Lovely husband versus different life with friend – what to do?

[KormasABitch]

Apologies for the long post, I will try not to dripfeed.

I have a lovely husband, let’s call him Pete. We’ve been together almost a decade. He’s devoted to me, endlessly kind; nothing is too much trouble. A few years ago, we moved to a country where, unfortunately, he can’t get work (I’m OK as I work online). We’re planning to move elsewhere. In the meantime, he does all the shopping and cooking, chops wood for the fire, etc. We get on brilliantly and have none of the irritations I associate even with close friendships. We have the same tastes in music, films etc and often enjoy lovely weekends away doing things together like hiking or cycling. We never get bored with each other’s company.

Pete’s quite a bit younger than me, which hasn’t worried us over the years because as far as we’re concerned, being incredibly compatible is so lucky that it outweighs everything. However, one snag is our difference in life experience. He’s used to renting a place, and I’m not sure he’ll ever be what I’d call a responsible home owner. General maintenance etc doesn’t seem to occur to him, and I don’t want to be a nag, but find the overall neglect depressing when I’m so busy. He covers the basics, but anything else is a bit like pushing water uphill.

None of this might have mattered had it not been for life throwing me a curve ball.

My oldest friend, “John” (we’ve known each other 20-odd years), got divorced a couple of years ago. I helped him through the emotional process. We’ve always been close (despite him living in another country), but I suppose that brought us a bit closer for a while. I never thought much of it when he left his wife, but over the past couple of years we have exchanged friendly (not flirtatious!) messages and sometimes I find myself pining for the kind of life I could have with him. Over the years, we’ve had some great adventures together (when married to other people, so we never acknowledged or acted on the chemistry that was there), we have a good laugh, we understand each other well, and we have the same values. Pete, for example, can’t be bothered with family and I wish he made more effort to know my parents, who won’t be around for much longer; whereas I know John would connect well.

I am approaching retirement age and financial security has become more important to me than it once was. I hate to admit it, but combining forces with someone who has worked as hard as me is also appealing.

This is all churning round and round in my head, and I feel ridiculous. I don’t want to discuss it with anyone IRL, but would appreciate any input here. I hate feeling even a smidgen of disloyalty to Pete, because I adore him. It feels as though my priorities in life might be shifting somewhat, but maybe I’m just doing that “grass greener” thing and should just STFU.

My husband earns far, far more than me, simply because I moved to a country where I could not find work and my earning potential was affected. ( lifelong expat) I am therefore the Pete in the marriage and I do most of the cooking and life admin (though I do work part time) My DH appreciates this and is not resentful ( as well he should).

In a few years he will retire early and we plan to live out of a suitcase and travel.Luckily we both agree on this. I think Pete may be of the same mindset and is inwardly shuddering at your responsible home owner dream:)

@yellowsubmarines

Pete has this plan for if I get dementia as I age. It involves IT: he would make sure a little film played every morning, when I woke up, to remind me who I am and who he is, and how much he loves me, before he brings in my tea and tells me how much he loves me. 💕 and I know he's not bullshitting me. What price do you put on that.

Pete's clearly watch the film '50 First Dates'.

Please don't take offense OP but why is Pete with you? You sound like the mother he doesn't seem to have and he sounds like the child you've always wanted. Pete doesn't work, he plays video games all day and you don't even make him clean up his room. He makes the odd meal, chops the odd log, does the obligatory cycle with you and chores done he's allowed to read DM and play his video games again. Are you really staying with this manchild because you like his taste in music? It sounds like you two have a mutual arrangement. He is 'around' when required and tells you he doesn't care about your looks, promises to look after you when you get older even though he can't be arsed to do anything now and you provide his housing, pay for his food, pay all the bills, pay to move him abroad, spent your hand earned savings paying to redecorate a ruin that he will take half of in the divorce and presumably give him some sort of allowance? Do you really think so little of yourself OP?

Pete doesn't take an interest in your parents because he probably can't relate to them at all due to their age? You say John would make the effort but your parents are probably John's parent's age and he knows what 'taking care of them' entails. Pete makes you feel young and gives you a sense of power and control over another so you don't feel 'alone' and childless.

