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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Original poster

Domestic Abuse - Why Do Women Put Up With It?

405 replies

Guides009 · 16/08/2020 16:10

I don't usually read the Mirror, this story of a mother of 8, has really made me upset.

www.mirror.co.uk/news/real-life-stories/mum-eight-beaten-death-paving-22504713?utm_source=mirror_newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=EM_Mirror_Nletter_DailyNews_News_smallteaser_Image_Story&utm_campaign=daily_newsletter&ccid=397482

OP posts:
GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 21:43

Again I know next to nothing about the benefits system in NZ but I'm presuming it would pay enough to supply the basics for a single mum of 8 (?)

So what were those authorities to do to save her ... Force her into counselling to not continue a relationship with him or live with him again? What are the odds of its success?

Change the law to force her never to have a relationship with him or live with him again? How do they enforce that? If they use the kids custody,parent they harming her and the kids?

Do you think not one person who dealt with her through 100 calls to the police and at least one jail sentence for an assault on her (how bad must that have been given it's being said NZ doesn't take DC seriously?) Didn't try to persuade her or support her to leave the relationship behind and not live with him? That's hard to imagine. Id be inclined to think they did but have no means to make her do so.

Was it the police and paramedics fault for not getting to get quickly enough? Apparently it was 90 seconds from when she called then til he ended the battering and drive off.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 21:46

Remove him. And punish him if he's found anywhere near them.

How would you know he was around her or the kids unless she reported it (or her family members)? And she wasn't reporting it because she chose to have him there!!

So it's only if other people reported it that you'd find out, you'd go over to remove him, and he'd be straight back there a while later because she let him in again!

thefourgp · 17/08/2020 21:46

Shame on you OP. Victim blaming. As though it’s so easy to leave an abusive man and he’ll just happily wave goodbye to you and your children. You’re a fool and the reasons are well documented without goady posts like this one.

MarineAqua · 17/08/2020 21:49

Why do men abuse women????

How offensive is this OP????

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 21:49

He was living with her and their six kids (and two from previous relationship) because she chose to (continue to) be in a relationship with him and live with him.

(Until they split but continued living together shortly, not sure how long, before he murdered her).

So he wouldn't be your problem, because he's only there because she's let him stay there, us still.seeing him, stikl.livkngbwuth him, still having kids with him .. that was the case until a while before he murdered her.

So are you going to force her to stop seeing him etc and enforce it?

MarineAqua · 17/08/2020 21:50

Fuck the fuck off. Do your research before spouting off your vile on here.

longtimecomin · 17/08/2020 21:51

Women stay because some grew up in abusive homes and this is their norm. Many are too scared to leave. Many are gaslighted so badly they feel they are at fault for causing him (or her) to get angry. Lots of different answers. I was stuck in a relationship I couldn't get out of. We had a child together and he wasn't hitting me but he monitored me constantly, nagged me morning noon and night because everything I did or said was wrong, criticised me all the time and when I tried to end it he would threaten to commit suicide or to run away with our child. He refused to leave. I got the cops involved in the end but it's not as easy as walking out the door. Some women have no money or earning ability. Some women have it drummed into them for years that no one else would want them and that they're scum. Leaving can be the most dangerous time as they may try to harm you and or the kids. Every situation is different and sometimes it's better the devil you know than the unknown which could be even worse.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 21:51

*how

PicsInRed · 17/08/2020 21:56

So it's only if other people reported it that you'd find out, you'd go over to remove him, and he'd be straight back there a while later because she let him in again

He wouldn't be back, he'd be remanded, tried, sentenced and back inside.

We could take the freedom of perpetrators or we could continue to threaten and punish the victims of violence. We've tried punishing the victims and it hasn't worked, so let's try removing perpetrators entirely from the picture and be damned their "rights" of access.

FloreanFortescue · 17/08/2020 21:58

I think the answer is actually because of questions like this. Misogyny is so deep rooted in this country that abused women probably fear they won't be believed and they'd have to crawl back to the cunt of a man they've no choice but to depend on.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 21:58

Say we got the law changed so that no man who'd assaulted his partner could continue to live with or be within a certain distance of her and their kids ..... Do you "take him away" and you ban him from going to her home/anywhere near her or their kids .... But you find out through some other source (because it won't be via the victim until he's violent again or she decides to leave X no of weeks or months down the line) that he's back in her home with her agreement. This is a very likely scenario, with an average of seven attempts to leave in a DV situation, and in this case 100 plus calls to the police and him serving time for assaults in her.

What do you do then?

How do you enforce it?

How do you "make" her realise the situation she's in or not have contact with him, if she won't do counselling or dies it but still takes him back?

