DH and OW's baby. Can he see the baby without seeing OW?

[Lovelytea]

Husband cheated and got somebody pregnant but i decided to work on forgiving him to keep my family together. Would it be possible for him to have a relationship with the baby without having direct contact with the OW?

He confessed what he'd done himself I suspect because she was going to tell me anyway. We split for 6 weeks whilst i decided how to proceed. During this time I had conversations with the OW and I do believe it was just a one night stand that culminated from an EA and that he was no longer in touch with her. He has been transparent ever since.

He bitterly regrets the affair and cut contact with her before he told me what they'd done. Eventually I agreed to stand by him and we're now going through counselling to work through the problems we were ignoring prior to the EA, of which there were a few.

After coming to terms with the reality of the situation I realise the baby needs it's father. As far as our family goes I'm prepared to facilitate a relationship between our DC and their half sibling, I'm prepared to have the baby over our house and for our DC to slowly get to know them. It will be painful but I'd never begrudge an innocent baby a relationship with its relatives on my watch.

The babies mother has told DH in a series of rambling texts that the baby will have nothing to do with our DC and she won't allow them to come to our house. She wants him to spend time at her house with her and the baby if he wants to know him and that our family are to have nothing to do with him or be involved in discussions.

Unfortunately that doesn't sit right with me because she's made it very clear she wants to be with DH. I've seen messages where she has said as much and she's been particularly vile about me and our DC. I don't think I should have to put up with such vitrol after what they've done and if anything it should be me lashing out which im not. Although he has been unfaithful she isn't entirely innocent and is a manipulative, spiteful and so herself.

She isn't interested in being civil and adult about the situation and has done nothing but cause trouble since it became apparent I'd be standing by him. She was expecting me to leave him and for him to go and be with her and the baby. He has said he wants no contact with her whatsoever but does want to see his baby which I think he should.

So my question is, is there any way he can have a relationship with his baby without having to have direct contact with her?

We're trying to repair after what he did and quite frankly I cannot stomach the thought of him spending any time alone with the woman. I don't want to break up my family so please don't tell me to LTB as for now I've decided to try to make it work. It's been a long and painful period of deliberation but for now I'm satisfied that I've chosen what's best for my family.

A relative dealing with hand overs? A contact centre perhaps? If he took her to court would they support his stance of not wanting to speak to her? Is that even possible?

The baby is 2 weeks old now and he's yet to meet him.

@Lookatyourwatchnow

Parental rights and parental responsibility are different things.

Responsibilities include paying maintenance and the child’s welfare etc. He doesn’t need to be on the birth certificate to be made to honour some of these responibilies (like paying maintenance).

Parental rights include having access to the child.

FWIW I think you need to give yourself some time. You're awash with hormones and so is she and the babies just want all of their needs met, which doesn't need all of you to weigh in. There's no urgency, really, give yourselves at least 6 months, maybe a year to settle into a new reality that works for you. It won't make any difference in the long run.

He's done a really good job on you op hasn't he? Here you are, worrying over how he can maintain contact with his lovechild whilst remaining in your home with you doing all the wife work. Your self esteem is clearly through the floor isn't it?

As a starting point I would insist he asks for an immediate paternity test. There's no reason for him to refuse to ask for that. If he does though then you'll know just how much you are deceived by them both and I would suggest that's your line in the sand to walk away.
If paternity is confirmed then you should seek legal advice as to the best arrangements for the whole family.

So no answer to how court ordered contact of a 2 week old breastfed baby away from the mother actually works in practical terms, just that it's what you think should happen. Thought so.

Jesus Christ there are no such thing as parental rights. Just parental responsibility.

Yes but you can't think of her child right now it's to soon and that's the real truth if you want to stay together.
He needs to pay and offer support but honestly and I don't think it's right at all, he needs to wait for the baby to be a year or so. I don't think court etc is going to offer what you need or hope.

@TwistedStitch there's a new fangled thing called expressing.

