He did the mash. The Geller mash.

[StuckInPollyannaMode]

Thread 4. Wow. Thank you for putting up with my ramblings thus far, and for all the support - I couldn't have done it without you all.

Previous thread here

I can confirm he has purchased a masher. He sent me a picture of it and asked if it was alright

@Whathappensnext1

I’ve been reading some of this thread, I think you might need to accept that the DC’s poor behaviour and lack of confidence might be because of your family break up. I think you decided to leave only a few months ago and only moved out quite recently? Surely can hardly be unexpected that they feel disorientated? Also your XH is still learning how to parent on his own. It may take him a while and he may never parent them in the way you want him to, and he doesn’t have to. You took time to make your decision to leave, you’ve moved on and found a new relationship, they are just catching up. I think your mum was trying to say this to you in her own way. It will take a long time for things to settle down but they will eventually.

Have you followed the threads?

I don’t think that MN classic of “are you on glue?” has ever been so apt

Whathappensnext1 this is the third in a series of threads, as OP has made clear. May I strongly suggest that you go back, read all the previous threads and all of this one, and then withdraw your utterly ignorant post?

@Whathappensnext1

I’ve been reading some of this thread, I think you might need to accept that the DC’s poor behaviour and lack of confidence might be because of your family break up. I think you decided to leave only a few months ago and only moved out quite recently? Surely can hardly be unexpected that they feel disorientated? Also your XH is still learning how to parent on his own. It may take him a while and he may never parent them in the way you want him to, and he doesn’t have to. You took time to make your decision to leave, you’ve moved on and found a new relationship, they are just catching up. I think your mum was trying to say this to you in her own way. It will take a long time for things to settle down but they will eventually.

Honestly! At least I had the courtesy to READ THE PRIOR THREADS before posting on this, the third one!

I have lurked throughout your threads because I don't keep up enough normally to post anything useful, but have cheered you on from the wings.

I work with children and the phrase "attention seeking" is banned. Children are attention needing or attachment seeking, they need to know they are emotionally safe with you no matter what and you can never tell them that you love them too much! It will feel like a battle when he is being him and even more so when your mum throws things like that in, but it sounds like you are doing exactly what your girls need and they will remember it and it will make a difference for them, even if it doesn't always feel that way now (it feels condescending to say well done, but I hope what I'm saying is sounding as encouraging as I intend)

@SpringCrocus

If I were DD and it was handover day, I think I'd do anything to avoid being with Geller! Nasty shit that he is. Have a virtual hug from me, *@StuckInPollyannaMode* and some and a

I think it could be this. You are doing a wonderful job. X

Be good to yourself this weekend. Get rid of that cold!
You will feel better soon - but cry all you need.

DD2 will have forgotten all the trouble within mins of being at school

I hope you eat lots of soup and drink lots of tea this weekend @StuckInPollyannaMode! All of those things help drive up your temperature and help kill off the bugs. If you like spicy foods, I think that helps too. I’m not surprised you’re run down after looking after the kids like you do. You’re a brilliant mum.
Please don’t let anyone in your head. You’re amazing.

Morning all

Well I'm finally feeling more like me. I had a day of wallowing, a day of being kind to myself and going for a run. Then a friend turned up with my favourite supper from a local restaurant and took me for a walk, and my girlfriends all got me on a zoom and we had wine and a giggle.

Slept like shit but this morning I've done my pilates and changed the bed AND got into size 14 jeans for the first time in a decade (I can just about breathe!) AND I treated myself to a Babyliss Big Hair which I've wanted for ages.

Just about to go buy some paint as I'm dealing with the horridly pine coffee table and a text pings in.

Guess who?

'They won't leave their beds and say I control their lives.

To be honest I'm done'

Now, after the initial laughter response - and I've muted him on Whatsapp so he's messaged me on text instead - I do hear what you're all saying BUT I can't bear to think of them at the mercy of his shouting and ridiculousness.

Advice welcome. I want them back if he's going to be a shit to them.

Ouch. I'd want to go and get them and hug them tight. I wouldn't want to play the long game which is probably to leave them there, let school see how they are on Monday after a weekend at his, and wait for the CAO. But if you can demonstrate a pattern of him handing them over early because he can't handle them - surely that's a good thing? I can't help but think he doesn't actually want them and you're going to end up with them 95% of the time in a few years anyway so why not reduce the damage to them and go get them now.

You need to resist your urge to involve yourself.

Keep his texts, you will need them.

This was the dynamic of your marriage.

He avoided parenting and you stepped in.

He either parents his children or he chooses to give up a role in their lives.

Don't intervene.

That is what he wants you to do.

You need to think of the bigger picture and the long term.

I appreciate it's hard but it will benefit the children in the long run.

Ignore his messages.

He has made a fool of you for years.

You can do this.

Leave him to it.

If HE returns the children to you, fine.

You will be able to take note of that.

But don't step in.

Until the divorce is finalised, you need to stay strong.

I suspect he wants to divorce you on a 50/50 basis, screwing you financially in the process.

