Organisational skills for husband who don't get it

[demotedreally]

Ok I know I am going to get a load of grief for having married a. Man who doesn't seem to get life, but perhaps some people can cut through the crap and help me out a bit. Things didn't used to be this bad but I would say have never been great in this area.

We have a busy life, 2 full time jobs, a renovation and 3 kids all at primary, at least one of whom has SEN. The SEN is news to us in the last 6 months but is dominating our family dynamic (things have got bad quick).

In the meantime my husband seems to have lost control on daily life and I am doing everything, non stop and helping him to do his stuff too.

In recent weeks and months - I have organized the shit out of our lives to try to help - we have routines, a calendar, white board, a meal planner. My eldest children help with it all and tend to know what is going on, who should be where and what is for tea.

Dh doesn't seem to have a clue. He doesn't follow the meal planner on his cooking nights which upsets everyone (causes a mtdown for sen child), prepares meals for my cooking nights, picks up kids on my nights, "forgets what day it is", can't get them to bed on time (last night was 2130 instead of 2015). They always leave the house late on his drop offs.

I am trying to get tips from the internet on parenting together but it is all about shared values etc. Like prioritizing education or approach to discipline. We are nowhere near those discussions. He has no skin in those games. I just do it. "He can't get them to read, do homework, practice piano" etc etc. He wastes a lot of time - by forgetting stuff or coming back for things etc, his job is dishwasher and it takes him much of the evening to load it and sweep the floor.

He gets everyone's backs up by just giving out instructions and repeating them, which doesn't work as an approach. He doesn't consider the impact of this,he doesn't have fun with them particularly or listen to them much.

He is loving towards them. He is very willing in lots of ways. For eg he forgot to go to b&q earlier but when I reminded him off he went. (I just wish he hadn't actually forgotten of course)

We have run out of words for a discussion on this all. It is just a row. And the tension is not helping the kids. And although they love him, they think he is a fool for forgetting to cook the agreed meal, not knowing it is non uniform day etc.

And the burden on me is ridiculous.
(He also can't manage sen child behavior and literally stands there while dc is violent and bites.)

How do I change this dynamic? We are stuck.

Whoh loads of messages and they all merit further consideration than I can give them now, so I will reread them later.

I clearly need to look at ADHD again. The bullet points above don't seem to apply to him, but I accept I am not an expert. He has a desk job and likes nothing more than spending the evening at his computer also sitting. He doesn't get enough time to do this in general (his view). He doesn't click pens, get up or down or have a restless mind. In all our relationship if I have asked him what he is thinking he will say nothing! I think he is overwhelmed however and I may be misunderstanding what I see.

I'm not totally sure the routine is overscheduled other than by necessity. The schedule is contains the times we need to leave for school, what needs to be taken - standard stuff, but glasses / water bottles / jumpers get forgotten all the time. I have made a note of things for him to check he has at pick up but Im not going to put it on a post it note and give it to him that is too much. He never checks what they bring home and did actually say to me the other day - perhaps we should check their bags at pick up to make sure they have their stuff... I boggled. So now I just buy more jumpers / water bottles etc.

We could ditch dance and piano, but frankly it is a shitty enough home life when your brother bites you and your parents seem to argue a lot so I am not that warm to doing that to the older two.

The point of trying to organise it all is to reduce and simplify, but perhaps it feels like it is complicating things I will take on the suggestions though and think it all though again.

External childcare is an interesting point. we used to have a nanny, we are currently using after school club. I guess it is only really working ok. But the kids like it there and when the older two go to high school I will regret not having dc3 well settled there I think. But we don't have any external help at all these days and I don't really have a life other than this

(To answer the question above - I was at home last night trying to talk to dc1 and 2. DH was putting dc3 to bed having failed the previous day. At 2030 he had not managed PJ's teeth or late supper. It took me 1h to get dc3 calmed down enough and into bed which I also did alongside the other 2. Dc1 read to dc3 to calm him down "to help you out daddy as you can't get him to bed"

There's a lot to unpick here and you've had lots of advice.

Even if you don't think your DH has ADHD, I think it would be worthwhile checking out some life tips for people with this and seeing if they help - How to ADHD on YouTube is good.

