DH has driven me to despair

[treacletree]

Hi everyone.

Long time lurker here. This morning I feel very bleak about my fairly new marriage and I desperately need someone to talk sense to me. Sorry because this is just word vomit and very long. I hop me it makes sense.

I guess I feel a bit like I’m going mad and I have no idea whether the problems are rooted in emotional issues I admit I have, or a fundamental incompatibility, or his issues, or all of those.. I guess I want to know if I am as much of a piece of shit as he makes me feel about 80% of the time. If so, then I want to change, I’m happy to change. The other 20% of our time is wonderful- affectionate, loving, full of jokes, adventures. But I just feel exhausted by the cycles we are in.

This morning he is being short with me over text (always a sure sign) and sat on the bed staring into space for about 45 mins while I rushed about getting my dd breakfast and ready for school, and showering and washing my hair. When I was out if the shower he stood there “checking me out”/trying to grope my bum as I got dressed and I said joking “dh I’m jsut trying to get ready here” (I feel very self conscious at the moment due to weight gain and skin flare up and i just wanted to get my clothes and makeup on without feeling looked at. Yes, I know maybe that’s weird- but jsut because he is dh doesn’t mean he gets to just leer when I’m not feeling it? Am I wrong? Anyway he accused me of being “nasty” and went off to sit on the bed. I then did all of dd breakfast, getting dressed, teeth and got myself ready, ended up rushing to work and being 5 mins late. Which has happened a lot lately- as I am there he tends to do very little now.

Extra Background: He used to be in charge of mornings but I changed my work hours to be there too- because regularly he would text or call me when I was already at work, saying dd (4.5) was being difficult and he “couldn’t” get her to get ready. Tactfully as possible I suggested that it would be nicer if we all went off together in the morning. In reality I changed my work hours (sacrificing an early finish) because it was incredibly stressful trying to do work in the morning knowing how incapable he was of getting him and dd out the door without getting cross and worked up. It caused a lot of fights so I now ensure everyone gets out the door in a better mood. With dd like a lot of things this amounts to strategies, praise, being firm but fair (she hates mornings.) He tends to just get cross and resort to threats of taking toys away, etc.

Anyway, he is now being off with me like I said. I apologised a couple of times, explained how I was feeling about myself and said I had never meant to be nasty. He just brushes this off like HE isn’t acting weird. I don’t really know what I’ve done so wrong. The only thing he has said to me today is that I need to split a hotel night with him for when me and dd came to visit him on his last work trip. I paid just under £300 for me and dd flights over, and he expensed that entire week except for the one hotel night (£100). I guess I thought that because I got the flights he would get the hotel night. Anyway, we are married. He also earns a third more than I do. It seems a little petty I suppose, and is definitely in the context of today’s “row”.

Anyway maybe that gives you a flavour of the type of situation we find ourselves in time and again. Generally it’s a misunderstanding that escalated into a full on row. Last week, when we were out as a family he made a comment about “when we move to the suburbs”. I turned around and (again trying to be jokey) was like “what? Since when are we moving to the suburbs?” He apparently thought I was pissed of and immediately accused me of spoiling the day. I was cross he would do this in front of dd (though he has before a lot) but explained that as he knows I never wanted to move to the suburbs of our city and I had jsut been surprised by what he said. He essentially got very angry and said I was trying to start an argument, it ended with him threatening to storm off and leave me and dd in this unfamiliar place. (He has also done this before, most memorably while we were on holiday in a foreign city I didnt know, when he had the keys to the hotel room.)

I try and try to talk to him about why we argue, why it escalates. It happens so much and I’m not playing down my role, it’s just that if I express a wish that he doesn’t like, or if I call him out on something, he gets really angry. Either I’m “nasty” or I’m “trying to start an argument as usual” or similar, and he goes to stonewalling. It makes me really upset. For a long time I imagined it was me being too emotional and I have been having weekly CBT counselling for the past 3 months (fitted around my busy job) to try and target emotional baggage I have. He previously said he would get counselling so he is better at emotional discussions, but he never has pursued this. I also try and send him articles on relationship conflict resolution if we have had a bad one and suggested we try and approach conflict better, but it’s always me initiating this.

