Am I being paranoid here?

[Canaryblue]

Been with my partner for 4 years, and currently pregnant with my first child.
We were out for a meal and bumped into an ex of his, who got really nasty. She basically ignored me entirely but laid into him with absolute anger. I was really taken aback because I never expected this out of nowhere.
He was terrible too. When she had com up and snapped at him he somehow taunted her and that made her even angrier. She said horrible things, like what she hoped would happen to “his” baby and this really upset me. He got angry at that, but at that stage she was already being asked to leave. It was so embarrassing, and everyone was staring at that stage.
I asked him of course what on earth this had been about, because wtf?? He said he had been seeing her for a while when he had been working at uni, but that it had been short and that he didn’t know what this was about, and that she was obviously unhinged.
That would have placed the two of them together ten years ago. I can’t help thinking that there must be more to the story and that there is something he isn’t telling me :( I mean who would still be this angry after such a long time??
I’m so torn. I really want to know what this was about but I’m also terrified of running into her again because I can’t get over what she said.
I don’t know what to do or if I should just let it be. I don’t want to ruin everything by being paranoid.

Why do you want to be in a relationship with someone who has an unpleasant hidden side, and behaves unpleasantly towards other people? I'm baffled as to why this doesn't just turn you straight off. One of the things I love about my partner is what a lovely person she is. It would ruin it if she was only lovely sometimes.

@Canaryblue

He does have another side, but he’s just never shown it at home and has always been adamant that this is nothing that he wants in a relationship. Yes, this is the reason why this has thrown me. I’ll speak to him later and then this should hopefully be resolved. You are probably right that we seem to have communication issues. I didn’t think we did but I might have been wrong.

If he has never shown "this other side" at home and is adamant that he doesn't want it in a relationship , then how do you know about it?

I don’t know how to explain it really, I think it’s the way he grew up (but I could be wrong). He just doesn’t seem to care about anyone who isn’t close to him or people he cares about. He’s very good to me, my family and to and to his close friends/ colleagues but that’s where it ends. As I said I there seems to be something missing, and I don’t mean this in a mean way.
He grew up in a very abusive family and I think there are just some things that he learned/ didn’t learn which cause this disconnect.
Hes fiercely protective of those he cares about and that’s when the nasty side can come out.
I don’t think I can explain this very well.

He does have another side, but he’s just never shown it at home and has always been adamant that this is nothing that he wants in a relationship.

Okay. So you've seen it, and/ or talked about it? What evidence do you have of this 'other side'? I don't want to be the bringer of doom and gloom but another way of phrasing that is that he hasn't shown this other side at home in the four years you've known him. It's still there. And pregnancy is when abusers tend to start to show this other side more, because by that point you are trapped, or will feel trapped.

Why people are abusive doesn't matter to anybody except them, OP. They need to know why when they start working out how to stop.

From everybody else's point of view... does it make it ok to abuse someone if you were abused yourself? Does it make it a bit more ok than it would be if you hadn't been? No. Nasty words are nasty words. Poor behaviour is poor behaviour. Adults who have been abused in their past have a responsibility to themselves and others to ensure that the way they were treated doesn't seep into and affect their current life and relationships. If he's not taking responsibility for his own behaviour, and instead blaming it on childhood abuse, then he's not taking responsibility for himself, for who he is, now, today.

It's perfectly possible to be protective of people without having a nasty side that comes out, and yet he chooses nasty. That's on him.

I think the key thing here will be whether he talks to you about this other girl and takes responsibility for his actions with her. Him saying he doesnt remember is just bollocks.
She remembers clear enough to still be affected by it 10 years later and lets it all out on seeing him.

Think about it. How he reacted to her at that meal. It doesn't sound like he was at all remorseful about what he'd done to her. In fact he taunted her, telling her he doesn't even remember her which would have made her feel so much more hurt and angry. That he'd dished out this behaviour and still couldn't care less how it had affected her.

You say you've seen this side of him, but not with you or close friends. What behaviour are we talking about exactly? Just getting angry or is there more to it than that? Therres one thing being protective of your loved ones, I don't know a single person who isn't. But there does seem to be a little more to just being protective from what you've written.
Also, this woman was his GIRLFRIEND at the time he did this. Doesn't sound like he was protective of her?

So he may have grown up a bit. But if he does not own what he did in the past, I think thats a huge red flag and going forward together I think you need to take note of how he starts treatig you once baby is here. It likely won't be a sudden change. Think of the boiling frog analogy. Just keep in mind, don't ignore the little things. I hope he is remorseful and treats you well and you are not then in this womans shoes in 10 years time.

Hmmmm, it’s a tricky one. He could of grown up a bit and changed.
However he sounds a bit like my ex….he treated me terribly. I am so angry about it still. He treats everyone else he cares about including his now fiance wonderfully I’m sure. Probably in his eyes he didn’t care about me as much….did it mean I deserved the sub human treatment….no.

My OH's ex has accused him of coercive control. It's so obviously untrue that it's almost funny. What stops it being funny is that she's unhappy enough to think this. I know he has his faults, but the potential for being abusive and manipulative are not amongst them.

@BertramLacey That's what people who haven't been the victim of the abuse often believe about abusers.

@me4real I'm aware of that. It's an odd one because you're either convinced they couldn't be abusive because they genuinely aren't, or because they are abusive but are manipulating you.

I know a more recent ex of his who was with him for several years. She is very aware of abusive behaviours having been the victim of abuse herself. She said the same thing about him - he doesn't show signs of it. And I've been on the receiving end of manipulation and abuse. I've been in that situation where someone just can't believe what you're saying about someone else 'oh but they're lovely, they speak so highly of you' blah, blah, blah. When in fact they're being a bullying, manipulative nightmare.

