SIL and money issues

[ChopinandChampagne]

I recently lost my DH and I thought that it would be nice to give some money to my DGDs, both toddlers, to set aside for their future as a gift from him. Realistically, they will not remember him, but I thought that if they have some money to spend on travel or driving lessons or to help with their university costs or whatever, they would think of him and know how much he loved them, even though he didn't live to see them grow up.

I did some internet research and the suggestions were for a Junior Isa, which a parent would need to set up, and I would then pay into, and the child could access at 18. Alternatively, a savings account, which I would be able to set up as a grandparent, as long as I produce a copy of the birth certificate, which the child can access and take over at 16.

So far, so good and, I thought, relatively uncontroversial, so I suggested it to my DD and said that I wanted to give each of the DGDs £10k from DH and the options. I said that I wanted it to be a separate account and that suggested that she open a Junior Isa or that I should open a savings account. Her response was that she would have to discuss it with SIL and I said fine, thought no more it. Then, I sense that there is a bit of tension and DD says she wants to set up a telephone call with both her and SIL one evening, to discuss the matter after the DGDs are in bed. This was a text, so I reply saying fine, is now a good time, but DD said not, but we could schedule a couple of days later, but only if she has completed her coursework for her studies.

Then, a couple of days ago, I receive an email from SIL, from whom I never hear anything direct, advising me that if I really want to put money in an account, he will open one, but that he thinks that it is a bad idea, as inflation will erode the money. He thinks I should invest it in gold bullion or some other specific account (he says he has recently opened one for DD), and he provided links to various websites.

The tone of the email comes across, not as friendly advice, but telling me what to do. I have said that I will have a rethink, but I am worried about offending him if I don't follow his advice. I feel that he is trying to control how I invest the money. He refers to it as my wanting to invest for the DGD's future, which it is partly, but it is also about wanting the DGDs to remember or be reminded of DH. I don't really want to invest in bullion, as I think it's a bit volatile, and the idea of a bank account is that the DGDs would get the bank statements and maybe learn how to save.

Does anyone have any advice on how best to handle this diplomatically? There is quite a bit of history with SIL (Lobster Boy for those who remember my previous threads), but things are on a reasonably even keel at present and I currently have a good relationship with DD, which I don't want to upset. She says that there is no rush to decide how best to invest the money, it is important to get it right.

Thanks everyone.

Yes, grieving is indeed hard. I am going to a formal dinner tonight at a livery company in the City, which a dear friend from university recently introduced me to.

It's the first event I have attended one of the events, and the first formal event without my darling. He looked so wonderful in his black tie - I think most men do - even though he found it a bit of a faff!

The last event was our niece's 21st, just before we saw DD1 again after three years. We had a wonderful time with DH's family. So many happy memories, which makes it so raw and painful to be going tonight on my own.

I have been feeling sick about it for the last few days, my heart isn't in it, but this is sadly the new normal, and I don't want to let my friend down. And my experience so far has been that if I do these things, the pain is extreme, I submerge a bit deeper, but then I bounce up a little higher.

I am due to see DD1 next week. She actually seems quite keen on going out to lunch together, so fingers crossed it will be ok.

In the meantime, I had the reading with the medium earlier in the week and she was scarily accurate, telling me things about DH and his illness and death, which she could not possibly have known.

She then asked if a close family member was planning to move and I said yes, one of my daughters. She said that DD1 has no choice in the move, could not refuse, was in a controlling relationship, and to be wary, especially around money and not to let them use the DGC as pawns. I suppose that I gave her a bit of a hint by volunteering that I did not get on particularly well with SIL, but the rest came entirely from her. Interesting......!

Wow that’s really impressive to challenge yourself to go to a big event. I think that you are right that a hard push forward will ultimately move you on if the balance is right. You are doing all of this very consciously - aware of the emotional effort needed and how draining and exhausting it will be.

I hope that you feel emotionally protected for the visit next week and that you have contingencies, exit strategies and expectations all hammered out so that you don’t get hurt.

Preparing for the worst and hoping for the best is all you can do.

Do you have anyone going with you for support?

Hope you are able to enjoy this evening even a little bit even though it will be tinged with sadness

The medium sounds like she’s been following the thread that’s creepy.

I am hoping above all hope that lunch with Dd goes well and even better if LB stays away.

How was the formal event @ChopinandChampagne? Was it nice to get all frocked up and out and about with your friend?

Thanks everyone.

The evening was actually very enjoyable once I had psyched myself up to go, and I met some lovely, interesting people.

