Financial secrets

[ponderingpenguins]

Married 20 years. 4DC, aged 13-7.

Just discovered that DH has racked up £20K of debt, and not been paying it. I have been working super hard the last two years, retraining, and so he has been dealing with all of the banking.

Sadly it's not the first time he has been financially irresponsible. It happened when we first got married. Then again, 7 years later when he asked to take responsibility for finances again.

I had all financial responsibility until two years ago, and I stupidly believed that with two decent salaries going in, and the fact that he is 47 and more mature, it would be ok? I know, I know, I know...

He just keeps saying that he is sorry, and crying, he got lost. That he loves me. He won't discuss it, hasn't kept paperwork or even records of everything. He didn't even know how much he owed exactly. I have had to sit down, make phone calls and piece everything together myself.

I have paid off all but £2K with my personal savings.

Now, I am 45, with absolutely nothing left to my name and 4DC to think about.

I am genuinely considering asking him for a divorce. I do not want to be legally vulnerable. I do not want anyone else to have the ability to do something in my name. How many times do I give him a chance?

The only thing keeping me from asking him to leave is that he is a wonderful hands-on father and the children will be broken hearted.

We really do have a happy family life normally.

I don't know whether this anger will pass, or if the marriage is over, or if I should ask him for a quiet divorce and continue cohabiting for the sake of our children and see where our relationship goes, until they have all left home?

My head's a mess.

Thoughts?

I think in a way, you too have been irresponsible. Why does re-training/working 'super hard' mean you can't keep an eye on the finances? You know he has struggled with keeping these things in order before, and yet you've resigned from the responsibility yourself.

If you do remain married, then you need to accept that you can't let go of the financial reins.

I feel for you I really do it's such a betrayal .

It's a lesson learnt never leave your financial security to someone else . Married or not only you will take care of you .

What's happened has happened but from now on you hold the purse strings and he gets personal / pocket money only until you have built your savings up and he can be trusted . Also don't just consider cards but check he hasn't filched pension savings investments remortgaged the home etc etc .
Time to get busy .

Somas a family you've overspent by £10 per year for the past 2 years? Do you know what on? Was it household bills or fancy holidays or gambling? I think the answer to that would determine how I dealt with this going forward.
If it was household bills, then I think you need to acknowledge your part in taking your eye off the ball. Likewise if it were holidays, or new handbags etc.
It if we're gambling or a new car that he told you was affordable or pub trips, then I think I'd be reconsidering the relationship.

What did he spend the money on, and why did you deplete your savings to pay off his debt? Does he have a gambling problem?

Does he have no savings? What has he spent the money on?

Those questions aside, I'd struggle to get past this, it's now the third time this has happened, yet he's let it happen again. Why he's bothering to cry and saying sorry I don't know, as he clearly doesn't respect you enough to talk about it when it starts happening and hide it from you. Get past this and it's a green light he can do it again and again with no consequences

You don't have to forgive him if you don't want to. This is absolutely grounds for divorce and no one would think you unreasonable.

That said, it is for you to decide whether you can continue in the marriage with appropriate controls around spending. You don't have to divorce him if you don't want to.

You also don't need to decide today, tomorrow or in a month. You have time. You can also decide to stay together and change your mind in a year.

It's really a question of how you want to live. You don't mention loving him in your post - do you?

No, it wasn't on overspending. But it has happened by not paying bills, and the 20k has come from penalties. He did not respond to any of the demands and it spiraled.

We are not in the UK, if that helps.

And with regards to training, yes. I have been doing 16-20 hour days plus long stints away from home as retraining. But yes, I know I have been irresponsible and am partially to blame.

I paid, because we always had shared finances. As his wife, I am legally liable.

This is a tough one, my DH gambled £20K away. I could barely bring myself to speak to him for a long time. He had been planning an early retirement, but I told him he could retire once he had replaced to £20K. I have sort of forgiven him, but now cannot trust him with money. It used to be that if we were going into overdraft, I would top up the account. If it happens now, I just tell DH that we're in overdraft and if he doesn't top up we will be charged.

Thank you for this. I really appreciate it.

I have loved him so much. We had a happy healthy relationship. At the moment, I just feel like I am in shock. Honestly, I had no suspicions that anything was wrong. I sat and passed my exams at the beginning of the year and then we have all just been settling back into normal life.

