He told her she's beautiful....

[ijustlovecrisps]

please tell me is this emotional abuse?
on going situation and long story...
He has been in contact with an ex girlfriend.
He wrote her a poem and in it included line "but still beautiful..."
I found out and "discussion" followed...a very emotional one full of anger, tears and upset.
Well he reckons it all meant nothing, "it's just a poem" he says.
"Beautiful is just a word.."
He confuses me saying he doesn't actually think she is beautiful but it was just the best word to use ?!!
He says he is sorry and it was a mistake but I cannot and I say again CANNOT get past the fact that he said it!
To me, as a woman, if a man says you are beautiful, that is very special and it hurts me that he has said it to another woman whilst still married to me!
I apologise if I haven't explained very well and I am emotionally and mentally drained with it all and all the other stuff |I have to put up with.
He says I'm a snoop and a snooper and lots of other things. He also said I don't understand poetry.
He could win an argument with God IMO!
I am both fuming and heartbroken about all this.
I give up.
As far as I'm concerned this other woman has been told she is beautiful by him.
He says he will message her soon to put a stop to it all. I have to forgive and move on. He also says I'm unforgiving.
To me it's not that simple.
He says I'm unforgiving and destructive.
There is a history of problems such as this.
I feel broken and want to quit.
Sorry for this long story.

He sounds awful.
You said in your op you want to quit, so quit!
You don't need permission from him or anyone else!
Life's too short and he's had his chances many times over. He's not going to change!

Thank you
I'm going to keep trying.
I cannot believe it's all ended up like this. But he has had moods and tempers from the start.

I mean keep trying to actually separate.
Sometimes he agrees and says yes we need to part but then he backtracks. He gets upset and cross etc and then it gets left again.
Says he will try to be better but I'm no longer convinced.
I believe I have tried my best over the years and put it with more than others might have done.

You're focusing far too much on his use of the word 'beautiful' and less on the fact that he a) was writing her poetry in the first place and b) is clearly emotionally abusive.

You need to find the courage to leave.

I know.
When i ask why he wrote her a poem he said she mentioned he used to write her poems and letters and she still has them! So then he thought he would write one and send it. So I said why write it about her? (it is about their meeting and describing her, including "still beautiful")
Why not write about the natural environment? He says yes it was a mistake but just a poem written in the moment. Says it doesn't mean anything bla bla. But he had to agree with me that she has now received that complement from him and thinks he means it. He says he doesn't really mean it but sees how people could find her attractive! I can't see it any other way. But he tells me I don't understand! I suppose he's trying to dig himself out if the hole he's got himself in! I would rather him just be honest.
Anyway, yes, in a way so what - he has been awful to me for years and then all the other woman situation too!

He says he will end the contact soon and tell her I'm upset and it's caused trouble.
He thinks that will all be ok then!

You mean he'll blame you for him being an arse

I can't imagine the circumstances in which it would appropriate for a man to write a poem to another woman when he is in a relationship with someone else.
He's lying when he says it doesn't mean anything. And why will he be ending contact " soon" rather than immediately?
This is all nonsense and he is a jerk. He sounds awful for many reasons, why would you stay with him?

...he had to agree with me that she has now received that complement from him and thinks he means it. He says he doesn't really mean it but sees how people could find her attractive! I can't see it any other way. But he tells me I don't understand!

Ah yes, the old narcissistic 'judge me by my intentions and not by the effects of my behaviour'. And the chorus 'I get to decide what my intentions are and fyi they are always noble and unimpeachable'.

With the follow up hit single 'I am so special that mere mortals couldn't possibly understand'.

He says he will end the contact soon

Oh that is obliging of him .

When exactly?

What is 'soon'?
Answer: 'Soon' is a put-down aimed at you.
He is telling you he will not do what you want when you want it done. He will decide for himself when he will stop dallying with this woman.
The word 'soon' is the equivalent of a nice big 'Fuck Off, ijustlovecrisps. You don't get to tell me what to do.'

I wish you could see what we do in your posts OP, he has absolutely fried your brain and tied you in knots until you literally don't know which way is up. It's impossible to see, and even more impossible to untangle while you're still in the thick of it, it's only when you're away from it that it all becomes clear.

You need to break the cycle, take control of your own decisions about what happens next. Think about the language you've used, you will 'keep trying to separate'?!! Can you see how wrong that sentence sounds? There should be no trying, no agreement needed from him, if you want to separate then that should be that. Does the fact that you essentially need permission to leave him not ring major alarm bells for you? I don't mean that to sound harsh, I'm just trying to make you see how completely he has conditioned you to feel you're not in control of your own decisions, your own life.

I'm hoping if I say this enough times you might actually believe me, you need some time away from him, you can't think straight with him there because he deliberately won't let you. Please just try it, I think you'll be amazed how much stronger you will feel after just a few hours away from him.

I mean keep trying to actually separate.
^Sometimes he agrees and says yes we need to part but then he backtracks. He gets upset and cross etc and then it gets left again.
Says he will try to be better but I'm no longer convinced.^
I believe I have tried my best over the years and put it with more than others might have done.

If by 'trying to separate' you mean basically asking his permission to separate, then remaining in the relationship and accepting his lies about change (this is what it boils down to) then you need a new definition of separating that does not include the word 'trying'.

Here is how you do it:
You go and talk to a lawyer.
Ask your mum if she can help with the cost of an appointment, or cast around for a solicitor offering a free half hour.

