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Relationships

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DP and radically different attitudes to money

152 replies

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 12:10

NC for obvious reasons, please don't out me if you think you know me.

I will try to put this as neutrally as possible.

When DP and I met, DP had substantial debt in a debt management plan. I knew about this from early on and was told it was all under control and that, once it was paid off, it would all be ok. I accepted this and, once the relationship got more serious, I was fine with the idea that we were a unit and therefore I would end up paying much more of day-to-day expenses (rent etc).

Since then, DP had a baby. Several times over the past few years, I have discovered DP has not told me the whole truth about money. It's been a mixture of DP not finding out what the truth was and telling me something that wasn't correct, or DP actively lying. Needless to say it has been very rocky.

During this time, we have both had patches of unemployment or under-employment, the longest of which involved me working one year when I worked part-time and had baby DD part-time, and one year when I wasn't working at all and had DD nearly full time (we had her in nursery two afternoons so I qualify to get a job, which I then got).

Since the first time I found out DP had not told me the full truth, I have made the point that I have been spending my savings, including an inheritance my relative meant for a house deposit, to meet our costs. I have always paid at least half, including when I wasn't working, and in total I've paid far more than half.

Now my job has come to an end, and DP has been promoted; I am looking at another patch of possible unemployment and DP is in a position to save money. DP wants us to continue paying half the household costs each. DP's logic here is that, if a relationship is going well, you treat household money as shared, but I have been repeatedly saying I felt that DP had effectively spent 'my' money on false pretences, therefore our relationship no longer functions this way.

DP has absolutely no savings and feels very vulnerable; I am very fortunate as I still do have a small amount of savings and my parents are lending me money to buy a house (me, not DP).

DP's position is that if we each pay 50% of bills, it'll be possible to save about 400 per month, and then when there's 5k in the bank, that would be the time to consider letting me pay less than 50%. But until DP has 5k in the bank, there is no chance of letting me pay less than 50%, let alone subsidising me while unemployed.

I feel really angry and cheated here. DP insists I don't get it because I am not, and have never been, financially really vulnerable. This is true. DP also feels that, if we split up, I would be fine because of my savings and the house. DP says if we stay together, of course the 5k savings would be pooled, but until it's clear the relationship is stable, not saving that money would be too risky. I feel that it is ethically wrong.

What do you think?

OP posts:
MrsSquirrel · 15/06/2021 13:16

OK, if you have a budget then you know the difference between your monthly income and your monthly expenses. Assuming you have something left after the essential expenses, that is the disposable income you divide between the two of you. DP can choose to save some of it.

I am in a somewhat similar situation in that my dp (also a two mum family) is crap with money. However, she recognises this and tends to take my advice. Also, she is honest with me.

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:17

@Hoppinggreen

Who is the child’s father? Does he contribute? I’m assuming you are a same sex couple, in which case your DP is the mother but what are you in legal terms? It’s important in case you split
We're a same-sex couple; we both have parental responsibility; donor sperm.

Sorry, it was really stupid to try to make the OP gender neutral!

OP posts:
fantastaballs · 15/06/2021 13:18

I can totally understand why she would feel insecure with you buying a house and her left with her own trashed credit rating. That can't be easy and would affect the dynamic of your relationship just as much as the finances situation.

As a compromise I would give her £2.5k providing she transferred it to a secure account that requires notice draw it so she isn't tempted to spend it. She has a terrible track record with money. And that would be all I would be doing. If she can't accept that she needs to repay the favour that you have repeatedly afforded her, then I would be ending the relationship.

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:19

@MrsSquirrel

OK, if you have a budget then you know the difference between your monthly income and your monthly expenses. Assuming you have something left after the essential expenses, that is the disposable income you divide between the two of you. DP can choose to save some of it.

I am in a somewhat similar situation in that my dp (also a two mum family) is crap with money. However, she recognises this and tends to take my advice. Also, she is honest with me.

Yes, that's what we do now.

The problem is if I don't immediately manage to get another job when my contract ends.

I agree with you the honesty/willingness to recognise a difficulty is the issue.

OP posts:
MrsSquirrel · 15/06/2021 13:20

She was in debt before you got together and now she is debt free. Sounds like she has benefited financially from the relationship.

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:21

@fantastaballs

I can totally understand why she would feel insecure with you buying a house and her left with her own trashed credit rating. That can't be easy and would affect the dynamic of your relationship just as much as the finances situation.

As a compromise I would give her £2.5k providing she transferred it to a secure account that requires notice draw it so she isn't tempted to spend it. She has a terrible track record with money. And that would be all I would be doing. If she can't accept that she needs to repay the favour that you have repeatedly afforded her, then I would be ending the relationship.