I know you said you couldn't go to a relative for more then a few days, but what happened when you split for six weeks?

You must've coped without him then, you got through it, you and the children survived it.

I think you underestimate yourself.

Is he claiming she got pregnant from one sexual encounter/instance of interccourse?

I'm with the posters who doubt that; it's about 25% chance for 20 something's with no fertility problems and 12% or less for 30 something's (roughly) per cycle, which most likely would have several instances of interccourse. It just seems unlikely.

Parental rights and parental responsibilities are two different things.

I do think I need to take a massive step back from obsessing over the situation and concentrate on just me and my own DC for now.

Don't get me wrong, I have been trying to.

She isn't a constant topic in our house, only in my thoughts, and I don't continually argue with DH about her or the baby at the moment.

Things are as calm as possible in our house given the circumstances, at the minute were plodding along and trying to avoid the subject where necessary. We've been getting on and looking after the DC together trying to regain some normality. I don't think he fully understands how badly I've been affected by what he's done and what's happened as a result of it.

Because I knew about the baby before he arrived I've had time to "process" his existence and I believe DH thinks I'm through the worst of it, emotionally that is.

In hindsight I should have spoken to somebody IRL alot sooner so I could prepare for the here and now / future as it happens, as opposed to spending the remnants of her pregnancy pretending it wasn't happening and just trying to get on with rebuilding our own family.

Its all hitting me now because there's only so much burying my head in the sand I can do and now the babies here I'm regretting not getting myself some support sooner so I could be mentally prepared.

Again, are you saying that courts are ordering 2 week old babies from their mothers and telling them to express- something that not all women can do, can be painful and disrupt breastfeeding especially in the early days? Is this really happening to mothers and their newborns in the courts?

This happened to my friend. She was pregnant and he got another woman pregnant. 10 years down the line the husband has run off with another woman (a different one). My friend and the original OW are now actually ‘friends’ and the children play together. It was only when the husband was gone that they realised he had lied and lied and lied to both of them causing a huge rift. He played them both off against one another in many different ways. My friend didn’t realise it at the time

They had done mediation and court for contact and original OW was very awkward and difficult and my friend used to get so angry and upset about it. She also didn’t want OW to win her husband. It turns out that OW was just hurt angry scared and alone and felt quite intimidated by the husband and wife combination against her, and became a spiteful very over protective unreasonable uncooperative mother. They have managed to build a good relationship now for the kids and husband doesn’t see ANY of the DC at all now - his choice

I feel so sorry for you OP, you and the children hvw been caught up in a mess that wasn’t your making but you all have to live with the consequences.

At what stage did your DH tell you about the baby?

I do feel the OW is being written off as some kind of terrible person here. Let’s not forget he has probably been promising her the world, telling her how unhappy he is and maybe even they he would leave his family for her. She has gone through pregnancy and birth and those early newborn days without a partner, she is probably in the exhaustion stage, full of hormones and feeling pretty angry that this man lied to her and now his wife is contacting her suggesting that she hand her baby over to go and play happy families.

So a mother of a two week old baby would be court ordered to express, against her will, in order for the baby to spend time with the father who it’s never met, despite the mother allowing access in her own home.

You know BF babies aren’t encouraged to use teats until they are afew weeks old and have an established BF routine? Normally at least6 weeks. So that doesn’t make much sense either.

I think I am saying you need to take a different view of this. By taking a side against her all you do is draw a battle line and it’s doing you no good. The fact he’s weak, untrustworthy and frankly selfish and idiotic is a huge issue for you and her. SHE CANT TRUST HIM EITHER.

As for registering the baby, all mine were registered within two weeks and I believe in some places you can do it at the hospital.

What a clusterfuck, your h is an irresponsible prick . I find it impossible to believe they just had the one sexual encounter. I feel so sorry for you op.

From the government page

All births in England, Wales and Northern Ireland must be registered within 42 days of the child being born. You should do this at the local register office for the area where the baby was born or at the hospital before the mother leaves.

