Losing my mind - Sex row

[BounceQueen]

Ok I feel like I am losing my mind here, my partner steadfastly refuses to accept that he is in the wrong to the point I am doubting myself. So I am here for a sense check.

I had a doctors appointment yesterday that I have been very anxious about. I have mentioned several times that I feel anxious about it so he knows. It's an issue he has been supporting me with so he knows all about it.

The night before this appointment he caused a row because and I quote here "We only ever have sex when you want it"

Bearing in mind we had sex 24 times in April and in the 7 days in the run up to this row we had sex 5 times. Of the times we didn't one was because he had a bad back and I spent a good half an hour giving him a back rub and lots of affection.

So we spent the entire morning in the run up to the appointment arguing when i wanted to approach it calmly and prepare a list of the things I wanted to say.

I am really annoyed and think that he shouldn't have caused a row over sex when I needed emotional support and he could have waited if he genuinely felt he had a point (I think he doesn't have a point but that's irrelevant).

He is saying that we had a row because of my attitude and I have been stand offish which could well be the case because I have been on my period so sensitive anyway and also been worrying about this appointment. If he had raised that then I would be less annoyed but he didn't, he caused a row over sex.

I am not wrong here am I. he is adamant that it is all my attitude and he wasn't in the wrong!

Bounce, I am so sorry for the emotional rollercoaster you are having to experience in order to get all this straight in your own mind. Of course you are reeling - but you are doing all the right things in keeping your distance now.

Did you say he came to pick up some of his things? - sorry can't go & check right now but I think so - & hope you are wide awake to the fact that this is simply another performative gesture to keep you in line.

He won't want to split - he's invested howeverlong in training you to keep dutiful records of sex frequency, he won't want to waste shagging time train up another victim unsuspecting woman if he can punish, wheedle, or otherwise manipulate you back into the status quo.

If you want my advice - & you are you, there is no need to respond & certainly not to justify any disagreement with my suggestion - it would be wise & fitting to send him this -

& then block him.

If he has any more stuff at yours, he knows where you live & can knock for it. (Do NOT let him over the threshold if he does this, do NOT engage in any conversation - DO have his shit bagged up & ready to go.)
If you have any at his - write it off. He'll use its retrieval as a chance to get back into your head, or berate you - anyway, it won't be to make you feel good about yourself.

You have done so well to see his behaviour clearly while still in the thick of it. Don't let him suck you back in.

It's all about control.
He'll be okay as long as you are "up for it", but when you have a problem he'll turn nasty or give silent treatments. He's just nice when everything is about him and his appendage.
What happens when you have a serious health problem ?

To be fair I have worried about getting old or ill and what would happen then. I would like to think he would sort himself out but who knows!

I will watch the video when I get home, just going on the school run.

I don't think I want to break up with him, he is usually amazing but I need some kind of acknowledgment and an honest conversation about his problem with sex.

I do think a previous poster had it right when they said his self worth is tied in with sex after his ex left him to be a lesbian. His masculinity is directly tied in to this.

Sex can be a barometer for other things. It seems to me that he's using it here as a tool to validate himself and control you. Which is revolting, frankly.

You’ve been warned. This is likely to be the thin end of the wedge.

if he’s willing to seek therapy about his issues then I might give him another chance. If not; nope.

I don't think I want to break up with him, he is usually amazing but I need some kind of acknowledgment and an honest conversation about his problem with sex.

Obviously your choice.
But, it's very likely he won't change. I hope you know that
In 5 years, 10 years, 15 years, he'll still see you as a mastabatory aid and not a partner, he'll just find new ways to keep you sweet so you keep servicing him.

Good luck though, I do hope you wish better for your kids, especially if you have daughter's.

This guy has done a great job on you OP.
a fantastic job at ensuring yoi feel it is an external cause to manipulate you away from his abusive behaviour

I cannot believe what I am reading

same narrative as ‘my ex wife cheated on me so I feel so insecure so thats what led me to cheat on you’ no.

masculinity has nothing to do with sex. Sex to these types of men is about power and control and they lack masculinity at a fundamental
level. Masculinity has everything to do with making a woman feel safe, secure and empowered to fall into her feminine energy so she can feel safe to let her in to her space emotionally and physically. This loser is not masuline at all. You have been entirely gaslit here.

