PIL turning up uninvited

[Hidingin]

I have a terrible relationship with PIL. They are rude and cruel to me, make fun of me, judge me, openly criticise me. They comment on our house, relationship, careers, our parenting, anything really and it’s never ever a positive comment. I normally shut this down with a ‘thanks but we’re happy with what we’re doing’ type comment but it’s relentless. Whilst they aren’t often horrible to DC they aren’t always the nicest either.
I ask them not to be rude, I have protected dc and DH defends us all too. but a lot happens subtly, and it becomes a waste of time as they deny everything or say we are just being sensitive if we raise any issues. Or occasionally they get incredibly mad, and will scream and swear at myself and DH even in front of DC. so when they’re in our house really I’m just trying to not let things blow up. There’s a lot more examples but we are now LC, with periods of NC after any particularly bad behaviour. Though they do pretend like nothing happened the next day, and then the rest of the family will comment on how cruel we are being in not having them over to our house enough.

My main issue is that sometimes even though we are LC, they just show up at our house uninvited. When they show up they will look in the windows and they won’t leave if they think we are in, so just ignoring them isn’t an option. They once stayed for 15 minutes whilst I was bathing dc and couldn’t get to the door. The entire time they were banging on the door, looking through the windows, and even shouting my name. DH was at work, and saw them on our security cameras. So he called them and asked them to come back later when he was home instead as I was obviously either out or couldn’t get to the door. But they said no, then they carried on knocking on the door and windows at the front of the house and then walked around the sides and back of the house, knocking on all of the windows and still shouting, letting themselves into our back garden and trying to open the side and back doors to let themselves in, getting more and more angry as time went on. I couldn’t hide upstairs with DC indefinitely so had to let them in, they were angry and started talking to DC about how silly mummy was, and can’t she hear anything? Why did she spend all that money on security cameras if she’s not going to look at them when people come to the house? Why won’t she let PIL see DC, aren’t DC much happier with PIL rather than just mummy, don’t DC love love PIL more than mummy and daddy…and so on…

Ive obviously asked politely and then more firmly told them not to come round uninvited. DH has also told them. But still they just turn up.
Sometimes I feel like I can’t relax in my own home because I know they could turn up any minute and we have to let them in and have them be rude to us in the house, or have a confrontation at the door where we tell them they can’t come in. I can also feel my anxiety building at any occasion that’s supposed to be nice like birthdays or even when dc2 was born because I know there’s even more chance of them turning up than normal.

I just don’t know how to stop getting so anxious about this. I don’t think it’s my decision to go no contact as they’re not my parents. I have attempted NC myself and DH can go visit at their house whenever he wants. But still they turn up at our house.

@LookItsMeAgain

Just another suggestion - why not try their own tactics on them?

Show up at their doorstep when (and this would be important) you would be aware that it's not the most convenient time for them and bang on their door and walk around their home and treat them with the same level of distain they are showing both you and your DH.

Bet they won't like that!

If you start behaving the way they do it'll encourage their bad behaviour.

Hard core NC and include the flying monkeys in that. They’re either in denial about how fucking nasty your PIL are or they’re scared of them.

Your job is to protect yourselves and your children from harmful influences, which these intrusions are, and stop caring at all about what anyone else thinks. Literally who gives a fuck if they think you’re being mean? They can’t care about you if they think you’re unreasonable to choose not to spend time with such toxic bastards.

You’ve got to do something drastic, now, to stop this happening. I’d move tbh, move and cut contact with the whole toxic bunch of them. No family is better than awful family who are cruel, rude, abusive, intrusive, ruin special occasions, keep you in fear IN YOUR OWN HOME.

I agree with the previous posters. You need to take control.

Speak to DH and decide on clear boundaries. For example, you will NOT under any circumstances let them in without prior arrangement.

They will kick back but you need to stand firm. It is YOUR home not theirs. You do not need to let them in. Let the dog go mad for a bit. Let them knock and knock. I’d play some music, pull down my blinds and carry on regardless.

You have let them away with too much. Now is the time to claim back control of your life.

@Hidingin

I forgot to say, the few times they’ve been particularly rude I’ve said they can’t come back and DH has agreed But then they’ve (conveniently?) gotten sick or needed him a few days later and DH says he can’t have his elderly parents sick with no help, in case something happens he couldn’t forgive himself. they make a miraculous recovery every time, with no medical intervention, they are on best behaviour for a little while and then it all starts again.

Now I’m writing it all down I’m realising just how ill this is all making me!!

