September 2020 Well we took you to Stately Homes thread

[AttilaTheMeerkat]

It's now September 2020, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012
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December 2013
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May 2017 - August 2017
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December 2017 - November 2018
November 2018-May 2019
May-August 2019
August-October 2019
November-December 2019

Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat or toomuchtooold for details.

Some books:

Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

@CeciledeVolanges

Sorry to be self obsessed again but I’m out and it feels the worst. My dad drive after me to tell me his heart is breaking. Everyone is telling me I will lose my job. I’m on the way to my flat and it feels awful

I'm so glad you're out of there! Your parents are absolutely awful. Please, please block them on every possible device, app etc. You need some proper space. And don't feel guilty. This is all their doing, not yours. You deserve time and space alone. If Any of your family come knocking, ignore them. It may also be worth calling a helpline. I'm not sure which one... Samaritans maybe. They may also be able to give you advice regarding what to do next. I think someone said a while back that you should contact the police. That might be a good idea. Also, would highly recommend contacting your local GP. I did that a while ago, and they said I was suffering from PTSD from past events as well as having to deal with current stuff.

And please don't apologise for being "self-obsessed". You're not, and anyway, that is what this thread is for...for us all to have an outlet. Talk to us on here...we all understand.

Xxx

@Downandupdownandup

I'm so sorry I didn't see your post sooner.

Really hope you're ok and doing your best to ignore your parents behaviour. I know what it's like as I get very similar behaviour from my DF (DM is lovely but has dementia nowadays so has no clue).
The sooner you can move into your own place (rented or bought) the better it will be for you and you can move on to create the life you want for you and your children. I'd go low contact at that point for your own sanity.

I'm in a similar position in that my DF wants me to move in with them (me and ex are still living together as financially cannot afford to split.) Moving to my parents would mean I'd have to leave my job, the area I live in and my life in order to move hundreds of miles. I'm trying to avoid it as I know DF would behave in a very similar manner to your parents. My children consistently get told off there and can never do anything right (they are quite well-behaved but DF will shout at them for breathing in the wrong way)

I would work towards moving ASAP as the technique they are employing where they are them effectively bombing the children with affection after telling them off is very emotionally confusing plus then being so demeaning towards you in front of the children just isn't acceptable

Cecile

No need whatsoever to apologise for being supposedly self obsessed.

I hope you manage to continue to stay away from your abusive parents and grandmother. You are not useless at all, you are a fine young woman who has been deeply wounded by the very people who were supposed to love and support you. It’s not your fault they are like this and you did not make them that way.

Callistography

Never ever move in with your parents!. Your father is probably eyeing you up to be his de facto carer.

He and in turn your mother as his attendant enabler and secondary abuser are using your kids to get back at you. They are being treated not too dissimilarly as to how you were treated as a child. They were not good parents to you when you were growing up and they are deplorable grandparent figures to your kids now. Going forward you all need to stay away from them entirely and have no form of contact with them.

Morning all,

I hope we all had a lovely break at Christmas. I've been thinking ahead to 2021 with a tin hat on over the past few days after a bit of an epiphany. We have another relative in the family who has been horrendously abusive towards my husband and I spent all of yesterday saying to myself "that's it." I don't choose to associate with friends who treat me this way so why can family members push me around?

So this morning I've removed my father and his other children from social media. They were restricted before but now they're removed. I don't see why I should let them in my life when it's a one way street: my father has not made any effort during a pandemic to speak with me directly so he's no longer on my "friends" list so that he can reassure himself that I'm still alive.

I'm thinking now is the right time to block him on my phone and email, I'd like to sent a short note saying having had time to re evaluate a number of things during 2020 I now choose not to have contact any more. No explanation needed I think. Even if I did he'd rewrite history and make it all my fault. I'd like it to be final and my decision so that I can move on. Is this the right course of action?

Do indeed block him on all channels.

No note needed as it will only encourage further communication and or leave a door open that should be firmly closed.

