Perfect guy but he’s had the snip

[Wendywoo19]

I met my BF a couple of years ago and after a few dates he told me that he’d had the snip. I don’t have any kids but enjoyed his company and had the mindset it wouldn’t go anywhere but I was having fun. Fast forward 2 years and we are in a serious relationship, live together and are very happy. But... i think we are both burying our heads about the fact he’s had the snip and I don’t have any children. I know there are men who get divorced and have kids later in life with a new partner, or men who have their vasectomy reversed when their situation changes. I know I need to have the conversation with him but I’m worried if he’s dead against it then I have some big decisions to make. What if I end things with my BF but then never meet someone as good as him? What if I meet someone else but kids don’t happen with a new partner either? It’s all what ifs and it would help to hear from people who have maybe been in similar situations?

@Wendywoo19 I was in a very similar position.
8 years ago, I met my partner (I'm now 30 and he is 50) - I was 22 and he was 42. He had a ' 'child' aged 18.

We never expected to last because of the age but we fell in love immediately. We both got together on the understanding that he did not want any more children, and I didn't want any. About 4 years ago, that changed for me and I tried to bury it. I couldn't and in the end, I broke down and told him I thought I may have any children one day. He said to cross the bridge if we ever came to it. I had to say no, we are at the bridge now. He accepted that I was still very young and it was natural to want kids, that all the reasons he didn't want any more kids years ago were no longer there - financially stable, stable relationship and he agreed we could try one day.
We are now pregnant and things couldn't be better.
I didn't give him an ultimatum- my worry was that I wanted children with him, and that if we split up, I may not want children with anyone else and will have ruined our relationship. However, as time went on, I realised that I would end up resenting him and it being too late for me to try and start again. That conversation was the best one we have ever had and made me feel like the weight of the world was now gone ❤️
You need to speak because either way, you need to be honest xx

@Wendywoo19 to add, it was frustrating knowing that if we split, he is likely to meet someone with kids and he would have to play a role in their lives, yet wouldn't want to have a child with me.

Have the discussion, test the water perhaps and gauge his reaction.

Please don't give up your chance of having children for a relationship xx

@Twinkle1989 I’m pleased for you that you got your happy ending. And that’s exactly how I feel, he could say no to me, we split up and then him meet someone else with young kids. I know people are saying it’s easy to walk away if it’s not your child and I know everyone is different and each have their own views on this. None of which are right or wrong. But for me personally I can’t understand how some men feel ok to play a father figure and bring up someone else’s kids after refusing to have their own child with a previous partner.

He's not the perfect guy for you then.

It's unlikely a vasectomy reversal would work 14 years afterwards.

From NHS:

It's estimated that the success rate of a vasectomy reversal is:

75% if you have your vasectomy reversed within 3 years
up to 55% after 3 to 8 years
between 40% and 45% after 9 to 14 years
30% after 15 to 19 years
less than 10% after 20 years
These figures are based on the number of couples who successfully have a baby after the man has had a vasectomy reversal.

@Wendywoo19 exactly beaut! You need to speak to him.
There were many issues discussed.
My DP knew deep down that I would be gone, he said he felt that it was unfair to prevent me from being a mother and he loves kids!

Perhaps ask him why he had it, why he didn't want anymore children and start it that way...

I do recall someone making a joke about us having kids may be a year in and he made his views known which didn't bother me at the time. I suppose that put my off addressing it for so long.

I was hurt that his ex partner had very young children who he accepted and spent time with, yet he wouldn't want a child with me. I was worrying about nothing thing. You may be worrying about nothing too. But you will never regret having children, you may regret not and giving up your opportunity for him xx

Op I'm wondering why the conversation has to be an ultimatum? You are talking a lot about the repercussions if he says no. But perhaps you should just ask him would be consider it and then try to think things through yourself.

Personally (and this is just me) as someone ten years older than you I cannot believe I nearly didn't have a child. I did not prioritise it in my life and then after a health crisis (cancer) I thought that was it. There was always a small possibility but given my age and my single status I decided to accept a future without children.

I met my now DP, he had three teenagers and I assumed he didn't want anymore. Some time later I asked him would he have wanted more and to my great surprise he said he didn't need more children but being a parent is so wonderful I should not miss out and asked if I wanted to try. I told him not to get his hopes up given my medical background. Like you I didn't want it to take over our happy relationship. So we continued as normal but threw away the birth control. Three months later I was pregnant - no problems or complications whatsoever.

In short - just ask him how he feels about it. Then you can figure out if it's a non-negotiable for you.

@Josuk

@SandyY2K

There is a simple and painless procedure to extract the small amount of sperm needed for IVF.

If it was so simple, I doubt we'd hear about situations where having a baby doesn't work when a man has the snip.