The medium described things which I have not published anywhere, including one very specific thing, which I had only shared with DD2. However, I know that these things are controversial, and I don't want you to think that I am a sandwich short of a picnic, so I won't mention it again

It was also lovely to spend time with DH's mother and sister and her husband, as we went out for lunch yesterday, also with DD3. I felt a bit exhausted today though!

DD1 called this afternoon. It seems that she has been pestering BIL, who is the executor, for proof of funds coming, as they are bidding on a property in Ireland. The agent has demanded proof of funds before putting offers to the seller this weekend. They are £30k short before receipt of the inheritance, so wondered if I could help, and they would pay me back. I was able to say, quite truthfully, that I couldn't, not least because I do telephone banking and my bank closed at 2pm for the weekend.

They seem desperate to buy, as apparently they aren't doing anything at present, and feel that life is passing them by. DD1 is also very worried that they may not be able to go there, even if they are successful in their bid, as they refuse to be vaccinated. They have concocted some elaborate plans to go to Northern Ireland and cross over the border, then quarantine back in Northern Ireland for two weeks afterwards. I couldn't really follow it, but she is clearly very anxious about the situation, I could hear it in her voice.

It was all a bit contradictory really, because she was saying how pleased she was that I had been to the dinner, and how it is so important for mental health, to have face to face contact and maintain relationships. Then she was saying that they are going to home school the DGC for both primary and secondary education, but not to worry about them socialising, as they will go to lots of clubs, just as she used to do. However, this place is miles from the nearest town, so I am not sure how many clubs and activities will be on offer. They are worried as prices are apparently escalating fast and seem to have become involved in a bidding war. They just seem obsessed by the idea.

Sssloou - I will be travelling alone, but everything is time limited and we will be occupied, so hopefully should be ok. I want to move on from the last memory of DD1 and the DGC, which is DH's funeral. I am feeling stronger, but still a long way to go.

You need to tell DD1 that all your money is tied up and can't be accessed for the foreseeable future.

So glad you had a good time after all and are keeping busy. I think you are doing wonderful, I know how hard it can be to be sociable when you are struggling with your own worries.
I am buying a house at moment but kept getting outbid, could not afford to go higher so have lowered my expectations and looked at cheaper properties.
You DD1 seems to be almost emotionally blackmailing you now. There is such thing as financial abuse. Please be careful OP here.
If she turns 'funny' with you, it will certainly confirm she sees you as a meal ticket. Please tell her your money is tied up for the time being until you have dealt with your bereavement, that she will have to adjust her plans to something more realistic?
Have a peaceful evening. These constant requests must be destroying the peace you deserve. X

She’ll ring on Monday morning for you to release £30 k to her unless you tell her no you’re not going to do it, because just saying you can’t as the bank closed at 2, still implies that you would lend it if it had been open.

I agree with GhOstontoast OP. If you tell her no, she can make other plans. Stalling her will make her feel played.
The treading on eggshells needs to stop now. Are you worried of being rejected again? You cant always be dictated to by her, its truly abusive.
You do not have to give her a reason to say no.
Saying no does not make you a bad person, a bad mum, a bad anything. Your absolute determination to be seen as good and supportive all the time must be exhausting. You have a choice of responses it does not always have to suit DD1.

OP, I would let her know before Monday that you won't be giving her the money (if that's your decision). Steel yourself for her reaction, I'm concerned that you're very emotionally vulnerable at the moment...I know you don't want to burden your other DDs but hope that you have some real life support with this situation from family & close friends

I haven’t posted before, but l have been reading this thread.

I am saying this very kindly, but if l were DD2/3 I would feel very resentful. DD1 has been given lots of money and now she is trying to manipulate you into giving her more.

You do realise that if you lend her this 30K, you will not get it back. LB, doesn’t work and l assume nor does she.

Tell her that you will not be lending her this money needs that she shouldn’t of asked you in the first place.

Find your power and don’t be afraid of saying ‘no’ to her.

Premium bonds or a bare trust with a bond minimum £5k

Do you have 90k to give to your dc? 30k each? I'd let her know you'll not be able to give her the 30k it's all emotional blackmail to get cash from you. So sorry op

'Dear dd, it was lovely to talk with you today and hear about all your plans. I realised after we hung up that I may have left you with the wrong impression re your deposit. I wanted to make sure you understood I wouldn't be able to lend you anything as I've tied my money up for the foreseeable future. I hope bil is able to sort you out, and I'm very much looking forward to seeing you soon. '

Beware your meeting may be conditional on you forking out the cash I'm afraid.