Please read lundy bancroft why does he do that

these guys never change and usually if one aspect of their behaviour is abusive the rest will come in time
then you will be another five years in with more spreadsheets

your children will also see this dynamic and the relationship circle continues ad nauseum

I am renaming the spreadsheet immediately to the Fucking Frequency Spreadsheet. I must admit I am shocked you knew it was a spreadsheet but I love excel! It has colour formatting and percentages etc.
😂😂😂
Just a wild stab in the dark (witch reference, Blackadder) sometimes We Just Know These Things. Am laughing heartily at the realisation that the spreadsheet's acronym is FFS ...

I am sorry I know my comment is flippant and I honestly can tell where you are all coming from and it has given me food for thought but my life isn't awful, yes he is very demanding around sex and it occasionally causes problems but on a day to day basis we get one really well. That's why i was so disappointed, it's just not the behaviour I would expect from him at all. He is usually right there on my team, cheering me on!
You carry on being as flippant as you need to be - whatever helps you deal, Bounce. However, I'm gonna invite you on a date ...

It's a picnic, on a glorious sunny & gently breezy day, on a meadowland river bank. I have packed treats, wine, & flowers are on display in a vase you can take home with you. Main event on the food front is the most delicious sandwich you have ever tasted, made with all your favourite ingredients, lovingly sourced from individual artisan producers, & handcrafted by me into a delightful silk wrapper tied with ribbons.

I am kind & supportive, we have a great date & we get on really well.
Of course you accept a second date!
It features The Delicious Sandwich that was such a hit last time.
Except ...
.. this time, along with all the handcrafting & special ingredients you love, oh dear! I have inserted the tiniest sliver of dogshit between the layers. But really tiny! - only 1%, tops!
Why would I do this? I am usually right there on your team, cheering you on!

What are you to do?
Rejoice in the sunny day, riverbank setting, 'thoughtful' gestures ... & carefully eat 99% of The Sandwich?
Of course you bloody don't.
You realise that underneath the easy gestures, there is a raving nutter.
You throw The Sandwich in the river, & run screaming to your closest friends for comfort & safety.

If it's not obvious btw - your b/f is The Sandwich. Throw him in the river.

Omfg what an analogy i love this 💐💐💐

I do think a previous poster had it right when they said his self worth is tied in with sex after his ex left him to be a lesbian. His masculinity is directly tied in to this.

Stop making excuses for him. Rapists gotta rape.

We've all been left for somebody else. It didn't make us decide to coercively control a person of the sames sex we were left for in order to punish-by-proxy.

If your b/f is feeling emasculated because his ex preferred sex with a woman, he's in need of a kick up the arse for his misogyny, not a fucking pat on the head about his "self worth" for crying out loud.

And anybody whose self-worth is tied in with sex to the degree they feel entitled to it on demand is a walking red flag. Why are you hoping that this is a fixable trait?

You've decided not to dump him? That's a common response. When you recognize yourself as a victim of coercive control and sexual abuse (yes, you are), it's painful to process. You go through all the phases people navigate through bereavement: denial, bargaining, etc. That's normal, and to be expected. Nobody wants to look at themselves and see 'victim', particularly when like me you've prided yourself on being a strong woman who takes no shit. It's hard.

Your initial response is by no means unusual. You have a lot to take in. It usually takes several attempts for a woman to leave a controlling or abusive partner. But please, at the very least, do three things for you and your children:

1. Don't move in with him. Ever. You already know the warning signs are there and it will be a million times more difficult to extract yourself once you've enmeshed your home space and finances with his. Plus, once you're more trapped, that's the time when people with controlling/abusive tendencies will ramp up their control. There's a well-documented script or it.
2. Stay vigilant. If it escalates into anything more, such as touching you in your sleep or pushing harder to get what he wants, you back right off.
3. Read Lundy Bancroft's Why does he do that? and take time to digest its contents.

I wish you well.

Oh fgs it is not another woman's fault that your DP is transactional; struggles with the concept of consent and can't be supportive when something is purely about you.
This is not because his ex left him. This is not because his ex is a lesbian.
He is an adult. This is all on him.

Beautifully put

Not your problem...

Putting the sex issue to one side for a mo Bounce - please get a copy of the book Mariel recommends - www.amazon.co.uk/Why-Does-He-That-Controlling-ebook/dp/B000Q9J0RO

And have a LONG think on the title of your thread.
Your b/f makes you feel like you are losing your mind.
He chose to do this to you - quite deliberately - on the day you needed support due to worry about an appointment.