Once the divorce is through on the best terms he can get, he will dramatically back away from parenting the children, will try 95/5 and put his full focus into finding another victim/partner.

Stay strong.

He's called me in tears. Says he can't do this any more and I win.

I said it's not about winning. Tried to talk to DD1 and she's just inconsolable. I offered to go pick them up but he said no. I said this can't carry on long term, it's damaging the kids and that he needs counselling.

I said to him to go get a cup of tea and calm down and then go have a cuddle with them.

So what DOES he want @StuckInPollyannaMode?

He’s stuck between a rock and a hard place... taking the girls with him.

I get your dilemma... I really do.

I think it would be a huge error to have them returned to you because they would realise that playing up for Dad means being with you.

Yes to him have less time with them overall but it still needs to include whole weekends and doing the grunge work.

Don't get involved. Don't let him use the DC to manipulate you.

Yes somehow again he has coming to you to solve his problems and parent him.

Perhaps you can put in writing that it unacceptable for him pile this emotional guilt trip on you and that if he is serious about parenting the girls properly to do the specific parenting courses that he has previously refused to do and send him a link/name of them.

That's is clear his incapable of parenting them well so to divorce on the realistic basis of 80:20 and he can work on building a relationship with them in the future? Start with EOW fri-Mon and after school for dinner every Wednesday?

Can I say that I always tell my girls I love them. When I was going through a divorce my girls would constantly seek reassurance that I was still there for them and loved them.

I’ve developed the habit of telling my kids & DH I love them, I do it randomly and probably a lot more than most people. But it reassures my DC. DH admits he found it strange at the beginning but he’s delighted at the way our younger DC 4 & 2 randomly come for hugs and tell us dada/mama I love you.

I don’t think you can ever tell your kids you love them too many times. I grew up in a house where my parents never told me they loved me.

Also with my DC I always tell them it’s brilliant if they don’t know answers at school because then they know which bits they still need to learn.

I’ve always told my DC they are A* to me as I can see how hard they work, and they’re incredibly smart and clever because and it’s all them as I’m not half as good at

It take time to build their confidence, my older DC are amazing young women, my eldest goes off to a very prestigious university in September (Covid allowing), to read medicine. And you bet that’s all her, if you had seen the tiny shadows that they were you’d understand why I’m so proud of my awesome girls.

Take one step at a time, don’t stop telling your girls you love them. They need at least one parent who they can rely on.

He can leave them in bed can't he ? its Saturday. They will get bored & get up when they are hungry & see that the stand off has no effect.

I just wonder what "You win" actually means ? You already have them more than him, he was given the contact he asked for....

Don't go & get them, why would you do that ? if he doesn't want them he can drive.

You know I've changed my mind.

This an intelligent high earning manager.

I think he is an emotional abuser.

His behaviour before and since separating is about keeping your focus on him and him alone. So you aren't allowed to think or try and escape.

He used to use the DDs to keep you to busy and exhausted, and ensuring you know there was no money to keep you working so you were further knackered and couldn't think enough to leave nor that there was enough money to leave.

Remember what he said when you sold the house?"I can't believe I won't live in this house anymore"

The constant messages to keep you focused on him.

The lies to your friends to keep them focused on helping him instead of you.

Phoning in tears because you ignored his messages to keep you focused on him.

He is ensuring that you are always focused on him and will be even when the DDs are with him and it's your downtime.

This is who he is, an abuser that wants you & the DDs treading on eggshells around him not some bumbling clueless idiot that he is portraying himself to be.

How can you be "done" with parenting? You can't just put them back in their box and turn them off.

Tears are just another manipulation tool. He is using the children to get you to engage with him. The more you engage, the more he will do as he knows it works.

Hard as it is, you need to ignore all his messages and calls when the girls are with him. You need to show him that using them isn't going to work and then he will stop.

Tell him once and once only that if he can't cope he can return them to you and leave. Then that's it. No further communication. It's really tough I know but you have to do it for them.

@RandomMess is right, he's an abusive cunt he doesn't want responsibility but he doesn't want you to have them so he doesn't pay. He is getting your attention anyway he can. I know you don't want to ignore the kids but try,they will be ok they have you. Tell him email only unless less physical emergency this will document his incompetence and abuse.

He can't stand that you now have the time and freedom to please yourself. Your "job" has always been to do as you're told, do all the parenting and meet everyone else's needs.

Try not to get drawn in by his tantrums and tears. This is all designed to stop you having your own life outside of his say-so.

I have to admit that my first thought was "Why do they have to get out of bed...it's Saturday!". Then I thought "Is 'You control our lives' really something a six year old would say'?" (My two are in their 30s so I have to admit some of my 'what little kids say' has left my brain). Then my third thought was "Did that whole thing even really happen at all?". Because it sounds more to me as if he's trying to manipulate you and using them to do it. No news there I assume.

It may be time for you to speak to a child psychologist about this whole situation and see what they say about his behaviour, the children's reactions, and whether or not it would be better to stop contact. If a child psych feels he's crossing the line, then speak to your solicitor.