To feel hurt and betrayed by my DS?

[MsSweary]

I have been here a long time but I've never posted in AIBU and I'm not sure if that's even relevant but I have to say this to someone. My head is all muddled up and i probably should wait until I calm down but I can't.

I am so very angry and hurt by my eldest DS (he is 37) and I don't know if my feelings are justified and if they're not I think there must be something wrong with me. He is the oldest of my 3 DC's. Both my eldest DS's are from my first marriage. My DD is from my second marriage.

The back story is I divorced my ExH 10 years ago; the years leading up to the end were hideous and I was a mental and emotional wreck and thought I was mad; I was drinking too much to cope with things that didn't make sense and I was on antidepressants. ExH is what I think is called functional alcoholism so never really got drunk but couldn't be without alcohol daily; he'd had a gambling habit during university, he told me early on.
In our marriage He'd also had at least one 'emotional affair', and I once came home early in the day to find him alone with one of them who by that time he'd given a job in his service; not having sex but when i walked in he jumped back from her like a scared rabbit. She had also turned up at our house once in the evening claiming to have broken down and couldn't get back to London that evening so we put her up; a week later ExH decided to buy this woman an item of clothing exactly like the one of his that he'd leant her to sleep in because "she loved it so much" and some months I later found texts between them saying I love you.

After couples counselling during which he never accepted or acknowledged that his behaviour was unnaceptable, he left me for a woman he'd lived with whilst at Uni so it was the age old story; that affair was ongoing during the time we were supposed to be saving our marriage and i later found out he'd come to the appointments from being with her. . Eventually his clear hatred of me wasn't enough to tip me over the edge into throwing him out (because I thought the problem was mine). Either alone or together they decided to send me an anonymous letter informing me of the affair and then ExH blamed our then 15 year old DD for having sent it. i know she couldn't have and wouldn't and she was so upset that her DF had suggested it was her; the post mark of the letter placed ExH in the area he works in, too far away for DD to possibly have been in as she was at school.

She, by the way, had learned of his infidelity or put 2 and 2 together and had begged him to tell me but he wouldn't; when I found this out out her anger and spiteful comments to him and telling me I was a fool, began to make sense. I also found out that he had been stealing money from my bank account as part of the plan to screw me financially whilst I was at my most vulnerable but that particualr plan failed. I should've learned what was to come earlier when he once cleared my bank account right up to the overdraft. I know I was stupid not to end it there and then but I'd not long had our DD and had just moved into the first house we'd bought. I so very nearly did though, and I never really felt the same about him after that.

A week after he left and whilst I was still in shock he introduced my eldest DS to the new partner. My younger DS would not have anything to do with ExH.

I'm sorry for telling in such detail (and I've left loads out as you get the picture). So ExH has split with the woman and moved permanently back to the area. He has been seriously ill, very seriously. I have stayed away all this time and I'm in a much better place after lots of therapy and I haven't had alcohol at all for about 8 years and no inclination to drink at all.

But ExH is slowly inching back in to my DS's lives and the 'weak link' has always been eldest DS whose relationship with his birth dad has never been great but it's not awful either. It's been a source of tension for us as ExH is very manipulative and only ever sees people as a resource to help him get what he wants. Younger DS saw him and spoke to him for the first time in 10 years a couple of weeks ago. ExH mentioned that he hadn't met DS's young son (my DGS). It was a clear bid to get that introduction I think. DS didn't respond but I don't think ExH will give up.

I found out this morning that yesterday ExH leant my eldest DS his car to take my DF shopping; DS usually borrows his brothers car to do that on a Sat morning. But I'm told by DS that it suited him to borrow ExH's car yesterday.
Reasonable or not, I am so hurt and I feel like this man is inching his way back in by any means necessary and it's not because his illness has made him have a sudden epiphany. It's because the other relationship ended and he wants what he left behind. I feel like DS is being disloyal; by his own admission he said that if the situation were reversed and I was to spend time with people who have seriously done him wrong, telling them stuff about DS and generally including them in my life he'd be really upset and pissed off with me.

But it's ok for him, because it suited him to use ExH's car.
I have to stop typing now.

[Joeblack066]

I am in exactly your shoes with 3 DS from 1st marriage and 1 DD from 2nd. Eldest is 34. I have never ever tried to block or discourage their relationship with their Dad even tho he cheated, robbed and gaslighted me. Because to do so would harm THEM. You will also give Ex H ammunition to say it was all your fault. Keep your feelings about your Ex H to yourself. You will drive them away otherwise. It has worked well for me. My 3 boys are settled and well adjusted. They know what their Dad did (not all by any means) but of course they love him.
That’s my advice anyway.

[Quartz2208]

OP like it or not you brought him into your sons life as a substitute father given that his birth father is useless. For 20 years he was that role and by all accounts all of the betrayal was to you there is nothing in your post about how he was as a father.

DOes your DD see him?

