Dating thread 170: Know your worth

[Ginmel]

1. The first rule about the dating thread is don't talk about it with people you're dating.
2. Develop a thick skin.
3. Do not invest emotionally too soon.
4. It's all BS until it actually happens.
5. Trust your gut instinct.
6. People vanishing, lying & being generally weird is not your fault.
7. Know your worth.
8. If it's not fun, stop.
9. Loo update is mandatory.

10. No dating the thread. 11. Do unto others as you would have them do to you. 12. Any relationship you have that could get ruined by having a conversation about your feelings, standards and/or expectations wasn't really stable enough to begin with 13. The things you choose to ignore/tolerate now are the reasons you will break up in the future

Link to Info on Dating Websites & Apps www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3514717-List-of-Dating-Site-Info-Dating-Thread

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Optional: Please give your irons (potential dates you are talking to) nicknames like Mr Scottish. Initials are allowed (Mr S) when you are an item. 😘

ty @lifegoes

Its advice I have to give myself everyday!

I’ll pm you too. I just feel he was trying to tease me/get me to ask him something.
Now you mention it he did something similar earlier this week. Again, I didn’t bite.
Wonder if he’s trying to make me feel insecure?

@SBD1 the more women I speak to and read about on here, the more women I hear having body confidence issues. No matter the circumstances. I absolutely despise my body yet everything thinks I have a good one. Unfortunately 7 years of abuse both physical and Mentally when I was in my younger 20's has left me with body issues. I wasn't over weight. But after having my child I wasn't exactly skinny. He would grab my fat during sex and tell me I'm vile and fat. That no man could be attracted to me etc. This has always stuck with me.

I have slept with athletes since, had relationships with some amazingly fit men. The worry each time is the same. I get anxiety about getting naked. If it ends with a man. I worry it's because I'm not skinny enough. Im only now starting to learn it can't be that.

Glad you're feeling better and back @KermitRulesOK. Imagine being able to just take a trip to Russia on a whim (as opposed to the kind of logistical effort most of us would require).

@AtSea1979 Jeans and a top is great. And there's nothing wrong with a cardigan. I have loads of them. In fact, I wore one on my first date with MrSG. He didn't seem to think cardigan wearing was incompatible with fancying me.

It is so easy to fixate on what we think is wrong with us. He's probably as critical of himself as you are of yourself.

MrSG is really good looking, and very fit indeed (he's got less than 10% body fat 😱). When I swiped on him I was surprised that I got a match. And I still find myself surprised that someone as good looking (and generally great) would be interested in me.

The thing is, he regularly tells me that I'm beautiful and fit (looks at stomach that's wobblier than I'd like it to be and covered in stretch marks, and laments the effects of pregnancy/gravity on boobs). And he tells me that he can't believe that I'm interested in him. I'm not sure which bits of himself he thinks are not up to scratch (probably some ridiculousness about his muscles not being big enough or a completely unfounded worry about what's in his pants, or thinking that he looks 'tired' and older than he used to). Whatever it is, I think he looks really amazing. And I just have to believe him when he says the same about me. Even if I think 'WTF? You cannot be serious that my goofy looking smile is beautiful'.

So don't assume that any man looks at you with the critical eye you apply to yourself. And don't be down on the knitwear. 😂

I hear you @lifegoes
The sex in my marriage was frequent and good. He was obviously attracted to me and that wasn't the issue but time and again it's something I question - is it because of how I looked?

Although on reflection I'm not sure it's any real comfort to think it's about me as a person instead....

I am nervous of showing off the pregnancy stretchmarks to someone who's fault they are not though.

@DustMyselfOff I think, maybe, it might not have actually been about you at all. There's nothing wrong with his you look or your personality. It will have been about him. All about him.

It's something I'm learning to overcome as well. One way I put it in context is to recognise that my attraction to someone is always the whole package. If I like him, I like him. Mr Goatee is shorter than me, something I usually can't get over, but when we clicked it turned out I didn't care at all. He isn't some perfect specimen of manliness, but he was kind, thoughtful, etc - we had chemistry together. As I get more used to dating again, I'm learning I genuinely don't care about a partner having a specific list of physical requirements.

I figure that it must work both ways, and the man I'm with must feel similarly. Anything I have hangups about sort of disappears in the haze of hormones.