Another thing that makes me uncomfortable recently is that he has accused me of being way too negative because I get “too angry” about issues that I care about which mainly revolve around child poverty and feminism. I do a bit of volunteering in these areas, read widely around them and sometimes I do get very passionate in saying my views. If I do, he will either not engage and will change the subject completely, or he will say he doesn’t think I should get too worked up because there’s nothing you can do. When that happens I feel lonely and wonder if I am actually an incredibly difficult person. We have always been quite different- I’m quite passionate and opinionated and he doesn’t take views on a lot of controversial topics, as in his family they never really talk about stuff like that. I never minded that he was this way, I guess I jsut now feel like it’s being used as a way to make me feel bad. Like I’m an angry, negative person. The other day I was talking about a rape case in the news and he just ignored all I said and when I asked what he thought he said he jsut didn’t see why I was getting so “angry”. But I wasn’t angry with anyone. I was just being me. I don’t know how not to be me, I’m in my thirties and I’ve never been made to feel wrong like this before.

Sometimes I feel like there’s no benefit to him being around. On a great day: he’s had enough sleep, had a good week at work, is excited about something coming up, maybe we had sex or something, DD is well behaved, I’ve made a plan for the day he is interested in. And then things are jsut so good. He’s engaged in the family, he’s joking and happy and doesn’t take things to heart, he’s lovely with dd. Our honeymoon was like this.
But then the reality is if most of these are not the case, he’s moody, unpredictable and easily irritated. I feel like the middle man trying to stop him and dd clashing. I begin to feel despondent then at some point I voice this and he gets quickly angry because I was “trying to start an argument again”. Jsut 2 weeks after our honeymoon a big row happened in this way.
On our worst days he has had me sobbing in public places while he refuses to forgive me or calm down from whatever it is. That hasn’t happened for a while. But it has happened more than once.

I know I am not perfect. I’ve had a string of failed relationships including dd’s Dad. I always put this down to me being difficult but through therapy I am a bit kinder to myself and can recognise I picked the wrong men since being a teenager shuttling between 2 EA households after a bad divorce. 2 of my 4 sex partners before dh sexually assaulted me and I never realised it for years after. When I met dh I had a young dd, had been a single mum and felt worthless. After about 6 months only he began to show unearned dominance around my house and my dd and it is a big regret that I didn’t shut him down. They do have a good relationship but to be honest I know their bond isn’t as strong as he thinks it is. Her bio dad has recently got back in contact and I have a feeling she will become more distant from dh if that relationship develops.

I also have a fear of having a child with dh. It makes me feel abnormal. When he is on a good day and being supportive he says all the right things- we will do what you want whenever you want, I’m here for you. But it’s not that I don’t want another child or that I think I couldnt even manage as a single mum, I know I can. It’s that I don’t want HIS child. I don’t know why. Ona very good day I think I do. But usually I just don’t.

Again though, is this just down to my emotional damage? I’m beginning to think that maybe I am not cut out for adult romantic relationships and I feel a strange sense of peace at that. I’ve never made them work. I’m married and I can’t make it work. I know he is not all bad but he can be a lot bad. So can I, but I don’t know if that means im all wrong. Maybe I’m just wrong with him. Or anyone.

If you got to the end, Thankyou. I have never voiced some of this stuff even to myself.

If you can share any wisdom or thoughts I would appreciate it a lot because I don’t think I can go on like this

OP, make a list. All the things he does/has done that make you feel like shit. Recall every tantrum, every day ruined, every time your heart broke for your DD. Read and reread it.

And never ever let him back into your heart or home again.

I say this having been through what you have.

You are fine. IT IS HIM.

This thread has helped me keep my resolve the last couple of days. As much as I want to think about his words, that he loves me and dd, I need to think about his actions— frequent moodiness, controlling mood swings, nasty remarks, being lazy and entitled and disrespectful. I keep thinking of him saying those unnecessary things to me in anger the other day- our marriage was a mistake, I’m terrible, he was “bummed out” to be married to me. Last night I messaged him telling him to go to his brothers for the rest of the week (he has been at a hotel- paid out of our joint wedding present savings without asking me.) I said I don’t want that money being used on a hotel when both his siblings live in our city. He was really trying to get me to let him back I think partly because he would be so embarrassed to tell his dB or dsis that I kicked him out, and why. He was saying he wanted to come back and help me feel reassured and show me he is serious about changing. That he has bought some books about how to be a better partner and stepdad and how to be “kinder in relationships”. I think he thought it would be easy to use this to get back. However it just rang so false. I felt manipulated because he didn’t want to speak to his family and let them know about what has happened. I also don’t believe he has bought these books or if he has he will not read them it’s just lip service. Also why didn’t he want to read them before?
So I said no, firmly, I need you to go to stay with dB or dsis and I don’t wish our wedding money to be spent on a hotel. I reminded him that I am still very hurt about what he said and that I can’t easily move on from it, and I wish him to give me space. When I said that his responses became a lot more curt.

