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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Misatched libido is causing issues.

115 replies

Enzso · 20/04/2022 14:25

First time poster. I wasn't going to post here but I think I need to hear mostly female perspectives so it's probably the best place.

Married with two teenage children. Childhood sweethearts (first together 33 years ago) but we both went and had other relationships before we eventually came back to one another and got married. Best friends. There's nobody in the world I'd rather spend time with. We communicate well, we're attracted to one another, there's complete trust between us.

Our issue is our mismatched libidos. Mine is very active, my wife's is on life support. When we have sex it's usually great. Loving, with a deep connection, we both get a lot of it. But she can go without it for weeks whereas I find that very difficult.

As a result, my advances are often rejected. It's very unpredictable when she'll be open to sex. We could go on a night out, or spend the day together, it doesn't necessarily lead to anything. We talk about it a lot. My wife acknowledges she has "blockages". Finds it very difficult to get aroused initially or to be in the moment. Her awareness of our kids in the house is an issue for her (although I doubt they can hear anything) but she's not often open to daytime sex either when they're both at school. For my part I talk or joke about sex too much, which she sometimes takes as pressure. I'm working on that. We would see a sex therapist but we don't know what they'd say. We talk about it. We tell each other what we want. We're both present in the marriage. Housework is 5050. We have good kids and no stresses in life.

Lately our work schedules have shifted so that we may only have 1, perhaps 2 nights a week together where we go to bed at the same time. While I'm always hopeful something might happen, I try not to project or mention it, as I know that doesn't help. More recently though on those nights we're together there's been a very minor disagreement early in the evening that's spoiled the mood between us. We're fine the next day but I've found the disagreements incredibly disappointing and frustrating. It's just one more thing to come between us at the moment.

When it last happened four nights ago, something in me switched. I was done with it all (not the marriage, just the constant unpredictability and rejection). When that's happened before I withdraw all affection. A bit like I'm punishing her, because she loves cuddles and I'm very touch feely with her. "See! How do you like it?" Usually in a day or two I get over it, we laugh, and the cycle begins again. This time however I'm four days in and have no desire to back down. My wall has gone up. She could tell the day after it happened I was upset, and she suggested we be spontaneous and go and get a hotel room that night. I said I didn't want to and meant it (normally that would be amazing but normally she would never suggest it). The constant rejection hurts over time and sometimes I just don't want to be understanding. Maybe the wall will come down in another day or two, maybe I really am done.

OP posts:
HowlongWillThisTakeNow · 21/04/2022 11:22

@BadNomad
I agree with you, and that’s why I feel the OP on this thread should be receiving a comparable level of support and constructive advice, and not some of the dismissive comments that have been posted here
but I also think he should leave, but that’s just my personal opinion

Watchkeys · 21/04/2022 12:10

gannett · 21/04/2022 09:30

*I don’t think he’s trying to improve his relationship - he’s just trying to have more sex.

If he were trying to improve his relationship he wouldn’t be treating his wife the way he is.*

This is definitely not the kind of comment I saw on the other thread. Imagine a woman complaining about a sexless relationship and being told it was her fault for not being a good enough girlfriend or wife.

These quotes don't say anything about whether it's his fault for not being a good enough partner. Don't put words in people's mouths.

And unless you've got the same poster saying opposing things on different threads, you simply don't have a point re men and women being treated differently. There's no hive mind. You get opposing views even within a thread. Having opposing views on different threads doesn't mean anything.

Watchkeys · 21/04/2022 12:12

I don't really see how anyone's got "pestering" from the OP. Of course it's his side of the story but bawdy jokes are perfectly normal and don't constitute pestering

So, if you say no to sex with a man and then he has to 'work on' his habit of making bawdy jokes that you don't find funny, and his habit of referring to sex often, you think that's fine?

SnowingInApril · 21/04/2022 12:21

For those who gave really considered and respectful replies, thankyou
Translation: For those who agree with me, thankyou

DivorcedAndDelighted · 21/04/2022 12:29

@Jumpking put it perfectly -
It's not about "she should be having sex more", it's about "somethings not working well between us and I want to seek help with him to improve things"

There doesn't have to be anything wrong with you as an individual for you to benefit from therapy as a couple. The relationship is more than the sum of its 2-person parts.
It is not as simple as "she just doesn't want sex much, suck it up" . Desire takes different forms and those with responsive desire may well enjoy having sex more often, but need their partner to help set the scene and initiate in a way which works for them. There is a good discussion of responsive desire in this article on preventing a sexless relationship and also this one on fixing a sexless relationship.