Granted, I haven't been treated as @lifegoes was, that is truly vile. I'm sorry he did that to you, life, and I'm glad you have been able to move past his abuse.

@lifegoes Sorry that happened to you.

Something that has stuck with me since I was young, was a bully going, "Doesn't SBD1's face look like a siemens phone". We're talking 16 years ago, I remember they were curved and so he was basically saying my forehead and chin pointed out and my face was sunken. Still to this day I HATE seeing a picture of my face from the side, it literally carved something in to my soul.

@WooMaWang oh intellectually I know you're right but it's hard to feel that on my gut. Is it a woman thing or a co-dependent 'me' thing, to take responsibility and blame for everything whether it's my fault or not

@SBD1 I hear you. If only we could internalise compliments the same way we internalise criticism...

Though someone once said i should do M&S voiceovers because my vpice was rich and sexy. I've hung onto that one!

I remember my exh telling me no one would ever want me because I'd stretch marks and a tummy. It affected me for a long time but then I decided that was him winning and got back out dating again. How wrong he was!! I know it can be daunting but if he likes you your tummy doesn't matter to him so enjoy and embrace it.

Isn't it funny @WooMaWang that we get told this. (They attracted to us, or can't understand why we are with them ) But refuse to believe it. Yet if someone said something about our body in a negative way. We take as gospel.

@DustMyselfOff It's bizarre isn't it. We always go to whatever our own insecurities are and blame that for the reason. But I'm really starting to accept that whilst yes I may have my faults. Half my relationships haven't worked because I refuse to tolerate their bullshit/behaviour.
My friend calls stretchmarks the map of her life and if a bloke doesn't like them, he can take his small cock and do one. (Really makes me laugh, I wish I was as positive as her)

😘 @MoreNiceCereal

@SBD1 it's always things that we feel insecure about that hurt us the most. If someone said to you, I don't like you because you have a blue beard. You would laugh it off and never think Of it again. Because you 100% know it's not true.

Yet when it's something we doubt already. We take that what they say as truth.

I detest bullies with my life. The scars they leave is horrific.

Love that you've done that @Chocolate123 that's very empowering for me to hear.

@JeSuisPrest still had the best post ever when she she gave advice about how a man sees the body. It still sticks with me now. I can't rem it word for word. But it was about how a man had more things to worry about that how our stomach looks etc. They are worrying about. What if I'm not big enough. Is she enjoying it. What if I come too quick. God I must not come too quick. Etc etc. And I do believe that.

@dustmyselfoff My american friends love my voice and tell me all the time, makes me laugh. So I've latched on to that. Also Mr Cactus sometimes says the odd little compliment and I know he means it because he doesn't give them all the time. Even if we don't work out, I'll still have built some confidence from his compliments, even if I'll be heartbroken haha.

Should be seeing him tomorrow night, very excited.

@DustMyselfOff whatever causes it, I do exactly the same thing. I take blame/responsibility for stuff that objectively just isn't my fault. It's not a helpful habit in the least.

Attraction is definitely a whole package thing. And you just cannot know in advance what is going to do it for you. MrSG is gorgeous and fit, bit he is also short (5'6) and stocky (because he's literally just a lump of muscle). Loads of women would just write him off because of his height. And, before meeting him, I wouldn't have thought that stocky and muscular was what I was looking for.

Although the muscles thing is ludicrous. He actually flexed his bicep at me last night after he'd been to the gym. I just laughed at him. I'm not about to start swooning over lumpy muscles. 😂

Eek I had a new iron last night that I decided wasn't for me. We had barely talked but had a feeling he was going to be quite intense. I told him this morning an old boyfriend had gotten back in touch and he replied with
Oh I'm really disappointed. I was looking forward to developing our relationship.

What kind of relationship exists beween two people who have exchanged less than 10 messages and 2 photos? Anyhow he's gone.

@woomawang have sent you a quick question by pm

Really interesting points. I’m fairly attractive, very slim, fit, outgoing etc., but I find some guys often try to pick at something to trigger insecurities or destabilise me.
I’m really not saying this to blow my own trumpet, just to say that it is totally about them. No matter who or what you are. They need to control you.
When I was in my early 20s a guy i was seeing stroked my cheek and smiled, then said,: you have crows feet.
I fell right into his trap and checked in the mirror - sure enough when I smiled I had crinkly bits. I was devastated (as only a 20-something be 😂) But he then laughed it off and said don’t worry they’re not that bad.