You have some homework to do because you will need to gather information.

Documents to bring (or details to know):
Proof of his income.
Proof of home ownership/mortgage, and deeds.
Bank account statements - for savings and current/joint accounts, plus statements wrt any investment accounts, pension/s.
Any debts - credit card, car/ boat loan, holiday home mortgage, investment property mortgage, university loans.
Any assets - holiday home, boat, investment property, land, bloodstock, stocks/bonds/futures/crypto currency, etc.

Questions to ask a solicitor:
Can you leave the home with any children who are still there?
If you do, do you abandon your interest in/right to the home?

What proportion of the proceeds from sale of the family home are you entitled to after 20 years, with you a sahm for X years of the marriage?
What sort of spousal support or child support are you entitled to?

You do not need the agreement or permission of this man to file for divorce.
Every time you ask about separation and then stay because he says no /fools you into staying, he laughs at you.

You may well have put up with more than others have, but sadly there is nothing to be gained personally for you in that.

Please, please look into the world of paid work, be it ever so humble a job. Aim to get back into your profession.

Can you do yourself a massive favour, ijustlovecrisps?

Can you buy, beg, steal or borrow the book by Lundy Bancroft Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men
Look for it on Amazon UK or on used book sites. Maybe your local library has a copy.

There is a companion book too - Daily Wisdom for Why Does He Do That?
Encouragement for Women Involved with Angry and Controlling Men

And can you call Women's Aid?
They are there for you. You don't need black eyes or broken bones to be utterly pummeled and brought to your knees by a partner.
0808 2000 247 is the number.
Call, give your number and a convenient and safe time to receive a call back when prompted, and get the help you urgently need.

www.womensaid.org.uk/domestic-abuse-directory/
Find your local WA.

when I say he "wins" every point what I mean is he has to have the last word, he is sarcastic, I feel like giving in, I feel like he never listens. He responds selectively and won't always answer me. I try so hard to communicate clearly and it never seems to work. He gets angry and shouts and rarely admits anything. I don't like conflict but he seems to like it

Too much hard work putting up with all that. You have one life. Years wasted on an idiot who can write 'beautiful' poetry to another woman, but speak to you and treat you as if you are nothing. What's the point? Unless you want to spend your elder years tearful stressed and miserable I'd say this one isn't a keeper, so deal with situation accordingly. He's not the only man in the world. When you're with an unkind man your relationship is dead in the water anyway, no matter what

Narcissists need to 'win' conversations.

They only apologise if there is something in it for them.

How are you today OP?

Not feeling too good but had some help and support thanks

I spoke to a doctor as I was so stressed and the doctor said it is emotional abuse and said I am very stressed.
When I told my husband he as usual cast doubt and questioned eg "Is he legally qualified?!"
"did he hear both sides?"
"That's just his opinion" etc etc
"thanks for reporting me"
this is typical of his reactions...
He has now agreed to reserach the meaning of emotional abuse but I expect a contrary response.

You are making the mistake of requiring his approval and agreement OP. He is abusive, he is not loving, he has emotional affairs and gaslights you. He doesnt make you happy. You will only be at peace when you leave and learn that what he says means nothing, rather than waiting for him to give you peace by making it better.

Beautiful is just a word, usually one that men drag out the woodwork to use on women they want to shag because they know it works and provokes the impression they really think you're special.True story- My first serious boyfriend used to tell me I was the most beautiful girl in the world when he was trying to persuade me to date him and sleep with him . I met his ex through mutual friends once without realising who she was and she was sat there telling me she had just met a great guy who tells her she's the most beautiful girl in the world and she'd 'never had that'- 5 minutes later in walks my ex. She and I are friends now. He's since dumped her for the next worlds most beautiful girl and we rue the day we were ever that young and daft.

Many of you are commenting that I keep seeking his approval and agreement and I obviously have a problem with this and need to work on it.
I am fuming with him at the moment but can't be bothered saying anything as it is a waste of time - like talking to "he who cannot be challenged so don't even try!"
And as for telling women they are beautiful he also told the OW at work last year that she is a beautiful woman!
As a previous poster said - the sending of a poem is probably worse than saying beautiful (which I seem to be more bothered about.)

When I ask him questions about it all and seek reassurance he says I'm getting obsessive and it isn't healthy. He always says "what good will it do?" "Is it relevantt?"
"Is it constructive? Instead of just answering the bloody question!!!!!

Typical abusive behaviour OP, please take back your own power and work towards being free of him, he’s playing the cruel gamers that they all do in one form or another, make no mistake, it IS abuse, reach out for support from whoever you trust, friends/family/GP, call Women’s Aid, you don’t have to live this way xx

Make plans for changes and distance yourself emotionally and physically however you can. Be clear to him and everyone around that this is over. If you waiver you could caught up and waste months...years even!

He always has to have the last word. He is sacastic. He will listen and say yes and then always has to add on with a "but.... or the problem with you is...."
No wonder I feel this way.
Yesterday he said I was losing my mind... thanks!

When I remind him of stuff in the past he says things like "What are you bringing that up for?" "Can't you forgive?" "How long ago was that?!"
And then he says "I can't remember... I'm not a walking dictionary!" Funny, because he can remember all the football scores from years ago!
Also, even if it was last week, it was ""in the past and I "shouldnt be bringing it up. I should be moving on and it's not healthy to keep going on about stuff from the past!"
I want to cry and run away!