Sexless marriage affair reflection

[me1co]

Hi everyone,
I will try to keep this as short as possible!
Myself and my husband have been together for 18 years. We have two children together. In our 30's. We enjoyed a positive loving intimate relationship before the children came along. Thereafter, we still loved each other. But my sex drive took a massive nose dive. I didn't want sex. Wasn't interested in it and had no desire for it. Pretty much ever. My husband still very much wanted me sexually. I often rejected his advances and made excuses. I even used the children as a way to get out of having sex and distanced myself from him emotionally and physically in fear of him thinking that I wanted intimacy. I hated that I didn't want it. But I just didn't. And I expected him to just accept it. He often told me how unwanted he felt and would express how he just wanted to be close to me. But this was largely ignored by me. Anyway, fast forward a few years, I discovered he was having an affair. We are a few years past this point and have worked through a great deal of issues during this time. There has been lots of anger, upset, guilt, regret. But we are now in a good place. We communicate. And the intimacy between us is like it was many many years ago. I still hate his affair but I have moved past the blame and the anger stage. This takes me onto my question. I have reflected a lot of the last few years and I have done a lot of soul searching. Whilst I totally blame my other half for his affair, I have given a lot of thought to the role that I may have played. I did not want him sexually. I rejected him and made him feel unwanted and undesired. We were pretty much in a sexless relationship. What are peoples thoughts on affairs for sex in these sorts of situations? Is there ever any justification?

I think whilst both parties have some blame, your last post about you carrying the burden of looking after the children and doing the bulk of the work there puts a slightly different slant on it.

Personally I don’t think infidelity has to be a deal breaker in marriages. I would prefer it to be upfront and open and by agreement but it can’t always be that way. I had an agreement with my husband which probably worked out well for him as well as me.

[quote Tryinghardfornothing89]@AnneLovesGilbert
I'm not suggesting that, I have been supportive in my previous comments. I guess I can see it would be therapeutic to make a thread like this in the same situation.[/quote]
I guess my reflection has given me food for thought. And I just wanted others view points in relation to this issue. Because of society and the way that cheating is widely viewed, it has been hard over the years, not to see my husband as a total and utter cheating scumbag. But actually, there is a bigger picture here. There is a lot of shame when people stay in relationships after cheating/an affair and a lot of stigma. I really what I've come to realise is that I shouldn't feel ashamed for staying. Because we both made mistakes. But in the end we both still chose each other. And our hardships, I believe, have made us stronger

I think you've expressed this very well OP. My husband's previous marriage was sexless for 10 years and it caused him great distress. It really hurts to be constantly rejected and not have any intimacy

Nope......no excuse for lying and cheating....what you need to think of is HE COULD have communicated to you exactly how he felt before He TOTALLY communicated with her and jumped in her pants. HE showed you NO respect and I don't think you have come to terms with OP. What's to say he won't do it again?

@thenewduchessofhastings

Life isn't black and white.There are many shades of grey.

Whilst having an affair isn't the answer to issues in a relationship you can sometimes see the reasons that can lead down that slippery slope.

It's said that commonly men have affairs for sex and the thrill if the chase and women because they feel neglected by a partner physically and/or emotionally and they seek comfort and attention from the affair partner.

It's easy to say that maybe someone should have left their partner instead of cheating/should have gone to marriage counselling etc but again left isn't simple.

It sounds as though both of you have taken accountability here.It must have been incredibly hard;it also sounds like you love each other very much but sometimes things like this can chip away slowly at a relationship.

Have you had any relationship counselling?

I think life with young children can be tough. Life in general can be tough. Full stop. But in a relationship, you weather the storm together and stand by one another. And that's why I felt so hurt when I discovered what had been going on. But the biggest issue was that we failed to communicate. Life was tough. We hardly spent any quality time together. And we didn't discuss our issues. And things just deteriorated gradually for a number of years. Without us knowing I would say. How naive to think that our relationship didn't need any work. That we could continue to become distant from one another and then one day miraculously, we would be as we once were, happy and in love.

@me1co that all sounds like healthy reflection to me. And completely understandable. I wish you all the happiness for you and your husbands future. It is genuinely nice to hear that people do work things out opposed to the usual mumsnet affair threads.

