Is it just me or does most men suck?

[peanutttttt]

Exactly just that. I really hate dating now a days, because you just never know if someone's intentions are genuine. Like how do you know anymore? Men of all ages just suck and at this point I have given up. I went on a date with this man, the connection was great before the date and the date was great. I even got a kiss at the end of it but never heard from him again. Like how weird! I don't dwell on it. It's just annoying I wish people would be honest now. I can't stand it. How's everyone else's dating life going? Because my love life is an absolute joke.

I'm not convinced this logic works. It's still the case that children - especially when very young - are cared for by women.

If your mother is empathetic enough, why wouldn't it follow that you'd be put off a lack of this in a potential life partner?

I agree with you @coronaway. I would rather remain single than be with someone I don't fancy regardless of what a nice guy he is.

A friend tried to push a friend of hers like this on me a few years ago. There was no chemistry and not a glimmer of attraction. I prefer to date nice kind men who I also find hot!

@BuggerBognor

I can say the exact thing except in reverse...every single one of them (family members) were/are emotionally unintelligent and/or abusive in one way or another.

Same here - even the “best” one has a very limited emotional repertoire. The psychological explanation is that we are drawn to the type of men who raised us because they are familiar. In which case, I’m fucked!

Same again , hardly know any who are not abusive or user or addicted to porn / cheaters etc and I’m not just speaking for my own experience I’m speaking of work colleagues I became friends with who’s had similar experiences with their husbands and boyfriends, women who are hooking up with men who outwardly seem respectable ie good jobs , seem kind and respectful to women , that is until they are found out to be doing these things

@TomPinch

I'm not convinced this logic works. It's still the case that children - especially when very young - are cared for by women.

If your mother is empathetic enough, why wouldn't it follow that you'd be put off a lack of this in a potential life partner?

If you do a little basic psychologist you’ll find that for boys the biggest influence is usually the main female in their lives ie mother and for females the father This goes for whether the mother / father is present or not People frequently try to repair or make right the things that were wrong with their childhood

Just as a side note , why are you not believing or at best , minimising what the women here are telling you are their experiences of men ?

You do realise that this type of minimising is one of the major issues ?

@BuggerBognor

*Just as a side note , why are you not believing or at best , minimising what the women here are telling you are their experiences of men ?

You do realise that this type of minimising is one of the major issues ?*

Mansplainers gonna mansplain! 🤷🏻‍♀️

yes indeed . Totally ignore the pages of women’s lived experiences not to mention the multiple other other threads , hell, even the daily newpaper reports and govt statistics on abuse, harassment and men’s general behaviour .... BUT MOSTLY JUST IGNORE what women themselves are saying . Whether this be about their experiences online or in relationships. Then if that fails perhaps we can blame the mother

It’s not just you, however I think it’s true that most of the decent men are held onto for dear life - as I would if I’d found one earlier!

Many men are decent in many areas of life, my soon to be Ex husband is a lovely, caring, funny intelligent man and held in high regard by all of his family and friends. But our society is misogynistic and has definitely contributed to him feeling that he could go around meeting other good looking woman because... I guess... entitlement. If I’d not been home with the kids and men still found me very hot and attractive, because... you know good job and middle age make me look better because look house, look car, look great job... and I didn’t stay at home looking after children maybe I’d turn into a bit of an asshole too.

Society encourages them. Hell, I have to say it... even women encourage them (all the twenty/thirty something women who could well get a man their age but somehow find a man leaving his marriage and kids attractive? Just why?)

Sigh...

@Babdoc

I must have been lucky. I had a nice affectionate caring boyfriend at school - we still exchange Christmas cards, and chat on FB occasionally - and then met my wonderful DH at 19. DH was an absolute treasure, loving, caring, came to the hospital and cooked my dinner for me every night I was on call, changed nappies, did more than half the chores, and was great in bed. He taught me what love is, and undid the damage from my emotionally abusive parents. Sadly, he died at 36, 30 years ago. I never remarried, as I feel he is irreplaceable. I would hate to be dating now, in an environment saturated with violent porn and misogyny. I would advise young women to snap up one of the few decent men as early as possible - by your 30’s/40’s it’s mainly rejects that are left. Divorced men who were abusive, idle, drinkers or cheaters, plus mummy’s boys and incels. You could kiss a helluva lot of frogs before finding a prince in that lot.

This is so sad Babdoc and so poignant. So sorry for your loss.

I think you are dead right - snap up a wonderful man when young and build an amazing future with them and have kids. Best advice ever.

@Blossominspring2021

It’s not just you, however I think it’s true that most of the decent men are held onto for dear life - as I would if I’d found one earlier!