Yup. Thank you for this reminder. I need to start making checklists

20k in two years. Impressive (not in a good way).

How has he accrued the debt? Overspending? Gambling? Hobbies? Frittering it away? Did you notice he was spending a lot, or was it secret? How did you discover this new debt?

what do you want going forward? Do you trust him to be secure financially going forward?

He can still be a good dad to the children if he’s not living with you?

Sorry, just read your update.

But what bills? Joint bills? Bills for what? It makes a difference

I also think this is a dual responsibility I simply can’t believe you advocated all responsibility for money, what were you thinking? I’m happily married and we are equal partners we both over see finances.

you can’t blame him for not doing it when you didn’t either. You are both at fault. You both didn’t deal with it. No excuse for either of you.

As grown ass adults with children you should be able to both manage your finances and keep a watchful eye and know where you stand, there is no excuse for this.

So nearly 20,000 on penalties for late payements over two years and he has been irresponsible on two previous occasions.

This is really unbelievable to read.

You know well that he is an idiot and you decided to give him another roll of the dice with the financial security of the family.

18,000 to be blown on penalties?

I wouldn't forgive him and I wouldn't forgive myself.

If it wasn't overspending, then where did the money go that was meant to pay the bills? Has it all been accounted for and put towards debt reduction and the €20k was the residual in penalties after that?

If you want to and can forgive him, it has to be conditional. What has his explanation been? Has he been honest? What's he planning to do about it etc.? What is he proposing? What is he doing to stop you walking away etc? If he's not showing remorse or effort to understand why he did it, I'd struggle not to leave him

Take the time to be in shock and try to tell yourself that you don't have to decide what you feel yet. Easier said than done. It is a massive shock and it's a massive breach of trust. Of course you're in shock. It's a horrible thing to go through. He's finally told you so he will feel a weight is lifted. Ignore his tears and don't let him make you feel like you have to make him feel better for what he's done.

Also and to be brutal, there's nothing wrong with being self interested here. You mentioned you just retrained - does that mean if you're going to split up it's better to do it in a year or so? Nothing wrong with delaying the decision if it does. I delayed a decision to divorce my husband when I was in the process of retraining. I needed him then and not to be adding being a single parent on top of things. It was cold and calculated but it was right - for me and the kids. In the end we're still together 10 years later, but if I hadn't been able to get past what he'd done (which was a massive breach of trust over an administrative mess but not financial) I'd have split up when I felt I was in the right position to.

It doesn't matter what the bills are, in this country, as a married couple we are both equally liable. But it wasn't for anything non essential. He simply hadn't paid them, and then ignored all the reminders.

And I found out when I opened a letter. Even then he downplayed it. When I translated the letter, he gave me a little bit more information. And then I started contacting departments to get the full picture because he couldn't/wouldn't give it to me (although he was literally right next to me when I was doing this and writing everything down).

Thank you. You have really hit the nail on the head. I appreciate your kindness

So where is the money then? I'm not getting where the money has gone for the bills that haven't been paid.

Exactly where is the money. So nine grand a year in penalties plus none of rhe existing bills were paid and not once in two years did you even look at your financial position.

That is unforgivable
He not only got £20k in debt he lied about it to your face
And this is the 2nd time?
If you divorce at least he won't be able to affect your life/credit rating
He'll do it again. Why wouldn't he?

The bills have now been paid.

The debt was incurred penalties.

For those who ask why I didn't check, he has had my log in calculator. Of course, I kept an eye on main joint account and monthly spending. I asked after it a couple of times, and even more so since I qualified, but he kept forgetting it.

I have been running the house, working a full time job, managing DC (we have no help in any form, so I pick them up from school etc.)and then studying on a night. He has been working his normal 8h day, I have been managing everything else, and so said he would take this to ease my load. Which I was grateful for.

I never ever imagined that it could turn so quickly.

Hard to think of divorcing him. After all you made vows to each other - for better or for worse, for richer for poorer

Sorry that he has made a mess of things for you.

Exactly. Where is all the money he was supposed to pay bills with? This is not just about the penalties from not making payments. There a lot more than just 20k in penalties to account for. He's continuing to lie his arse off.