What’s the deal with not being married?

Cloud1220 · 2020-12-03T08:29:21+00:00

Myself and DP of 10 years are not married. We have two DC. Mortgage/house in joint names 50/50. Every thread I see on here (when things get rocky) where someone isn’t married has comments like ‘why didn’t you think about marrying him before you had children?’, ‘this is why you should have been married’ etc. So, wise people in my phone, what do I need to know?!

SweetCruciferous · 03/12/2020 08:31

I believe it’s to protect you legally in case of death/infidelity, etc.

Titsinknicks · 03/12/2020 08:34

As above. Those threads are usually written by women who are extremely vulnerable financially - have given up their career to raise children and do not have their own or any money and no name on the house. Marriage is a contract, a largely financial one.

Alexandernevermind · 03/12/2020 08:34

If you aren't married you won't be his next of kin, so any important decisions will be made by your PIL or DP's siblings until your children are old enough. It means you won't inherit his share of your home or any of his money and won't be provided for in his pension. The same goes both ways of course.

SunnySomer · 03/12/2020 08:34

Do you work and have similar income to him? A massive issue for many women is that they spend some time (or a lot of time) out of work and find themselves hugely financially disadvantaged in the long term. If you were to separate he would have absolutely no financial obligation to you at all, even if you’ve made career sacrifices for the family. This includes pension contributions.

EssentialHummus · 03/12/2020 08:36

As sweet said. Do you have wills naming one another as beneficiaries? If he is hit by a bus tomorrow and you don't, his share of the house is likely to go to his parents. If either of you decide that the relationship has run its course, you'll have your share of the house and child maintenance but no claim on his assets, even if you're a SAHM who has given up her career to raise the kids and he is Jeff Bezos.

TooManyDogsandChildren · 03/12/2020 08:37

Also you can leave everything free of inheritance tax to a spouse.

VettiyaIruken · 03/12/2020 08:41

It's a contract. It gives a number of rights and protections.
Many you can recreate with various other contracts. (And like every contract, you can end it.) But isn't it daft to enter into half a dozen contracts because you don't want to enter into one 😁.

I'm not at all romantic. Or trusting. If I'm having kids and I'm taking the financial and career hit, I'm sure as shit getting my legal protections in place first!

IRunLikeJoeBiden · 03/12/2020 08:42

I don’t get it either OP. I earn more than DP, and we have wills where the other is the beneficiary. We own the house 50/50 and both pay the same into the house.
On hospital forms we are each other’s next of kin.
There is no need for us to be married that I can see.

IRunLikeJoeBiden · 03/12/2020 08:44

@VettiyaIruken

It's a contract. It gives a number of rights and protections. Many you can recreate with various other contracts. (And like every contract, you can end it.) But isn't it daft to enter into half a dozen contracts because you don't want to enter into one 😁.

I'm not at all romantic. Or trusting. If I'm having kids and I'm taking the financial and career hit, I'm sure as shit getting my legal protections in place first!

Or you could choose not to take a financial and career hit. It’s not compulsory for women not to work for years because they have a child.

ALLIS0N · 03/12/2020 08:45

@SunnySomer

Do you work and have similar income to him? A massive issue for many women is that they spend some time (or a lot of time) out of work and find themselves hugely financially disadvantaged in the long term. If you were to separate he would have absolutely no financial obligation to you at all, even if you’ve made career sacrifices for the family. This includes pension contributions.

This. It’s about legal protections.

If you have never taken maternity leave
or worked part time
and you both earn the same
and have equal career prospects
and pensions
And if he does half of all childcare
And half of all housework
And half of all wifework
And will do 50:50 of everything after a seperation

Then it’s not a problem.

ALLIS0N · 03/12/2020 08:46

That’s aside from the other issues about wills, next of kin, inheritance tax and pensions.

IDontMindMarmite · 03/12/2020 08:48

It's desperately sad to see some of the threads on here where women have been with their partner for many years and it's going south. His name's on the house but she does all the childcare. She doesn't work because she wasn't the high earner and paying for childcare was unaffordable so she's got NO MONEY to leave. She's trapped. If they were married it wold be different.

Glad you've got this stuff sorted. Most people haven't sorted their will.

Alexandernevermind · 03/12/2020 08:50

It’s not compulsory for women not to work for years because they have a child. agreed, but its bloody hard to avoid a financial kick or career dip. however hard I tried
The problem with marriage are the expectations of the day itself, from both the bride and groom and from all of the family around them. Being practical and nipping out to a reg office and returning to announce you are married would probably be the preferred for so many people.

Chasingsquirrels · 03/12/2020 08:54

@IRunLikeJoeBiden

I don’t get it either OP. I earn more than DP, and we have wills where the other is the beneficiary. We own the house 50/50 and both pay the same into the house. On hospital forms we are each other’s next of kin. There is no need for us to be married that I can see.

What about protecting your DP?

When my late-DH died I joined WAY - an organisation for those widowed young (under 50) but the emphasis was on the loss of a partner, marriage was not a prerequisite for membership.
From speaking to others in the group those who hadn't been married had found dealing with the legal ramifications much harder. This ranged from not having had their ducks in a row and therefore not inheriting the deceased's share of their home etc (wills are VERY important), to other things you can't necessarily protect against such as losing out on pensions (this is being challenged, but as a matter of course it might not be automatic at the moment), not being entitled to state bereavement payments, having funeral and disposal of remains decisions being taken out of their hands.

I don't think I'll be getting married again, but I've done it twice and maybe I just haven't met the right 3rd yet! But I do understand the ramifications of that choice on both myself and any partner.