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 22:02

He wouldn't be back, he'd be remanded, tried, sentenced and back inside.

How long for?

For breaking the edict not to go near her or his kids again (with her permission/agreement)?

Sentences for the most heinous crimes in our society are ridiculous; so how long are they going to jail someone fir the above for, before he's back out again (a d he's in her home with her agreement again)?

Come on, you know is this isn't hanging together.

PicsInRed · 17/08/2020 22:14

Do you "take him away" and you ban him from going to her home/anywhere near her or their kids
Yes.

But you find out through some other source ... that he's back in her home with her agreement.
He is breaching the non-contact. He is arrested.

What do you do then?
He is tried.

How do you enforce it?
Prison.

How do you "make" her realise the situation she's in or not have contact with him, if she won't do counselling or dies it but still takes him back

A small minority may never realise, but those perpetrators wont be free to brutalise the family - and continue the cycle of violence into another generation. Isn't that a great outcome?

We presently threaten and punish women (and their kids), it's time we punish the bashers instead.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 22:15

So police, already stretched, are going to rely on who? - family members (they may not know he's in contact with her or in her home, the couple would probably hide it in the above scenario) .. neighbours (they may not know or care, the couple may move to get away from people who know him in the above scenario), stretched social workers to call every hour of the day and night to catch him there again (not feasible) ... To report him as being around her or in her home, then arrest him he'd prob be gone by the time they got there if they had the southeast heads up), try him, sentence him to jail time (for how long) on repeat, on an ongoing basis ....

Sorry I'm not trying to be argumentative for the sake of it .. I just can't see how it would work.

And for potentially tens of thousands of men/couples.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 22:17

*slightest heads-up

PicsInRed · 17/08/2020 22:18

Come on, you know is this isn't hanging together.

What's your solution - one which doesn't put the responsibly for male violence onto women?

chickenyhead · 17/08/2020 22:19

What you are describing is not every DV. I have met many many victims, all desperately wanted to get away. The support was not there.

Women as a rule dont want him back. The truth is that he won't stop and nobody will help you to force him to stop.

It is clear that you blame victims. Good luck to you.

PicsInRed · 17/08/2020 22:20

And for potentially tens of thousands of men/couples.

I concede it would be rather inconvenient for men - well, the abusive ones. I can live with that.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 22:20

The main issue is that the women in the scenario often continue the relationship and would therefore have no reason to make the police aware that he is breaking the order to stay away from her (and any kids) ... Until he assaults them again down the line, which could be months or even years.
In fact they'd hide it.

chickenyhead · 17/08/2020 22:21

not true

Bubbletrouble43 · 17/08/2020 22:23

Haven't read rtft sorry, I'm tired. But fucks sake. To the posters saying " there is help available in the UK" you are so fucking naive and have obviously never had to access these services. I've had to press charges ( attempted murder downgraded to common assault) against an ex, almost 20 years ago and the agencies whilst sometimes meaning well were incompetent and I did not feel safe. Court orders and restraining orders were broken by him with no consequence whatsoever and he didn't even serve time. The man tried to kill me, and came close to doing so. No prison. A ten month ordeal for me and 4 yo dd hiding out at a families house leading up to the court case where I was completely unprotected and he was stalking me. The police were worse than useless. I was pregnant when the abuse escalated. Op fuck off with the victim blaming.

Fightingback16 · 17/08/2020 22:25

They could do a hell of a lot more then they are doing. Some victims may for whatever reason be beyond being able to save themselves, they become completely brainwashed. I’m sure many others would be relieved if there was the guarantee there abusers would be far away. Where they would go though and the amount of abusers would be massive. There needs to be a deterrent, they need to reduce the cycles.

GilbertMarkham · 17/08/2020 22:25

What's your solution - one which doesn't put the responsibly for male violence onto women?

My point is your "solution" is unworkable, unfeasible, impractical ....

It depends on the violent men being reported every time they go within a certain distance of the woman; and they wouldn't be. Because women conmonly take multiple attempts to end a dv relationship, and it continues even after assaults that the police be able aware of.
In this case he had done at least one prison sentence for assaulting her, bur she continues the relationship. That statement is without blame on the woman .. it is just fact.

Bubbletrouble43 · 17/08/2020 22:25

Thankyou chickenyhead you have posted sensibly.

amieejust · 17/08/2020 22:26

Because there is nowhere to go, only the streets. You have no support, no money, no job, no family or friends who can help. Nowhere/no-one to keep your beloved pets safe if you leave.
Refuge space hard to come by and even then only temporary, especially if no DC involved.

Even if you could leave, he's always home anyway and moving out while he's there would be impossible.

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