How much does a man who exploits a vulnerable woman know what he's doing?

[Interestedwoman]

Silly question really I suppose!

I'm still reeling from the impact of my previous thread www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3800172-Is-it-ok-for-a-lover-to-ask-repeatedly-for-sex-acts-he-knows-you-dont-want

I don't want to reach the conclusions I'm reaching.....

This is a highly qualified therapist (not mine!) at the height of his professional development.

Before we started a sexual relationship I said 'I have bipolar, I've gone into hypomania, and it's effecting my libido.' This was kind of an aside comment. I didn't realise the implications of this myself at the time, I was just ridiculously horny lol (out of character- changes in mood and behaviour.)

He claims that as it's not his exact field, he didn't know what this means in terms of consent etc. He has a PhD in therapy and stuff from a reputable university. Amongst other books, there's a book called 'Psychiatric Diagnoses' on his bookcase , and a copy of the DSM.

I think I'm starting to struggle......

He claims he asked if I was ok with everything we did that summer before we did it (which he did.) I've said 'I don't have any regrets.' He said 'there you are then.' But still

So

1. A bloke who's a therapist and self-confessedly a bit of a narc thought he had such a depth perception of the human will that he could establish consent for individual acts each time from someone, despite them being hypomanic.

or
2) A bloke decides to milk a woman's mental state for all it's worth for several months.

or

3. He's just an innocent bloke, acting like a bloke

or -any other ideas you may have? --

He claims he's not a therapist 24/7, when he's off work he's basically 'just a bloke.' But you don't forget everything you know, do you? :/ This is basic stuff. He'll even have done courses on consent etc, as part of his safeguarding training, he would've been taught that people when in the throes of a hypomanic episode of bipolar or other severe mental illnesses can't consent.

This is like, GCSE psychology or whatever stuff, amirite? Or even, a friend said to me, is well known by a lot of people as it's in popular culture- TV programmes such as Peep Show or Homeland show the effect of bipolar/severe mental health episodes on libido.

'Narcboy' even patronisingly happens to have lent me a basic book on psychology a while back -this is a basic book and stuff about bipolar is in there.

I had a complete wanker of an ex and even he wouldn't do some things at one point because I was hyper! He had no qualifications in it, just general knowledge of mental health and consent.

I need help. Think I'm gonna have to call someone tomorrow- my previous therapist or someone. Not seeing my current one till next Wednesday.

Hang on, I’m confused. Is your boyfriend your therapist or does your boyfriend just happen to be a therapist?

I'd mostly go for 2. I don't think that a narcissist can be a competent therapist, they don't seem to have the appropriate mental wiring. Sorry :(

If someone says they are a narcissist that's all the red flags you should need to be running for the hills! He is a mindfucking arsewomble, get your skates on and boost outa there.

@AllTheWhoresOfMalta He just happens to work as a therapist (not mine.)

@Pinkbonbon Wouldn't it be unlikely that a true narc would admit they're a narc? He claims he cultivated narc traits to help him feel better about himself.

I read your previous thread, I thought it was a 2 before you asked if I thought it was a 2.

But the fact you are thinking in those terms is really positive. I really hope you continue to heal from this OP.

@LonnyVonnyWilsonFrickett Thanks. I need help lol. Am meant to be seeing him tomorrow morning but I can't bring myself to go. Going to have some time off from him at the very least- don't really know how things can ever be resolved between us in a way that we could be friends. Maybe if he said he was really sorry he effectively raped me for several months or something.

I want to see some sort of therapist and them to say to me effectively, 'yes, you're right, bloke's a cunt.' :) When I see the psychologist next week I think she'll agree. If any were to tell me I was wrong at this point I'd be kind of disappointed.

As it's so clear to me now, that was wrong- really wrong.

a true narc usually admits it with a sense of pride. Why wouldn't he? Everything about a narc is wonderful.

2 a predatory narcissist who manipulates and exploits people.

He seems to use a lot of word salad and gaslighting

I think he uses his qualifications to make himself appear safer and more knowledgable.

A woman might start to doubt themselves because after all he's a trained therapist and he knows better and surely a trained therapist would know not to hurt people.

2 Even if he didn't have a psychology background, surely you telling him about the bipolar libido effects would be enough for anybody decent to think OK this is Interested's telling me she's vulnerable because of MH and not totally hot for me.