I understand why she feels insecure too. But I also feel quite angry that I had no part in trashing her credit rating, so I feel as if she is in effect blaming me for this, when actually, I have done everything possible to help her improve her credit rating?

I like the idea of a secure account with a notice draw.

OP posts:
DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:21

@MrsSquirrel

She was in debt before you got together and now she is debt free. Sounds like she has benefited financially from the relationship.
Yes.
OP posts:
BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 15/06/2021 13:22

How much of the savings you have is money you have saved up and how much is from your folks for a deposit?

I couldn't imagine my parents gifting or loaning me deposit money and wanting to exclude my partner (and the other parent of their grandchild). Do they dislike her?

updownroundandround · 15/06/2021 13:23

She is an adult and a parent, but she seems very jealous of your savings and inheritance.

It's not up to you to 'police' her, and it's not up to her to 'decide' that you should dip into your savings every time she fucks up again.

I get the whole ''pool everything together as 'family' money, but not when she's constantly 'expecting' to be 'bailed out' by you.

Your parents have sussed her out, isn't it about time you did ?

If she's living in a house you own, then she needs to be contributing 50% for bills/ food etc, and I'd be getting a solicitor to draw up a no claims agreement in case you separate too, so she has no claim on your house, because let's face it, she's not contributed to buying it or doing it up either is she ?

If you're both happy to continue with the relationship under those conditions, great (you could agree that she doesn't pay 'rent' until she has some savings behind her if you wish, but at least you know she's contributing 50% of bills in the meantime, and you wouldn't be 'wasting' your savings on doing up your house.)

MrsSquirrel · 15/06/2021 13:24

If you don't manage to get another job, then your joint income goes down, you will need to budget accordingly and reduce your expenses.

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:26

@BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz

How much of the savings you have is money you have saved up and how much is from your folks for a deposit?

I couldn't imagine my parents gifting or loaning me deposit money and wanting to exclude my partner (and the other parent of their grandchild). Do they dislike her?

A bit under half is what I've saved.

My parents don't dislike her; my mum especially. They have actually put an enormous amount on me not to split up with her, which I have considered.

I think they are just genuinely worried that, if they made the loan to both of us, it could turn out that DP has told more lies and debt collectors will come after assets like a house, or it could be she runs into more money problems down the road, with the same result.

OP posts:
MadeForThis · 15/06/2021 13:26

Has she finished paying off the debt?

What is she continues spending and never saves the £5k?

MrsSquirrel · 15/06/2021 13:27

I agree with@updownroundandround, if you will have separate finances to the extent that she pays rent, then she doesn't get a say in what happens to your savings.

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:27

@updownroundandround

She is an adult and a parent, but she seems very jealous of your savings and inheritance.

It's not up to you to 'police' her, and it's not up to her to 'decide' that you should dip into your savings every time she fucks up again.

I get the whole ''pool everything together as 'family' money, but not when she's constantly 'expecting' to be 'bailed out' by you.

Your parents have sussed her out, isn't it about time you did ?

If she's living in a house you own, then she needs to be contributing 50% for bills/ food etc, and I'd be getting a solicitor to draw up a no claims agreement in case you separate too, so she has no claim on your house, because let's face it, she's not contributed to buying it or doing it up either is she ?

If you're both happy to continue with the relationship under those conditions, great (you could agree that she doesn't pay 'rent' until she has some savings behind her if you wish, but at least you know she's contributing 50% of bills in the meantime, and you wouldn't be 'wasting' your savings on doing up your house.)

I think you've misunderstood?

The issue isn't the possibility of her not contributing 50% now, the issue is, in the past I have bailed her out, but she doesn't want to bail me out now.

She would be perfectly happy with the idea of contributing 50% of the bills, but she would expect that if I don't get a job, or get a job that's terribly paid, I should dip into savings to pay my half, rather than her bailing me out.

OP posts:
DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:28

@MrsSquirrel

If you don't manage to get another job, then your joint income goes down, you will need to budget accordingly and reduce your expenses.
We could do that if it were joint income; the problem is that she doesn't want to treat it as joint income from now on.
OP posts:
DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:29

@MadeForThis

Has she finished paying off the debt?

What is she continues spending and never saves the £5k?

To the best of my knowledge she's now paid off the debt.

I suppose if she never saves the 5k then she never gets into a position where she'd ever consider bailing me out. I don't know. That's a good question.

OP posts:
BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz · 15/06/2021 13:29

So she is happy to benefit from you having a higher salary than her bit when it's the other way around she wants to change the parameters?

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:35

@BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz

So she is happy to benefit from you having a higher salary than her bit when it's the other way around she wants to change the parameters?
Yes, exactly.