So I keep an eye out. I trust my OH as much as it's healthy to trust anyone. The ex who is accusing him of coercive control has a long history of falling out with people, completely independently of him. I mean, they've been apart for more than a decade and she's falling out with everyone around her. And no, it's not him I get that information from. She's also very manipulative in her interactions with their daughter - that I have directly witnessed.

I'm pretty long in the tooth. I've learned over the years to trust my instincts with people. I've learned from mistakes I've made in the past. I highly doubt my OH is capable of manipulation. I've seen his ex manipulate people. Pretty sure she's just accusing him of things she does herself.

I mean, they've been apart for more than a decade and she's falling out with everyone around her

Abuse and the resulting trauma has an effect on our ability to make and maintain relationships. The fact that she is experiencing these difficulties is in no way evidence she doesn't have trauma, it's one of the biggest symptoms of relational abuse.

OK. Cool. I am completely wrong about my OH. My judgement is off. All the signs are there. He abused his ex and I'm just deluded. Whatever evidence I present to the contrary will be met with 'aha, that's what abusers do'.

Thank you, people on the internet who have never met him or me. I bow to your better judgement of my situation.

@BertramLacey

OK. Cool. I am completely wrong about my OH. My judgement is off. All the signs are there. He abused his ex and I'm just deluded. Whatever evidence I present to the contrary will be met with 'aha, that's what abusers do'.

Thank you, people on the internet who have never met him or me. I bow to your better judgement of my situation.

Bertram, this is mumsnet of course he's going to be accused of being abusive. I've seen threads where women have had a little moan about a row they have had with their husband and people have said 'it's abuse leave him' you trust your judgment just because his ex is a woman doesn't mean she is telling the truth. I love mumsnet but men really do get crucified on here.

@BertramLacey

OK. Cool. I am completely wrong about my OH. My judgement is off. All the signs are there. He abused his ex and I'm just deluded. Whatever evidence I present to the contrary will be met with 'aha, that's what abusers do'.

Thank you, people on the internet who have never met him or me. I bow to your better judgement of my situation.

I can’t see any reason for you to doubt your husband when he has given you no reason for it. That seems mad ..

We had two conversations since yesterday and I think we will need some help.
He admits to having been an asshole during his uni days but doesn’t see any issue with this and doesn’t feel bad about it. I don’t have a problem with it as such as I wouldn’t want to be judged for my past either, but he seems to be totally disinterested in any pain he might have caused. It’s like we are talking 2 languages and are not understanding each other.
Now, he’s not stupid or naive, and he does brilliantly in his work, but anything outside his “circle” is irrelevant.
I’m not sure if couple’s therapy is the way to go because I’m not sure if that’s the issue, but I’ll look at it as a starting point. I’m an idiot.

I just wanted to give an update since I had gotten so much helpful advise.
He kept denying any wrongdoing, and continues to do so even after I got proof that he wasn’t telling the truth. He was abusive and coercive, and looking back at it I am amazed what he got away with. His ex wasn’t yet he only only be who got to experience this, and I have seen correspondence with the university regarding his behaviour. I guess now I know why he suddenly went for a total career change.

I have moved out and am living with my parents for the time being, and feel like a total failure. I really don’t want to be here but I know I will need the help for now.
He’s so angry, with me particularly, and he is twisting this around. Apparently I am the one who is ruining his life with lies, and who is trying to keep his child from him. I have had to block him everywhere for now because I can’t deal with the additional stress.

I just wanted tip say ye were right, and I have left now…I’m heartbroken and feel like a fool, but I guess I just have to deal with it now. I don’t know what’s wrong with him and how I never noticed.
Thanks all.

Wow! Thanks for coming back and updating OP. I'm glad you are away from him and safe at your parents.

Thank God that woman did see him and speak up, or you could still be blissfully unaware and have become more entangled with him (marriage, property etc).

OP you are not a failure….you have done what is best for you and your child and it that means staying with your parents for a while and accepting some help from them that is nothing to be ashamed of.
well done for leaving, you will be so much better off in the long run x

He’s really caring and I’ve never seen him as anything she described him as, so I don’t understand it. I have seen him taunt people before when they are agitated, and I don’t like it. But in this case something just doesn’t fit.

This is a very confusing paragraph and contradicts itself. How can he be kind and yet taunt other people?

Also how can he be kind, yet lack empathy?

Sorry, just seen that this is an updated thread and my posts were irrelevant.

You are definitely not a fool, just the opposite in my opinion.

The fact that you took action and didn't bury your head in the sand as soon as you were aware of any abusive tendencies,speaks volumes.
Too many of us have explained away red flags, ignored our gut instincts and paid a heavy price for it.
You and your child have the best shot of a good life, because you refused to be sweet talked/duped into believing his twisted take on reality.
Give yourself a pat on the back love. 👏👏👏👏👏

You're not a loser or a failure.
You are a winner ❤️
You trusted your instincts, investigated the situation then took action to protect yourself and your baby.
I admire you OP, well done.
Now, chin up and tits out and move on, you've got this! ❤️

Thanks all. I think I’m just scared how this will all go. I really hate confrontation and I guess it will be nothing but going forward.
My Dad seems fine with me here but my mom keeps making the odd remark that I overreacted and that I am being unreasonable. Sure she isn’t the one who is getting her words twisted around so it’s easy for her to say.

I'd have a problem with anyone that could be that much of an asshole and witness the hurt he caused, still 10 years later, and not care. Lack of empathy is a massive red flag. I think you have dodged a bullet. That is not a failure by any stretch.

How are you op x