Don’t know what to make of what he’s said

[WhatToDo11]

Officially exclusive for 7 months, seeing each other for 10.

Right at the start we had a conversation about what we wanted. He’s 38 and I’m 36. Both said we wanted to settle down and family etc. We didn’t talk about specifics but I wanted to know we were on the same page and he said the same, before we got into anything more serious.

Anyway, last night we are driving back from the shops and we park outside and a child runs past the car very close. He said something about how his friend always says his child does that, then says he can’t wait for kids. This made me smile and I love him and it felt nice to hear him say that. I told him that it had made me smile and he said how many would you want, I said 3 probably but any would be nice. I then said with three though I’d want to crack on soon if that was the aim. He paused and said totally casually ‘yeah I would want to start that in four or five years time.’ This obviously took me by surprise. I told him so and said why would it be an aim to put it off for so long if we are in love and things are going well? He said he would consider 4 years but basically any shorter wouldn’t work for him as he’s still enjoying getting better at work. He pretty much shut down the conversation.

We had food in the car so we started to unpack it and went in to cook. I can’t get his comments out of my head. I really love him and honestly thought we’d go the distance but this has thrown me.

Ok look a female biological clock has a bit of a shorter range than a male one.

So ask him , does he really want to be an older dad? Picking up primary school at 50?

It's not always about just biology and baby.

Me and Mr Me met early 30s, I fell pregnant sort of not not planned, he didn't want to be a "too old" dad.

It's not about those 'magical' 9 months it's about so much more, that is what you should have a conversation about. And yes we had that conversation easily within 4 months of being together and being a dad changed my not ready the slightest into the fully grown wants to be role model man he is today.

So a starter for ten "you think going to the playground when you are 55 is desirable do you?". ...maybe .......

I know someone who's partner said the same kept putting it off another year another year - she now can't have kids. Honestly if you were younger I would say go gave fun live your life but it's awful to say but your chances greatly reduce as you get older for some anyway and if your pretty set on knowing what you want don't hang about too long.

I also think saying X3 is ambitious.

I said "let's start with one if we can and take it from there"

One is fine.

Seeing as he told you you’d better get a hurry on he definately realises your biological clock is at play and he wanted to make a point that his inset and he has time … being a man
I’d be promptly pointing out to him that his thinking is flawed and his sperm is declining in quality with age . That older fathers put babies at risk of problems
Then I’d say thanks anyway for your input and I wish you well
Why would you even want kids with a guy who’s clearly not into the idea of having kids with you and thinks he can be a Don Juan fetching some fertile young thing whenever the desire takes him
My guess is that in 4-5 years he be feeding the same line to another woman his age until the day he meets the young trophy he wants and he’s ready to lock her down with kids
I’d toss this one back

No Pinkbucket it was the OP who said she'd have to get a move on to have three, not her partner.

This might help op a thread from someone who is 36 yet being told the exact opposite of what everyone on here is saying, apparently she’s got plenty of time to start a family so there is no rush, I wonder why pp are saying the exact opposite on two identical threads!

That’s because in this case it’s a man wanting to wait. If OP wanted to wait then it would get very different responses.
MN often has a way of making the man out to be the unreasonable one regardless of what he did.

I remember one thread when a wife found out her DH had got some money but didn’t tell her about it and the responses were LTB, he’s abusive etc then another thread was about a women who had inheritance money and loads of the responses were saying to not tell DH and put it into a separate account etc. The scenarios were almost identical but the responses were completely different.

Please keep us updated, OP, I'd be interested to know how this one works out. Good luck.

It really doesn't take years to establish whether he or she is 'the one' when you've got a bit of living and loving experience under your belt. Maybe it does when your in your 20s, but two people in their 30s who both proclaim that they are ready to settle down and have children... they'll know.

OP's partner either isn't ready to settle down and start a family..,,... or he just isn't sufficiently into her. Or he may just need a gentle nudge to get on with it...

Either way she has to take a deep breath and start this difficult conversation.

@DiamondBright

If having children is an absolute must for you then this is probably not the right man and unfortunately you don't have time to waste. You need to lay your cards on the table and be prepared to walk away, don't make threats you're not going to follow through on.

I know too many women who waited for a man to be ready, left it too late and then were left for a younger still fertile woman.