Many men are decent in many areas of life, my soon to be Ex husband is a lovely, caring, funny intelligent man and held in high regard by all of his family and friends. But our society is misogynistic and has definitely contributed to him feeling that he could go around meeting other good looking woman because... I guess... entitlement. If I’d not been home with the kids and men still found me very hot and attractive, because... you know good job and middle age make me look better because look house, look car, look great job... and I didn’t stay at home looking after children maybe I’d turn into a bit of an asshole too.

Society encourages them. Hell, I have to say it... even women encourage them (all the twenty/thirty something women who could well get a man their age but somehow find a man leaving his marriage and kids attractive? Just why?)

Sigh...

This is so spot on . Society values men for things that come with age to many of us like job status security and even salt and pepper hair ( although in women notice you rarely hear it described like that ) Yet for women we get largely devalued. Men have used this narrative throughout history to keep women locked down , in competition and wanting to ‘keep their man ‘ whilst they do whatever the hell they want

I could have done with this knowledge when I was in my 20s so I didn't find myself in my current position as I fast approach my 40s. Why didn't my elders lay it out like this!

@coronaway

I could have done with this knowledge when I was in my 20s so I didn't find myself in my current position as I fast approach my 40s. Why didn't my elders lay it out like this!

Yes true , me too, no one will admit the world is hugely skewed in favour of men, least of all men ! We are repeatedly told we have equality . Look at the pay stats , look at who are the majority of victims of domestics abuse , rape etc, look at who the single parents are, internet porn culture , who does the lions share of unpaid work in homes etc then listen to how societies messages about how women have it so good , men complaining about how hard it is for them now and and see the real picture.

When we are young we don’t have the skills to see past the propaganda bullshit but as we get older we soon work it out .

@Washingtofold

I googled 'are fathers the biggest influence on their daughters' romantic relationships'. What I found were some rather saccharine webpages from the US and one study by the Institute of Family Studies, which appears to be a right-wing American think-tank funded by the Koch brothers. Please find something else for me to read as you're the one defending the claim.

Secondly, I haven't commented on anyone's actual experience. I have questioned a couple of generalisations that I think are doubtful. They are both generalisations purportedly provable by scientific data, not individual experience.

If you go back and read my posts, you will see that I haven't said anywhere that men aren't a bunch of ratbags.

I haven't given any experiences of my own to contradict anyone elses, precisely because that would be mansplaining, something I have not done.

@tompinch
Wow I have no idea what you searched but perhaps try searching some psychological journals . I’m referring back to my days of psych 102 at uni . Granted it was part of my child development studies so you may need to dig a little but I’m sure if your ready to get on here and discredit women’s experience , which by the way IS EXACTLY what your doing despite your protestations, I’m sure you’ll take time to do.
For starters maybe begin with these then get into some more advanced literature

www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/the-truth-about-exercise-addiction/201711/the-link-between-absentee-fathers-and-womens?amp

scholarworks.merrimack.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1049&context=honors_capstones

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30014954/

Washingtofold -.

I think your argument is what you see quite often on MN pages. But I think what it's saying is look this small group of successful/ good looking men thrive more in society than everyone else. Hence men have it easier and society is skewed towards men. I think that's not the case, itsjust skewed to this small group of men and the reason for that is the attitude of both men and women. It's also why I think a lot of men switch off when they hear the argument as they know it's not the case for the majority of men.

@Oreo01

Washingtofold -.

I think your argument is what you see quite often on MN pages. But I think what it's saying is look this small group of successful/ good looking men thrive more in society than everyone else. Hence men have it easier and society is skewed towards men. I think that's not the case, itsjust skewed to this small group of men and the reason for that is the attitude of both men and women. It's also why I think a lot of men switch off when they hear the argument as they know it's not the case for the majority of men.

No that’s not my argument at all .

Men have privlidge regardless of looks that women simply don’t . Including but not limited to .