"That's fine DH - you go & see them whenever you want to. But I will not, & I will not have them in my home."

Fair enough @girlmom21 and @Aquamarine1029....I did say it was only a suggestion. Not necessarily something that they should do.

Pil are batshit and not good for your children to be around. Out of interest what relations are telling you to let them visit?
Does your dh want these people visiting all the time?
Time to get angry and start shouting louder?

PIL just want to see their GC so why aren’t I letting them in. If I let them in they wouldn’t have to keep banging on the door

There’s a part of your brain that instinctively knows why this sounds so wrong. It’s because it’s just another form of: “If you didn’t make him angry, he wouldn’t hit you.”

Your PILs are ignoring your boundaries, affecting your mental health, and it sounds like they say things that are emotionally abusive. And the rest of the family is saying, “Well, if you didn’t fight back, they wouldn’t emotionally abuse you.” And in so many of these situations as well, it’s because the rest of the family doesn’t want to deal with PILs; they don’t enjoy them either, and they really don’t enjoy listening to them when they’re angry at you. They want YOU to have to deal with PILs so that the family’s life is easier. They want to sacrifice your mental health for that.

You need to take the fact that they’re PILs out of the equation. You need to ignore the family, and maybe even DH. The question is: if two abusive people are knocking at all your doors and windows, yelling your name, then trying to OPEN those doors, while it’s just you and toddler DC at home, what would you do? You would call the police. And that’s exactly what you should do.

You shouldn’t have to feel this constant low-level anxiety in your own home. It sounds so much like what someone who has a stalker feels, never knowing when they might show up or when they might escalate the situation.

Good luck, OP, and please, don’t feel guilty. This situation is not your fault; the only “family” that thinks it is, is the kind of family that follows a very dangerous script.

@Hidingin
Have a read of this and see if it rings any doorbells......

www.insider.com/sibling-dynamics-behaviors-narcissistic-families-2019-7

Move, far, far, far away.

It’s very simple

They turn up start banging and shouting, you open the window and tell them you are busy, cant see them today and they must leave immediately and shut windows

They carry on, you open window. Tell them you have told them they are not welcome and please go , and if they don’t go you will report them to the police, and do it

As to the rest of the family my favourite mantra to mine is there are two sides to every story, you have only heard one, and surely, knowing us, you would know the action of not seeing them or whatever would not be taken lightly,

Then leave it to dh to sort,

Through sheer battle of wills I would have sat upstairs all day. No way would I have let them in. Dog going crazy or not.

Firstly you block them all in your phone. Dh can organise away from your home any contact he wants. Your dc are not being subjected to their toxicity.

Tell your dh you will refer him to a physiatrist if he he thinks your dc will benefit from having them in their lives..

It's harassment. I suggest calling non-emergency police; I've found them very helpful (not on this specific issue, NB).
Be clear that they are letting themselves into your garden and trying doors as well as ringing and shouting.
DH can do what he likes in terms of going running to them when they're 'ill', but tell him in no uncertain terms that you will not be involved. Fuck what people think.

About time you stand up to them. Or call the police.

I think you should have stuck with the nc!

Frankly I'd get them dealt with for harassment and trespass! They sound bloody horrific!

What exactly has your dh done to put them straight "come back later when I'm home" is hardly assertive!

Never mind "politely" or "more firmly" I'd be telling them to bugger off they're not welcome!

You can absolutely be nc with them even if dh doesn't want to be and you can massively limit dcs contact with them too

Also don't - with them OR any flying monkeys inc dh

Justify
Argue
Defend or
Explain

(Jade)

It's pointless with these people

Just have nothing more to do with them at all

But then they’ve (conveniently?) gotten sick or needed him a few days later

Yep

Classic narc behaviour

Check out

https://outofthefog.website

And the "stately homes" threads on here for support and advice

As you have ring doorbells or similar already I'm thinking you possibly have video of their behaviour? Or can get some ?

I think it's best to keep it simple - tell them (pref dh does this) that they are not to go to yours EVER that if dh wants to see them he will go to them NEVER the reverse, that they are not welcome at yours and if they attempt to gain entry to your home or grounds or harass you that you WILL take legal action (and mean it and follow through if they ignore!)

Quite honestly I'm your shoes I'd be moving house on the understanding they are NEVER to be given the new address

If dh waivers on any of this I'd also honestly and genuinely say it's this or you split - because this level of stress will likely lead to a split eventually anyway!

The suggestion to give them a taste of their own medicine did make me smile but I agree would be counterproductive (plus I wouldn't put it past them to call police on you immediately!)

