Concerns about DW and therapist - am I paranoid?

[StonedRoses]

I’ve posted before about my concerns about the Male therapist has been seeing for the last three years. Let’s call him John. He’s a little unorthodox and the process has lead to my DW going nc with her entire family. I’ve really no idea about whether the memories they have unearthed are correct or not. But that’s a side issue to today

One of my concerns has been the frequency of contact. Often 2-3 times a week. Text and email between and often arranged at short notice. There have been emergency they sit sessions, sometimes meeting at a local park or in the car

This week she told me on Friday at 5pm she had a phone call with John at 6. Then she left the house to make the call from the car, for privacy of course. However she then drove off and come back a couple of hours later.
Again yesterday her scheduled session is Thursday. Mid afternoon she text me to say she has another session straight after work

A friend of mine who can be a bit cynical has said to me ‘are you sure there’s nothing else going on’. And it’s got me thinking. I’m sure there isn’t and I hate feeling paranoid. But even so it does feel like current contact is OTT and rather eating into family time.

You should look up false memory syndrome. There were loads of therapists practicing recovering fake memories in the 80s and 90s. It ruined thousands of lives. Derren Brown and a few others have videos online where they show how false memories are implanted by doing it on volunteers.

Nobody "forgets" abuse they went through until eighteen, not realising their during that time that it was going on. Victims live with it every day. I work with refugees, nobody's ever come out of a camp and said "I thought I was on holiday the whole time". Real trauma is something you can't forget.

Your wife needs to make a formal complaint against her therapist and apologise to her victims for the vile false allegations she has made against them. You need to stop enabling her.

I feel very sorry for those who she has smeared and slandered.

You absolutely can go to the police and see if anyone else has made a complaint.

I’d also make a formal complaint with the governing body.

As you said you’ve have medical background you should absolutely know this has now crosses in to a potential safeguarding issue and there are still lines open to seek professional help

A month or so someone asked if there were any updates. There weren’t at the time so I didn’t reply. Sadly there are now and things have got worse. Please go gently on me because I just don’t know what to do

I have drawn a blank in terms of my concerns about the therapist. The professional body will not take a complaint from me whilst DW is a (legally) capably adult. Although some of his behaviour isn’t what is usually it isn’t ‘forbidden’ in their guidance. The GP made a note of it but of course cannot discuss it with me and as such it’s there if DW comes to the GP but again as she’s a competent adult they can’t get involved. The police (I spoke off the record informally to a friend who’s an officer) wouldn’t get involved between DW and therapist. Bluntly it’s her decision to believe what she wants and to spend her money. As she’s not a vulnerable adult there’s no issues regarding payment. I could make a formal concern about children in the family not being safe or report the potential abusers. But I have no evidence whatsoever and don’t have any idea if they are or not. So it would go anywhere without DW involvement- which she doesn’t want
Basically if she wishes to see the therapist and spend her money that is her choice

So whilst there seems to be little I can do about her and the therapist things get worse for us as a family. It all started when she was feeling better and considering reducing or ending therapy.
For a few weeks DW has been giving me cryptic messages hinting at something but not saying what. Things like ‘remember, you chose not to know’ and ‘it may involve you even if you don’t want to get involved’. It turns out she is utterly convinced she had a child as a result of family abuse aged around 21 when age wasn’t living at home. And that she abandoned that baby. Gave birth alone with no medical intervention. Somewhere out there my son has a half sibling. I can’t believe this. How you could go through and no one notice? Not housemates, uni friends, lecturers. And no hint when our son was born that she had given birth before. Too me this seems too absurd to be believable. But she is convinced. Apparently thousands of babies are born each year as a result of incest and that most are killed at birth to avoid detection. This does sound fanciful. She has become convinced that abuse is very common (which I know it is) and that in your average primary school at least four or five families are involved in serious ritual abuse

So I am very stuck and torn. I’m very worried for her mental health. Either it is true and she needs real support and help. This is truly horrific. Or it isn’t and she’s very ill. She definitely believes it’s real and her distress is real. She won’t see conventional medics or psychiatrists for fear of being labelled insane. But where does this leave me? This is not the life I wanted to live. No intimacy or relationship. Always worrying because something may trigger her but I never know what. It impacts on little ways that are getting hard to cope with. I have to go to bed before her because footsteps on the stairs are triggering. As is seeing my parents who are the same age as her So we don’t see them. I find it hard to deal with what I’ve been told. But I can’t leave someone who is ill and needs help. If it was just about me I would like to lead a different life - probably on my own. But I made vows for life - ‘through sickness and health’. And I have to consider what’s best for DS. He comes first of course.
I know no one has the answers or solutions but I need to vent and anonymously on her is the only way I can

Nobody "forgets" abuse they went through until eighteen, not realising their during that time that it was going on. Victims live with it every day. I work with refugees, nobody's ever come out of a camp and said "I thought I was on holiday the whole time". Real trauma is something you can't forget

That is simply not true. I remembered being abused. I remember seeing my sister being abused. Our brother witnessed my sister being abused. She denied all of it for twenty years before it came back to her due to various circumstances. She was more recently diagnosed with a dissociation disorder. It is very common for victims to not remember traumatic experiences.