I feel like I’m buying time while I get my head in order this week.Today I have made an action plan of the things related to money, the house and stuff I need to do. It really isn’t much. He contributed so little really.
I cannot see him as someone I love anymore. I’m sick of him. And his words just ring totally false.
Thankyou for all the support.

Well done. It sounds so hard. But every time he communicates it reminds you that he is not the person you thought he was. He’s trying to manipulate you. Its interesting isn’t it how he seems to have all the ideas now of things to say that might win you back? If he was a genuinely nice guy but had real emotional problems he probably wouldn’t be able to think of those things. Very easy to say ‘I’ve bought some books on how to be nicer’. Harder to actually face up to the fact that you have behaved terribly to your partner and actually need to change. He doesn’t want to change. He’s just saying whatever he thinks you need to hear to let him back. This is all about him. Don’t let him back for your own sanity and happiness! Well done!

It happens so much and I’m not playing down my role, it’s just that if I express a wish that he doesn’t like, or if I call him out on something, he gets really angry. Either I’m “nasty” or I’m “trying to start an argument as usual” or similar, and he goes to stonewalling. It makes me really upset. For a long time I imagined it was me being too emotional and I have been having weekly CBT counselling for the past 3 months (fitted around my busy job) to try and target emotional baggage I have. He previously said he would get counselling so he is better at emotional discussions, but he never has pursued this. I also try and send him articles on relationship conflict resolution if we have had a bad one and suggested we try and approach conflict better, but it’s always me initiating this.

This was me for years. I stayed married to exH for 19 years. I recently opened my eyes to his behaviour (in part thanks to counselling and also with the help of MN).

Yes, you will feel sad, yes you will miss him, you will keep on thinking it's you, you could have tried harder.

Please please please get hold of a copy of "the Verbally Abusive Relationship" by Patricia Evans.

I ready Lundy Bancroft but even so doubted myself about whether it was me or exH.

This book described my experience (and yours) exactly - verbal abuse is NOT just shouting or swearing (my EXH did neither of these) but it is constantly wrong-footing you and making you wonder what you have done and doubting yourself.

In the book they explain that the partners of these verbally abusive people are often optimistic, open, friendly, good listeners etc.

You sound like me in that you are a feminist but realising that your home life does not match up to your principles.

Please keep posting and stay strong, everyone here will help you and even if you are having doubts please post too - it's normal and we can keep you steady and focused.

Having a real panic right now that it’s all in my head. All me.
Why do I do this to myself, always doubting my own feelings. I’ve done it before in every relationship. I suddenly am panicking that I’ve made a mistake and need to apologise. I’n trying to do anything but text or act on these feelings.

Have you transferred half of the money into your own account yet?

Maybe you could use some of it for counselling.

I'm sure you would find the Freedom programme helpful too.

OP - you are doing the right thing. That sounds like a horrible way to live and a horrible environment in which to bring up a child.

That is not a good or normal relationship. It is abusive. You would be doing a huge disservice to your daughter to live with this man another minute - she has already witnessed too much.

Your life will be so much better without him. Good luck with everything.

Thing is it’s not always a horrible place to live. We often are affectionate, joke, chat, support each other with work stuff, we make plans (or I do anyway.) I guess it’s just that even when things are good like last Saturday, he’s on a hair trigger where if something upsets the mood and I don’t indulge him, he gets angry and sulks and ruins whatever it is. It seems like he has so much inner anger towards me I’ve said it a lot of times to him- do you actually like me? Are you angry? Do you want this? And he always acts like he doesn’t know what I’m talking about but his body language, facial expressions and conduct jsut show such a level of anger. I now sort of dread even nice plans we have together as it is so fragile. That’s so shit to say. I think maybe I just think that’s a normal way to live. I don’t know why. In some way I feel like I cannot be anything but alone as at least then it’s only about what I can control, my own moods or behaviour.

OP, he won't change. He is who he is. Maya Angelou said that if someone shows you who they are, believe them.

Also Google The Abuser's Script. He will beg, cry, berate you, blame you, beg forgiveness again, make you feel guilty, get angry and aggressive, threaten suicide, threaten to never see you again, threaten to force his way back into the house, threaten to tarnish your name, beg you not to tell anyone....all contradictory bollocks and tactics he will try to regain the status quo, because it SUITS HIM. If you give in, it will all go back to the way it was before after a few weeks. He cannot pretend to be a nice person for very long.

Stay strong. Do not cave. Do not believe him. Do not feel bad. Do not let him back.

