Help me process my anger with my mother, is a somewhat Brexit related story

[mediumsize]

I am NC for this. I am just really angry and wanted to put this out there. Not sure how it will help but maybe just to vent.

Basic story is about two families:

1. My husband and I are British (but both grew up in another country) and absolutely avid Europhiles, and I have been very active in the anti-Brexit, pro-EU campaign since the referendum. All the marches, volunteering etc etc. Then Brexit actually happened, which I really did not think it would, and it has impacted us hard emotionally and, in the future, given that we have property and business interests in the EU, potentially financially. There are also other family, and in my case, strong ideological reasons for being gutted at leaving the EU.

1. My parents are elderly (late 70s) and have always been completely irresponsible with money. They do not live in Britain. They have no pension, no policies of any kind, no property and no income other than my father's small business, which he continues to run even though he is nearly 80. This is going to have to stop some time soon and he is also in quite poor health. I support them financially to quite a large degree. If my father dies my mother essentially is destitute (except not, of course, because I will be expected to support her. Oldest child, professional, good income in Britain etc).

So, my husband and I just, since Brexit Day, have decided to move (well, retire actually) to Ireland. We can get our EU passports back in 5 years, which means an enormous amount to me. We have however no ties whatsoever to Ireland, DH has never been there and I once went there for conference for three days twenty years ago, We have despite that made all the arrangements to do this. I have a pension lump sum due which will mean that, for the first time in my life since I left my first husband and he fleeced me for everything I had in return for my freedom, I will be able to buy a property (in the part of Ireland we are going to go to we can, we have never been able to afford a property in England).

So I phoned my mother tonight and told her of our plan. Her response was "well, that is a completely crazy idea". I had to bite my tongue so hard not to say no Mummy, what IS a completely crazy idea is to be nearly eighty with no assets or pension of any kind, with no plan whatsoever about what happens when Daddy cannot work any more or he dies.

I said nothing but feel so angry. I don't know why, this is not new ridiculousness from these people. When I left X country (where they live and where they grew up) for Britain in the 1980s, to further my career, my father told me "I don't know why you are leaving, you know you will just have to come back". I never did. Why am I so angry now?

You are angry because they are judging your choices when their choices have had a massive impact on you and presumably you don't tell them what you think but they do you for your new plan.

Your mother isn't taking her choices into consideration or comparison with yours she is approaching it from first principles. If you look at what you are doing it does seem at first glance to be quite unusual to move to a country your DH has never even been to and neither have you in recent times - honestly I think my mum would think it crazy also.

But I can completely see why you are feeling like this - your choices are having no impact on them and it's your decision to do what you are doing.

I mean....Brexit day was less than 2 weeks ago so it's not exactly a deeply thought out plan, is it?

It might appear unusual but it is not the first time I have done this, I moved to Britain at 25 having visited once before for a week, purely because I did not want to live under a fascist regime. I have made a success of my life here. My DH moved to Britain at 34 to be with me having spent only one night with me and never having been to Britain or even Europe in his life. We have been happily married for 15 years and brought up both his two children and the child we have together (well, he is ten, so we are still bringing him up). I hate this government, abhor Brexit and have the opportunity to retire and afford a property if I leave Britain. Oh, I have thought it out. I need to put my money where my mouth is. But that was not the point. The point was trying to understand my immense anger with my parents especially my mother, when they are just being true to what they have always been.

PS we also have property and residency elsewhere in the EU, and we were planning to retire there when our DS finished school, but that is all thrown into uncertainty by Brexit. It is not so Unusual, I would submit, to want to get back our EU citizenship.

No not a well thought out plan. Ireland does not have particularly low cost housing except in deprived or depressed areas. Plus, if you are going to make simplistic political conclusions, they have just voted for a nationalist party with paramilitary links. Even Boris and Farage fell short of that.

You should also consider the extent to which the prewar generation had opportunity to save for a pension and old age. Your parents are not boomers borne in a booming economy. The money they don’t have may have been spent on you.

I’m not surprised you’re angry, frustrated and hurt. It’s tough to be told your plan is crazy by someone who a) hasn’t exactly made wise life choices themselves and b) you’d hope would be unconditionally supportive, or at the very least tactful.

I think come over to the craicnet thread and find out more about Ireland there.
I think you can do what you like, it seems like you commit to change when you do it, so you are more likely to be successful.
My husband and I moved here from the UK, he would never move back now.

Oh it is a well thought out plan, we just had not shared it with my parents before. People retire to all kinds of places and we already have long had a plan to retire (partially at first, while our son is still at school) to another EU country where we have property and business interests. That is all complicated and made uncertain now by Brexit. We need our EU citizenship back. We know Ireland is not a crazy plan at all, that is not what I am posting about, the issue that I am so angry with my mother now when up until now I have just shelled out and supported my parents financially without comment. (They did spend money on my education, for sure, and I do feel indebted to them for that, but that was over thirty years ago and since then they have lived a very nice lifestyle. My mother has never worked a day in her life, they spend vast amounts (in their country's terms) on an expensive and completely useless hobby, they have servants etc).

PS they are not the prewar generation, they were born during the war. They don't live in Europe and they have had a very nice lifestyle their whole lives. But without my financial support they would not any more.

You can’t judge your parents and then get angry when they judge you back. Yes it does seem like a leap moving somewhere neither of you knows or has any connections. Your mother has a right to worry. Do you and DH have work there to go to?

They are lucky to have you - you have clearly facilitated their lifestyle for years. Ignore their opinions - you are adults who do not need parental approval to carry out your plans. Communicate your anger, if you can in a measured way and refuse to allow any more discourse about the matter perhaps?

It is a leap but it is OP’s right to leap. She has thus far done what works for her and her immediate family. Why shouldn’t she trust herself to continue to do so?

