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Original poster

Do I have kids or get divorced? I'm lost.

136 replies

GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 00:44

My marriage of 3.5 years has been pretty miserable - plaugued by arguments, depression, chronic resentment, rejection, anger, etc. We have had loads of counselling and are now, on DH's ask, about to get started with a new counsellor, for a new perspective / plan (DH didn't feel our counsellor of 1.5 yrs now has been good). I have agreed but a part of me inside is wondering if we have reached the end of the road; I feel lost and I feel unsure in what I want anymore - do I want to stay married to DH and try to have the family I have hoped for; or do I leave now and not bring kids into what could eventually be a divorce anyway but with kids involved? I am 35 with a confirmed low egg reserve (my mum hit menopause by 40). I could concieve naturally at the moment though (but need IVF due to DH's infertility) and it feels like a divroce now might mean I never have kids. I may take a few years to recover and assuming I somehow meet someone i can trust again, my fertility will likely have tanked by then. How do i make a good decision / find myself a path, with such high stakes?

DH (36M) is a kind individual and a good man with several good qualities, but I just feel we have been awful in what we offer each other (ie. we bring out the worst in each other) and in how different our visions / world view seems to be. I am also shocked at some of the incidents particularly in the last 2 months and how much he is able to hurt me (was ready to walk out in the middle of an IVF round, was ready to walk out again recently because of an argument with his sibling which the sibling started, etc). I just feel differently towards him lately - like I love him but I am not attracted to him; I am bracing myself, I am guarded and aloof. He is being loving at the moment and is trying to make an effort (he has stopped IVF though because of the arguments and says he needs the time plus counselling). I just dont know what I am even doing anymore. Feels like everything is on pause and there is no end in sight. I want to find it in me to make an effort again and work on my marriage.... but I am so tired and so lost right now.

Making matters worse, lately, i also find myself attracted to a guy I barely know (I've said hello a couple of times at our local store). I find myself fantacising about romance /relationship with this guy a lot. I know this is just trouble and I dont want to cheat at all; I just wonder if the "lost" me is trying to find solcae somewhere...

OP posts:
toucaninjapan · 17/05/2023 11:58

Personally I'd ditch that husband and get pregnant through a sperm donor in this situation. You (as a couple with DH) don't seem to be a possible healthy environment for raising a baby with all the arguments you already have and birth of a child will definitely add more stress.

Manichean · 17/05/2023 11:59

Is he one of these men who is nice to everyone except his wife. Walking out on you during IVF and because he argued with his sibling sound like punishing behaviours. And your 'weaknesses' 'triggering' him - fucking horse shit. He won't improve if you have children.

standardduck · 17/05/2023 12:02

Why would you even consider having children when your marriage is not working out? I think it would be very unfair to your children to grow up seeing their parents are not happy together.

End your marriage and consider having a baby on your own.

TheSnootiestFox · 17/05/2023 12:03

Right, this is my one post on here because I'm going to get absolutely crucified and probably quite rightly, but you do both.

I had the most awful marriage from day 1, but I was 32 with known fertility problems so stuck with it to have my two amazing babies. A sperm donor is not a proper father, and how ever you feel about your husband at least they'll have someone to call dad. I'm assuming that absolutely every other poster has never struggled to meet a partner that actually wants children and I certainly wouldn't want to have to explain to my kids that I'd never met their father. Stick with it, have your babies and then go. Not ideal but better than ending up childless. Just don't do what I did and end up on antidepressants that numb your feelings so I stayed a lot longer than I should have after baby number 2. Good luck x

forgotmyusername1 · 17/05/2023 12:04

get a divorce and have a baby on your own with donated sperm

Paperbagsaremine · 17/05/2023 12:06

It's an awful situation OP and I am so sorry.

That said - the thing about kids is putting them first. Don't bring kids into this. It's one thing to do what my parents did, which is to have kids when they hoped (I will say VERY NAIIVELY) that they would have a long and happy marriage. They were young and dumb with very few people to advise them.

The fallout from the unhappy marriage and aftermath still affects me & siblings fifty years later. Don't knowingly do that to kids.

That's my take - it's up to you what you do.

forgotmyusername1 · 17/05/2023 12:08

TheSnootiestFox · 17/05/2023 12:03

Right, this is my one post on here because I'm going to get absolutely crucified and probably quite rightly, but you do both.

I had the most awful marriage from day 1, but I was 32 with known fertility problems so stuck with it to have my two amazing babies. A sperm donor is not a proper father, and how ever you feel about your husband at least they'll have someone to call dad. I'm assuming that absolutely every other poster has never struggled to meet a partner that actually wants children and I certainly wouldn't want to have to explain to my kids that I'd never met their father. Stick with it, have your babies and then go. Not ideal but better than ending up childless. Just don't do what I did and end up on antidepressants that numb your feelings so I stayed a lot longer than I should have after baby number 2. Good luck x

but having a baby with husband means being tied to him forever - it could get nasty after a divorce with issues with maintenance, access. Is it fair to husband to have a baby with him knowing she will divorce him and he is then on the hook for maintenance for 18 years when she never intended with them staying together - that is deceptive behaviour.