Couples counselling might also lead you to conclude that you're no longer compatible as a couple. Either way, it gives both parties the chance to explore options and to know that you have tried. It shows that you value the relationship enough to put in the effort and face up to possible embarrassment, because you want to find a way forward with your partner. So refusing to try therapy/counselling is basically saying you prioritise other things over your partner's unhappiness.

DivorcedAndDelighted · 21/04/2022 12:35

thestraitofillinois · 21/04/2022 10:21

I think it was wrong for the OP to turn away from his wife when she made the suggestion to book a hotel room. The very thing he says he wanted, when offered to him, he declined.
None of us can know her motivation for making that move. OP thinks she only made it because she knew he was upset. That may be the case, but there might be more to it than that. She might have noticed he was upset and wanted to make him feel better, wanted to mend the situation.
Assuming that she only made the suggestion to keep him sweet seems to me to be entirely wrong. When someone reaches out to try to mend a situation, and they are rejected, this is incredibly damaging.
Please find out if she feels rejected, if her self-esteem has been affected, OP. For a lot of women, their libido is intertwined with their body image as well.

I agree. OP, I have a lot of sympathy for you, but you acted like an arse in freezing your partner out when she reached out to you. God only knows how much damage that did. You froze her out in revenge for her being cold to you before. Have you heard of the saying about can eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth leads to a whole lot of toothless, blind people"?
You could at least have told her honestly that you felt so hurt by the number of previous rejections that you needed some recovery time, but that you appreciated her making the effort, and could you talk about it at a later date. Or something at least, not a sulky snub. I think you really need to grovel about that.

differentnameforthis · 21/04/2022 16:07

When she says no, you withhold completely from her, you "joke" about sex and you wonder why she doesn't want sex!

Withholding and sulking when you can't access her body is manipulation and makes us feel like all (some) men want is sex. My ex was a lot like you and it killed our sexual relationship.

You have tp stop seeing her right to bodily autonomy as rejection. It's no such thing.

differentnameforthis · 21/04/2022 16:18

Enzso · 21/04/2022 00:11

Thanks for the responses everyone. Really surprised at some of the more aggressive ones as I'd tried to show we had a really full relationship in every other way. There's a lot of lovd and respect in our marriage. Leaving isn't an option - there's nobody else I want to be with.

I probably should have said my wife says she wants to want sex more. Yes she absolutely enjoys it. Yes she absolutely has blockages - they're her words, not mine. She doesn't need to fake it or not tell me everything, that's not our marriage.

I'm sorry for the incorrect assumptions some of you have made or the tone some of you have taken in responding. That says more about you than me sadly. I see this wasn't the right place to post after all and won't return. For those who gave really considered and respectful replies, thankyou. You made some good points.

Right... your wife won't have sex when you want, so you withdraw.

Now you don't get the response from other women that you want, so you withdraw.

That says far more about you than you realize, op...

EarthSight · 21/04/2022 16:28

You lost all my sympathy with this -

When that's happened before I withdraw all affection. A bit like I'm punishing her, because she loves cuddles and I'm very touch feely with her. "See! How do you like it?" Usually in a day or two I get over it, we laugh, and the cycle begins again. This time however I'm four days in and have no desire to back down

She doesn't want to have sex, presumably, because she genuinely doesn't feeling like it.

You are denying her affection as deliberate punishment. You sulk with her not just for hours, but for DAYS. What the fuck?? Days!!!

You have no desire to back down? Just a classic case of performative sucking. What am absolute charmer you are. No wonder your wife doesn't want to have sex with you. A lot of women would pack your bags for you in this situation and would not be sorry to see you go.

me4real · 21/04/2022 16:42

When that's happened before I withdraw all affection. A bit like I'm punishing her, because she loves cuddles and I'm very touch feely with her. "See! How do you like it?" Usually in a day or two I get over it, we laugh, and the cycle begins again. This time however I'm four days in and have no desire to back down

You are in charge of your behaviour @Enzso . That you say you have 'no desire to back down' shows you know you at least partly have control over how you are acting and deciding to continue acting that way. It's not something that 'just happens' - you're the one choosing to act like this.