Then pick one thing and see if you can both use an intervention to improve that area - eg. use Alexa to set reminders for when they need to do things in the morning routine, or prepping the pasta dish the night before so it's quicker.

It might be useful for you to acknowledge to your DH that you know he's trying really hard and putting the same amount of effort into parenting as you but for whatever reason he's finding it all difficult to meet all the demands that this creates. Because it sounds like he's trying.

I agree with this and am similar. I work part time because I know I could not do my job full time and manage my household. I have to keep things simple too. I try really hard to keep things together and after all these years trying, I manage most of the time. My husband is very patient with me when I lose my

He doesn't necessarily need to have ADHD. Even a normal person can drop balls if you make them juggle enough balls. To be honest it sounds like everything in your home is organized for the convenience of the kids - you don't want to drop dance and piano (no need to drop both, you could just drop one, by the way), you don't want to use a nanny because they are settled in the after-school program, you don't want your dh to make all three water bottles because the older two want to do their own, but aren't consistent enough to do it without supervision, and so on. (What is "non-uniform day"? Is that basically a day to trip up parents by having something that is different than the regular? Cuz that's what it sounds like.) I don't know how old your kids are, but if they are old enough for you to be thinking about high school soon then maybe they are old enough to learn by experience that if I leave my jumper at school then I'll be cold tomorrow.

In general, I don't think the solution for an overly complicated org chart is an even more complicated org chart with more specific instructions.

Wow I wouldn't want to be your husband, life totally controlled at home and at work. It may work for you, but it obviously isn't working for him. He must be overwhelmed, especially as you appear to be judging him and making him feel inadequate

Agree. I don't much want to be me either, so I guess it falls to someone to do something about it.

I was at home last night trying to talk to dc1 and 2. DH was putting dc3 to bed having failed the previous day. At 2030 he had not managed PJ's teeth or late supper. It took me 1h to get dc3 calmed down enough and into bed which I also did alongside the other 2. Dc1 read to dc3 to calm him down "to help you out daddy as you can't get him to bed"

This makes me actually wince - you're supposed to be on Team DH (and he on yours) and that your kids are picking up this narrative that daddy's a bit useless is really not good.

Are you becoming contemptuous of him? Because there's no coming back from contempt really.

If water bottles are a big issue, then go back to the way DH was doing it before. It's not really a huge step in independence for the dc to do it themselves - or you know, if it is, then maybe they need to have the consequences when they forget, rather than it being held as DH's fault.

Piano and dance are no compensation for a turbulent homelife.

Some people thrive in structure (you), but I'm not sure it works for your DH. It'll be shaking his confidence/self-esteem to be "failing" at these (trivial) things, having his children treat him like he's incompetent, which in turn will make it harder for him to get it "right" through stress. You've got to look at the big picture for you as a family and really, jumpers left at school or whatnot, is probably not the hill you should want your marriage to die on.

I guess it's worth pointing out that if it is an executive disorder function issue then the schedules and lists won't help him. They're good for you and for the dc to learn to check and create habits etc but DH would struggle to actually use them in the way others would.
There are some great threads on here for ADHD parents on how they cope/streamline their lives which might have some good tips regardless of if he has it or not
I've added one of the adult screening questionnaires too.

You say he doesn't follow the plan which seems like a big problem, otherwise why bother having one. Perhaps get him to co-plan so he's not just carrying out your instructions

I don't understand why so many people are saying the husband must have ADHD. Sounds like a hectic life, planned to enth degree in isolation by OP. It's not surprising he's dropping the ball? Sounds like a nightmare (I'm very organised, but just reading OPs lists makes me feel tired!)

I bet if you left him to it for a couple of days, he'd work out his own system and it would be fine

There seems to be an assumption that I have deliberately left him out of all this. I haven't. He doesn't want to do any of it though. He agrees it is a good idea to have a shopping list / calendar but doesn't actually contribute to it. There comes a time when you give up and just get on with it yourself doesn't there?

I genuinely don't think there are any schedules beyond the normal. I understand most people to have a calendar, to try to remember to take shit to school/work, lots of people meal plan, parents generally know who is dropping off or picking up on any given day. People also have cleaning rotas or schedules, use tasking apps etc. We don't do that. It is all normal stuff. I'm not unilaterally deciding very much at all. School set the start time. The bus decides when it is picking up. I've listened to the kids re the food and tried a million times to discuss it with DH. It is bog standard life isn't it???