Bythecooker · 17/05/2023 12:09

I noticed in one of your posts you said maybe it was you. I had a very similar toxic relationship. We brought the worst out in each other. I did have a baby and she is wonderful (& no longer a,baby). We did not stay together. I have had a couple of relationships since and none have been like that one so do not think there is something wrong with you that the relationship is not working.

gogohmm · 17/05/2023 12:12

I know it's scary to take the leap but a far better partner could be just around the corner (maybe literally) I met dp just 7 months after my marriage ended, if I wasnt older I would have been able to commit to kids pretty fast, sometimes it's just so right (we both had adult kids so not on the cards)

Don't waste your life, 1.5 years of therapy already tells me it's not savable

tattygrl · 17/05/2023 12:14

Having a child with this man will link you to him forever. This is someone who you believe treats/will treat others with kindness, but not you, for whatever reason. You say you think you bring out the worst in each other. OP, set yourself free. You have a whole lot more life left to live. Don't bind yourself to this person for the rest of it.

There are a lot of people nowadays going for the option of solo parenting. Look up Preciousstars on youtube and instagram, for example. She has a network of other solo mums, so it's not necessarily an isolating or lonely path at all. I think you should funnel your energies into the life you want, i.e. children, family, and as your life grows, so will your potential for a happy relationship at the right time and with the right person. Focus your energies, love and attention on the things you positively want in life. Don't settle for this OP. Any kids between you and your current DH will sense the unhappiness, and that's a bad environment to grow up in.

Original poster
GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:14

@OhBling I dont know; I guess i am sensitive to unfairness / partiality / inequality / exclusive behaviours. I guess I expect him to acknowledge it in the least (between the two of us) and at times to do something about it (gently / subtly). He on the other hand wants to not see it or hear about it, never be seen as rocking any boat or being any agent of change. His persona is the easy-going ameanable guy that will never notice a negative thing even if it slaps him in the face. There are people in his life (and his own values / inner self), that make him feel very guilty if he doesnt live up to their expectations. All of this came up in the counselling; I guess this has been at the root of a lot of the conflict, in the course of which he has come to view me as being controlling and wanting to exercise his autonomy... and I have come to see him as weak and as being callous, unsupportive and biased.

It has led him to push me away from people in his life and I have in turn accepted that and am very detached from (and avoidant of) people in his life. It depresses him and he says he will never be happy if I cannot have a closer relationship with people in his life (and it is because he is unhappy that he has stopped IVF; having taken 2.5 years to even agree to start trying. He has been very depressed and even took anti-depressants for 6 months). I on the other hand am tired of being judged and being assessed based on how I get along with people in his life. I dont understand why his overriding commitment and priority isnt us and the family we would build (and instead has been about how much I help him preserve his relationships with others).

OP posts:
Testino · 17/05/2023 12:18

Poor kids! That a person who's already miserable and thinking of divorce can even consider having kids is beyond irresponsible. Already makes you a questionable would-be parent.

Please sort yourself out first, not bring another life to suffer with you.

Original poster
GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:25

@TheSnootiestFox Yes this is what I have been toying with and am torn about. I could just have the kids with him and then break up I suppose. Financially for IVF, I am better off with him as we share all the costs (double the income, etc). Its deceptive but I feel he leaves me little choice - he changed his mind about kids after we married and spent 2.5 years in a dilema about whether he wanted kids. About a year ago an ultimatum made him agree to start trying; 6 months in we find out about infertility and even after that his focus and priority is not on building our family (and being supportive of me through the process).

But... the idea of bringing kids into a relationship so bad, just feels so wrong.

Being in this place in life feels awful. Choices are to bring kids into what might be a marriage failed in future, or to accept I may never have my own kids (in leaving my marriage now or killing time with endless counselling...).

OP posts:
MrsSlocombesCat · 17/05/2023 12:26

IVF is often unsuccessful. You would be better off taking a chance on someone new, far better off if the marriage is unhappy. What are you waiting for? No-one can change your life except for you. Leave, move on, find someone new to have a baby with. Conceiving naturally is a far more likely scenario.

Original poster
GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:28

There is always room for self-improvement but sometimes it's not that we have weaknesses but that we annoy people we're not compatible with

@PaintedEgg - I agree, this is what I think at times too....

OP posts:
NoSquirrels · 17/05/2023 12:29

If he’s always been undecided about children, then you would be very unwise indeed to carry on with IVF with him.

TUCKINGFYP0 · 17/05/2023 12:29

Don’t have children with him ( even if you can). He will use them against you, he will treat them unfairly to get at you. He is already using the IVF to punish and control you.

He is not cruel to you because you “ trigger him “, he is cruel and controlling because THATS WHO HE IS.

Get out now, he is not a good man and he won’t be a good father.