It does sound like she needs professional help and I am not sure how you’d go about it unless she is sectioned

I find it impossible to believe she could have forgotten about a pregnancy. Sometimes you just have to walk away, even if it goes against your morals

It’s very common to bury and not recall trauma. It’s a way that the brain protects itself. It could be that she is telling the truth. This is the scenario that the victims of child abuse faced when they came forward about the “pillars of the community” figures that had done despicable things to them, they were not believed because trauma is misunderstood.

Oh StonedRoses so sorry to read your update.
You made vows for life but that doesn't mean prioritising your son is breaking those vows. "In sickness and in health" doesn't mean "I will be your healer".
This has been going on so so long now and - regardless of the truth - it is getting worse, not better. Where does it end, this process? When does your wife envisage being "better" and having recovered from her experiences?
Your son is now not allowed to see either set of GPs? Who's next??

I think the general consensus here is she's using therapy sessions as a cover story for an affair;either that or John is a creepy unethical weirdo who's abusing his position to gain sexual gratification from a younger woman.

@StonedRoses

I've just seen your latest update on your wife deteriorating mental health;you need to phone her doctor and told them about the baby thing;that's extremely concerning;tell them your concerned she's losing her grip on reality and your worried to leave your DC's in her care.That should get them to take notice.

I know you don't want her sectioned but sometimes needs must.My DH+I are currently in the position of supporting our close friend in getting his wife sectioned-In this case she's seriously ill,paranoid,self harming and keeps threatening to kill herself.

I can just about undrstand (or begin to) the process of how you could bury such horrific memories. But what I can’t get is how no one noticed. At this time she was sharing a house with four girls. And playing hockey regularly. Attending lectures etc. And yet not one person knew or now knows that she was heavily present? Unless you go down the line of everyone being in on it. Which is one hell of a conspiracy theory. It doesn’t make sense to me.
Everything is being twisted round this narrative. I remember a time her mother came to stay with us and they went shopping in the city. She brought nice dresses and posh underwear. Now apparently her mother did this to increase her sale value to the abusers. But she was 26 and living with me. So who was she being sold to and when?
I’m finding it all very confusing and very difficult

I remember your other thread.

What I would like to know is - given that the situation doesn't seem to have changed, what was it about the last thread's responses that left you feeling unsatisfied? You're getting pretty much the same response here in this one.

I’m so sorry to read your updates OP, I remember reading your thread back at the time you first posted, but never commented.

It’s clear that the situation is getting worse and is having a huge impact on so many lives. I honestly think you need to start taking some very real steps to intervene now. If any of what your wife believes is true, she needs proper professional help to deal with it – she’s not getting that from the therapist. And if she has some kind of illness that is contributing to her paranoia and beliefs, then again she needs professional help and treatment for it.

In one of your previous posts you said the GP kindly but bluntly told me ‘grown adults are free to be as daft as they wish, and spend their money as they wish’. This is far more than that – this is preventing you all from living normally and having a hugely detrimental effect on your own health and well-being. Needing to go upstairs before your wife does so she doesn’t hear footsteps on the stairs, being unable to visit your own parents, your children being cut off from their wider family. Buying a 26 year old nice underwear to increase her “sale value” – these aren’t “daft” thoughts, they are insidious and dangerous.

Please speak to your GP again and if you don’t get anywhere, speak to a different GP.

She won’t see conventional medics or psychiatrists for fear of being labelled insane.

It’s not about being labelled insane – it’s about checking whether there is some underlying medical condition that could be contributing to her present state of mind that needs to be diagnosed and suitably treated.

You're not allowed to be told private things about her medical care etc
BUT
you can go to your (shared?) GP and tell them all this. All of it - what you've said here. Make a timeline going from what she says about her childhood, through the baby thing and the clothes thing, to now, when your DS can't see your parents (*) and you have to go to bed first. Because if nothing else, YOU need help.

The heart of the matter is

• she's not getting better (you have to go to bed first)
• she's not seeking effective treatment
• you are not a qualified mental health professional carer and frankly even if you were it can be a very tough thing to treat
• you are stuck in this nightmarish half-life where your much loved wife is deteriorating in front of you and you are helpless

You may also want to see a specialist solicitor, because I'm guessing part of the worry is you don't know what will happen if you don't think she's safe to look after DS on her own - just understanding how cases like that would be handled takes away at least one unknown for you.

(*) BTW can he not see them just you and him? Or does she say no, or do you not want to leave her alone?

@20shadesofgreen

Nobody "forgets" abuse they went through until eighteen, not realising their during that time that it was going on. Victims live with it every day. I work with refugees, nobody's ever come out of a camp and said "I thought I was on holiday the whole time". Real trauma is something you can't forget

That is simply not true. I remembered being abused. I remember seeing my sister being abused. Our brother witnessed my sister being abused. She denied all of it for twenty years before it came back to her due to various circumstances. She was more recently diagnosed with a dissociation disorder. It is very common for victims to not remember traumatic experiences.