[EarlGreyJenny]

@Joeblack066

I am in exactly your shoes with 3 DS from 1st marriage and 1 DD from 2nd. Eldest is 34. I have never ever tried to block or discourage their relationship with their Dad even tho he cheated, robbed and gaslighted me. Because to do so would harm THEM. You will also give Ex H ammunition to say it was all your fault. Keep your feelings about your Ex H to yourself. You will drive them away otherwise. It has worked well for me. My 3 boys are settled and well adjusted. They know what their Dad did (not all by any means) but of course they love him.
That’s my advice anyway.

I wish my parents behaved more like you. You're a hero.

[MissBaskinIfYoureNasty]

Please tread carefully here. My husbands mother caused problems for him and his sister because they maintained a relationship with their dad who she absolutely loathed. They don't see or speak to her at all anymore and she hasn't met some of her grandchildren. Don't alienate your children.

[essexmum777]

I think you need more counselling OP, this seems to be eating you up - its fine to feel these emotions but if you get stuck feeling them the only person you are hurting is yourself.

[ancientgran]

He isn't their father.

[LouiseBelchersBunnyEars]

@rottiemum88

Sorry but YABU. As someone with step parents who have been brought in to my life, and then had them removed from my life, it really bugs me that parents can think they can introduce someone into their child's life and then get upset when a relationship is built. It is very selfish. You introduced this man into your child's life, you live with it now. You need to keep your upset to yourself

This. And no, I don’t think you should ignore your DS until you can pull yourself together, he hasn’t done anything wrong. You need to find a way to get a handle on your emotions and not make them a problem for your children to deal with. It’s emotionally manipulative and cruel.

Sorry, but I think if he’s feeding information to this man about his mother, which she doesn’t want him knowing, then he is doing something wrong.

I didn’t have any contact with my dad or his family growing up, but as I got older relatives have made contact.

My mum always said she doesn’t mind what I do, but she doesn’t want to hear about them, and she doesn’t want me telling them shit about her and her personal business.
Which is fair enough.
I don’t see any of them anyway, but that’s by the by.

If he wants a relationship with this man, that’s one thing, but that relationship should be between the two of them, OP shouldn’t be mentioned.

You’re not wrong, OP, to be hurt by this.

[jessstan1]

@2bazookas

Your post is all about you and "he done me wrong".

Your sons are not you. They are adults who can make their own decisions, choices, relationships. It's not their fault you chose them a crap father. But he IS their father, and they still feel some kinship and identify with him. That's perfectly normal. Many children and adults still have feelings for even the worst parents. Haven't your sons stayed in contact with you, despite their broken home and all your problems with booze, MH,

You now seem to be transferring to your sons, all the anger, resentment, jealousy and blame you feel for their father. That's irrational, unfair, and self-defeating, and will damage your relations with your sons.

So, instead of accusing your EX of manipulating your sons feelings, try looking in the mirror. Isn't that exactly what you're doing to them?

If their father is still a manipulative bastard I they are old enough to work that out for themselves. This might be ir last chance of closure, and coming to terms with the past, because he's dying.

You need to step back, give your sons space to grow strong and find their own way. That's what parenting is all about in the end.

Actually, 2bazookas, the op's ex is her sons' stepfather. They obviously had a good relationship with him - 'like' him. He won't be around much longer.

Op, I agree with what others have said; your sons are old enough to choose who they see and not see and it would be wrong to interfere. I do, however, understand some of how you feel. I really hope you can get past it because you've been divorced ten years! It's time. Just make it clear you don't want to discuss your ex, or have your boys discuss you with him, and leave it at that.

You said in your opening post:
"She had also turned up at our house once in the evening claiming to have broken down and couldn't get back to London that evening so we put her up;"

Very recently, someone else posted a similar story but it had only just happened, ie at the time of posting, the woman was still staying with them. I wonder if she will read this and wonder. At the time, the general consensus was that it was dodgy though the husband said there was nothing going on.

Good luck as you move forward, there are easier times ahead. x

[CJsGoldfish]

would I BU to not speak to my DS for a few days until I can do so without crying ? He has already phoned me but I can't bring myself to speak without becoming really emotional.

TBH, you sound really manipulative. At some point you have to stop trying to control them all this way otherwise you will lose out.

[Porcupineinwaiting]

I think you've put your kids through enough OP. I feel really sorry for them having to deal with such disfunctional parents and their issues.

[SnowHare]

You cannot control the relationships two other adults have. You do need mroe cousnelling as to hang this all on loyalty etc is potentially damaging.

I understand it hurts, but you need to be an adult about this, honestly.

[VashtaNerada]

YANBU for feeling this way. However, as others have said, it’s really important DS makes up his own mind on this. Sometimes we have contact with relatives we don’t particularly like, so just because they’re speaking doesn’t mean your DS can’t see him for what he is. You’ve got the difficult job now of being the oh-so-reasonable parent that DS can talk to if it all goes wrong.