The fact he is a therapist makes it awful behavior, he should've refused to get involved sexually. I think he probably went into that field of work because he's a bit of a manipulative fucker.

I want to see some sort of therapist and them to say to me effectively, 'yes, you're right, bloke's a cunt.'
I can see why you'd want a professional to tell you that, but don't forget your view is the opinion that matters here.

There might be issues to address if therapists have a regulator?? Perhaps seeing another therapist might shed some light?

If he's a grown man he knows alright. He couldn't not know. He just enjoys being a bully.

I couldn't live with someone like that, neither should you.

you telling him about the bipolar libido effects would be enough for anybody decent to think OK this is Interested's telling me she's vulnerable because of MH and not totally hot for me.

Which is what any decent man would think. He's not a decent man.

Thankfully the height of it was about 18 months ago. I've been well in myself for quite a while now, so things have gradually tapered down.

Still a weird thought, though.

I think these types of men have a terrible instinct for homing in on vulnerable women.

I remember your other thread, his manipulation of you is quite shocking. I meant to ask on your other thread; he didn't try to spin you a line about all the risky sex stuff being gestalt therapy by any chance?

I'm glad you've taken a step back from this man, hopefully you'll break into a run soon! (I picked option 2)

Wouldn't it be unlikely that a true narc would admit they're a narc?

www.livescience.com/amp/47197-narcissists-admit-to-it.html

Your therapist already told you it was exploitative.

You know it was.

You've repeatedly described conversations with him that are Manipulation 101.

He's not a good man.

You even say yourself that a "just a bloke" complete wanker of an ex wouldn't have done what this guy did.

Stop giving him a pass: he's a non-friend whose main benefit appears to be playing pokemon twattily.

I remember your other thread and I'm so glad you're distancing yourself from this man.

His justification that he is "just a bloke" when he isn't at work is so ridiculous - on the one hand, he expects you to defer to his opinion on everything (including how you ought to feel) because he is so clever and a trained therapist, and then as soon as it suits him, he's "just a bloke" who can't be expected to realise that a partner having a manic episode might be vulnerable to exploitation.

How deliberate is his behaviour? Usually I would say that manipulation does not have to be part of a thought-out plan to qualify as deliberate, but in his case, I think it is . He targeted you at the beginning (using a lie about "research" as I recall) and has persistently ground down your boundaries to get what he wants. His response to you taking sex off the table was so predictable and unkind that I don't think you need to worry that this is somehow all him being "just a bloke".

'. I meant to ask on your other thread; he didn't try to spin you a line about all the risky sex stuff being gestalt therapy by any chance?'

@SpamChaudFroid No lol, but I can well imagine one of these types might say that.

' he's a non-friend whose main benefit appears to be playing pokemon twattily.'

@category12 lol!

@FineWordsForAPorcupine Thanks for your considered response.

I just blocked him on my phone.

I don't know if all bullies have a fully conscious understanding of their behaviour. I think if someone is a trained therapist, they should have far more understanding and self awareness - he's certainly not just an innocent bloke acting like a bloke.

Wouldn't it be unlikely that a true narc would admit they're a narc?

No. It's actually a really common warning sign early on that you are dealing with a narcissist if they say 'I am a narcissist' or 'my ex says im a narcissist' or 'i'm a bad person' ect…

Narcissists don't see anything shameful about being a narcissist so they have no problem saying it. It's also often said to test you and see if you will reply 'oh don't be silly, no you aren't' so that they then know they have you fooled.

And I've heard three separate narcissists each say one of those things. Well, tbf looking back on it, the 'I'm a bad person' guy might have been a borderline personality disorder case. But actually he was the worst funnily enough.

I'd say more than half of them will straight up tell you what they are really early on. Like within the first few weeks/months. In some way or another. It could also be like 'I treat women badly' or a more round about thing that should get you thinking like 'all my exs are crazy'.

I haven't read your other thread but based on this one at the very least he doesn't appear to be 'ethical' presuming he has the relevant background knowledge about bi-polar. It sounds like he's saying when he's 'off-duty' the rules/guidelines don't apply, when in reality there's more reason to expect them to be adhered to, if you see what I mean.

If you think therapist always act in good faith then just check out the pages of complaints and findings on the BACP website.

Your relationship sounds exceptionally unsafe for you and abusive on his part. The fact that you want validation for your strong feelings displays that you’ve been taught to put faith in others rather than yourself. Trust yourself. Your feelings are valid.