I've read this thread for a while but i've never posted because my issues are with my in laws.
From my husbands point of view though, he is really struggling with his parents and as people will know it is really hard to cut contact with family and he is really being made to look like the 'bad guy'.
I'm pretty certain his dad is narcissistic or he has traits. He is a very negative man and holds on to grudges and anger and it almost feels as though their has to be a target of his anger at all times and only when this anger is redirected to a new person, his focus will shift. He has to drag everyone around him into it also and everybody has to agree with him and a lot of time is spent gossiping and fuelling this anger in the family home.
My husband has 2 siblings and whilst on is a girl and she is always golden child, he would change between the son's- who was in the good books and who was in the bad. He could never be happy with everyone.
He is controlling and does nice things just to hold them over you. He owns a company and my husband used to work for him but he has left now - when working there, he would provide a car and if you were the current golden child hand out bonus'. But it left my husband feeling the need to compete all the time and also being treated terribly for no reason if he wasn't the current favourite.
They have had a falling out now so my husband was actually sacked and car taken away - his dad has blocked him. We are a year on from that.
My husband wants to go no contact with his family - we currently only have contact with his mum but she is honestly just as bad. Total martyr. Last year we told her we couldn't pay the mortgage and we were struggling, when he had been sacked whilst i was on maternity leave. She didn't reply and instead posted a picture of herself round the pool on holiday, saying 'this is the life'. If you ever raise any issues about the way they treat us and our children, she acts a total victim and actually says things like "don't do this again" and tells us she can't cope.
I agree we should probably cut all contact as it's been another dramatic christmas. She excludes my youngest child and has no interest in her and when we have raised this she has had another go at us.
I'm just wondering what people's experiences are of cutting all contact when there are children involved. It's only the mother who is interested anyway and she is only interested in our eldest. I've put up with this, this year, as my youngest hasn't a clue and I've hoped she would start to show an interest in her. This isn't the case and in the long term this set up isn't working. I would be happy if we could all just move forward and be civil but that won't happen as the dad is very very stubborn and he's making it his mission to turn other family member's against my husband. I feel that the only way is just cutting them off but this would really create more drama.

MandB
Yes cutting them off is the only way
The way to deal with the drama is completely ignore it, cut the drama off too
It's not easy but do it because it's the only way to be free

Cecilede are you ok?

MandB

I would support your husband further in cutting off his parents from your family unit. No good whatsoever comes of being in contact with his parents anyway and your mil is her husband’s enabler and secondary abuser. She is also favouring one of your own children over the other and that will continue also. Protect your children here from such bad things, family is not binding and besides which too his parents are not safe people to be at all around.

@AttilaTheMeerkat

Do indeed block him on all channels.

No note needed as it will only encourage further communication and or leave a door open that should be firmly closed.

I just realised I forgot to say thank you for your reply @AttilaTheMeerkat . Noted with thanks. I did the blocking yesterday but missed WhatsApp and a forwarded video pinged through last night. Now blocked on there as well.

Hi, I posted elsewhere too, but I was hoping I could join for some longer term support.

Things with my DM have been coming to a head for a long time, we are fairly close in age, she had me at 18 I'm 34.

My childhood was chaos, we moved homes about 15 times during my childhood ( my DB are 28 and 20 have moved another 6 times since) no real reasons often we had to move schools too.
She is also incredibly emotionally immature, there stock phases are
'I don't deserve this'
I'm tired
I'm ill
Why are you talking to me like this.

Things have gotten worse she can't make calls now with writing down word for word what she will say.

Things like unexpected letters send her into a panic, she then posts on Facebook for sympathy... Things like 'feeling sad' 'can believe this has happened'

For Context she hasn't worked in 32 years, all 4 of us siblings had mild disabilities so she was never required to work.

She sends huge paragraphs of text via messenger with the jist 'I'm getting new carpets'

It's very much a parent ( me) and child relationship.