Someone can be disappointed but they never need to act out in this way so as to have an effect on someone else.

Fluffyhairteddy · 21/04/2022 16:45

I’m going to go against the grain here: I don’t think the OP should be resigned to a sexless life. Sex is important (to some people at least). The OP feeling like he has to walk on eggshells etc isn’t right. This relationship will leave you frustrated and resentful: life is short. If you can’t meet in tbe middle I’d say go separate ways - it’s not ok for you to just accept it: sexual connection is one of life’s pleasures and it’s ok to want to be happy.

Fluffyhairteddy · 21/04/2022 16:47

I’ve just seen your update OP: if you won’t leave you have to meet her where she is and accept less sex than you want is what you’ll have to put up with. Sulking isn’t ok: either stay or don’t but this isn’t ok.

me4real · 21/04/2022 17:22

The OP feeling like he has to walk on eggshells etc isn’t right

@Fluffyhairteddy There's no evidence of that. He's the one who admits to sulking and probably making his wife feel that way.

Unless you mean that he feels he needs to STFU about sex and with the sexual jokes. Which is a reasonable thing to expect him to do when he self-confessedly keeps going on about it too much.

Fluffyhairteddy · 21/04/2022 17:52

He referenced nights together where a v minor disagreement meaning no sex.

the point is - I think no sex in a relationship is sometimes brushed aside as no big deal. It really is. And if I wasn’t somewhat equally matched with my partner I’d absolutely leave (in fact I have). It colours everything and makes people miserable. It’s ok to want sex and to say “I’m not prepared to stay if we don’t match on this”. Clearly the OP isn’t there but reading some of the replies it feels like this issue is minimised. Tbe OP is frustrated and I can see why. Although i wouldn’t give the silent treatment ultimately it’s a frustrated response to a situation he can’t change.

me4real · 21/04/2022 17:57

I would absolutely want a partner to leave or shag someone else instead if he kept pestering me for sex when I did not want it (and so effectively pestering to rape me, coercively have sex with me when he knows I am not fully willing.)

me4real · 21/04/2022 17:59

But I accept that most women would rather their partner was faithful but didn't badger them when they weren't in the mood.

Libertaire · 21/04/2022 18:10

Unfortunately, OP, you have experienced the ridiculous double standards which are endemic on Mumsnet. A woman posting the same question in the same way would get a very different response and we all know it.

Nobody should have sex unless they want to. Full stop. And nobody should attempt to pressurise, coerce or bully anyone else into having sex if they don’t want it.

BUT

Sex is the glue which keeps relationships together. When one partner withdraws sex, and refuses to take steps to resolve the situation, the other partner is entitled to refuse to live indefinitely in a sexless relationship and either end it or look for sex elsewhere. And the partner who is refusing sex cannot complain when they do.

Keepitonthedownlow · 21/04/2022 18:19

This reply has been deleted

This has been withdrawn at the poster's request.

Seconding this

Hawkins001 · 21/04/2022 18:19

Enzso · 20/04/2022 14:25

First time poster. I wasn't going to post here but I think I need to hear mostly female perspectives so it's probably the best place.

Married with two teenage children. Childhood sweethearts (first together 33 years ago) but we both went and had other relationships before we eventually came back to one another and got married. Best friends. There's nobody in the world I'd rather spend time with. We communicate well, we're attracted to one another, there's complete trust between us.

Our issue is our mismatched libidos. Mine is very active, my wife's is on life support. When we have sex it's usually great. Loving, with a deep connection, we both get a lot of it. But she can go without it for weeks whereas I find that very difficult.

As a result, my advances are often rejected. It's very unpredictable when she'll be open to sex. We could go on a night out, or spend the day together, it doesn't necessarily lead to anything. We talk about it a lot. My wife acknowledges she has "blockages". Finds it very difficult to get aroused initially or to be in the moment. Her awareness of our kids in the house is an issue for her (although I doubt they can hear anything) but she's not often open to daytime sex either when they're both at school. For my part I talk or joke about sex too much, which she sometimes takes as pressure. I'm working on that. We would see a sex therapist but we don't know what they'd say. We talk about it. We tell each other what we want. We're both present in the marriage. Housework is 5050. We have good kids and no stresses in life.

