Husband is lying I'm sure...what do I do?

[scaredofdoingitallwrong]

My husband and I have been together 17 years and have 2 children 11 and 14.

He's recently started a new job and told me he had to away for training on Friday / Saturday 2 hours away. No issues, I'm often by myself with the kids. Then Friday afternoon he called me to say he was late arriving as were some other people and he'd have to stay Saturday night too as they'd finish the training on Sunday.

This seemed a bit weird to me. He sent me a photo from where he supposedly was on Saturday. I did check and the location was right.
Then 8am on Sunday he sent me a photo of the training course. Only it was a screenshot, no metadata attached.

I looked again at the deleted photo from Saturday and it was taken 10 days previously.

When he got home on Sunday I confronted him about these photos and asked him what was going on. He seemed a bit flustered and admitted the photo was not taken on Saturday and he didn't know why he did it. He showed me his photo on his phone and one was a hotel lobby looking one where he said they'd got coffee. When I asked to look at the details the location was 30 minutes from our house in a different direction to where he said he was 2+ hours away and taken at 9:30 Saturday morning.

He had no explanation for that other than the phone was wrong and that was taken on Friday. He then got really cross and started shouting and one of the kids came in.

When I asked again to see the photo as it was eating me up he would let me touch his phone and he had deleted the metadata. Although he claims he hadn't. I told him I just wanted an explanation. He threatened one of his "tantrums" if I carried on talking about it. So I dropped it as I'm in shock.

Our marriage has been very up and down for years, mainly due to different sex drives. It's very down at the moment, we're basically just living in the same house.

In the last 12 months or so he has started working away at weekends occasionally which I had initially joked meant he was having an affair. He's stopped even trying to initiate sex for 8 months since we had a massive argument on holiday.

He's either having an affair or going to orgies or something isn't he? I need to speak to a solicitor don't I ?

To be a shit partner, you need to be in a partnership. You’re not.

He sounds like a nasty piece of work. Ignore the haters - I think they are escapees from Menz Rights.

I think it's time to go, OP. So many people tie themselves in knots to prove their partner's infidelity beyond a shadow of a doubt but I think it's enough to end a relationship when the trust is so badly damaged, you check the metadata on a photo he's sent you.

Life is too short and you'll just drive yourself bonkers reading into everything he says or does. You already know he's a liar - what else is there without trust?

If you're not ready to leave just yet, I'd recommend going to therapy by yourself (if it's an option, I realise it's not financially feasible for many). Focus on what you want as an individual and then build a better life for you and your kids.

OP ignore posters bashing you for asking to see the metadata. I know how it feels when you sense something isn't quite right, but you're being lied to and gaslighted.

It's quite clear, something dodgy is going on. No one needs to send fake screenshots or old photos to prove where they are, and whether it's an affair or not you're clearly better off without him and his pathetic tantrums. I know it's not easy, but in the long run you will be much happier without him.

100% he is cheating and I’d bet on one of those married dating sites too. Work training just doesn’t inexplicably go over into another weekend day. People have lives.

He will be justifying it in the basis that he doesn’t “get enough sex” and may actually be telling an AP that he doesn’t want to leave the marriage.

But it’s very clear he is guilty, that it’s been going on for quite some time and so you need to decide if you can ever stay in this relationship. Sounds like the trust is justifiably gone. I wouldn’t expend energy trying to get more proof or metadata. But decide what you want to do going forward.

Yes. You do sound like you've gone off the deep end.

But I am a counsellor, and what struck me is he threatened a tantrum, and this was enough to stop you, questioning him? That and your need for lots of hard evidence to believe yourself yo the point where others above said 'That's not normal' raised an alarm bell for me.

This feels emotionally manipulative and possibly emotional abuse and coercion. I would advise that you speak to someone like a talking therapist to work out if he's being abusive and manipulative.

It is hard to tell sometimes, and it might not be what is going on. For me, I know that my past abusive relationships meant I saw emotional abaur where there was none. And I managed to "self gaslighted myself". I nearly ended my marriage until I realised that it was me that needed to get my head straight (well, actually, hubby had counselling, too).

@scaredofdoingitallwrong he’s definitely up to no good in some way. You are not a shit partner either! If he had given you no reason whatsoever to not trust him then yes it’s strange to want to track him/question him. But what I don’t understand is when you write an OP such as yours then people say you clearly don’t trust him… when he’s given you lots of reasons there NOT to trust him! His reaction says it all, when they get angry that’s because they are backed into a corner, he can’t explain what you have found out so his only way out of it is to get mad. I saw a message pop up on the screen on my ex partners phone once where I could only see the first part which alone looked extremely dodgy, I asked him about it and he showed me the full message which in full context showed me there was nothing to worry about. He wasn’t mad or angry, he could understand why I was worried about what I saw and I didn’t even ask to see the message, he showed it me off his own back because he wanted me to know there was nothing to worry about.