We use to go out in a group with friends to watch bands; but she gets drunk, lairy and cries when people don't want to go to nightclubs.

She had friends but for the above reason they stopped inviting her and I won't invite her out with me because frankly she's embarrassing.

She has no hobbies, clubs, volunteering.

Anyway this weekend me and my brother got into a huge row, he's attempting to move out of mums again for both their MH sake and I was financially assisting him

My brother lives in a loop of chaos with no personal responsibility, gets a job, quits, will take his antidepressants, stops them, gambles, smokes cannabis he's 28

For a few months Mum would call or tell me when I seen her that he explodes and shouts and screams in the flat (I've seen him do this)

So I lost it with my brother who spent all his money on clothes instead of saving it as I had reminded him.

He basically shrugged and was like I won't move then.

' I didn't ask for your help' bloody took it though!!!
So he left mums for a walk

I told mum this is the last time I'm supporting him, that he takes the piss out of all of us. (He often doesn't pay rent or gambles rent etc)

Well my mum couldnt see the fuss

• it's not that bad ( she was calling the police a few weeks ago)
• he sometimes pays rent ( begging him for £75 a month apparently)

And how dare I say negative things about HER son that's nasty! ( she literally moans about him weekly)

So I left and told her I needed a break from the family; but I'd arrange for my DC to see her

"How dare you take my grandkids away, don't you worry I'll tell them the truth"

Well I lost it again and told her I would be stopping visits if she did that
(For context she never protected us from any adult issues, over shares, had meltdowns, let us witness arguments with dad, let dad take us out when she knew he had a temper) DM and DD have been seperated for 15+ years.

So leave, she's screaming wailing, "I'm packing a suitcase"

Then there's a barrage of messages. I'll tell the kids you can't poison them etc etc etc.

Luckily ex and I are on the same page and made it clear that if she attempts that, they'll be no visits.

This morning she texts my DD12, I love you, your DM and DD are mad at me and are trying to poison you and DB

Well I did fucking lose it then! For a start we protect the kids from this Narc bullshitting so my DD thought she was talking about real poison her Dad had a chat with her and we've blocked her number from their phones.

I told DM she should be fucking embrassed, her response "why should she? "; anyway she's tired and ill and if I'm going to abuse her I should leave her alone!

My brother is apparently still moving, he'd rather not as he rules the place for £75 a month all in but I'm pretty sure she wants him out.

I think I've come to head of years of putting up with the moaning, the sad emojis, the drunkness, the martyr routine, the woe is me routine.
. But of course due to the toxicity and codependent traits I have I feel guilty

Any advice please?

BTW I I'm in therapy, which is helping and pulled the wool from my eyes about the kind of person she is

Hi countesskay :)
It sounds like she never really learned to function as an adult, and that's really hard because you never really had a proper supportive parent that you deserved and needed.
She isnt ever going to get any better, I feel like some kind of 'back away slowly' might be a good approach, drop the rope, dont engage with issues that she raises.
Do not JADE (justify, argue, defend, explain) with her
try to let go of any hope you might be holding onto that she will improve and be someone that you can rely on to do or say the right things.
Keep things very superficial, dont let her into your actual life, dont let her into anything which is important to you.
Protect/shield yourself from her

@Free3mee3

Thank you for the response, long I would like to go LC but after breaking the boundary regarding my children I'm not even engaging with her any time soon.

I had started to put firm boundaries in. She hates that I talk with my Dad, even though she's friendly with him and his GF.

She started talking about him, I calmly said 'I'm not talking about him
starts the 'countess always defends him'
I calmly say ' I just told you I'm not talking about him, if you mention it again we are leaving'

Well she flipped, screaming crying writing SM posts about me. I just ignored her like you would a toddler

I just ignored her
Well done😊 you're taking control, she did her worst, she threw a big toddler tantrum and it was just water off a duck's back
How I wish I'd been able to stand up to my mother when I was in my 30s
(sometimes I wonder if it might have even made her wake up and see that she was out of order-nah, probably wishful thinking)
cheering you on😊

@Sssloou

There is a sub conscious psychological reason that we go back time after time to our parents who abuse us as ADULTS as this is hard wired into our behaviour from birth.