Why would you give any more time to a person who wants to make you feel mad, wrong, & "ridiculous" when you say no to them? You have been groomed & gaslit to the extent that you had to pop your head over the Mumsnet Parapet to sense-check if it's ok to say no to sex.

Of course you are going to wobble - see everything Mariel wrote to understand why, & how common this wavering feeling is in situations like yours. But it' entirely possible that your feelings of connection, warmth, & "but everything else is fine, it's JUST this one issue" are in fact not love - but force of habit, & trauma bonding -

At the moment, you are at a standoff.
It's a powerplay (no criticism - human relations are peppered with it, it's natural) between you as to who backs down - him with an 'apology' (he won't mean it - see my PP), or you by accepting some form of his narrative that YOU are ridiculous, YOu are over-reacting, it's a one-off & YOU need to accept responsibility for his behaviour ... as Mariel says - there's a script for this.
The danger is that you will accept an 'apology', as you will mistake it for standing for a return to an equal distribution of power between you.
You will then take him back, you will both pretend this row wasn't the dealbreaker it should have been, & you will be back to filling in your FFS xl.

Don't eat that shit. 1% shit is still shit, & taints the whole sandwich.

www.verywellmind.com/trauma-bonding-5207136

Oh op. Do you know how many times I had sex with my dp in April? once. I'm having a hard time at the mo with my health and other issues. I know he'd like it more, but he doesn't pester. You are being abused. Your dp is not a nice person.

'Why does he do that' is available here: archive.org/details/LundyWhyDoesHeDoThat

I do think a previous poster had it right when they said his self worth is tied in with sex after his ex left him to be a lesbian. His masculinity is directly tied in to this.

You've also noted he was coercive about sex with her and used the same manipulative lies about her as he does to you.

It's pretty twisted to rape one partner and then use the fact she then - perfectly understandably - left him as his excuse to rape the next partner.

Women are entitled to leave coercive and rapist men without then being blamed for that man mistreating future women.

Hold the man responsible for his own behaviour choices.

The night before this appointment he caused a row because and I quote here "We only ever have sex when you want it"

He said out loud, to your face that he would prefer to have sex with you when he knows you don't want to rather than wait until you do.

Aka rape.

I can only imagine what he thinks in his head and doesn't say out loud.

You've got kids. Get this absolute wanker out of their lives Ffs. He's sexually coercive at absolute best.

Buying someone protein bars doesn't mean you get 24/7 live on demand access to their vagina.

I don't know how you aren't disgusted by a man who has driven you to keep a tally of your sex life with him on a spreadsheet so you have justification or proof that you're 'giving him' enough (sex shouldn't be transactional, it isn't something women give men or let them do, it requires mutual enthusiastic consent) for him to accept that no means no.

If your child comes to you as an adult and said "mum Dan gets angry and sulks if we don't have sex at least every other day because I promised him I would do it at least that often a while ago. So now I sometimes have sex with him when I don't want to because otherwise he gets annoyed with me." Would you think Dan was a nice bloke? Would you want her to keep seeing him? Would you think he respected her? No. Because Dan would be an entitled cunt who thinks women owe him access to their body if he's 'nice' to them often enough.

Your 'partner' is a prick mate.

Aka rape.

I can only imagine what he thinks in his head and doesn't say out loud.

Yup @youvegottenminuteslynn - my thoughts exactly, which is why I am dismayed that OP currently feels that this is a single incident that might get fixed with an 'apology' - instead of feeling utterly aghast at what his awful comment has revealed about WHO HE ACTUALLY IS, & how he perceives her as an object that must perform to rules-based sex standards in order to 'deserve' basic human kindness.

You don't need to have a conversation about his attitude about sex, it's how he handled not getting his way. He was happy to try and make you think you were the one with the problem. The fact that you keep a spreadsheet shows that despite the nice bits he is an habitual gas-lighter. No relationship is wall to wall bad, abusive relationships have bits that are good in comparison.

How much crap would need to be floating in a glass of water before you got just got a clean one?

He sounds vile and like a nasty sex pest.

How much crap would need to be floating in a glass of water before you got just got a clean one?

i will be using this quote going forward