Lately our work schedules have shifted so that we may only have 1, perhaps 2 nights a week together where we go to bed at the same time. While I'm always hopeful something might happen, I try not to project or mention it, as I know that doesn't help. More recently though on those nights we're together there's been a very minor disagreement early in the evening that's spoiled the mood between us. We're fine the next day but I've found the disagreements incredibly disappointing and frustrating. It's just one more thing to come between us at the moment.

When it last happened four nights ago, something in me switched. I was done with it all (not the marriage, just the constant unpredictability and rejection). When that's happened before I withdraw all affection. A bit like I'm punishing her, because she loves cuddles and I'm very touch feely with her. "See! How do you like it?" Usually in a day or two I get over it, we laugh, and the cycle begins again. This time however I'm four days in and have no desire to back down. My wall has gone up. She could tell the day after it happened I was upset, and she suggested we be spontaneous and go and get a hotel room that night. I said I didn't want to and meant it (normally that would be amazing but normally she would never suggest it). The constant rejection hurts over time and sometimes I just don't want to be understanding. Maybe the wall will come down in another day or two, maybe I really am done.

Is their any evidence that it's a possiblity that your partner is having an affair ?

Jjnbftgkhfrvjudv · 21/04/2022 18:27

I don’t usually comment on MN threads just read. But I find this topic particularly infuriating and often on these sorts of threads the double standards are very obvious. A PP said that you were punishing her by putting a wall up and avoiding contact when the OP clearly said he was upset by the constant rejection which is clearly understandable as we’ve seen women on other threads say this and all the replies are “ there’s another women RUN” or that this can’t last and they should leave. To answer OP’s ACTUAL question I think yes therapy could help and her being able to hear that your not upset about the lack of sex but feeling rejected and maybe find out if there is a hidden reason she hasn’t told you about as to why she’s been avoiding it.

Fluffyhairteddy · 21/04/2022 18:38

Keepitonthedownlow · 21/04/2022 18:19

Seconding this

So sex is a treat? And he has to wank and leave her alone? Sounds fucking miserable. And you are wrong. There are plenty of women with a very healthy sex drive. Sounds like sadly he just isn’t married to one.

and such double standards. Fast forward 5 years of ‘treat’ sex and the OP being told no repeatedly and hiding in the bathroom with his left hand. OPs wife will be on here asking for advice cos her husband has decided he wants a fully functional sex life with someone who reciprocates it. She didn’t see it coming. Isn’t it awful. It’s just sex. 🙄. Go to therapy! The need for sex isn’t unreasonable. If you can’t fix it, the OP will either have to wear it or walk.

HowlongWillThisTakeNow · 21/04/2022 18:43

Libertaire · 21/04/2022 18:10

Unfortunately, OP, you have experienced the ridiculous double standards which are endemic on Mumsnet. A woman posting the same question in the same way would get a very different response and we all know it.

Nobody should have sex unless they want to. Full stop. And nobody should attempt to pressurise, coerce or bully anyone else into having sex if they don’t want it.

BUT

Sex is the glue which keeps relationships together. When one partner withdraws sex, and refuses to take steps to resolve the situation, the other partner is entitled to refuse to live indefinitely in a sexless relationship and either end it or look for sex elsewhere. And the partner who is refusing sex cannot complain when they do.

Yep, agree with this

me4real · 21/04/2022 18:46

This is all a bit repulsive.

And under patriachy and in a world where men tend to have the penises, a woman wanting more sex from her husband isn't the same as a man wanting more from his wife. A man pressurising a woman is usually more coercive and more pressure. And women usually on one level know the reality of the world we live in, where they are at more frequent risk of rape.

Watchkeys · 21/04/2022 18:51

I think the thing is, both people in a relationship have to take responsibility for their own needs, and respect the other's feelings. This isn't happening here. One person isn't getting what they want because of an incompatibility, and instead of dealing with that, there are games.

Drop the games. You're not getting what you need. Talk about ways of resolving that, whether it's to change the format of the relationship or to behave differently within it. Stop feeling like you are not being given what you need. It's your job to make sure you get what you need, nobody else's.

Dusktildawnone · 21/04/2022 19:10

Time to move on?