Original poster

Cloud1220 · 03/12/2020 08:54

Very insightful, thanks all.

@EssentialHummus @SunnySomer to answer your questions:

Currently in the process of sorting our wills. Will be naming each other (and children) as beneficiaries.

In terms of earnings, he is main wage earner and self employed. The business is doing very well. I went part time 3 years ago when we started a family so my income is now less than half of his. We have a joint account and have done since day 1. I pay for the childcare from my part time wage (so, most of my wage gone ) and pay for the kids clothes/birthdays/Xmas etc. He pays for everything else for the house.

We have life insurance policies placed in trust naming each other.

Pension wise - I have a local government pension which he & the kids are named on. He has nothing being self employed.

Interesting about the inheritance tax @TooManyDogsandChildren !!

Building myself a good ‘just in case’ checklist here!

OP posts:

wishfuldreamer · 03/12/2020 08:56

A lot of this seems to hinge on giving up careers for childcare/sake of the relationship in some way. Out of curiosity, what are people’s views when a couple splits without marriage or children? Is there a moral, if not legal, obligation to support? Particularly if there was a difference in individual wealth?

Ironingontheceiling · 03/12/2020 08:57

Add next of kin.

Also. If he ever has to be sectioned or anything under the mental health act, there’s a strict hierarchy of who can make decisions. www.rethink.org/advice-and-information/rights-restrictions/mental-health-laws/nearest-relative/

LemonTT · 03/12/2020 08:58

@Alexandernevermind

If you aren't married you won't be his next of kin, so any important decisions will be made by your PIL or DP's siblings until your children are old enough. It means you won't inherit his share of your home or any of his money and won't be provided for in his pension. The same goes both ways of course.

You need to be clear what you mean by next of kin. It’s nots a legally defined term. This post is so misleading.

You basically want to say you won’t inherit without a will. Not that you will be stripped of parental rights.

ALLIS0N · 03/12/2020 09:02

Or you could choose not to take a financial and career hit. It’s not compulsory for women not to work for years because they have a child

That true. But some maternity leave is compulsory. And babies and children need looked after 24/7 . You either do it yourself or pay someone else a lot of money to do it . Many fathers do little or nothing.
Many men do little or no housework.

It’s a double or triple burden to expect women to earn the same money while doing all the childcare and housework.

Many women have children assuming their partner will share the work. When he doesn’t , they are already tied.

They stay hoping he will change. They have another child. He doesn’t change.

It’s easy to sneer at other Women if you have not been there. Or if you earn good money and / or have good family support.

drinkingwineoutofamug · 03/12/2020 09:02

Reading up thread that my assets will go to my pil if my partner dies??
We have a house together 50/50
We have joint bank accounts
We have wills
He is named as my next of kin and vice versa.
Insurance , pension and all the rest.

So if he pops his clogs before me , the will stating assets etc goes to me and our 3 children isn't worth the paper it's written on???

I'm lost here. We never wanted to get married but named each other on legal work.

ALLIS0N · 03/12/2020 09:06

In terms of earnings, he is main wage earner and self employed. The business is doing very well. I went part time 3 years ago when we started a family so my income is now less than half of his. We have a joint account and have done since day 1. I pay for the childcare from my part time wage (so, most of my wage gone confused) and pay for the kids clothes/birthdays/Xmas etc. He pays for everything else for the house

This is not a good plan. You need to pay into the joint account and all child related costs come out of it. You need to pay into the house too.

Please PLEASE tell me that you own the house 50 50? I don’t mean the mortgage, I mean the deeds?

And that you are paying into your pension as much as he pays into his ?

Is he self employed or a limited company ? If a limited company, do you own half the shares ?

AttilaTheMeerkat · 03/12/2020 09:06

"In terms of earnings, he is main wage earner and self employed. The business is doing very well. I went part time 3 years ago when we started a family so my income is now less than half of his. We have a joint account and have done since day 1. I pay for the childcare from my part time wage (so, most of my wage gone confused) and pay for the kids clothes/birthdays/Xmas etc. He pays for everything else for the house".

You cannot afford to be so reliant on him. Being as you are now i.e unmarried along with working part time too puts you also in a very precarious position financially as well as legally. I do not like this current position that you describe in that you're paying for the childcare out of your part time wage. Why is he not doing this as well, they are his children too. I would think he also regards the property more as his too. He really does hold the majority of the power and control here in this relationship and sadly I do not think he would now want to relinquish any of that. I would also think your children have his surname as well, yet more power handed over if that is the case.

What are his views on marriage?. What are your views on this?.

frolicmum · 03/12/2020 09:07

@ALLIS0N exactly what you said. If you don't need protection, who cares but some people also like having the same name (I kept mine DCs and hubby have the same).

I would never question anyone who is not married though, it's totally up to them, same as having children, how many children or no children at all. It's a very private and sometimes even sensitive matter. I genuinely believe that having been with someone for 10 years, having 2 children and a house means practically married, you just haven't signed that piece of paper. I am sure that being married doesn't make you any happier in your relationship, also if you are married and unhappy, having to go through a divorce must be awful.

Some women want to get married but their DPs don't, some people don't have the money, there could be so many reasons. My friend has been engaged for 4 years, she said she can't be bothered to organise it all and get married, it's not her priority.

KylieKangaroo · 03/12/2020 09:08

We're not married, could never afford it. I earn more and he is the SAHP. What is the marriage tax like, is it worth getting married just for that? OH is a low earner who works part time..

BigFatLiar · 03/12/2020 09:11

If you're concerned about any implications try getting advice from a solicitor rather than here.