There's also the cost of IVF with this method which will be a problem for many people too.

A vasectomy should really be considered as permanent, but reading MN, I see that women often push for it and feel entitled to.

Please please speak to him before the relationship goes deeper. He may be leading you along and may not want kids at all. I’m early 30s and wouldn’t even date someone that’s had one as I want kids and a family.

My partner had the snip he was about 25 years post op. He has three grown up children and I had none, he knew that I wanted a family and so when I asked him it wasn’t a shock. We didn’t bother with a reversal and went straight to IVF, DD is now the absolute light of his life.

My ex and I were happy with just the one child...having more was never seriously discussed.

We split 4.5 years ago. He met his new partner shortly afterwards and at 51 he's now a Foster carer and they are planning to adopt, so people can change their minds.

It’s good to hear these different outcomes so thank you. I know some are saying having the snip should be classed as permanent and for some people that’s the case. But I know decisions I made years ago aren’t necessarily the ones I would make today. And he had 3 boys with his ex wife so I can see why they both would have not wanted anymore at that time. I know people are saying talk to him now but after the year we have all had I would like a nice December with him and we can both see where our heads are at in the new year. It is a time for reflection after all! At the start of all this I probably didn’t really expect it to last as, like I said to him, we were in different stages of our lives. But he has changed his outlook / mindset on certain things since we got together and it’s allowed us to get to where we are right now. Im just 50/50 on what his take will be on me saying the time has come where I’m pondering our future because I want a child. Which is why I’m putting it off!

@Wendywoo19 I was terrified about bringing it up with my partner, but the ‘TALK’ was him just saying of course, I knew you wanted kids so that’s what will happen. He was just worried that a reversal wouldn’t work. I told him that we were going straight to IVF and the rest is history. The only thing you have to consider there is if you do get pregnant first time, what would you do with the embryos. I’d like to try them and he doesn’t want to and would rather donate them, so do think and discuss everything. Good luck x

@Esindi that’s what I half think, that he hasn’t mentioned it because even if he was open to it he would be worried about the consequences of it not working. So it’s best for him to not rock the boat as at the minute he has me, he has his 3 boys, so it’s not in his interest to bring it up. And for me, I’m worried about the other side of it that maybe I’m wrong and he would just flat out so no. And then I would have to decide where that leaves our relationship. So I’m not rocking the boat either. I know people are saying it’s not great that we can’t talk about it but if it was so easy to bring difficult things up Mumsnet wouldn’t be full of people asking for relationship advice. I can talk to him about stuff but this has always been the one thing we have mutually avoided as the relationship has progressed. How long after being together did you go for IVF if you don’t mind me asking?

@Wendywoo19 I think when you have so much riding on something it’s absolutely natural to be scared about it and not start the dialogue. Don’t worry about what other people say, they’re not you in the position you’re in. They’re text on a screen.

I spoke to him 2 years after being in the relationship, after worrying to my friends and to have the almost anticlimactic yes of course. I started the IVF 4.5 years after we met when I was late 30s and felt ready. I was a late starter when it came to kids. I got pregnant with DD within a couple of months. Our dr told us there was a minuscule risk that the sperm would have become infertile in the testes (apparently after a vasectomy this can happen- simplistic explanation sorry), but he’d never in his 30+ years of practicing had no sperm so he couldn’t see it being a problem. It wasn’t, at all.

Just to add though, I’m not in the UK. IVF was subsided under Medicare (we could have gone bulk billed- free, but we went for the dr with the best results).

Also my partner absolutely admits there is no way he’d of had another kid if it wasn’t for me, but he’s chuffed as chips he did! He’s not trying to build an empire anymore, with age things change. He’s slowly retiring to spend more time with DD and had a long paternity leave with her.

You don't really have time to squander by not discussing it, tho. You're early 30s so your fertility window has a good few years yet, but you really need to start the conversation.

So it’s best for him to not rock the boat as at the minute he has me, he has his 3 boys, so it’s not in his interest to bring it up.

But from his perspective there's nothing to bring up - you're the one changing the terms of the relationship.

Have you communicated to him how deeply you want a child? Because even on this thread your initial words were ambivalent, and it only became apparent how much you wanted a family after a few questions from posters. Of course, you had quite valid reasons for this. But from his perspective he's been open from the get-go that more children are not an option for him. He knew you were ambivalent, probably leaning in the other direction, but your actions in the past two years have indicated that you're fine with getting into a childless relationship.

And yes, there are anecdotes about men willing to reverse vasectomies - that might be the case. But in most cases, people who undergo surgery to end their fertility don't do so lightly! It's an act of finality and should be respected as such. Have you asked him why he took that step rather than other preventative methods?