OP, I would leave him because of his foul temper. Your DC shouldn’t be growing up thinking that’s normal. You’re not a shit parent, you’ve just got used to it.

Also, if you have no sex life, and he wants one, he’s going to leave or cheat sooner or later.

He’s also lying and quite likely having an affair, but the tantrums alone would be the dealbreaker for me.

Best of luck in the life you’ll enjoy when you’ve left him.

If it stinks like a fish....

You don't trust him and probably with good reason.
Trust is the basis for a marriage.
It sounds like it's over.

Agree with every word of this. When you are out of this situation, and on the other side, you will see that there are very visible patterns occurring here.

This is why some of us are saying that the tantrum threat is actually the biggest red flag here.

I seriously would speak to a counsellor first, even before a solicitor. If you can be clear in your mind why you need to leave, without guilt, it will be much easier in the long run.

If you are unhinged then it sounds like he's unhinged you. He's clearly lying and emotionally abusive, I mean tantrums? really? - obviously a threat to control you and your behaviour.
Do what's best for you now OP, you're not having sex so you don't have to worry about STD's, you know who and what he is so play it however you want.

Thank you to everyone who took the time to give me their honest helpful opinions.

I think I probably need to organise some counselling for me which will maybe help me understand my part in this breakdown. I know I am not blameless even if I think I'm doing the right thing. And I do need to see a solicitor so I understand where I stand and then I can make a decision.

I am sorry if I was misleading when I said he threatened a tantrum. That is what in my head I call the incidents when he screams and shouts and tries to scare with his voice to shut down any disagreement. He doesn't actually say I'm going to have a tantrum now.

I know I can be an argumentative little sh*t but I really wasn't when I asked him about the photos. I was so calm. I gave up because I don't want the kids to hear screaming. It's just nice to hear that I am not imagining this.

I used to argue, and try and explain myself. Until I stopped because I didn't want the children to hear. This is a pattern, you'll see it as you learn more about it.

Pleased you're looking at counselling. It is the right thing to do.

You seem to be getting quite a few messages questioning your actions from posters who don't even understand what you did (e.g. people telling you you've gone too far checking meta data who don't even know what meta data is). And talking about what you did as though it's weird and obsessive.

Your husband told you something that was fairly unbelievable - Corporate training that goes on for an extra day involving a hotel stay, at no notice, because people were late getting to the site? That is just not a thing, is it. While, in the spirit of "anything can happen", I wouldn't condemn someone as soon as they said it, it would certainly have me wondering what was really going on and my marriage hasn't been up and down.

It's a bizarre thing to be told and if it didn't make you curious it would be surprising. You checked the information he sent you to try and work out what was going on (I would have checked the meta data too - but then I know what meta data is). Then you talked to him about it. That's not obsessive or weird or stalkery the way a few posters seem to be implying. It's perfectly normal to be suspicious of a highly unlikely claim, it's perfectly normal to double check information at your fingertips to try and verify or refute it, it's grown up to ask about it and sensible to be skeptical if the responses are evasive or incriminating.

Counseling is a good idea to sort out what you want and there may be other things about your marriage that warrant questioning your own role. But don't waste your time on the fact you checked some meta data when your DH lied to you.

Good luck

I think I probably need to organise some counselling for me which will maybe help me understand my part in this breakdown

I think counselling can be really useful but I don't think it's necessary to understand why a relationship didn't work out. The fact is that the relationship isn't working for either of you. Neither of you are happy.

The important thing is to split up as amicably as possible (or at least with a little animosity as possible). You are still both your kids parents and it will help them if you can try and be civil to each other.

Wow this post has raised a lot of nonsense.

OP I hope you’re still reading.

Your reactions to your husbands quite frankly strange behaviour and gaslighting is absolutely normal. You’re not unhinged or taking things too far.

This level of gaslighting comes with withdrawal and dishonesty. You’re recognising that and feeling emotionally and mentally unsafe. That lack of safety is what drives the hypervigilance (checking up/watching). You’re in fight or flight mode.

This is really unhealthy for you but I know it’s hard to pull a relationship when you’re in this state and not sure of all the details.

I think from what you’ve said your relationship is over. His behaviour has red flags all over it. He clearly knows that you’re in this state and is not showing you any reassurance. Personally I’d place bets on an AP or shady dealings.

Individual counselling is good but not to place blame on yourself but to delve into why you’ve allowed his treatment of you to continue when there are red flags all over it and to find the courage to leave.