[SnowHare]

Oh yes and please stop with the silent treatment. It is manipulative at best, abusive at worse. It may backfire on you badly.

Good luck with sorting this out OP. But you may need to look inside yourself a bit and examine your reactions.

[RantyAnty]

It's been 10 years, your son is almost 40 years old. You need to dry your tears and get a grip.

Crying, ignoring, sulking, telling him how could you do this, etc. would be odd and manipulative.

[SnowHare]

Op it hurts i get it. I don't eman to sound harsh, but you need to let your adult child have a relationship with who he chooses- particularly if you were together with your ex for 20 years- that is part of his whole life.

[Ramblingwords]

OP, your emotions are your responsibility. You need to find ways to manage them without resorting to passive aggressive attacks on your children. Going low contact or even “not speaking” to your DS for a few days, just says that you expect him to respond to, fix and be manipulated by your feelings. That’s a terrible things for a parent to do.

Your DS is trying to maintain a relationship with his father figure. That is his business.

Your ex treated you badly. This is your business.

Don’t mix up the two things. Don’t dramatise the consequences of normal conversation (your DS discussing normal day to day things that might include you) to suit your own agenda of victimisation.

Find a way to deal with your feelings that doesn’t make them your DSes responsibility.

[BlueThistles]

YANBU OP, I'd feel very hurt by this too

[Booboobibles]

As you say, it sounds like he’s only trying to form a relationship because he’s alone and seriously ill. And he treated you so badly I can totally understand why you’d be upset.

Sorry I’ve not read your post properly but can you just have a chat with your DS and tell him that he’s free to have a relationship with his step dad but that he does have a tendency to be exploitative?

We had a similar situation in our family. My half sister’s dad wheedled his way back into her life when she was 20 after having nothing to do with her for 15 years and not paying any maintenance. She and my mum didn’t have a great relationship before this so I could understand why my DS wanted to see her dad but my DM has never forgiven her. She had a great relationship with her dad but virtually no relationship with her mum. This has been going on for almost 40 years!

[SnowHare]

@Ramblingwords

OP, your emotions are your responsibility. You need to find ways to manage them without resorting to passive aggressive attacks on your children. Going low contact or even “not speaking” to your DS for a few days, just says that you expect him to respond to, fix and be manipulated by your feelings. That’s a terrible things for a parent to do.

Your DS is trying to maintain a relationship with his father figure. That is his business.

Your ex treated you badly. This is your business.

Don’t mix up the two things. Don’t dramatise the consequences of normal conversation (your DS discussing normal day to day things that might include you) to suit your own agenda of victimisation.

Find a way to deal with your feelings that doesn’t make them your DSes responsibility.

That says it much better than me. I agree with every word.

[BiBabbles]

If you really can't manage talking to him without crying (which, as Bluntness said, could be read as manipulation, but so would giving him the cold shoulder), a quick neutral text thanking him for his help with DF and maybe saying you'll call him later may be a good idea.

When able to get more emotionally regulated, it may be worth talking to your DS about the things you don't want mentioned to your ex or hear about him, but as PicsinRed said, it's also worth considering not having DS involved in things that you don't want passed on.

I don't think this is a 'high' expectation, it's just an expectation - one that is not appropriate to put on a 37-year-old who will have had a very different experience and relationship with your ex and a different perspective on both of you during that time period. Dealing with a drunk mother, even just knowing and being unable to do anything, isn't easy. Being expected to pick sides when both parents/parental figures fucked up & feeling their love/kindness is conditioned on picking their side is a mind fuck, even when only one parent is doing it.

While you have every right to not want to have your business spread around, being expected to be "loyal" aka entirely taking your path on what may appear to be a far more complicated issue from another perspective is to be manipulated. It's damaging.

[PatchworkElmer]

Sounds like your ex was present for a lot of your DS’s childhood, and DS still feels an attachment to him. Which I think is understandable.

[CantBeAssed]

Firstly well done on 8years drink free...sounds like your ex brought you to rock bottom and you have managed to to break the cycle of "emotional damage" you suffered...i totally understand where you are coming from. When someone can bring you to such a low point its hard to except that your ds can display disloyality and form a relationship with this person. As advised i would not be telling ds anything you do not want your ex knowing..i think saying as little as possible about this relationship is best way forward..the more you speak nefatively of ex the more opportunity he has to deny.

[CantBeAssed]

Negatively*

[Thinkingg]

Do you worry that realistically your ex will turn up at your house or workplace, or interfere there? If so, fair enough. In general though, I wouldn't consider that private information; it seems like general chat, not like your medical information. So depending on the circumstances, I can see why your son might not have thought to keep these secret.

[aSofaNearYou]

I don't think YABU to feel hurt, especially as your son has admitted he would hate it in your shoes but just doesn't seem to care. You are certainly not being unreasonable to expect him not to talk about you and share details of your life with this man. He is being quite cruel if he won't respect that.