John sounds more like an equal but I agree with PP that John could go either way. Either he wants an equal who can help him enjoy his retirement years or he wants a much younger woman who looks good for all his mates.

They both sound ghastly OP. I don't think you and Pete are in love it's more a convenience for you both. John might be a good friend but that's all he'll ever be. Divorce Pete, sell the ruin and move on OP. Book some holidays with John and when John marries his much younger woman I bet you'll meet your Mr. Right on the dance floor at their reception.

Thanks for your comment! I understand your take on it, and it's interesting for me to unpick why it doesn't quite ring true.

First of all, yes, he probably did get that idea from a movie. But he means it sincerely. It's just the sort of thing he'd do.

The main thing is, this is very definitely NOT a mother/child relationship. I know because I had that for nearly 20 years in my first marriage (to someone my own age). And I don't hanker after children; I suppose the interest in John's kids was more that they'd probably understand him being with "Auntie Korma" and be a bit nicer to him.

"Pete makes you feel young and gives you a sense of power and control over another so you don't feel 'alone' and childless" is very wide off the mark. It's hard to explain, you'd have to meet us. I suppose, I'm beginning to think, we might be a bit unconventional. We don't socialise much, but when people meet us at friends' weddings etc they can't seem to get enough of us. I don't think people do that with couples who are badly matched.

Pete doesn't sit around all day. He does do useful things, and is more on the ball since I spelt out to him just how much it's bothering me. He always listens with respect and understanding and does what he can. He's just wired up differently. I think because my work is very deadline-driven, I have this natural sense of urgency that he totally lacks. And that thing about tasks expanding to fill the time available...

Just to unpick "He makes the odd meal, chops the odd log, does the obligatory cycle with you" -- he does all the cooking; I mean, I've virtually forgotten how to 😂
There is quite a lot of log chopping to do... to be explained in another post.
And re the "obligatory" cycle ride: that's not an accurate reflection of how it is. He checks the weather all the time to see if it's good for the weekend, and if it is, he plans a route in detail, checking every bit of it on Google Maps/Google Earth to make sure I can manage it (I'm clumsier than him), and he makes a packed lunch, and preps the bikes, and carries everything we need like water, so all I have to do is get on the bike and go. We share a lot of joy.

He's definitely not ghastly, and it is certainly not a "convenience" being with him! I think what would make it more convenient is if he was a millionaire 😍

@Westchesterarms

If it's so hot there, why is Pete chopping so much firewood?

Well, because it's not as hot here as we thought it was going to be.

Another top tip when moving to another country (especially in search of sunshine): Check weather statistics. It's quite simple to do so online.

I think maybe I should start another thread about what not to do when moving to another country 😋

@peridito

Have we now got a name change fail going on ?

Whether we have or not ,my twopennyworth FWIW

I'm not sure you're in touch with your feelings/understand yourself Korma .Another vote here for therapy .

It sounds as though you've been in very unhappy relationships before and understandably were bowled over by Pete's attention and affection .

But I think that although you "adore" him ,you don't respect him .The unequalness of the relationship is getting to you .Adoring eachother is not enough .

I do respect him, though, because he is so awesome and I don't think there is anyone more compatible for me.

I am beginning to think that we are both oddballs, perhaps stranger than I realised. We live in the middle of nowhere, so I am probably forgetting what other people are like (including John!). We tend to minimise contact with other people because they get on our nerves. We never get on each other's nerves. Unless you count my current crisis!

@fanofsun

John’s kids will never see you as a mum and ‘he stuck with her through four pregnancies’ erm they wanted to be pregnant - they were pregnant together - he didn’t ‘stick’ through them with her what a bizarre way you see John. Like he was hard done by. So what if they married young - there was obviously enough there for them to have four kids together. I feel sorry for Pete.

So, he met her on holiday when he was very young and she got pregnant. It was her plan, not his, to have kids. He could have just run away, but didn't.

I realise I described it badly! I don't mean he was hard done by, I just mean he behaved like an adult stepping up to his responsibilities, at an age when a lot of blokes would almost certainly choose to... continue their holiday.

I don't feel sorry for Pete 😂 You should see him this morning, happy as a lark. There is wood chopping to be done shortly!