So you're going to have to prepare yourself to hear "no" from him - and he might be the one feeling betrayed, as your actions in this relationship so far have indicated to him that you're content with a childless future with him. And if your desire for a family outweighs that, you'll have to leave him.

Please don't get taken in by the lunatic idea that reversing his vasectomy is a test of his love or commitment to you. Would you appreciate being told that giving up your dream of a family is a test of your love and commitment to him? It's a sad situation if you're not on the same page, but it's just incompatibility, not insufficient love.

Of course he could well be one of the few cases happy to reverse a surgical procedure originally intended to be permanent - I hope that's the case for you. But I don't expect it.

OP the way you are talking about your OH is really concerning. You're still assuming a refusal to want more children is directly connected to how much he loves you which is completely unfair. He has three kids which means he is already financially responsible for three lives which is expensive. He decided he didn't want more children a long time ago. Yes he may change his mind if you ask but not wanting them doesn't mean he doesn't love you. He's been honest with you from the beginning that he couldn't have them so it is you that is changing the goal posts.

Not sure why people are refusing to admit that things aren’t black and white and life, and decisions taken in some phase of life can be reconsidered at other times.

Plenty of men/people have kids with their first partners and think they are done. Vasectomy at that time makes perfect sense because it’s a simple procedure and removes the need for the woman in the couple to pump her body with pills on a daily basis. And many men don’t like condoms. So - it’s a perfect solution and works for the one marriage setup, if that marriages lasts.

If it doesn’t - men often end up meeting women that are younger than them. And it’s understood and widely accepted situation that those women, if childless, would want to have children.

So - those men have to make a choice, and often do go along with their younger partner’s need for a child.
Now - those men would not have had those new kids had they stayed with their original partner. Or if they were with a new partner their age, who already had kids.
Does that mean that they were forced against their will? Not really.
It means that their life developed in a different direction from what they thought previously, and they changed their mind on a previous decision.

Does that decision - to have kids with a new younger partner, vs not have kids and separate instead - have anything to do with the strength of their love/commitment to that relationship? Of course it does!

In the situation where two parties come to it with originally different views on something - both need to decide whether the relationship/partner is more important than sticking to that original view.
This is not only the case about children only - it can be about moving countries; living in cities vs rurally; taking this or that job etc. Pretty much about any big decision affecting the life of the couple.

@Josuk you have hit the nail on the head with how I view things. For some people it’s very black and white, and think because he’s had the snip that’s final. But people and situations change and I personally can’t understand how love doesn’t come into it. I have NEVER once said to him I don’t want kids, and when we first started dating I did bring up that I felt we might have an expiry date because we were at different stages in our lives. So to me, we are both to blame for continuing in a relationship without checking if the other one is ok without having kids / open to looking into having more. I think until you have been with someone a while and know the relationship has got legs it’s hard to say what what you might want with that person. Someone might say they don’t ever want to get married then they meet someone and 2 years down the line realise they do want marriage with that person. So some people may have laid all this out at the start or not got involved but that would have been a mistake for me as I don’t regret the last 2 years at all. And without going into things, I personally have made sacrifices for my BF because I love him and feel it’s worth it. So to me, yes love does play a part in it, like any life changing decision in a relationship as @Josuk states above. And there are no money worries so the financial side of paying for another child doesn’t come into it. As @Esindi says sometimes it’s hard to start the conversation about something you want incase it’s not the answer you want to hear.

I know you’re scared... my view was that you’re worrying about his answer anyway. If he has been thinking the same, you don’t spend the rest of the year worrying when you don’t need to be. If he hasn’t, he can think about it and you’ll get an answer sooner. Either way, you get clarity and you’re not keeping something inside... because I’d be very scared of what he was going to say, of course anyone would, but I’d hate all the waiting too. It’d drive me mad.

If you want to wait, do that. If it feels right not to ask him now, and you’re not just putting off the inevitable, that’s what you should do.

All the best for whenever you do

Thank you @HopeAndDriftWood

He could be not bringing it up because you have said you felt like you had an expiry date so the longer he leaves it the longer he gets to stay together.

He does already have 3 children, that is plenty for anyone and he decided he was done. My partners had the snip and when talking about it I said to him that he needs to make sure if anything happened to us that he still wouldn’t want any children. He had the snip because he’s completely done.

I’m sure you have made sacrifices but I don’t think you could make any bigger then the one you are about to ask him. You are possibly asking Him to have a child he doesn’t want, he may go along with it so please you and keep you but that doesn’t mean he won’t resent you down the line for it.

If he says no to a baby, that doesn't say anything about his love for you or his commitment to the relationship. Sometimes you must know yourself and what you want. Think carefully about what you want. If you really want a child and he doesn't, you will have to weigh up what will matter most to you.