Her logic is that, because I've pointed out she was relying on 'my' money, obviously I no longer see finances as pooled, so why should she? And that, because I'm financially more secure, I should understand why she feels vulnerable.

I do understand why she feels vulnerable and I get that she must feel life dealt her an unfair hand. But I also think, ethically, her first response ought to be 'you bailed me out lots so I will bail you out now; you trusted me to be honest so I will trust you not to kick me out with nothing'.

OP posts:
Maunderingdrunkenly · 15/06/2021 13:40

I think it’s about the spirit of the thing rather than the detail, she has had your support to get out of debt and is much further forward in life as a result of her relationship with you and she would be making a big mistake to become ebenezer now when you need a hand, it will and and sounds like it is, fatally undermining your belief in her and your relationship. Can you put this to her? She’s about to make an error. I’m in a similar position with my partner and I’m wildly financially better off thanks to his support over the years and if he needed help I’d give it, but I’ve also had to take on the chin that my financial mistakes are my financial mistakes and I can’t be jealous of his greater pension or house equity (I have both and am building them up but further behind). We have no kids though.

MrsSquirrel · 15/06/2021 13:41

She only wanted to treat it as joint income when it benefitted her. Now that she is debt free, she won't do the same for you.

Even though we have been together for years, my dp and I have separate bank accounts because we are so different in the way we handle money. But we are a family and very much share everything.

If you have entirely separate finances and she pays rent, she will be your lodger.

5475878237NC · 15/06/2021 13:46

To me these aren't money worries, this is symbolic of how your DP feels about trust and respect and control.

Does DP feel the need to have some secret savings here and that's why the lack of honesty about money? Or does DP come from a background of abuse or coercion and this is an attempt at keeping control?

DP is not being fair in keeping the truth from you, even if it makes DP feel better.

DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:47

@Maunderingdrunkenly

I think it’s about the spirit of the thing rather than the detail, she has had your support to get out of debt and is much further forward in life as a result of her relationship with you and she would be making a big mistake to become ebenezer now when you need a hand, it will and and sounds like it is, fatally undermining your belief in her and your relationship. Can you put this to her? She’s about to make an error. I’m in a similar position with my partner and I’m wildly financially better off thanks to his support over the years and if he needed help I’d give it, but I’ve also had to take on the chin that my financial mistakes are my financial mistakes and I can’t be jealous of his greater pension or house equity (I have both and am building them up but further behind). We have no kids though.
YY, this is how I feel.

I have tried to explain this to her, but she comes back to the fact she feels very vulnerable. I have tried to say that I feel emotionally very vulnerable.

I think part of the issue is that she genuinely believes that my parents would happily give me more money if I needed it, so what's the big deal? - when in fact this has all put a pretty huge strain on my relationship with my parents. And she also believes that it would be quite natural to come to the conclusions she's come to, so she can't see why I don't agree.

OP posts:
DPMoneyWorries · 15/06/2021 13:49

@5475878237NC

To me these aren't money worries, this is symbolic of how your DP feels about trust and respect and control.

Does DP feel the need to have some secret savings here and that's why the lack of honesty about money? Or does DP come from a background of abuse or coercion and this is an attempt at keeping control?

DP is not being fair in keeping the truth from you, even if it makes DP feel better.

We both have less-than-perfect backgrounds.

I don't really know about the control. If DP were solely motivated by wanting to save as much money as possible, that would be one thing - but DP is quite happy spending money on little luxuries. I've no theoretical issue with that, I'm just saying, it's quite clear she's not frantically saving every penny in case things go badly wrong.

OP posts:
NakedNugget · 15/06/2021 13:50

I'm really torn here.

My first thought is fuck this... couldn't live in a relationship like that myself especially with all her lies.

It was good if you to bail her out but I couldn't imagine being with my partner who had 20k of savings while I had nothing and they expected me to pay more, not save anything myself, just so they could keep their little nest egg. That's selfish

However your dp has lied to you so often I can understand why you're reluctant to dip into your savings.

Personally (in an ideal world) everything should just be pooled together so you both have 20k in the savings and money in is money in for the both of you regardless of who is earning it. But obviously this isn't an ideal world.

I'm really torn because you have a child, but ultimately if I were you and my dp had lied to me so often and was such a financial deadbeat then I would cut my losses and go. Financially you'd be better off.

MilduraS · 15/06/2021 13:52

My DH and I have separate finances and it works because we pay proportionately. He's always been the much higher earner but if he lost his job tomorrow I'd step in to cover as much of the bills as I could rather than expect him to keep up as usual and pay with his savings. I don't think it's fair of her to say you'd need to pay 50% whether finances are pooled or not.