@gonnabeok

Nope......no excuse for lying and cheating....what you need to think of is HE COULD have communicated to you exactly how he felt before He TOTALLY communicated with her and jumped in her pants. HE showed you NO respect and I don't think you have come to terms with OP. What's to say he won't do it again?

2/10 for your reading comprehension.

The OP states that he told her, many times, that he was unhappy at the lack of intimacy.

@gonnabeok

Nope......no excuse for lying and cheating....what you need to think of is HE COULD have communicated to you exactly how he felt before He TOTALLY communicated with her and jumped in her pants. HE showed you NO respect and I don't think you have come to terms with OP. What's to say he won't do it again?

I have totally come to terms with what happened so I have to disagree with you there. And in regards to him doing it again, maybe he will, maybe he won't. But we have done that much work on ourselves and our relationship that I would be very shocked if it was to happen again. It took a lot of time and hard work to rebuild the trust. He had opportunities to leave, he never. I've had opportunities to leave, I haven't. We have both made mistakes quite frankly both of us have reached rock bottom, but we still choose each other. And this is what I am referring to when I say that there is such a huge stigma around cheating. The comments like 'once a cheater always a cheater.' People are so judgmental and have really simplistic views when it comes to cheating. In some cases, there is a much bigger picture.

[quote Tryinghardfornothing89]@me1co that all sounds like healthy reflection to me. And completely understandable. I wish you all the happiness for you and your husbands future. It is genuinely nice to hear that people do work things out opposed to the usual mumsnet affair threads.[/quote]
I know! And believe me I have done so much reading and research. I have spent a lot of time on Mumsnet and there seems to be zero tolerance in relation to cheating regardless of the circumstances. There have been times when I have nearly pulled the plug on our relationship, because I have been made to feel so weak and pathetic for staying from things I have read and things that others have said to me. And thank you so much. The last few years have been very difficult. But I stand by my decision to stay. And so does he. It's so easy to loose each other in long term relationships, especially with children. But finding a way back and re-connecting has been (hard) but so refreshing.

I think you’ve highlighted an important perspective on the reality of affairs, and that just because a person has one it doesn’t automatically make them a awful person, even if what they did was awful. Can I ask if you did anything differently to reignite the desire for intimacy? Or did it come back naturally as a result of working through your issues and becoming closer all over again?

@Wishing14

I think you’ve highlighted an important perspective on the reality of affairs, and that just because a person has one it doesn’t automatically make them a awful person, even if what they did was awful. Can I ask if you did anything differently to reignite the desire for intimacy? Or did it come back naturally as a result of working through your issues and becoming closer all over again?

It came back naturally following lots of openness, communication, taking time out for each other, spending quality time together, working on myself and feeling more confident in myself. I feel loved, valued, supported and understood which has reignited the connection between us I think.

I am intolerant to affairs, especially longer affairs due to the deceit and manipulation. I am also intolerant to one member of a monogamous couple cutting off access to sex to the other without discussion. Enforcing celibacy on a sexual person without even acknowledging the problem is unfair.

I think your relationship surviving and improving as it has done is wonderful, and you obviously have a new found appreciation of each other. Your marriage will hopefully continue to thrive and I hope it does.

I have seen a glimpse of comments along the theme of "our marriage is so much better due to the affair", I would challenge that perception strongly. An affair never improves a marriage. If you and your husband had did the work on your relationship before it got to that stage it would be be so much better for everyone.

There are always reasons for someone choosing to have an affair- and some reasons are more understandable than others. Certainly as a relationship breaks down both parties are going to feel a void that intimacy with someone else will fill.
And if you contribute to your partner's unhappiness and if you disconnect from them, then yes you are responsible for the vulnerability of the relationship to infidelity. But context is everything. Everyone has a duty to seek to address things that make them unhappy, and keep their vows or promises of fidelity. Or be open about wanting to break them.
Ultimately its the failure to express unhappiness or resolve problems beforehand that hurts the most, and the deception, lies, and often the gaslighting that cause the greatest hurt and betrayal.
I have had relationships where I've disengaged or checked out where- had it resulted in infidelity (I ll never really know) I would have thought it understandable and accepted some responsibility. Other times it was just selfish entitled behaviour, and I deserved better.
I agree that it's never a good thing- but context is crucial to understanding why and sympathising or condemning betrayal.