No she doesn't have any time to waste. But finishing with him now, getting over the breakup and starting dating again, is only going to reset the process and delay things further. If she's really lucky she might meet someone else that she clicks with quickly (on the other hand it might take years to meet someone new), but the chances of a new partner wanting to jump straight in and have kids is pretty unlikely. In fact if she meets a bloke that does want his new partner to get pregnant that quick, she should probably be running for the hills, because that's a big a red flag as anything.

OP is between a rock and a hard place unfortunately. Best possible outcome is to try and talk the current partner round into a shorter timescale. It might have gone totally over his head about her age/fertility, and after just 7 months together, he's perfectly reasonable in thinking a of a few years of getting settled together first.

Officially the OP is already in the geriatric category. On the other hand Bernie Ecclestone fathered a healthy child last year at age 89, with his 44 year old wife. I think it's irresponsible to bring a child into the world at his age, but his wife's ages shows that there is hope for the OP yet. Think 3 is optimistic though, even if they start trying next week.

@Mymilk

Threads like this always baffle me. So many people saying dump him and find someone else. So OP has to somehow find someone entirely new that she likes/knows well enough to have a baby with, presumably have two weeks of dating to fit in with the required timescale, then what, jump in to trying for a baby right away? And that's if she even can find "the right person". I was single for 4 years before my current partner!

No wonder there are so many single mums if this is the way people are doing things 🙄 You can't possibly know somebody well enough to make such a life changing decision as having a child with them within such a short time! Insanity.

A lot of single mums have dated their partner for years and then split up.

Your comment is silly. OP is well within her rights to start having the baby talk now. If he doesn't want kids yet he is also within his rights but he should be clear with OP.

I bet all those saying OP may not meet anyone are sat at home with their kids!

I would rather chance finding a new partner than stay with a person and long for kids for the rest of my life.

@Pinkbonbon

BTW, he will likely backtrack now if you say this is a deal breaker for you. So no matter he says, if you do stay, the look to a marriage proposal and wedding within a year or two because if he won't meet that milestone then you can guarantee he will continue to put kids off.

Best advice on this thread yet.

@TurnUpTurnip

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/4392972-My-friend-has-basically-said-I-won-t-have-a-family?msgid=112213895#112213895

This might help op a thread from someone who is 36 yet being told the exact opposite of what everyone on here is saying, apparently she’s got plenty of time to start a family so there is no rush, I wonder why pp are saying the exact opposite on two identical threads!

Yes, this is true. That very thread although no partner is involved is full of 'advice' and personal stories about how plenty of time there is, and there is nothing to be concerned about fertility-wise . Very few people mentioned any statistics or talked about the reality of trying to conceive mid 30s onwards

@tiggerwhocamefortea

Yeah I'd make it clear in biological terms the implications of his decision.....that for a woman in her 40s something like 90% plus of her eggs are expected to be chromosomally abnormal, that this increases to 95% over age 43. That ivf success rates over 43 are as low as 2-3%. There is a reason why the NHS doesn't offer IVF to women over 40...because the success rates are woeful. Give I'm the facts and tell him he has 2 years max to "enjoy" his work FFS this sort of thing makes me so mad that people are so ignorant of their own fertility and that of their partners

(Speaking as someone infertile by age 36 after multiple losses and spent £35k on IVF)

Agree with your post Op although in my experience for men as well as women this information tends to fall on death ears..not sure why, denial? naive belief that they can control 'fertility' (I also had IVF for a blocked tube - unbeknownst to me before fertility checks and lack of a partner) and know where you're coming from because you know they knew someone without a uterus but met her partner at 44 and had twins on the first go ....

@Mymilk

Threads like this always baffle me. So many people saying dump him and find someone else. So OP has to somehow find someone entirely new that she likes/knows well enough to have a baby with, presumably have two weeks of dating to fit in with the required timescale, then what, jump in to trying for a baby right away? And that's if she even can find "the right person". I was single for 4 years before my current partner!

No wonder there are so many single mums if this is the way people are doing things 🙄 You can't possibly know somebody well enough to make such a life changing decision as having a child with them within such a short time! Insanity.

It's a tall order. No guarantees. Of course men and women settle, and even those who don't settle, still experience relationship breakdown. Finding the 'right, person before their 'become' the wrong person and then are back on the forums saying 'I should have spotted the red flags '

This is the reason I went at it alone and became a solo mother by choice because I need time to get to know someone, and didn't want to rush anything/relationship. A lot of many just keep pushing and either get lucky or make the wrong decision and end up settling as too panicked.