It’s because it’s just another form of: “If you didn’t make him angry, he wouldn’t hit you.”

Yep

And the rest of the family is saying, “Well, if you didn’t fight back, they wouldn’t emotionally abuse you.

Yes! DH gets worked up and feels guilty, he doesn’t like them either but he feels guilty, which is supported by them and other family members saying things to us about us being ‘difficult’ And I’ve been trying to explain it, but you’ve articulated it better than me. There would be no situation for me to be ‘difficult’ in, if they weren’t turning up at my house all the time.

You’re exactly right I do feel like I have a stalker. I’ve even seen them go to the house when we’re not in and look through the windows, even after it’s clear we weren’t home, they stayed and looked around the house.

To be fair to the rest of the family they are all treated the same by PIL. And all also have that guilt if they try to ignore them

Hidingin

What Graphista wrote here.

I would just add that your H needs to realise that his own inertia when it comes to his toxic parents hurts him as much as you people as his family unit. He cannot or will not address this toxic mess at all because he is mired in his own FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) re them. He grew up under their regime and it shows now in his attitude to them; he is far more afraid of them than he ever is or would be of you here. He really does think the sky will fall in if he upsets them and even now still wants and or seeks their approval.

I see you've also had relatives on at you re his parents too; they've been likely sent in by his parents to do their bidding for them. These flying monkeys have no interest in hearing your side of things so their opinion should be roundly ignored.

I would encourage your DH to read Toxic Parents by Susan Forward, you could read her book on inlaws.

He should ideally too seek out a BACP registered therapist to talk about his parents (this person must have NO familial bias about keeping families together despite the presence of mistreatment). At the very least tell him to look at talks about toxic parents on YouTube.

@Graphista
“come back later when I'm home" is hardly assertive!

I agree but he knew I was home alone with them outside getting angry.
He wouldn’t do anything to make them more angry whilst Im alone to deal with it and have the dc there who could hear it all.

I like the pp comments to just put some music on loud for the dc and try and make it fun and keep them away from it. Obviously I have to agree with DH first that dc won’t then see gp at all, or I’ll later have angry PIL to deal with when DC inevitably blab about what a great time we had whilst they were knocking at the door.

Has anyone really called the police on their family? This just feels like a huge escalation and I don’t know if I’m ready for the massive fallout. But you are right, it probably wouldn’t happen again.

To be honest if we turned up unannounced at their house I think they’d like it. They’d either be getting attention, a target to abuse or they’d get to ‘reject’ us - all of which they’d enjoy.

I have thought they may be narcs for a while now, it’s nice to see that other people are edging towards that too and I’m not just insane
The gaslighting is real!!

Sorry to add in there, I don’t mean to be insensitive
Clearly people have called the police on family members
But in a situation like this, when there are real issues, I feel stupid saying ‘oh my PIL are here, they want to their their grandchildren, and I’m too scared to tell them we’re busy’

Are Electric gates doable/affordable?

Otherwise I think I'd relocate as far as humanly possible

And the subsequent fallout when other people are told
‘Wow we just popped round to DSs to see our darling GC who we love so much, and his horrible wife called the police on us! For no reason at all. We are devastated and don’t know why she is keeping GC away from us’

I shouldn’t care what other people think but PIL know lots of people we know, even from work and things. It’s just a bit awkward isn’t it.

I’m not trying to be difficult I know what everyone is saying is right, but when everyone around you tells you this is normal and you are the one being difficult, it’s really hard to be sure that actually you aren’t being that unreasonable, nasty DIL

Call the police next time.

And tell your husband he's going to need to make a choice, because it is affecting your mental health having them in your lives and you are done.

@Hidingin

Sorry to add in there, I don’t mean to be insensitive Clearly people have called the police on family members But in a situation like this, when there are real issues, I feel stupid saying ‘oh my PIL are here, they want to their their grandchildren, and I’m too scared to tell them we’re busy’

But that isn't what's happening, so that isn't what you would say at all.

You'd say something like: "my abusive relatives are harassing me again & refusing to leave my property. They are upsetting me & my DC, causing a public disturbance, & I need help to make them go away."

I also think that you'd benefit from a quick chat with someone wise at the end of the 101 line. They would soon reassure you that yes - this happens with families a lot, that you are not out of line for wanting advice & assistance, & that you should feel able to call the police for help when your foul PiL's turn up to abuse & harrass you again.

Absolutely awful! probably the worst account of difficult relationship with PIL I've read so far, get an injunction you can't live like this. They're unhinged.