@Rose76445

I am intolerant to affairs, especially longer affairs due to the deceit and manipulation. I am also intolerant to one member of a monogamous couple cutting off access to sex to the other without discussion. Enforcing celibacy on a sexual person without even acknowledging the problem is unfair.

I think your relationship surviving and improving as it has done is wonderful, and you obviously have a new found appreciation of each other. Your marriage will hopefully continue to thrive and I hope it does.

I have seen a glimpse of comments along the theme of "our marriage is so much better due to the affair", I would challenge that perception strongly. An affair never improves a marriage. If you and your husband had did the work on your relationship before it got to that stage it would be be so much better for everyone.

I would agree. Our relationship is not better because of the affair. Our relationship is better because of the work that we have both put into the relationship post affair that we should have been putting in prior. And then like you say, if we had, maybe the affair would never of happened. But I suppose hindsight is a wonderful thing. I often wish I could turn back time. There is a lot that we would both change. I wish the affair did not exist in our relationship. It had been very damaging and has in parts changed me as a person. I think affairs sometimes shock people into making the changes that they should have made many years before.

@Seadad

There are always reasons for someone choosing to have an affair- and some reasons are more understandable than others. Certainly as a relationship breaks down both parties are going to feel a void that intimacy with someone else will fill. And if you contribute to your partner's unhappiness and if you disconnect from them, then yes you are responsible for the vulnerability of the relationship to infidelity. But context is everything. Everyone has a duty to seek to address things that make them unhappy, and keep their vows or promises of fidelity. Or be open about wanting to break them. Ultimately its the failure to express unhappiness or resolve problems beforehand that hurts the most, and the deception, lies, and often the gaslighting that cause the greatest hurt and betrayal. I have had relationships where I've disengaged or checked out where- had it resulted in infidelity (I ll never really know) I would have thought it understandable and accepted some responsibility. Other times it was just selfish entitled behaviour, and I deserved better. I agree that it's never a good thing- but context is crucial to understanding why and sympathising or condemning betrayal.

I 100% agree with this. People are so quick to judge and condemn when it comes to infidelity. He's a womaniser and a pig. She's a sl%t. But I believe that sometimes, not always, there is a bigger picture. There are reasons why people cheat and why people stay after they have been cheated on. And yes, I also agree that if people addressed issues within their relationship properly, there would be so many less affairs out there!

I'm reflecting on what I have learned from this thread, your marriage is in a good place now and you have overcome a lot to get here, it has this flaw in it but that doesn't make it any less beautiful.

I am in a marriage of over 20 years and although there has been no infidelity, there are hurts and betrayals that have had to be overcome. In my opinion nobody goes through a long marriage completely unscathed, you come across as a genuinely interesting and reflective person, I think you have chosen to grow from this and I admire you for it. I think your husband and children are fortunate that you are able to do this.

You are still young, ( I met my husband at 18, now early 40s, my only relationship), it's a difficult road but worth it. I hope things continue to improve for you and your family.

@Rose76445

I'm reflecting on what I have learned from this thread, your marriage is in a good place now and you have overcome a lot to get here, it has this flaw in it but that doesn't make it any less beautiful.

I am in a marriage of over 20 years and although there has been no infidelity, there are hurts and betrayals that have had to be overcome. In my opinion nobody goes through a long marriage completely unscathed, you come across as a genuinely interesting and reflective person, I think you have chosen to grow from this and I admire you for it. I think your husband and children are fortunate that you are able to do this.

You are still young, ( I met my husband at 18, now early 40s, my only relationship), it's a difficult road but worth it. I hope things continue to improve for you and your family.

Thank you so much for this! Your kind words mean a lot. I agree with you totally; no relationship is perfect. Especially long term relationships; there are good times and bad times, highs and lows and ups and downs. But I do strongly believe that difficult times can be overcome, if both still want the relationship, if both still love each other and if both are willing to learn from mistakes, grow and change together. Me and my partner met when we were both 18. We have shared so many wonderful experiences together and built a life together. We lost each other, through faults on both parts. The last few years have been immensely painful. For both of us actually. And there have been times when I have considered cutting my losses and walking away. But I am glad that I didn't. Because the hard work has been worth it. And I know I never want to be with anyone else.

OP- a lot of people have said that your DH should have left, rather than have an affair. This has always been a popular opinion on Mumsnet.