OP I have lived with what you describe: a constant simmering undercurrent of negativity, anger and hatred creating a tension that was palpable. Only it was never towards anyone outside of our home. Always directed at me mainly, and the DC to some extent. It is exhausting, and miserable.

Why do they do it? To keep you in your place, which is to please and placate and serve them.

I guess it’s just that even when things are good like last Saturday, he’s on a hair trigger where if something upsets the mood and I don’t indulge him, he gets angry and sulks and ruins whatever it is. It seems like he has so much inner anger towards me I’ve said it a lot of times to him- do you actually like me? Are you angry? Do you want this? And he always acts like he doesn’t know what I’m talking about but his body language, facial expressions and conduct jsut show such a level of anger

I can totally relate to this too.

Despite the fact that I loved my exH and we had some really great times together, my life is so much calmer and simpler now and I hardly recognise myself without the sick edgy feeling in my stomach about how he is going to react.

I noticed recently that my life-long eczema has almost totally healed - every time we had a "difference of opinion" it would flare up.

Trust your instincts. This feeling of being on edge is probably familiar to you (it was to me from my family/upbringing) but you don't have to live like that.

Op, please look up Dr Ramani on YouTube.
She had a recent video on how "living with a narcisstic partner feels like a series of unconnected episodes"

This is the issue, he isn't bad all the time but even an alcoholic isn't drunk all the time.

If it's bad enough that it drives you to despair then that is enough. It doesn't mean you are weak it means you know your worth and you want better.

Often women wait for physical abuse or maybe an affair to say that is the line in the sand as its concrete but emotional abuse has very significant longterm impact on health. I also think women feel more capable to live solo and no longer believe they have to tolerate emotional abuse, in a way that previous generations had to tolerate.

I started a journal and looking back I could see that the trend was always downwards but there were good days, which is why I hung on. You will get there in your own time but be aware the longer it goes on the weaker you may feel so it takes longer to recovery.

That is the equation, the pain & despair vs the good days = damage to your emotional and physical health.
Only you know the percentages involved however

It is not all in yr head. The problem is that the same anaesthesia that gets you through this is preventing you from acting. I was stuck in this phase for years.

Trust your feelings OP. Being this confused and anxious is enough of a reason to leave.

You don't have to correctly label every single feeling and have it scaffolded by reasons other people would understand.

Just focus on the fact that you're walking on eggshells and confused.

Basically, are you happy? Are you relaxed?

It's only been a few days... absolutely normal to have wobbles. Another few weeks of no or minimal contact you will feel completely different x

OP,

You are moving back and forth emotionally between "fight and flight".

The "fight" part of you told him to leave and knows in your gut that he is a horrible man, who is awful 80% of the time and actually doesn't like you, despite what he says.

He's abusive and is making sure your DD grows up in a horrible hair trigger environment.

No words can convey the damage this leaves with a child for life.

The "flight" part of you is doubting yourself and tired, and is just wanting everything to be ok so that you don't have to face the hassle and effort of separating.

These are very normal emotions.

The thing is MN is full of posters advising you not to spent another 5,10,20 years like this until you finally leave.

Because leave you will.

He's a pig that is not going to change.

The question is, do you do it now or just prolong the pain for your child and yourself?.

Hold on to the dream of your child growing up in a happy, peaceful environment.

She does not need a father more than she needs a happy, peaceful home. Ever.

You are strong OP, stronger than you realise.
You can do this.
💐💐

@billy1966. That’s exactly how it feels. You describe it perfectly.
I had my brother round for a chat last night and he was really shocked at the things dh had said and when I explained previous experiences like that he was pretty shocked. My db is only 24, but he is more mature than dh who is in his thirties.

I do feel sad, but I also feel relieved, and the thought of him being back makes me incredibly anxious.

Also, dd has not asked for him. At all. Since Sunday when he left. It’s pretty striking she doesn’t care where he is.

I know that he thinks I’m not serious. I texted his brother yesterday to let him know in brief what would happened to ensure that someone else was aware of the situation. But last night his family chat was just full of drunken in jokes. Far from his claims that he was going to talk to his brother about what he was feeling, he was seemingly out for drinks with his brother, brothers girlfriend and their mate.
I don’t really care it just feels shitty that I’m still reeling and he’s having a sort of holiday in his head and then expects to come back and it all be as normal.
Thankyou so much for staying on this thread with me.