If children are your priority , look at AID or adoption. Or hope to meet a good man ( though I fear that in your desperation you will find it hard to make a good choice ).

Even if you never have a child by any means, you need to get out now for your own sanity.

NoSquirrels · 17/05/2023 12:31

GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:14

@OhBling I dont know; I guess i am sensitive to unfairness / partiality / inequality / exclusive behaviours. I guess I expect him to acknowledge it in the least (between the two of us) and at times to do something about it (gently / subtly). He on the other hand wants to not see it or hear about it, never be seen as rocking any boat or being any agent of change. His persona is the easy-going ameanable guy that will never notice a negative thing even if it slaps him in the face. There are people in his life (and his own values / inner self), that make him feel very guilty if he doesnt live up to their expectations. All of this came up in the counselling; I guess this has been at the root of a lot of the conflict, in the course of which he has come to view me as being controlling and wanting to exercise his autonomy... and I have come to see him as weak and as being callous, unsupportive and biased.

It has led him to push me away from people in his life and I have in turn accepted that and am very detached from (and avoidant of) people in his life. It depresses him and he says he will never be happy if I cannot have a closer relationship with people in his life (and it is because he is unhappy that he has stopped IVF; having taken 2.5 years to even agree to start trying. He has been very depressed and even took anti-depressants for 6 months). I on the other hand am tired of being judged and being assessed based on how I get along with people in his life. I dont understand why his overriding commitment and priority isnt us and the family we would build (and instead has been about how much I help him preserve his relationships with others).

Oh worse and worse. He has parent issues - he’ll never put you above them.

You must, for the sake of your own sanity, extricate yourself.

OhBling · 17/05/2023 12:33

GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:14

@OhBling I dont know; I guess i am sensitive to unfairness / partiality / inequality / exclusive behaviours. I guess I expect him to acknowledge it in the least (between the two of us) and at times to do something about it (gently / subtly). He on the other hand wants to not see it or hear about it, never be seen as rocking any boat or being any agent of change. His persona is the easy-going ameanable guy that will never notice a negative thing even if it slaps him in the face. There are people in his life (and his own values / inner self), that make him feel very guilty if he doesnt live up to their expectations. All of this came up in the counselling; I guess this has been at the root of a lot of the conflict, in the course of which he has come to view me as being controlling and wanting to exercise his autonomy... and I have come to see him as weak and as being callous, unsupportive and biased.

It has led him to push me away from people in his life and I have in turn accepted that and am very detached from (and avoidant of) people in his life. It depresses him and he says he will never be happy if I cannot have a closer relationship with people in his life (and it is because he is unhappy that he has stopped IVF; having taken 2.5 years to even agree to start trying. He has been very depressed and even took anti-depressants for 6 months). I on the other hand am tired of being judged and being assessed based on how I get along with people in his life. I dont understand why his overriding commitment and priority isnt us and the family we would build (and instead has been about how much I help him preserve his relationships with others).

OP, please don't take this the wrong way but... this is all completely gobbledly gook and a lot of bollocks. It makes no sense.

But I think it's that there are issues in the relationship that he doesn't want to address or change and then he gets upset with you when you change your behaviours in order to feel better/cope better?

And all the pseudo psycho-babble is just a way to not face the reality.

But I'll say this - why would you want to be with someone you seek as callous, weak and unsupportive?

And why would he want to be with someone he sees as controlling?

Original poster
GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:36

@OhBling because we love each other and have been trying to understand each other's perspective... we have been trying to find the middle ground...

OP posts:
NoSquirrels · 17/05/2023 12:38

Have you read anything about toxic family dynamics, OP? Golden child and scapegoat etc.? Fear, obligation, guilt (FOG)? If not, do some googling and see if your husband’s behaviour and his family of origin display any of these hallmarks.

Tiddlypomtiddlypom · 17/05/2023 12:40

I wonder if you’ve ‘over therapied’.

There's a whole lot of jargon here.

But sifting through, your husband sounds like he’s too willing to try to hurt you and uses your fertility to do so, is too mindful of what other people think of him and by association you, and he’s not prepared to put you first.

It all sounds shit and way too hard.

FFF3 · 17/05/2023 12:43

You’ve been in counselling for 1.5 years of a 3.5 year marriage?! You know the answer. To have kids with this man would be utter madness and totally selfish on your part towards any future children - children push relationships to their absolute breaking point a lot of the time. You are considering bringing them into what already sounds like a toxic atmosphere. Please please don’t.

Original poster
GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 12:46

@NoSquirrels Yes there is FOG in DH's family and the therapist called them "enmeshed". I think his mum is v domineering (and a bit of a bully).

OP posts:
FFF3 · 17/05/2023 12:47

GammaRay01 · 17/05/2023 11:32

I guess, what if its me? What if I am the problem and if i leave this relationship and go into another one, I am just carrying my problem from one relationship to the next? What if I focus on improving myself instead? On addressing my weaknesses that trigger him?

Errrm - break up, get individual therapy and then enter into a new relationship as a more healthy individual?

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