So don’t beat yourself up about it - it’s normal as we are always in our own mind a CHILD to our parents even if we are 40 / 50 / 60 ..... because we depended on them for our physical survival as a child - for food, shelter and protection. So as a child we were driven time and time again to connect with them as they were our only option then to literally stay alive.

Even if our neglectful or abusive parent didn’t even supply these basics each time - we still went back with HOPE as a child as we needed these things even if erratic to physically survive.

As we become able to provide for ourselves we are confident to separate and have a different more adult to adult relationship with our parents around those basics. We don’t go back time and time again looking for food, shelter, protection.

It’s the same emotionally. They should have CONSISTENTLY supplied a sense of safety, warmth, kindness, respect and encouragement to grow our self esteem and emotional development just as much as the food for our physical growth.

If we were lucky to have had that we were able to grow into emotionally independent adults.

We didn’t know that we also needed these things explicitly as a child - this was “normal” in our “home” - but we were still needing these things implicitly and any deprivation stunted our emotional growth. This left was with deficits in our emotional development so we were often exposed to our own MH issues / anxieties and poor self esteem and often attracted similar intimate partners, friends, employers and stayed in these cold, exploitative, unkind, disrespectful relationships / situations whilst our self esteem was further eroded or until we emotionally educated ourselves and found the strength to move on - to a better partner, friend, employer. So we could replace bad with better.

But we only have one parent.

It is not as easy to go LC / NC as it is difficult to move on and replace them with another mother.

In our subconscious we are hardwired to continue to go back again and again in HOPE for the kindness, support, respect and encouragement that we still need from them in our deficient “child” emotional state.

We get hurt and disappointment either every single time or cyclically (if they are manipulative enough to work out our withdrawal / weak boundary pattern and timings with a nice / nasty cycle).....because they can’t or don’t deliver what we desire / need / expect. We preoccupy ourselves and talk about each incident as if it is shocking when the reality is this is always how they have engaged and always will be.

But we can move on and decide to get all of our emotional needs developed, repaired met and in reciprocal relationships with radiant, fun friends and family. We need to pick out who leaves us feeling consistently warm and refreshed when we spend time with them.....and focus on them. If we don’t have these types in our existing family / friend group - then we need to actively find them - we don’t need many - one of two would be enough.

But we need to appreciate the cognitive dissonance between the appropriately seeking, always HOPEFUL (because this is still needed for emotional survival) from the emotionally underdeveloped CHILD still in us in from this parent - the child’s naive expectation - despite the real life lived experience and evidence in the relationship to the contrary.

So don’t beat up your inner child who has not been emotionally nourished, who still needs and expects this subconsciously from their parent. Hope drives this inner child. That’s a wonderful stance but directed to the wrong place.

So our adult self
needs to gently tell this inner child that it’s NEVER going to come from this parent - in fact they can still continue to stunt our emotional development and do more and more damage.

But we can and do repair, emotionally develop, grow, get and give support, self esteem, encouragement, kindness, respect and warmth from other radiant emotionally balanced and healthy people in our lives and we need to actively seek this out as well maybe as seeking professional support to deal with this realisation.

The grief and pain that you as a child were starved and deprived and that child inside is still seeking that from the source that can’t or won’t give is v v tough.

Acknowledge and respect that.

It’s like going back to the same cupboard that is empty when we are hungry. We need to go somewhere else to get fed.
K
So don’t beat up your inner child who is only driven by childlike hope and is hurt, confused and disappointed like a child each and every time. Understand that this is the hardest relationship to come to terms with its dysfunction, to not get drawn back into (it’s hard wired in us), to move on from - to replace. So be self compassionate to yourself that this is the HARDEST relationship to see the reality in - especially if we haven’t yet understood this, then psycho educated ourselves and sought significant and professional help and support to get you through.

