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Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

He doesn't like talking on the phone?

134 replies

SadSausage44 · 12/04/2020 23:02

Hi everyone any opinions/input please?

I'm currently in lockdown a couple of hundred miles away from a man I've been dating for approximately 6 months. Met on tinder and have fallen head over heels for each other. He has 3 children with his ex so we were seeing each other every other weekend and a day or so during the week. My daughter is grown and doing her own thing.
His kids/ex don't know about me yet, which is fine by me, he always said it would be at least 6 months before he even thought about introducing a new partner to his children, so meeting the children was something that would probably have been begun to be discussed around now if the bloody virus hadn't happened.

Anyway, from the start, he's never been one for talking on the phone. Lots of texts, but general chit chat, calling and chatting on the phone, from the start, never really happened. That was fine with me because we were seeing each other regularly.
So, because of his childcare arrangements and social distancing and then me coming to my family home a few weeks ago as I couldn't cope with lockdown on my own, I haven't seen him for about a month now.

I have spoken to him twice in over 2 weeks, once at my instigation as in I said 'fancy a chat later babes' which was fine and then about a week later I just called him as I knew he was home alone, not with kids etc.
He was a bit off on the phone, I didn't realise he'd just made his dinner and had been on phone all day for work. I texted him after a slightly awkward call saying hey, felt a bit awkward, don't want to feel like I'm hassling you,but I did, we haven't spoken for 6 days, if you'd rather not chat on the phone because you're tired etc just let me know.
His job at the mo consists of talking on the phone all day every day, so I get it if he doesn't want to chat all the time but.... not at all?
I will usually wake up to a lovely good morning text and the text throughout the day, lots and lots of serious sexting, chat, zero calls.
I miss his voice, he knows I'd like to chat more. I'm certainly not going to demand he calls me if he doesn't want to.
Does anyone have experience of being with someone who is massively affectionate and lovely in person but just shit on the phone?
I feel like we need to hear each other's voices occasionally to get through being apart from each other for so long.
I have to add he's my first relationship after a 15 year marriage breakdown where exhtb cheated on me and blew my whole world apart a year ago so I'm perhaps a bit over sensitive and I'm definitely a bit scared of getting hurt again.
Thanks for reading everyone, I'd love to know what people think!!!

OP posts:
SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 10:59

I'm going to open up to friends about it, not him right now. It is definitely something I will talk to him about when we are together though.
He's in super positive mode at the mo, I think that's his way of dealing with what is going on!
Thanks so much for everyone's input, I really appreciate it.

OP posts:
toucancancan · 14/04/2020 12:10

Hi SadSausage, your post could have been written by me. It's a relief to read the thread and see the responses, as have exactly the same situation here. I feel my friends are getting me through this lockdown and I have one or two video chats a week with them. BF although suggesting we have a video date just will not commit to it. We haven't seen each other in over four weeks and I'm worried when this is over his lack of emotional contact during this time and that I don't feel he is being a particularly great support, will be damaging long term. We have never spoken on the phone unless its to arrange a practical thing, or last minute plans change, but we do message several times a day. Last Thursday I messaged to say I was struggling and finding the lockdown and lack of human contact hard and for the third time suggested us meeting on FaceTime over the weekend, and again he fobbed me off. I've told him I'm missing him, I don't understand how he just doesn't seem to be there when I need him most. I like him and he likes me because we give each other a lot of space, are not all lovey dovey and soppy, and are both very independent. However, he is very emotionally self sufficient and happy to be on his own isolated, while I'm more of an extrovert and am really finding this tough.

toucancancan · 14/04/2020 12:16

My friend's advice was to take strength from all the good things we have and that he usually sends through daily photos and updates, and that is our usual way of communication so nothing has changed there. To hold on to the good aspects. This is only a temporary situation, being made worse by lack of control over anything at the moment, so your feelings are heightened. I did ask him why he didn't want to chat virtually or on the phone and he said it was because he just wasn't a phone person, never had been and he wasn't in touch with any friends or talking to anyone as he was very happy in total isolation.

Cocobean30 · 14/04/2020 12:26

To be fair I hate talking extensively on the phone, when I worked in a call centre it completely drained me and I didn’t want to speak to anyone when I got home! Is he introverted generally?

billy1966 · 14/04/2020 12:45

I do understand that some people don't like the phone and I think that is fine.

What I wouldn't accept is that during a difficult and stressful time, his not liking it is final and he is utterly uncompromising in his position.

OP, you are not asking for a daily one hour chat, you are just asking for a short call to catch up...

And he can't do that...

He is showing who he is.

OP, you are being made to feel very needy by him.
It's all on his terms.

You are correct...he has laid out his terms very clearly.

I certainly wouldn't be impressed and would be very very wary of him.

What you ha e asked is very small in the scheme of things....yet he has blankly refused.

Protect yourself....he sounds selfish.

When things are difficult and challenging is when you learn the most about yourself and those around you.