The difference there is that there were other witnesses to confirm it. In my DW case not only is there no evidence, her siblings don’t recall anything and for some of the allegations there’s direct contradictory evidence. The view of my DW is that this evidence has been doctored and planted to cover things up. This suggests either things are worse than I thought in terms of abuse or that her mental health is even worse. Neither is a great thought.

I desperately want to help her and I know it’s important to believe abuse victims. I am just finding it hard to believe and so this affects the support I can give. In the meantime I’m getting stressed and agitated by the whole thing. At least it got the ironing done and the house clean - can’t sit still!!

When you ask her questions about this baby she had, does she say what happened to it? Did someone take it away? Was the birth registered? I know these are mundane questions in light of the bigger picture, but I wondered if you are ever able to pin her down with answers.

I really feel for you, you are in a terrible dilemma, but what jumped out of your latest update was the triggering footsteps on the stairs and the fact your son can now no longer see his grandparents.

Other, wisers, posters have given you good advice. I can only add my good wishes and that you can come to some kind of solution quickly. For the good of all concerned.

"I have to go to bed before her because footsteps on the stairs are triggering. As is seeing my parents who are the same age as her So we don’t see them"

Mental illness or no mental illness: this part has now crossed the line into emotional abuse OP. She is controlling your life. You need to leave.

It sounds to me like John could have some kind of degradation fetish. So he could be getting off on the idea of this woman "having been degraded". "You were sexually abused". "You were sold to abusers". "How does that make you feel?".

On the other hand, I can totally understand your hesitation. Because what if john is genuine?

To me theres only one solution here and that's that you somehow meet with john on person, not to confront him but to get a sense of him, to see what your instinct says.

Cant you make an appointment to see him as a "client" using an alias? Just to see what vibe he gives you

Hmm. What an odd situation. I have done EMDR therapy a style of trauma therapy before and have found it very uncomfortable. If you're not with a properly trained professional I imagine it could be very easy to accidentally program yourself into thinking or saying something that's not true. You're constantly being asked to recreate and relive a trauma over and over again. Then sometimes they think that the trauma is a result of an earlier trauma that you just can't remember and then you have to try and remember that but it's almost impossible to remember something from when you were four when you're a grown-up. Honestly, I think some people just end up drawing up a load of crap based on what they currently think and what they think their therapist wants. There's a very weird pressure to it if you're a 'pleaser' type person.

The answers to what happened to the baby are vague. Partly because it’s so long ago and she’s only just recovered this memory so it’s very hazy to her. And partly because I find talking about this with her difficult. It takes a lot of energy to stop myself screaming ‘can’t you see this is clearly bollocks’

But as I understand she believes that she gave birth to this baby and then abandoned it. So it wasn’t registered etc. If it is true I can only hope it was picked up and found. She must think something of those lines because she has warned me of this child turning up one day. Apparently this is quite common as a result of abuse but to cover up the scale of such abuse most babies meet a worse fate.

It clearly sounds like fantasy - but who really knows what goes on. The distress it’s causing DW is very real

Apparently this is quite common as a result of abuse but to cover up the scale of such abuse most babies meet a worse fate.

“Apparently” is right - this is another load of twisted bollocks that “John” is programming her with. Where exactly are all these thousands of infant bodies being disposed of, so thoroughly that nobody ever discovers them?

John’s previous foray into SRA is also a load of crap. It’s about the most thoroughly debunked hysterical hokum out there today. About on a par with Bill Gates’ microchipped vaccines.

I think you have a duty to your son which overrides your marriage vows. You need to be taking him out of what can only become a very dangerous situation with your wife.

@BrightonEarly1

"I have to go to bed before her because footsteps on the stairs are triggering. As is seeing my parents who are the same age as her So we don’t see them"

Mental illness or no mental illness: this part has now crossed the line into emotional abuse OP. She is controlling your life. You need to leave.

I unfortunately agree with this. And while I hate dredging up prior posts, when you've posted about your wife over the past years it's even clearer. Having possibly suffered previous trauma doesn't give someone a get out of jail free card to behave as they like. She's making no attempt to work with you, to tackle what she believes happens to her as a team with her life partner, to listen to you and understand how it is impacting your marriage or your son. She's just waving a big flag, essentially, "do as I say because this happened to me". You don't really talk about how it's impacted your son but it must do hugely. You need to act! This isn't going to improve on its own. Sorry OP.

Can you open up to a close family member of yours? I feel like you need to have support and advice from someone who knows both you and your W IRL

Is there any way you could get her sectioned? Just because she sounds like she’s becoming more and more unhinged and you need to get her away from John.

I think if I were you, I’d be calling a mental health charity tomorrow and asking advice. See if they can recommend the best way forward, but I am starting to think hospital may be the right place for her

Just found this link to follow up my message above

www.rethink.org/advice-and-information/rights-restrictions/mental-health-laws/mental-health-act-1983/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMIs9uQr9XL7QIVg2DmCh3pJwNGEAAYASAAEgLLm_D_BwE

Gosh, what a terrible time you are having. Such a difficult situation to deal with. Have you considered counselling yourself ? This may help you develop coping strategies ?