But I wonder- did you ever consider that you should have left, rather than unilaterally decide that the marriage was to be sexless?

I ask because it's too easy to blame the 'cheating' partner (the one who had an affair) But I think that actually, you both cheated on the marriage. Neither one of you upheld the vows and promises you made.

I'm glad that you've worked things out. And I hope that you both, in time, stop feeling hurt by each other's betrayals.

@Shodan

OP- a lot of people have said that your DH should have left, rather than have an affair. This has always been a popular opinion on Mumsnet.

But I wonder- did you ever consider that you should have left, rather than unilaterally decide that the marriage was to be sexless?

I ask because it's too easy to blame the 'cheating' partner (the one who had an affair) But I think that actually, you both cheated on the marriage. Neither one of you upheld the vows and promises you made.

I'm glad that you've worked things out. And I hope that you both, in time, stop feeling hurt by each other's betrayals.

I didn't consider leaving because I didn't want to. I loved him and my family. I just didn't view sex as a priority. I didn't know why I didn't at the time. But I just figured by sex drive would come back one day and that all would be well again. Looking back, I wonder how I could have been so stupid to think that a relationship would one day all be well again after such a lack of connection and intimacy for such a prolonged period. Can I ask why it is that you think I should have considered leaving the relationship?

But the biggest issue was that we failed to communicate

From what you've previously said he tried repeatedly to communicate with you. Not sure it's "we" in this instance.

@ShatnersWig

But the biggest issue was that we failed to communicate

From what you've previously said he tried repeatedly to communicate with you. Not sure it's "we" in this instance.

Well it is 'we' isn't it because he failed to communicate that his needs were such that he was considering having sex with someone else.

Can I ask why it is that you think I should have considered leaving the relationship?

I guess because, when I made my wedding promises, I said "With my body I thee worship". I always took that to mean that sex was part and parcel of the marriage contract so, to me, if I didn't want to have sex with my DH any more (and I don't mean the usual ebb and flow, but a more permanent state), that would mean I'd broken my vows.

I was just musing because as you've acknowledged, a lot of people see things in black and white, and will only view the affair-haver as having broken their vows, whereas I always had the belief that forcing a sexless marriage on someone was also breaking vows.

@Shodan

Can I ask why it is that you think I should have considered leaving the relationship?

I guess because, when I made my wedding promises, I said "With my body I thee worship". I always took that to mean that sex was part and parcel of the marriage contract so, to me, if I didn't want to have sex with my DH any more (and I don't mean the usual ebb and flow, but a more permanent state), that would mean I'd broken my vows.

I was just musing because as you've acknowledged, a lot of people see things in black and white, and will only view the affair-haver as having broken their vows, whereas I always had the belief that forcing a sexless marriage on someone was also breaking vows.

I appreciate where you are coming from but it's not like I was clearly thinking at the time 'I've broken my vows, I must leave.' And I'm not sure that I would go as far to say that because I lost my sex drive (I had no control over this) and did not want to have sex, that I was breaking my vows. But yes, I take on board that my behaviour was hurting him. And for that, I am regretful.

I seem to remember having lost all sight of what my 'needs' were when my children were small. So couldn't have communicated them even if I'd been encouraged to. I felt overwhelmed with responsibility, money worries, nagging childbirth related injury, and more than that I had lost my sense of self with no time or energy to figure it out anymore. I lost my libido altogether for a few years but I'm fortunate my DH stuck around and we are through that now.

I wish you all the best OP I really hope everything works out well for you.

@crosshatching

I seem to remember having lost all sight of what my 'needs' were when my children were small. So couldn't have communicated them even if I'd been encouraged to. I felt overwhelmed with responsibility, money worries, nagging childbirth related injury, and more than that I had lost my sense of self with no time or energy to figure it out anymore. I lost my libido altogether for a few years but I'm fortunate my DH stuck around and we are through that now.

I wish you all the best OP I really hope everything works out well for you.

I can whole heartedly relate to everything you have said. And I am really happy to hear that your partner remained loyal and stood by you, despite the issues that were going on for you at the time. Can I ask, despite your loss of libido, did you remain close and connected? Or did you notice a shift in this aspect of your relationship also. Can I also ask, was your partner supportive of you during this challenging time?