His unwillingness to bend on this issue would give me the ick.

You deserve betterFlowers

toucancancan · 14/04/2020 13:25

Billy, you're right, with the 'you are being made to feel needy'. (whether or not that is intentional) And then, Sausage, do you feel guilty for having this need? And feel guilty for having to point it out? That's how I feel.

SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 13:44

I feel really guilty and really needy and Ionow one of the things he loves about me is my independence and non neediness!!
I'm a bit pissed off with him actually and think it's a bit arrogant of him to think we can get through a couple of months without a quick facetime or chat.
He knows I adore him, perhaps he just doesn't feel he has to make the effort as ... well, what can I do?! I'm a bit worried this could do some lasting damage.
The ironic thing is my ex who left me for the OW and blew my world apart last year is utterly desperate to talk to me and I'm having to say no, leave me alone! Head fuck!!!

OP posts:
Cocobean30 · 14/04/2020 13:46

I don’t blame you for feeling the way you do. 6 months in is still quite a sensitive time and I understand your worries about drifting apart. He needs to make an effort to chat on the phone on his part, what do you want to do if he won’t?

billy1966 · 14/04/2020 13:54

OP, he's got you right boxed in hasn't he...he loves you independence .....better not show any weakness cos it'll put him off...

Hence you have to not even show a very natural inclination to want to connect.

OP, if his behaviour did fly a red flag or a niggle with you I would be wondering why.

I would not place trust nor my future in someone so dictatorial and unwieldy....

SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 13:59

I don't know what I'll do tbh. I really don't want to split up with someone I have otherwise had a fab time with!
I think he is very very different to me, which isn't usually a problem but I'm so scarred from my life experience I sadly revert to the negative, as in it's me, I've done something wrong, something is wrong, not, he's just a bit shit on the phone, we never really spoke on the phone pre lockdown and speaking on the phone to me doesn't help him with missing me so that's why he's not doing it..... I think he'd rather just crack on, best foot forward, not wallow, stay positive blah blah.
It is ringing massive alarm bells in my head, combined with some other avoidant behaviour I have experienced aaargh. Ffs.

OP posts:
toucancancan · 14/04/2020 14:00

Just how I feel Sausage about him not wanting to chat, although he said he would after his son has gone back to his ex's this week. His lack of understanding that I really need support has made me needy and anxious. And I am never like that. Quite the opposite infact. I feel pissed off with him too and am not getting in contact with him at all as I just can't bring myself to reach out. Have you thought about what you can do to get through the next few weeks feeling like this? One thing I'm concious of is not throwing away what has been great for the last nine months, over a temporary situation and his reaction to it. And if our partners are feeling fine/happy/aloof to our feelings then it isn't intentional just a case of lack of thoughtfulness and appreciating how it is making us feel.

SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 14:02

Some avoidant behaviour from him I mean. As in everytime I've invited him to join me going away or a social event, if he couldn't go because he had his kids or whatever he would just completely ignore the invite... wouldn't mention it again. A couple of times he said he really wanted too but couldn't due to money or kids, but otherwise just complete silence so I kind of worked out if he goes quiet about something it's a no!

OP posts:
SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 14:06

Toucancan same here, I do not want to throw away 6 months over him being ahit on the phone. I just feel like he's in the driving seat and has control and like you, I'm feeling less and less inclined to reach out via text, but I also don't want to come across as having a strop!
He needs to work a little harder I think!!

OP posts:
SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 14:06

Shit on the phone not ahit... he's certainly not that Grin

OP posts:
billy1966 · 14/04/2020 14:08

Well not giving you an answer is just plain rude OP.
Not avoidance, just plain rudeness.

I think he is training you to have very low expectations of him, not to bother him, because he will just plain not respond or do what you ask.

The bar is actually sounding very very low for YOU in this relationship.

SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 14:12

Billy1966 yes you're right. Me asking to connect vocally occasionally is now making me feel like I'm being super demanding! I do feel boxed in now... He loves my independence but surely that doesn't mean I have to curb my need to chat occasionally. He knows I'm missing him, my daughter, my friends and that I'm going through a shitty divorce as well as the virus stress.
I think he's v stubborn and quite happy to have things all his way.
So frustrating not to be able to see him face to face to discuss and I absolutely cannot cope with the thought of having our first disagreement over the phone or text!

OP posts:
SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 14:15

Yes, training me not to expect too much. I don't know. He's so good in other ways. My ex did f all for me for years. The fact that my newish bf cooks for me, makes me cups of tea, is just generally nice to me is an absolute revelation after years of a shitty marriage.

OP posts:
billy1966 · 14/04/2020 14:19

Well you should focus on the realisation that he is very stubborn and likes things his own way.

That is very clear.

Sorry OP, I don't think he is actually the prize you think he is.

He avoids bothering his arse to saying no by just not even giving you courtesy of an answer.

He's really not that big a prize.