And so began the quest to be good enough....

You are so right there @KhaleesiTargaryen my Male friend said I seem to pick guys who see me as a conquest. Because I come across so confident and strong. It's like they want to get me. But when they do get me and I start liking them (mainly because they tap into a insecurity of mine and suddenly I feel vulnerable) they act like a dick.

Oh god yes @lifegoes. It's impossible to believe the good stuff. But all the horrible stuff my ex used to say about me: I've taken it all completely to heart.

Actually that's partly why I find it weird when MrSG compliments my smile. My ex told me that I looked awful when I smile and that I should keep my mouth shut. Not that he gave me any bloody reason to smile. Similarly, all his comments about how I'd never be attractive but I could try to make the best of myself, or that I dressed frumpily or that I was a bit plump have totally stuck with me. He completely destroyed my self confidence.

However, the problem was him not me. I did look worse than I do now because misery tends to show. And I didn't want him to find me attractive (because that let yo unwanted sexual attention). But, objectively, I am and have always been much better looking than him. It was much easier for him to criticise me and undermine my confidence than for him to look at his dad bod, seriously balding hair and actually quite unattractive face and think 'yeah I look a bit shit'. In fact, after we split up the school mums were shocked to discover that he was only 35 (and younger than me). They thought he was early 50s and I was much, much younger than him. 😂 one of them still texts me with 'only 35!!!!!' every so often (after she's seen him at school).

Something I got talking about last night about men (sorry guys on the thread)

But how many men these days actually do the dumping?

I've found and from people I know.

Guys hardly ever leave an unhappy marriage. They either cheat or seem to force the woman to call it a day.

In dating, they either ghost you or again force your hand to end it.

I'm wondering why and how many of you have actually had a man leave because he was unhappy?

@lifegoes I think most men won't leave a marriage because of fear of being alone. That's why I think many of them cheat. As for ghosting I think they do this when they get what they want and then they've lined up others and think the grass is greener elsewhere. Fact is most women cope better alone and although it's lovely to be in a relationship they'd rather be alone than be treated crap. Most men would rather be with someone than no one. There are exceptions of course.

@KhaleesiTargaryen It is awful when they do that 'negging' thing. Bastards.

@lifegoes I have been dumped. Well kind of. I'd told my ex that I thought we should end it so many times and I'd made it clear that I would never tell him anything that mattered about me. But he insisted I was just bring abusive. So I waited for him to decide to end it (he was abusive, which is why that seemed a sensible course of action from the inside). He did so but only (I'm pretty certain) once he'd met someone else. I don't think it lasted for him though (although I neither ask nor care).

MrSG got dumped by his ex. Although he had been making plans to divorce her for unreasonable behaviour (he's got an evidence file he was keeping) but she gave him adultery grounds. I think though, the whole marriage was one of guilt/obligation and he'd always just been staying because they had a child. His friends were basically taking bets on how soon the divorce would be at the wedding type situation (answer: it lasted less than 2 years). So he would probably have plodded along miserably out of a sense of obligation longer if she hadn't shagged a potato. 😆

However he claims that he's always been the dumper (other than that). Who knows whether that's true.

My university BF dumped me by ghosting. 3 years in. The unspeakable shit.

He was never bloody good enough for me.

Never.

My mentally abusive ex blanked me on holiday and ignored me to the point where I screamed (whilst on a ski slope) FUCK YOU, YOU JUST LOST A GIRLFRIEND.

He went "Good"

Then my husband, I was the one who told him it was over, he said he knew. But he was too lazy to leave and also, he loves DS so I can understand that.

Other guys just ghost rather than break it off

I don't know. Stbx was making moves towards ending it, then backtracked, so innthe end it was me who pulled the trigger. But i very much feel it was him who ended our marriage and him who left, even though ultimately I was the one who called time. I definitely feel like the one who got dumped. His EA is still married and, as far as I know now he's not telling me everything, no moves have been made to make her unmarried so he is on his own... except he sees her every day and no doubt messages her every night. I strongly suspect he will come to regret what he did but what he did cannot be undone. Once the trust is gone....