OP isn't asking if her decision is the right one - it is for her.

But to your mother OP, it looks crazy but that is her opinion and she is entitled to it - it seems she is ignoring the Brexit piece which seems to be the point rather than the moving in itself.

You cannot control her opinion and she isn't listening to you.

We don't need jobs there, DH is long retired and is our son's main carer. I am retiring from my salaried job and taking my pension, as I said, but I also have a business which i can run from anywhere as long as I am able to come to the UK for a few days each month. I may well be able also to do business in Ireland (which I can't do anywhere which is not English speaking) but I am not, initially at any rate, relying on that. It may look like a leap, but people retire to other countries all the time. Would you say the same if I was moving to the Costa del Sol? Why does Ireland seem so crazy/ill thought through? Please don't say the rain.

It was a leap when at 24 straight out of university and will no job I left the country where I grew up and came to the UK (where I had been born, but had only visited once since I was an infant). It was a leap when I left my first husband when I was 40, with no savings, and took nothing financially from the marriage, preferring to declare insolvency. It was a leap when I married my DH after knowing him for a couple of months. It was a leap when his children came to live with us and I agreed to bring them up. It was most certainly a leap when I had a baby at 46. All of these decisions were adversely commented on by my parents and I just roundly ignored the comments. So why I am so angry now? I think I know though, having thought about this for much of the night. I think far more now about how the time is coming when my parents will be completely dependent on me. It is coming soon. As I said they have no assets, pensions etc. And as I am heading into retirement, one which I have paid for by a career of very hard work, I am starting to really resent that. There is nothing I can do about it. But I need to stop feeling angry about it.

Just thinking, I have a friend/colleague who retired a few years ahead of me from the same organisation that I am retiring from. He and his partner retired to France. As far as am aware no-one had anything negative to say about that. Why the specifically anti-Irish attitude?

@Amara123, thanks, I will come to craicnet! I am just waiting to see exactly where in Ireland we are going to be moving to (depends on school place), and then I will be asking for advice for sure!

Why the specifically anti-Irish attitude?

I haven't seen any specifically anti-Irish attitude. Just general anti moving to a country you have no links to and hardly visited even, if at all, attitude.

I'm sorry but it does sound crazy to move somewhere (geographically close) without visiting? But that's your business. The situation with your parents sounds like it has been breeding resentment for years. Why exactly are you funding their lifestyle and servants but can't afford to buy a house for your own family?

There is no anti Irish sentiment. You are moving to Ireland because you want to have an EU passport. You reference the British brexit decision and house prices as reasons.

Ireland has just had an election. A nationalist party with a history of EU opposition did very well and may be in government. Plus they have a housing crisis just like the UK.

But honestly we don’t care if you move. You mother just cares about you. But you can be bitter about that if you want.

Oh I will visit Ireland, to look for property etc, once we know where we are going.

From the way read Irish politics, even after this election, they are not going to be leaving the EU. Well, I guess anything can happen, but we do know for sure that the only other country in the EU where I can speak the language is leaving for sure...

If I didnt pay my parents' medical insurance they would have been dead by now. If I don't finance their holidays (to come and see me) I would never see them. They will always choose their ridiculous hobby over those things. So that is a choice I made years ago for my own benefit really. I dont want them to die and I dont want to never see them...

I don't have personal links to Ireland. But I speak the language and can build up a business there. Is that the case for all the people who retire to France and Spain with no particular prior links to the country? I have not heard people telling them that is crazy...

Anyway, thanks everyone. By formulating my question and answering some of your questions I have figured out and processed things better, which is what I wanted.

It was not the decision to retire to the EU that I was querying, that still seems like a no-brainer to me, and not a particularly unusual one, either before or after the Brexit debacle. I know at least five families who are moving now or have already done so (not counting people from the UK who have already been living in other EU countries, including Ireland, for years...).

I was just trying to process my anger with my mother's (typical) reaction to my life decisions, which it out has nothing to do with my retirement plans, in reality.

Why can’t you move to the EU country where you have ‘property and business interests? You could apply for a passport there if you have business surely, people come from all over and manage to get U.K. passports? It seems weird to want to go to Eire when you know little about it have have only been on fleeting visits.

It seems your obsession about Brexit is clouding common sense

It seems weird to want to go to Eire when you know little about it have have only been on fleeting visits.

It is an easy option though as the OP has a British passport so will have no residency issues. That might not be the case post Brexit in other EU countries.

Your parents are not going to change. Unfortunately they still have the capacity to hurt and put you down. Of course it is frustrating and horrible but try not to let it affect you.

My husband is Irish and while I would not consider moving, maybe look at co Cork and the area around Bandon. Bandon grammar is a good school (fee paying but about £3k per year). The community is also fairly diverse. I have experienced anti English comments in Dublin, but never there. My own ancestors come from West Cork (Ballydehob/Skibereen) which has a lot of Europeans expats and is beautiful but more isolated.

Gosh, that's quite unusual, surely, that someone with no connections to, and has barely visited, Ireland "speaks the language". But no doubt your skills in Irish will go over well in the New Republican Dawn in Ireland.

Nothing at all against Ireland (though strange that you talk about refusing to live under a dictator but embrace the terror connections on Sinn Fein) which would personally be my own preference - but as you have properties and residence elsewhere in the UK, why aren't you moving there? Lack of language skills? (I note that you had a good sneer at British retirees to Europe more than once...)

And it's great that random moving countries on a whim has worked out multiple times - no doubt Ireland will too. Will you be able to afford to have your mother immigrate when she's left destitute by your father's death, as you predict? Or what's your plan then?

Anyway, I think your anger is clear, and it's about being thwarted, whether by Brexit or your parents, or both, so it might be worth getting some therapy. For the sake of your son, if not yourself.