Keeping some mystery in relationships

[ArtemisOfOrtygia]

It seems to me like the waters (amongst women) are very divided when it comes to "keeping some mystery" in relationships. Some women feel self-conscious about doing certain things in front of their partner, while other women think everything that's natural and normal shouldn't be hidden. I'm talking about things like farting and burping, going to the toilet, etc. in front of one's partner. I guess I'm just curious about both types of women...

To those that belong to the latter mentioned group:

• How have your partners (throughout life, not just current one) reacted to you doing these things in front of them?

• How do you find the confidence to do such intimate and, potentially, off-putting things in front of a partner?

To the women that belong to the first-mentioned group:

• What do you do when you have to stay in a hotel room with your partner, and you have to share an ensuite bathroom...and that's neither sound-proof, nor have any windows? Surely, it's not very romantic feeling to know your partner can hear you in the bathroom?

I'm asking because I always grew up learning that it's vulgar and unladylike to do certain things in front of people, and in front of men, particularly. I'm just unsure of how I'm supposed to cope with things (I deem to be) embarrassing in front of their partners. My fiancé wants us to live together, but I have told him I'd prefer it if we continue to live separately. When we go on holidays, I usually book an AirBnB that's big enough for the both of us to have some private space, or I book two separate rooms. But he finds it weird and unnecessary...

We’ve been married far too long to have any secrets. I’ve nursed him through ICU and he was with me when I gave birth and he helped me was and dress when I had a hip replacement. He’s also held my hair while I was sick. He used to say he fancied me when I had rollers in my hair and a bad cold.

Haha there are literally dozens of pieces of research to back this up....I'll find some.
Why don't you also provide evidence to back up your claim?

Op, you asked views, you’re getting them and now you’re being quite snipey to those who disagree with you
I didn't ask for views about getting counselling, the status of my relationship and the concept of lady-like. I asked about what people do about feeling confident or embarrassed about doing certain things in front of their partners. I don't think I'm being snipey, I'm just responding to the comments that address things I didn't ask for views about.

There's a happy medium. I close the door to use the loo.

@ArtemisOfOrtygia who defines what is and is not "lady-like"? Why does this differ based on the culture of what you are part of?

Because society constructs its own ideals of what a person should do - historically it is women who are expected to act in a specific manner.

Therefore the term "lady-like" and what it entails is absolutely a social construct.

Haha there are literally dozens of pieces of research to back this up....I'll find some.
Why don't you also provide evidence to back up your claim?
Because I'm not the one saying "lady-like is DEFINITELY, ABSOLUTELY not constructed". The other posters claimed that their view is an absolute fact, that's why I asked for science that back up this so-called fact. I emphasised that my view on lady-like is only my personal opinion, I never said it was science.

I have a completely separate bedroom to my OH. It reminds me of when we were dating.

But gender appropriate behaviour is socially constructed - that is a fact ( and I say this as a sociologist)

Do you think girls and boys are born knowing how to behave in a way deemed suitable to their sex?

who defines what is and is not "lady-like"? Why does this differ based on the culture of what you are part of?
I believe we're born to find certain things natural and unnatural, and that what the different sexes find natural differs. I also believe that humans modify their natural instincts to fit society, not the other way around. Society is a social construct, human nature is not.

This will give you a basic overview of what socailisation is.....
link.springer.com/chapter/10.1007/0-387-36218-5_11

The articles I use with my students are behind a paywall unless you have a university account

OP you are being ridiculous. Why would women find pooing in secret or holding in farts any more or less natural than men?

I am honestly flummoxed.

But gender appropriate behaviour is socially constructed - that is a fact ( and I say this as a sociologist)
So if it's a fact, why is it so hard to provide reliable sources to back the fact up?

Do you think girls and boys are born knowing how to behave in a way deemed suitable to their sex?
Yes, I do. I have seen little boys that wouldn't know about life or society be cautious and protective of little girls, for instance. I believe the little boys instinctively feel this way towards little girls, and that the instinct only grow stronger with age.

The articles I use with my students are behind a paywall unless you have a university account
Thank you. I don't have access to the database from home, but I do from work. I'll have a look at it in the morning.

OP you are being ridiculous. Why would women find pooing in secret or holding in farts any more or less natural than men?
When did I say using the bathroom isn't natural for both sexes?

believe we're born to find certain things natural and unnatural, and that what the different sexes find natural differs. I also believe that humans modify their natural instincts to fit society, not the other way around. Society is a social construct, human nature is not.

Can you back these claims up?
We are not born to behave in a lady like manner - how do you explain how this differs between cultures and even socio-economic groups?
From an early age boys and girls are treated differently and given different messages. Girls are rewarded for feminine behaviour and punished for masculine behaviour. This continues into adolescence and adulthood.

"I'm asking because I always grew up learning that it's vulgar and unladylike to do certain things in front of people, and in front of men, particularly"

You have literally stated in your OP that you were taught this by your family (your particular society) not that you resorted to human nature which told you that perfectly natural body functions are unnatural for those with a vagina.

Interesting first post by the way! 🙄🤔

So if it's a fact, why is it so hard to provide reliable sources to back the fact up?
It's really not. Just go on google scholar

I have seen little boys that wouldn't know about life or society be cautious and protective of little girls, for instance. I believe the little boys instinctively feel this way towards little girls, and that the instinct only grow stronger with age

All explained by socialisation. These messages come from a number of sources....fairly tales, TV, language used to describe appropriate behaviour.

yeah, wait until you are giving birth in front of him
I personally don't intend on doing that, actually

Sorry, but you really do have bodily function issues!

I don't have access to the database from home, but I do from work.

I suspect you don't have access to anything .....database lol

How long have you dated your fiance? Why don’t you want to live together? Your OP refers to your preference for privacy, which if a key reason would be unusual.

Can you back these claims up?
It's not a claim, it's a personal opinion. I don't claim my opinions are fact, I claim they are my personal beliefs.

We are not born to behave in a lady like manner
I don't share this opinion.

how do you explain how this differs between cultures and even socio-economic groups?
As I mentioned, society is a construct, and humans modify their natural instincts to fit into society. I believe societies are constructed based on things like environmental conditions, among other things. Since we all come from different climates, we create different societies, and adjust ourselves to fit into different societies.

From an early age boys and girls are treated differently and given different messages
Because boys and girls are different.

Ah, you seem to have some unusual views about sex differences! Are you a US religious type?

Oh I see.

It's one of those threads.

Enjoy!

You have literally stated in your OP that you were taught this by your family
Yes, this particular thing. Other things that are considered to be lady-like, I wasn't taught, but naturally feel drawn to anyway.

You do know that attitudes like yours harm women in society? They play into the patriarchy and put women at a disadvantage across many arenas of society.

It's so depressing.
I hope you're a troll