It’s a mix of long term strategic thinking and acceptance that this is how it is alongside daily tactics to protect ourselves from them and consciously work on our own personal emotional growth. This is different for all of us and is ever changing. It’s a process over many days years months as to how you choose to respond to the situation (which also changes from the other side at the same time).

We may get to a point where we can emotionally disconnect in our heads whilst still having a boundaried relationship with contact - or we may need to to full NC to reset and rebalance so that in time we can reconnect knowing we can handle this person and get something positive out of the relationship for us - or we recognise (which is most often the case after years of repeated hokey-kokey NC / LC periods) - that this just costs too much, is draining and reduces our ability to be the best mother, partner, friend we could be as we only have finite resources (energy, time, emotions) and our own children’s childhoods are passing by.

This is a hard card to be dealt which can consume you and still haunt you when they are dead. Be kind to yourselves.

I wrote this last month to try to explain why it is so so hard to go NC with our family of origin. We need loads of support to keep going. It takes a long long time to put in the distance. It’s v hard not to be triggered to react to urges and impulses, longing and yearnings. Always imagining, hoping, wishing it will be different - or the self doubt that YOU got it wrong, over reacted etc. It’s tough - just know that. But necessary and in time you are free.

Well christmas is done and low and behold, my parents think everything is back to normal.
We saw them the weekend before Xmas. It was OK, for ds really.
Anyway, today is my first day of maternity leave, at home, on my own. Mother has Rung me and I didn't answer. Didn't press decline, just didn't answer. Then I get a text saying "is my number still blocked?".
I reply "it was never blocked, I'm just busy" and she responds saying "no problem, just says your number isn't accepting calls from mine. Calling as we haven't spoken since Xmas. I'm back at work now so speak sometime."
Of course there's no problem, because I can decide if, when and who I answer the phone to. Also, it's doesn't say that because I haven't blocked your number. Who even asks if you've blocked their number?!!

Ugh its so frustrating, like as soon as I give a tiny tiny inch over Xmas, they think everything is fine.
It's now about resetting boundaries I had in place before Xmas. New baby due at the end of the month, so that will balls it up again and make them feel theyre entitled to my time and space.

I had a nice chat with my therapist today about the escalation of things with my mum. She helped me construct the following message

Ive changed the name of my DB and Daughter

*Hi, After Saturday night it's clear to me that we need space apart. We are all adults and should not have to scream and shout at each other to be heard.
I want to have a relationship with you going forward; but one that is equals. I can't continue hearing about issues you have with David, or the fact you don't have much spare money. I'm finding that too draining when I've got my own life, kids and house to sort out. You need to find other people to share your worries with.

I'm happy for you to see the kids, as long as you keep them out of what's been happening.
You seriously crossed a line by messaging Evie if you do anything like that again then I would need to review the contact*

Her response:

First of all do not speak to me like that and do not tell me I have crossed a line I done that because you said I couldn't see them and you had no right to do that nobrightbin thiscworldvthats hurtful and discusting stop aruging with me it's discusting I haven't got a problem with anything so I think you are getting a bit wound up I have just woke up to this nasty message and don't ever lecture me about what contact I can have with my own grandkids as you will find that's crossing a line a very big line I just told you why I done that so whatever you do is up to you remember not my doing I have nonproblem with anyone and threatening me about the kids and lecturing me about things is bullying

For context she's 53.

Anyway my therapist said you know how she'd react and she did in a textbook fashion.

I'm going on radio silence with her now

@Pearsapiece sorry to hear they are creeping back in.

The whole call thing I've had with my Dad, I answer the phone when I want - I put that boundary in a few years ago.
I get "oh you're still alive then" "Haven't forgotten about me"

I just ignore it. Once I called him out on it as I wasn't doing very well mentality and wasn't in the mood for calling. He also talks 90% of himself!