No woman is going to let a stranger take her nb away for any amount of time, anywhere.

He is effectively a stranger, she has not lived with this man, she might know him slightly, sexually, but she can't really know who he is after one, or a few, encounter(s)

I'm sure he was filling her head with all kinds of bullshit at the time but I can't hold her above reproach because she knew about me, our tiny baby and older DC and still chose to hop into bed with him after entering into an emotional affair.

He's as guilty of sin and it's him who broke his promises but she's no angel and some of the vitrol she's spouted about me in messages is absolutely vile and unprovoked as despite what they'd done I was calm and level headed when I approached her.

There was no name calling or threats on my part, she had no reason to be spiteful towards me or my appearance. It wasn't me who shagged her husband yet she's been on the offensive from the moment it became apparent I was going to stand by him.

She directed the hurt from rejection onto me when I was the one who was wronged in the first place.

I can't have any respect for somebody like that no matter what she felt or believed from him.

"you never know how strong you are until being strong is your only choice"

I think this quote is very apt for your situation lovelytea. I know it seems like you're in a lose lose situation right now, but there WILL be light at the end of the tunnel, but that light will only become visible when the roots of your problems (dh, ow, and dare I say it... the baby) are no longer a part of your daily existence.

I know this isn't what you want to hear, but in my opinion, you should be seriously looking into your options (financial, childcare, emotional support) so you have the best tools in place to start rebuilding a life for you and your dc. It might not be easy, but you can't stay in your current situation just for the dc. You wont be doing them any favours in the longterm. Yes there will be an adjustment period, and yes you'll have times where it's shit, and you wish you could have gone back to how it used to be, but once you find your new routine and see what family life is like for you and your dc, it will all be worth it, and you'll all be so much happier for it.
Please don't let him get away with doing this to you. Staying with him is basically like saying your happiness is unimportant, and that's opening you up for a lifetime of disrespect and possibly setting the foundations for his actions in the future. Will he have another affair and expect you to forgive him because this time "He didn't even get anyone pregnant". Who knows what he's really capable if if he's treated you so badly during that very fragile postnatal state, 3 months after you birthed his child! I would actually be concerned about his mental state to do something so irresponsible and damaging.

What do his/your family think of all this? I can't imagine how stressful this has all been, but I think a weight would actually be lifted and alot of stress relieved if you ended things. The stress of "my bastard EXhusband cheated so I kicked him out" sounds far less to deal with than "my husband had an affair so now we're trying to figure out a situation where he can see the new baby, still be 100% on board with our family, have no contact with the ow (who clearly wants to be with him, and refuses to have anything to do with me or my dc), while dealing with the legal complications this all brings, and I'm the one trying to sort it out even though HE was the one that was unfaithful and put us in this effed up situation".

A future as a single parent bringing up your 2 dc who have regular contact with their dad, sounds far preferable to the insane amount of uncertainty and stress surrounding the other scenario where you try to play happy families. Huge hugs as this must be so terrible right now, but it will get easier once you realise What you're worth, and put yourself and your dc first. Screw him and his messed up morals. xx

My sons dad was there when he was born, he gave him his first feed as I was too ill. He has been in his life since the day and hour he was born, so yes, at 5 months, I am happy with him spending the day with him.

His grandparent have also been involved in his life since the day he was born.

Again, if you can’t see the difference between my situation and the current one, you’re a moron.

No I don’t do pick ups and drop offs, because yes I do want a break. And I’m not ashamaed to admit that, being a single parent is hard and I’ll take the help from my sons other, equal parent where I can get it.

What exactly is your issue with that?

Can I just say that I find the fact you have searched through my posts in order to make personal attacks about me and my situation quite bizarre, a tad strange and not at all the behaviour I’d expect from a practising social worker.

Wow I really hope you aren't a SW. Posting the opposite of child centred advice and then mocking a lone parent for sometimes needing a break.