When did women's expectations of men lower so much that a father facing up to his responsibilities is considered an amazing thing?

@AGirlCalledJohnny

Wow Korma, you have for yourself in a pickle. I genuinely couldn't maintain a relationship with this, no doubt very sweet, but arrested development man child. I would be absolutely mortified to be his wife rather than his mother. Ewww.

As for Golden Man John. Hmmm.... Sort out your marriage by divorcing and then see if John comes running. I'm curious as to what kind of lifestyle he leads? Is it similar to your own? I'm sure I sound completely superficial but should anything ever happen and I found myself single again, which I really hope isn't the case, I wouldn't remarry but date, and he'd have to be able to keep up with me because I'll be living large and he won't be riding my coattails (once I get the kids through US college $$$$ 😆)

"I'm curious as to what kind of lifestyle he leads? Is it similar to your own?"

I think that's a very good question and what I'm beginning to realise today is that he lives a more conventional life than I do. He lives the way my dad and my brothers do. Same priorities, same values.

And that is very appealing to me at the moment for various reasons.

But on the whole, my dad and my brothers have never really "got" me. They love me but think I'm bonkers.

Whereas Pete really gets me.

Her plan to have kids, not his? So he had four?

@MiddleParking

Her plan to have kids, not his? So he had four?

I mean when they met and she got pregnant, he'd had no plans for kids.

Obviously that changed rather dramatically!

Surely by the 2nd kid, John should have realised how contraception works. He sounds worse and worse. Team Pete!

Another twopennyworth from me - being in a not completely dissimilar quandary ,I wonder if it's something to do with having the time and space to indulge/be assaulted by this sort of "problem" .

Most of my life all I could manage was carrying on ,no head space or energy for fine tuning .

@Whatkindofdaughter
"Has this moved from Relationships?"

MN have done what they can to make the thread less conspicuous. I know I'm being silly about "prying eyes" but still. It's quite terrifying posting a thread.

@MareofBeasttown

Surely by the 2nd kid, John should have realised how contraception works. He sounds worse and worse. Team Pete!

I think he enjoyed being a provider.

Imagine how appealing that is to me in my current rut!!!!!! 😉

@lazylinguist

I haven't got anything to add about what you should do, OP. Just wanted to say that it's an interesting thread! And I think the reason you're getting some stick is that you're sounding so pragmatic about it all, and posters are kind of almost offended that you're not just 'going with your heart'. I disagree though. If more women really thought through the pros and cons of men they dated/married like you are, there might be fewer sad or horrible stories on the Relationships board. Fwiw I'm probably team John.

Thank you @lazylinguist and @Comedycook!

I do try to keep my head screwed on, although it spectacularly unwinds itself and flies off in various directions despite my best efforts 🤣

I think I've been focused on the cons lately. But what I'm beginning to realise is something I suspected from the start: it's easy to take for granted what makes someone so right for you.

@MareofBeasttown

My husband earns far, far more than me, simply because I moved to a country where I could not find work and my earning potential was affected. ( lifelong expat) I am therefore the Pete in the marriage and I do most of the cooking and life admin (though I do work part time) My DH appreciates this and is not resentful ( as well he should).

In a few years he will retire early and we plan to live out of a suitcase and travel.Luckily we both agree on this. I think Pete may be of the same mindset and is inwardly shuddering at your responsible home owner dream:)

Oh God, I wish I could read this without envy!

We'd also love to have more freedom, but it is looking like an increasingly distant horizon for me.

Our plan was always to free each other from slavery. His turn next.

@KormasABitch I think you sound fun and interesting. I’m in a similar position regarding retirement and pension planning but I’m younger than you. I’ve been traveling and bouncing around countries for the last 7 years and have just bought a small inexpensive house with my husband that needs a bit of renovating over the next few years. Financial reality has caught up with me so it’s time to be real about all that future stuff now, ASAP. I hear you.

I think if you and Pete can get a good work plan set out for both of you and get you both financially back in the black, it’ll help ease your restlessness. This can entail him looking for remote work and/or applying for jobs in the new country. Make sure you take work visas into account for the next country as well.