He gets this from my paternal grandmother who I also call when I choose.

This cones from when my other gran died and either DD or GM checked to see how I was.

I have nothing to add really, except to say your not alone. Family can frankly be shit, but you have your own family to take care of now

Countess

Any message, no matter how carefully worded, will be seen by your mother as an attack on her so she will react accordingly. She was not a good parent to you when you were growing up and she has not fundamentally changed since that time. I would also keep your children well away from her also. Why would you want her at all around your kids anyway?. Again that is probably due to fear, obligation and guilt.

Radio silence from you needs to be maintained. Low contact as well is not going to work with someone as disordered of thinking as your mother. It is not your fault your mother is the ways she is and you did not make her that way.

Toxic people as well like nothing more than a fight or the last word. Do not send her any more communications.

For context she's 53
countesskay, she's just a nut job isnt she, no insight no ability to reflect, just spits at you like a feral cat
I hope you can get enough distance that you can laugh about her.
I'm not condoning her, or minimizing the impact of her behavior on you but in many ways she deserves pity, she seems not all there.
And that's part of the horror, that we have let these fecking eejits harm us so much because we had no choice but to trust them as children.

Mine would have been the same, 'dont speak to me like that!!'
' WHO do you think you are!!'
bursting with contempt, gaaawd how I wish I'd just lamped her one

Hi everyone,
Sorry, I will catch up with everyone else's stuff over the next couple of days. I am OK, currently in inpatient treatment for the next month which my parents are actually paying for, I probably wasn't going to be alive much longer without it honestly. I somehow managed to agree with my parents before I went in that I would move from Durham but be living independently in the South nearer them so we will see how that goes. Sorry to have worried everyone on this thread and I will be back to contribute when I'm a bit more stable. Happy new year everyone and thanks and sorry again. x

Happy New Year Cecile👋
Glad to hear you're ok 🙏 keep posting, let us know how you are😊

Happy New Year to everyone. I hope everyone survived Christmas. I’d like to thank everyone who supported me with Toxic Hag (coercive narcissist mother in law) before Xmas. The change over at Xmas to go and stay with my mum for five days didn’t happen obviously (and commiserations to anyone who was hoping for a positive change that they wanted).

Background: the Hag was physically and emotionally abusive, Mr Monkey got away, she got her claws into his disabled brother who has no life for 20 years. Hag was ill before lockdown, stayed here for five weeks until I kicked her out for vileness and we’ve been stuck in a bubble with her since.

For anyone stuck in a bubble with the twat in your life I feel your pain. It’s awful. Their behaviour gets worse.

We’d pushed back on the Toxic Hag coming with us for five days to my mum’s at Xmas - WTAF, she invited herself which would have been five days of Hag Show and toxic behaviour. She played a ton of games over that which we didn’t engage with. We politely offered her two hour meal on Xmas Day once our plans had to change which she sulkily refused (her problem and we didn’t play the game of begging her - fuck that) We did a meal on NYD - three hours.

I now count the days of “exposure”. It’s very helpful.

She’s so vile. My partner got a call yesterday from her “you never ring me” (he phones her once a day) and then kicking off on the vaccine that she will have on Saturday.

The advice here has been brilliant, I no longer join in on the calls, I no longer take her to her endless medical appointments (she’s 83, whines about them but loves the attention) and I’ve disengaged.

My partner has made lots of changes - he rings her in the morning so he doesn’t have his evening ruined and pushes back on her moaning “moan” “you need to do this. It’s within your power so don’t moan”.

These people are horrible, don’t doubt your instincts and empower yourself (even though that’s so difficult). Keep on, keeping on. This forum is brilliant.

P.S.
With vaccines, I wish the children of narcissist had the choice of choosing who gets a vaccine and who doesn’t, if you catch my drift.