I know makes you all wince etc but you see this crap up and down family houses all over the country. It is how people manage life.

Fuck knows what DHs normal would look like if I wasn't there, but he and I agree that he would find it pretty hard and the children would too.

I would try dropping everything extra for the rest of the school year and see if everyone can get a grip on the basics.

Sounds like a calmer home environment would benefit everyone.

Instead of chopping and changing every day try splitting responsibilities by task.
You do all the drop offs, he does all the picks ups for example - then everyone is just remembering one place at one time.
You do all the cooking dinner, he does all the cleaning up/dishwasher.
If you want 'getting water bottles ready' to be his job, then just let him do it. It seems like his way resulted in everybody going to school with a filled up water bottle, so job done.

If you can all make a simplified version of life run for 6 months, then start adding extra activities in again and see what you can cope with.

Just to be clear - he didn't consistently remember hot water bottles that why I started getting the kids to do it

We have split the tasks. He doesn't consistently remember the split. I do the washing,he does the dishwasher. I wash everything that needs washing, he washes up most of what is on top of the dishwasher

We don't have 9-5 type jobs with fixed hours. If one of us has a trip to London etc we have to move things about. Again,so far so normal.

I'm not trying to be difficult but this isn't about the water bottles. It is about the whole lot. I can solve the water bottles by just doing it myself but at some point I start to fall over and that's where we are.

I genuinely cannot just remove stuff from life for 6 months. Ive already explained why dance stays. School also has to stay too of course...

I'm losing focus a bit on this now, so I am going to reflect a bit

So you have a very busy and complicated life, and he can't cope with the level of organisation needed.
Your only options seem to be - simplify your life to a level he can cope with, or do more of the organisation yourself.

Or - employ a nanny-housekeeper who will keep on top of organising the children for school, cooking dinner, school runs, supervising homework etc.

It's not the routine that makes me wince, it's the attitude the children are picking up towards their dad.

Another late diagnosed ADHDer chiming in to say I recognise myself in your husband. I'm now on medication and generally life is much much better. I have put lots of things in place to keep me on track and get things done, but it's still a daily struggle to remember to use them.

EVERYTHING needs a prompt or reminder, I even have a water bottle that lights up and flashes at me because I forget to drink and get headaches without realising why. Alexa reminders are set for daily tasks but they need changing regularly otherwise I get used to ignoring them. I have to write everything down and trick myself by making all appointments earlier than they really are. It doesn't always work.

For example, today I went to a meeting at my son's school. The meeting was supposed to be on Monday, I got mixed up and turned up on the wrong day. It was in my diary for Monday, I've spoken to people about my meeting on Monday. I didn't check my diary.

It's mortifying. I'm a reasonable intelligent woman but my executive function simply doesn't work.

In general, I don't think the solution for an overly complicated org chart is an even more complicated org chart with more specific instructions.

This made me smile, this is totally me, lists, charts, colours, timings. I don't think it has ever occurred to me that you can't fix something by better organisation and/ or planning, eye opening.

I'm not surprised, there's been a lot on this thread. A lot useful but a lot that I think unfairly blames the OP as controlling and expecting way too much of her DH. If she didn't do everything, he would clearly not manage anything!

I said early in the thread that it sounds like ADHD, probably inattentive type. However living with someone who struggles with executive function can be very hard! I probably have ADHD, my DS does and it now seems to explain me, and my DH can find it hard when I'm not able to manage well.

There's no need for people to pile on the OP that she's created this issue by using organisational charts, she's HAD to!

I think the OP has touched a nerve in a lot of posters tbh.

@demotedreally it's really hard being married to someone with poor executive function so give yourself credit for holding everything together this long. It doesn't sound sustainable though, so you'll need to make changes together to make it work in the long run, and it might mean changing your expectations. I'm sure you'll work out a new way forward though, as a team.

Does it? Why?

Why is that relevant?

No. It's not "bog standard life". You seem to think that it's "normal" but it's not. There are people who do it, but most have something that takes the load off. They have grandparents who do a lot of running around. They have a nanny. Once or both partners work part time. They have fewer children.

You are someone who can live like that. Your husband is someone who can't. Something big has to give. A nanny might help,or one of you going part time.