Does no one find it bizarre why he's uncompromising on 4 years? Why not 2 or 3? What additional info do people learn about compatibility in an extra 1-2 years?*

 His reason is  "getting better at work"   which probably refers to the   usual progress up the promotion ladder  and pay scale  in his particular career . Plenty of ambitious people  aim at a particular  career level (and income)  before they take on the responsibility and cost of children/

Those mentioning salary and position at work - he’s in the highest position at work, he got that last year. His salary is 112k. There are no financial reasons or really career progression reasons other than him wanting to ‘settle in’ to the job. He said women worry too much about when they have kids

I’ve raised it with him again. He said he would consider 3/4 years rather than 4/5. What worries me though is his brother is 42 already and not in a relationship. He often says very confidently that ‘of course’ his brother will meet someone and have kids.

He never mentions us moving in though says he thinks about it I’m a bit wary to be honest.

we’ve not had years together but we are grown adults settled in our careers and financially. It makes no sense to purposely put this on the back burner for up to five years. Why he wants to plan to start that at 43/44 is beyond me.

As a man he doesn’t have the same urgency or timing as you.
But at the same time it’s unfair to expect him to decide to have kids after 7mo of dating.
I’d plan for the long term - freeze some eggs, just in case.
And see how the relationship is going - at least make it to a 1-1.5 mark. If there is no progress - no moving in, etc - I’d be getting out then.
But at least with frozen eggs you’ll have a bit of a back up.

I am planning to freeze my eggs to extend the time I have to have more dc but I already have one. I agree with @MMmomDD to do this if you can

but in your shoes I'd probably also give up the current relationship and look for someone looking for exactly what you want, a family quite soon, obviously without just jumping straight in too quickly but to those saying there's no guarantee you'll meet someone else in time, it really doesn't look like there's any guarantee you'll have dc with your current dp no matter how painful that may be to face up to.

@WhatToDo11

Those mentioning salary and position at work - he’s in the highest position at work, he got that last year. His salary is 112k. There are no financial reasons or really career progression reasons other than him wanting to ‘settle in’ to the job. He said women worry too much about when they have kids

I’ve raised it with him again. He said he would consider 3/4 years rather than 4/5. What worries me though is his brother is 42 already and not in a relationship. He often says very confidently that ‘of course’ his brother will meet someone and have kids.

He never mentions us moving in though says he thinks about it I’m a bit wary to be honest.

we’ve not had years together but we are grown adults settled in our careers and financially. It makes no sense to purposely put this on the back burner for up to five years. Why he wants to plan to start that at 43/44 is beyond me.

He sounds very naive. I am guessing he doesn't know anyone personally who has suffered infertility, been through IVF or pregnancy loss.. Did you spell this out to him that pregnancy isn't always that easy? If he knows this and continues to want to put it off then I'd be getting annoyed. Along with the 'thinking about' u moving in together, sounds like he is either very laid back or has commitment issues.

I meant if he continues to put it off.for that long

@WhatToDo11

Those mentioning salary and position at work - he’s in the highest position at work, he got that last year. His salary is 112k. There are no financial reasons or really career progression reasons other than him wanting to ‘settle in’ to the job. He said women worry too much about when they have kids

I’ve raised it with him again. He said he would consider 3/4 years rather than 4/5. What worries me though is his brother is 42 already and not in a relationship. He often says very confidently that ‘of course’ his brother will meet someone and have kids.

He never mentions us moving in though says he thinks about it I’m a bit wary to be honest.

we’ve not had years together but we are grown adults settled in our careers and financially. It makes no sense to purposely put this on the back burner for up to five years. Why he wants to plan to start that at 43/44 is beyond me.

He's wasting your time.

A man on £112k doesn't need to worry about improving his career before children and can't be so absolutely stupid to the realities of the world that he thinks a woman can confidently conceive at the age of 43. Perhaps he thinks his money can sort that but even the richest of people can't have any guarantees. Egg donation would give you a better chance but many women don't want that.

You need to give him a deadline and stick to it because you're on one yourself.

I'm really starting to wonder if this is some weird thing he gets off on for some reason. I know a high salary doesn't mean you must be a genius but it surely means you've got a degree of worldliness and didn't grow up under a rock.

He's wasting your time. I'm afraid you have to tell him it's off.

This man is future faking you. All I see is a massive waste of your precious time.

With your update, I'm even more convinced he doesn't want kids or want them with you.

His brother sounds the same. Both sound like they're all talk about babies and no interest in the realities.