You haven’t fought some of the quite frankly nasty comments on here and even described yourself as a shit parent. Please don’t let mumsnet strangers perpetuate untruths about who you are.

You deserve so much more than this half life.

Good luck

I asked MN to delete it. It was in reply to the poster who kept going on about Metadata being a "wanky term" and sneering at OP for using it, which it isn't. But I decided I was being a bit mean to that poster. So my snarky comment is gone, but wasn't directed at OP who is clearly having a terrible time and I don't blame her for looking for proof before she decides what to do.

Ffs you are so twattish it hurts. A cheating partner can make any sane person crazy.

Life is too short. In the space of 5 mins my partner suffered catastrophic burns and lost both his parents in a fire in July. Please don't waste your life. It is not unlimited. He is lying.

Crazypaving22 thanks for for your very kind words. I am still reading and trying to pluck up the courage to call some numbers tomorrow and get some answers on where I stand legally.

My husband was only my second long term relationship so this a scary move. And I was brought up in a traditional family where the relationship between my parents had broken down at the end so I feel doubly stupid for repeating the mistakes.

I haven't fought back to any of the nasty comments but there's a part of me that believes them. And another part that thinks if you really can behave like that to someone who is asking for help then you're clearly a pretty nasty person and it's always better not to engage with those kinds of people, in real life or anonymous forums because they'll never change who they are.

I am so sorry to hear this, I cannot imagine how horrendous this must have been.

@scaredofdoingitallwrong I’m so glad you’re still reading.

This man’s lying, blameshifting and gaslighting tactics have really done a number on you. There is a tactic on the surviving infidelity website called the 180. If you Google surviving infidelity and 180 you should find it. It’s a way of finding some emotional space when you’re faced with this so you can think clearly. That might help. In fact the SI website might help full stop as you’ll find no one on there will accuse you of some of the bs you’ve been accused on here. They will help you work through his gaslighting. You could seek support there.

Using shouting and screaming to silence you is absolutely abhorrent and I’m glad you’re seeking legal advice. Make sure you go through with it.

I wrote this on another post today but you really need to be your own best friend. If you were talking to her and she was telling you this, what would you say to her.

You matter, your happiness matters, your future matters!

This relationship has run its course. When you get to the point of having to check metadata... the trust has gone.

Not sure where to start really... so ive been with my partner nearly 2 yrs and for the most of it we can be pretty happy but there have been sooo many issues already, i will start at the very beginning of our relationship. We were both in long term relationships when we met (i was in a near 10yr relationship where we just ended up being like Roommate's with a 3yr old daughter) he was in a 4yr relationship with a 1yr and 2yr old! My relationship wasn't perfect but we never argued and we were just so distant with each other and there was NO romance at all. His relationship was very toxic, fighting, shouting, swearing all in front of their children to the point police had been called etc. When we met we had instantly connected and got on so well, after a year of working together we started to really like each other. I broke up with my partner at the time and told him everything about me liking someone and feeling really attracted to them etc BUT he never told his partner about me but they had broken up due to her cheating, he stayed living with her and then started seeing me. It got to a month in and he still hadn't even mentioned me so i got defensive and told him he needs to tell her as i wont be a secret especially if they weren't together (all while he was still living there) so anyway he was on the phone with her one day and i said for him to say something now. He didn't want to but i made him so all he said was he was going on a date... she then went mad and was shouting and swearing that they were still sleeping together, he was confessing his love for her still etc and of course i respond to him and said that better be a lie and he just told me to shhh while he was on the phone!!!! Anyway she sent me a message and told me everything and even sent a photo, he was 100% he never received this photo but i had the screen shot, he said for months that she was just making it all up, few month later she needed to get to a town that she also needed to be in and again i overheard her say that she got in MY car and he drove her there, he also says this is a lie and that he only took her up the road? Again months later we had a row and i said i just can't trust him and i will never believe that he didn't sleep with her the whole time being with me and then he finally admitted to actually receiving that picture and he didn't want to tell me because he would lose me! Fast forward to now, we have a 13 week old baby (that's a whole other story about fertility issues) and i broke up with him the other day and he just cried and cried and said how sorry he was for all the lies and that he would do anything to keep us together and im at a loss, i have agreed to try once more for the sake of our daughter but i just cant help shaking the feeling that he still slept with his ex and he will never admit it and i really don't know if i can ever move on from that no matter how much he tries to prove that he is a better man now.

You need to start a new thread, you’ll get more replies. I think it’s easy to add a new post rather than start a new thread.

Just copy and paste it. And can you add some paragraphs? ☺️