She will say its a loan. You can respond, "O like the last one?"
I would say, even if I had this cash available, I would have to gave been consulted & involved from an early stage to have sn inforned opinion.
IMO, they have not established citizenship, & even if LB can get it, it is not necessarily going to be a fast process, & even less so for DD & DC
They dont have any notion about the hand outs they assume they will get to survive, They will have no money to invest, for heating/fencing/livestock. &
You are opposed to home schooling.
You are not helping to finance thus shit show.
I know I'm not in your shoes, but you need to stop now, they have you over an emotional barrel.
It will never stop.

Hi Chopin I agree with pp you will have a phone call Monday morning when the bank opens. I think you do need a strategy of how to shut it down without causing upset which won’t be easy. I’m afraid I’m a scaredy-cat and would be out without my phone but that won’t work indefinitely.

They are worried as prices are apparently escalating fast and seem to have become involved in a bidding war.
This is meant to manipulate you into believing that it's either 30K now or 60K when prices escalate, so it's in your interest to release the money now.

I agree with PP that you need to be clear that there is no money you can make available to them. I don't think it's a coincidence that this is happening in the week you're due to see them, to try and make it as uncomfortable as possible for you to say no.

@Mix56

She will say its a loan. You can respond, "O like the last one?" I would say, even if I had this cash available, I would have to gave been consulted & involved from an early stage to have sn inforned opinion. IMO, they have not established citizenship, & even if LB can get it, it is not necessarily going to be a fast process, & even less so for DD & DC They dont have any notion about the hand outs they assume they will get to survive, They will have no money to invest, for heating/fencing/livestock. & You are opposed to home schooling. You are not helping to finance thus shit show. I know I'm not in your shoes, but you need to stop now, they have you over an emotional barrel. It will never stop.

+1 to this.

And her asking for 30k like it's a tenner. Wow. Life is 'passing them by' because by the sound of it, neither of them would work to warm themselves, as the saying goes. They will just keep tapping at the bank of you, forevermore, with plenty of emotional blackmail at every turn.

I agree with a pp, she is trying to make it all sound very urgent and will keep upping the ante.
If they do succeed in moving, you will not see the grandchildren anyway, OP, imo.

I agree with others, DD will be back, Monday am looking for £30k. It's better to have a simple line available and to keep saying it if someone is putting you under pressure 'I'm so sorry, I just can't afford to help at the moment" (Cue pressure from DD), 'Yes, I'm sorry, I can't afford to help right now". Don't explain more than that, don't try to justify or defend your position- just repeat that simple statement.

You should make it clear before Monday really if you have given her the impression you would help.

Tell her. “the bank of Chopin” has shut and to stop asking for loans/.advances/ large cheques

Buy them an £8k Rolex each and keep it in a safe! Won’t depreciate and list it in your will - could be worth significantly more when they inherit and maybe sell it :)

I am very much afraid that the next visit to see the grandkids is going to cost £30k. I feel that the offer to come and visit will be immediately rescinded should @ChopinandChampagne refuse to “lend” this money and this will be further evidence of the children being weaponised. Please stay strong @ChopinandChampagne. When it all blows up - and it will - You will be where she runs to with these kids.

How low of her to keep asking for money when you are so low, grieving and
vulnerable. She should be by your side giving you support not using it to her advantage. Please be careful you do not hand over money out of fear, obligation and guilt. Make a stand whatever the consequences. I think in your heart she has been grooming you for this cash for a while. So sorry OP.

You have taken a lot of challenging steps this week by attending the event and other social activities, which is all good progress but it will likely wipe your energy levels.

You have another monumental week coming up with the visit which has already been used as an opportunity to hurt you.

This new request for money is so predictable - they are always grifting - so you know that nothing has changed it’s the same manipulative, financially extortioning dynamic that it has been from day one. This time it’s the DGDs again as a pay per view and the hype and drama of the bidding war for the self sufficiency move to add another layer of tension/pressure.

But I know you Chopin - you are smart, steely and alert to all of this. I know that you can just say “No. I won’t be lending money” on rinse and repeat. I know that you are able to visit and not be strong armed into their financial demands. You saw this coming - because that’s all they are about.

Are you planing to fudge it until you are face to face in the hope that you at least get to see the DGDs or are you going to say “No” before?

Either way are you mentally and physically prepared to do this long trip on your own with the v high risk that they will at best cancel at worst kick up an almighty row? Lots of hystrionic drama coming your way - I hope that you are able to detach from it and rose above it.

Don’t let yourself get hurt and fleeced.

You need to say no OP. Do it now before it carries on.

You don't want them to go anyway, 'lending' them the money is enabling LB and your DD.

This is going to be hard to read but they are using you for the money.

You have the power here. You need to say no. If that means they disappear again, that's their call. It shows that it was all an act anyway.

Are you really going to be ok for the visit? I'm very worried for you now, genuinely.

Harassing BIL is just awful too.