Society says to all men regardless of how good looking they are that their value is in their status , their humour , making a woman laugh , being wise etc ( all the things that mean little to men in a woman )

Medicines are designed with men in mind , vehicles , working hours , pretty much all of society

Walking down the street without being leered at or having sexual harrasment

Having a huge social media arena by and for at their sexual desires and fantasies in pornography
Having people like themselves in the majority of power positions within government and even business

Being socially ‘ let off ‘ for being slack with parenting responsibilities or not ever of rarely being asked who looks after their children when they are working - the assumption being women hold that load

Earning more money for the same work , doing less of the unpaid work etc

The list goes on and on

The reason men switch off is entitlement

A Guelph there is mountains of information available about the many privileges being male affords you yet most men are oblivious .
I guess that’s part of it . Ignoring the fact that one is in fact ... privileged
Not sure why you think these privilege only apply to a small
Percentage of good looking men

Male privilege is definitely an established fact. Check out this book, for example www.amazon.co.uk/Invisible-Women-Exposing-World-Designed/dp/1784706280/ref=asc_df_1784706280/?hvlocphy=1006964&linkCode=df0&hvptwo&psc=1&psc=1&hvnetw=g&hvadid=256266022931&hvpone&hvlocint&th=1&hvpos&hvdev=m&hvdvcmdl&hvqmt&tag=mumsnetforu03-21&hvtargid=pla-886826816787&hvrand=17432740422593168215

The pay differential is down to a small group of men that sit at the top of the tree.The pay differential is actually being addressed quite a lot with people in their 20/30s, whether that will ultimately topple the glass ceiling I don't know but there's a whole societal piece that simply can't be over looked.

Status. So what you're saying is what's important is responsibility. Which I agree with. Do we value that in men and women, not as much as we should. I base that assessment on frustration and personal experience.

The whole thing with childcare. Where to start, a system skewed against men when it comes to relationship breakdown and the subsequent child access arrangements regardless of fault when the relationship ends. Post break up the man usually leaves the family home regardless of who decided to end the relationship and is looking at a pretty bleak few years trying to get back on his feet. Something which is barely acknowledged, well it must have been their fault right....

On a day to day basis relationships can be difficult. People can be very difficult to live with and their behaviour very unreasonable. That's just as like to be the woman as the man.

I'm happy to accept the faults of men and where they can do better but that doesn't mean we're all entitled and unable to behave reasonably or responsibly (which many of us do).

Wow that’s interesting that you see the fact that so many dad just abandon their children and don’t pay child support , or do their best to dodge it as a system ‘ skewed against men ‘

You also men briefly that in the younger ages some address is being made to pay . Yes , and change is slow in coming .

So you are yet to address the fact that women still do predominately the lions share of unpaid work in most homes

That most harassment and abuse is perpetrated by men against women

That men experience a plethora of privilege that women do not .

You can sit their and say that relationships are as hard for men as women but ultimately your refusing to acknowledge your privilege as a man in this world .... and that can not be blamed on ignorance when your given solid examples yoh simply ignore

Most men are emotionally stunted immature sexist sleaze bags. OLD makes it so easy for them to enact their sleaze. I feel so sorry for heterosexual women trying to connect with actual grown up men.

So I ask again Oreo why you believe it’s only good looking men who experience these benefits

As a man do yoh also not live I. A world where women do not routinely sexually harass you

Where women are not paid more than you for the same job

Where you are not expected to do the lions share of childcare and unpaid work

Where you have the privilege to move about in a world free of harrasment , assault or rape by women

And the many many other benefits you experience as a man

‘Status. So what you're saying is what's important is responsibility. Which I agree with. Do we value that in men and women, not as much as we should. I base that assessment on frustration and personal experience.’

I have no idea what this means

So many man are shitty to women and children. A psychologist friend told me it's true that women in general have no idea how much so many men dislike them and have no respect for their sex.

If I divorce, I would be delighted to never date an again. Ever.

@Washingtofold

Wow that’s interesting that you see the fact that so many dad just abandon their children and don’t pay child support , or do their best to dodge it as a system ‘ skewed against men ‘

You also men briefly that in the younger ages some address is being made to pay . Yes , and change is slow in coming .

So you are yet to address the fact that women still do predominately the lions share of unpaid work in most homes

That most harassment and abuse is perpetrated by men against women

That men experience a plethora of privilege that women do not .

You can sit their and say that relationships are as hard for men as women but ultimately your refusing to acknowledge your privilege as a man in this world .... and that can not be blamed on ignorance when your given solid examples yoh simply ignore

I don't. I pay child maintenance and have fought through the courts to see the kids. I also put arrangements in place to make sure they had somewhere nice to grow up in which is possibly to my own personal detriment. I have no idea how you've drawn that conclusion regarding child abandoning being my view.

I'm basing my views on my first hand experience. I'm not projecting.

At the extremes men are more disagreeable hence why most people in prison are men. Men are more aggressive but its something like 60/40 (if you were to take two random people of the opposite sex).

Repeating myself. I think society suits a small group of men that thrive and are unchallenged by other men and women. That is driven by behaviours of men and women.

You haven't had my lived experience and yet you're trying to tell me what I should and shouldn't accept.