I kind of wish we could hang out OP! You sound like my kind of people and my husband is definitely a bike ride for hours kind of guy too. :)

I now think wood-chopping is a euphemism for something.

@JingsMahBucket thank you!

I think part of it is that I'm bored shitless working all the time. We moved here so that I could have more play time, but the reality has been the opposite. Imagine my surprise when we moved here and found the house was not only falling down, but too small 🤣 To pay for what needed doing, I've basically just switched on the computer every day from the moment I get up. Thank goodness Pete organises lovely things for us to do together, because he knows I don't really have the time to give it much thought.

Downsizing elsewhere is the way forward, I think. Funnily enough we were perfectly happy living here when it was (literally) a ruin and we just shared a small room all day every day with water running down the walls. So we don't need much.

i think in a relationship Johns lowbrow interests would annoy you. I think if you and John were going to be together it would have already happened. Maybe you were both each others back up plan in the back of your minds, but that wouldnt be enough long term. I think you sound like the sort of person who might always be looking over your shoulder and have half itchy feet, but it sounds like youve got a great match in Pete and its actually a bit maddening to always be on the look out for something better. What you already have with Pete is a relationship most would dream of. He is already a whole person, not just a pack of pros and cons. Hes giving up things for you as much as you for him

Thanks @Branleuse.

"I think you sound like the sort of person who might always be looking over your shoulder and have half itchy feet"
... is not true, actually. I don't normally get unsettled in relationships. I managed to be married to someone for nearly 20 years without him being particularly nice to me! I think that shows devotion of sorts, or stupidity. That's probably why I am taking such a hard-nosed view here. When doubts arise, I want to look at them seriously and not just dismiss them as "disloyal" or "ungrateful" or any of the other ways I used to discount my feelings in my first marriage.

I've been with Pete for many years without feeling the least bit restless. That's why it's knocked me for six a bit, to be having these doubts all of a sudden. Hence sticking my neck out on here. Believe me, I wouldn't do it for fun!

I am getting over involved in this thread. I understand you are tired of being the main earner, but I do not believe John is the answer.

DH is tired too. But if he does it for another couple of years he gets a substantial pension and is free of wage slavery. I appreciate we are lucky and you are not in the same position.

It is also exhausting and a lot of mental labour being the one always organising fun things and running the house ( I know bcos I am the Pete) and perhaps Pete has a similar thread to yours somewhere:)

Oh -- and
"I think if you and John were going to be together it would have already happened."

John has been married, until 2 years ago. So it's only in the past 2 years that anything could have happened. And we live in different countries. And I have only considered this recently, obviously by way of reaction to current circumstances. Probably because he gives me friendly advice on how to get the house ready for sale etc, and the weasel thought has crossed my mind, "God, I wish Pete thought like this."

He sure as shit didn’t plan to not have kids. What sort of man who’s married (or has been married) with four kids tells his female friend that they were never in his plan? I think you’ve got serious greener grass syndrome. He really doesn’t sound all that. Which is not to imply that the Workless World of Warcraft and Woodcutting sounds like a barrel of laughs either.

@MiddleParking

He sure as shit didn’t plan to not have kids. What sort of man who’s married (or has been married) with four kids tells his female friend that they were never in his plan? I think you’ve got serious greener grass syndrome. He really doesn’t sound all that. Which is not to imply that the Workless World of Warcraft and Woodcutting sounds like a barrel of laughs either.

He didn't tell me that. I made it up! And might have got the wrong end of the stick. 😋 Personally I found it rather impressive that someone so young could slip so readily and immediately into an adult provider role, when errrrrmmmmm a certain person, much older, does not.

I think OP that the sad reality is that you now realise how important it is for you to be financially secure. And your current husband doesn’t support you in that respect.

The only negative you have talked about in relation to Pete is his lack of get up and go in respect of work and doing tasks.

You have different priorities. And that might be because of your different stages in life, or it might just be how he is and how you are - 10 years ago, it didn’t seem as important. Because at 50 you weren’t really thinking about retirement and what that would mean for you financially.

It doesn’t make you shallow to worry about these things. We all need security.

What does make you sound shallow though is bringing another man in to the equation just because he is a bit more relatable financially.