounds like you are sick of being treated poorly by his family and are attempting to put boundaries in place to protect yourself but he refuses to acknowledge their behaviour is an issue (because he’s inured to it) and acts like you should just suck up the poor treatment for the sake of appearances. Your feelings are irrelevant to them and him and it hurts you that he won’t take your side.

Your real problem, I’m guessing, is that your own boundaries are soft enough that you ended up married to someone who shows clear signs of emotional unavailability. When you didn’t get respect and kindness from him, rather than taking a step back and thinking, “Huh… I deserve better than half-hearted care, so this isn’t the relationship for me” and leaving, you thought (maybe) “This may be my last chance at kids and nobody’s perfect so I’m just going to make this work.” But you can’t fix someone who doesn’t want to be fixed.

Nobody is perfect but the right person will want to work on improving things with you. You won’t have to push for it (which is feeling controlling to him), he’ll be willing, not resistant. You need to accept that your husband doesn’t really want to change. He thinks he and his family are just fine. And maybe someone who comes from a similar background to him won’t be so “sensitive” to their behaviours. But you are. So it’s not right for YOU.

Take a real stand for yourself because your husband ain’t gonna.

I was in exactly the same situation 14 years ago. We had an ivf baby and split 7 mths later.
Just so messy and wished I'd walked ( I was 35 ).