I recognize so much of what you are saying OP. When I was going through similar with my now ex it was like there were two versions of reality in my head, the one where I recognized how wrong things were and the one where I would minimize and think it was all in my head and it was my fault and he wasn't that bad. I would flit between the two and in so many ways the second one was much easier and stronger because it meant I did not have to face up to difficult truths, separating etc. it is a really hard thing and it keeps you trapped and going back but I would recommend talking more to people like your brother, other family and friends. You will find that when it's all out there you get real clarity on it and like your brother has those around you will also give their perspective, which is very strengthening.

I left my ex after two months of marriage btw, I know how hard it is and there have of course been times when I've second guessed myself since, but the peace and clarity only gets stronger with every day.

for you

@leomama81 yes, that’s exactly how I feel. Incredibly confused and torn between my two sides. But in my absolute gut as much as I miss the good side of him I know today that I cannot go back to the way things were. I feel anxious jsut thinking about it. I am currently deciding where to take my dd away this weekend so that dh can properly pack his stuff and realise that I am serious. I jsut can’t live with him anymore.
You are so brave for leaving after 2 months of marriage. I feel so embarrassed and a failure we have been married just under 4 months and I guess I would like to know how you handled it? It feels just so awful to contemplate telling people and also reconciling what was such an expensive and foolish mistake. We are still paying for our honeymoon.

It took 17 years for my marriage to reach this sort of stage of sniping, clashes, misunderstandings and unpleasantness. Then we divorced. You say you've not been together long - clearly only a year or two and it really should not be this hard so early. I've been with m my partner four years and I think we've had one row in that time. It'll only get worse. Find someone you can be opinionated and loud with and you can enjoy having some heated debates instead of getting told off!

@grumpiestcat we have been together for nearly 3.5 years - but yes, agree that’s not very long in the scheme of things

He was a bastard 80% of the time

You spent your life tiptoeing around him to facilitate him. You did all the housework and chores. You did everything for him. You even changed your working hours because he couldn't cope with your dd.

That's all you need to think about, really. It might help if you made a list of all the times he was awful to you - the times he left you somewhere, stonewalled, ruined a day, made you cry, threatened you, caused an argument...

This is meant to be your honeymoon period. This is who he is. He will not change. He's showing you his best side!!

I suggest you do the Freedom Programme before getting into another relationship.

[fllowers] for you

I have just emailed my local freedom programme to try and get a spot. I have already downloaded the work sheets but I think the group work would focus me as well. I am seeing my counsellor tomorrow. However I’m almost worried because tbh I have been keeping a lot of our relationship stuff from my counsellor (I know, stupid) and trying to focus on myself, my personal anxieties and my anxieties around being a mother etc. I am worried that in cbt tomorrow I will tell her what’s happened and she may try and get me to see from his perspective/see it in another way and that’s the last thing I want to do. I’m done doing that. I think I like cbt because it gives me a legitimacy for always turning situations round on myself and finding explanations when there really aren’t any.
Feel really anxious, nervous and also numb today. Like this isn’t happening to me, or it’s a bad dream. I feel calmer a lot of the time but also panicked a lot about being alone.

OP, being alone isn't lonely. It is peaceful and free. Embrace it. Enjoy the fun and harmony in your home now. Focus on how good you feel when he isn't there bringing you down, making you feel small and wrong and guilty. Freedom from this is priceless.

I totally understand about feeling embarrassed and a failure - I think fear of that was partly what made me go through with the marriage in the first place - i didn't want to be that girl that called off the wedding at the last minute etc.

What I would say is that people really won't see it like that. Once I told friends and family everyone was really supportive, nobody saw it as a failure, if anything people thought I was courageous for walking away from something that was making me really unhappy. And as it turned out most people had had concerns about my ex anyway, and once I started to actually talk about what had been going on my loved ones were nothing but encouraging about my decision. I also think that is how your counsellor will be btw, and if she isn't you should sack her as it's really not for her to convince you stay in something you are unhappy with!

The fear of how it will be is much worse than how it is in reality. I'm also still paying off debt from the wedding (which I almost completely paid for) and from the last year I was with him in which he was very financially abusive, but it's a small price to pay for peace and freedom!

I also agree with a PP that being alone is not lonely. It is bliss to be honest. For me, the change in not having emotional trauma, conflicts and tears all the time was such an immediate relief. And you have your daughter, and friends and family that love you.

I really like that Robin Williams saying about how he used to think the worst thing was to be alone, then he realized the worst was to be with people who make you feel alone.

Agree with @leomama81 being alone is bliss compared with being in an emotionally traumatic relationship.

Check your therapist has understanding of Domestic Abuse. If not, change the therapist