A d because he has said he doesn't like the phone before...now with a world wide pandemic and a lockdown...he remains completely unmoved by your request and immovable in his determination not to give an inch on the subject.

Na...not a prize...sounds like a right selfish twat.

I'd show him exactly how independent you are and give him loads of space by no longer replying to him.

Twat.

toucancancan · 14/04/2020 14:20

Yeah, I feel the boxed in thing is right just now. It sounds like we are out of our comfort zones and they are in theirs with them being introvert. It is important to keep a balanced view, as us feeling stressed out, anxious etc means any small thing is amplified and each worry has a domino effect. I am putting together a simple message to explain how I feel, so that I can take the time over what I want to say, would that help you to carefully put your words together and then you have time to reflect on just what you want to say?

toucancancan · 14/04/2020 14:27

Meant to say, in this climate it's easy to lose rational thought, so it would be wrong to make any big decisions but I worry that waiting until this is over is too far away to simply state that you aren't yourself and need more support.

SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 14:28

I won't bother telling him again. I've just spent several years trying to teach a man, my exhtb how to have a reciprocal relationship and it exhausted me. I'm not doing that again.
He will reach out if he's bothered, I'm definitely not texting him half as much as I was. He can put in a bit more work. If he doesnt and it goes to shit it will just show me that I was doing a lot more work to keep things going than him. And that I cannot be arsed with.

OP posts:
billy1966 · 14/04/2020 15:07

Good for you OP.

Well done for seeing a pattern you had and not repeating it.

I think you are much much strong than even you realise.

He's really not any great prize.

I think you are.

Stubborn people are actually very dull and one dimensional.

They think a bit too much of themselves.....as if its great to be utterly implacable.....its not...stubborn people are actually a bit dim....can't understand any other body's point of you, other than their own.

Dull
and
DIM

Flowers
SadSausage44 · 14/04/2020 15:45
Grin
OP posts:
IntrovertBnReady4Lockdown4Ages · 14/04/2020 15:47

I think it's all very well and good, and makes us feel better to rationalise someone as the "bad guy", 'has issues and hey, while we're at it, that person is a monster too' just so we don't feel like shit about the situation.

I see nothing here that you've written to make him whatever is being insinuated that he is. Your earlier defence of him seems to be going out the window one post at a time, understandably so you feel better about this situation.

Whatever makes you feel great...but hey, you're not a bad person, he's not a bad person. You have some differences and those differences are a big deal FOR YOU (as you're having to find out - how else do we get to know if something will work or not?) and doesn't seem like something you can handle. Someone else could find this particular quality exactly what they need in a man and understand his "avoidance" as perhaps being a bit cowardly and not wanting to hurt your feelings or something.

There's a reason why people can't seem to say No to someone's face or directly. It happens. It doesn't make them terrible.

So let's refrain from the usual "I wish I could change someone so they fit me better, I wish they would change for me or do what I want them to do, otherwise, I'll say they have issues and are selfish" trope and just call a spade a spade.

What do you do when something isnt working for you? That's what your question should be now. It sounds like you don't want to let go..understandable. You've invested some time and you have history that you still probably need to heal from.

But dont hold on to what isn't working till you find a way to justify it (in this case, making him out to be everything but himself).

One could see it the other way easily. One could say you are this or that just for being the sociable, extrovert person you are who NEEDS social contact, chat on the phone, etc. No, as usual that is "normal" and everything else is weird, strange, something to be wary of. SMH

You've mentioned letting him make the effort. That's a great plan. I remember writing this earlier to you. Just step back, if he really wants to, he will push himself to 'come to you' and meet you at the point you are. That's his prerogative though. Not doing so doesnt make him a bad person. It just means he's who he is and he's showing it to you. You're who you are and showing it to him. If THAT doesn't work for you, save yourself the story rehashing and move on.

It's not easy to just move on, I know but making it what it isn't, especially knowing this is a typical reaction to introverts/introversion, just pisses me right off.

TDLR: There's nought wrong with him. Theres nothing wrong wih you either. You both are different. What you see now and what you saw pre COVID is all him. Does all of him work for you or not ? That's the question.

IntrovertBnReady4Lockdown4Ages · 14/04/2020 15:56

Or you can step right up and have a serious conversation about how you feel. Not that you miss him, not that you would like to hear his voice....but that you're feeling overlooked/avoided, etc and you're wondering why he isn't direct with you about somethings like making plans, or social events, etc. You know...get to know him deeper and why he does what he does (That's what social butterflies AREN'T great at). You may be surprised, he will open up and you both will get to a new level of closeness just by being open, vulnerable and sharing your misgivings, explanations and understanding in a caring, non-confrontational way with each other.

See what happens there, then you can re-evaluate. Don't be afraid to rock the boat just because "he's in a positive mood". You don't want to spend your time with him walking on eggshells. Having a "talk" doesnt have to be negative and if anything, it's right up introverts' street to have deeper, more meaningful conversations than just "hearing your voice" or "seeing your face". Small talk isn't their strong suit.

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