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Relationships

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Married to someone with Asperger's? Support group here! (Thread 3)

816 replies

ChangerOfNameAspieThread · 29/12/2018 14:44

This thread is for partners seeking to understand the dynamics of their relationship with someone with ASD. It is a support thread, and a safe space to have a bit of a rant. Avoid sweeping generalisations if possible, try and keep it specific to you and your partner.
(ASD partners welcome to lurk or pop in, but please don't argue with other posters and tell them they are wrong.)

Some resources from the threads so far:
www.theneurotypical.com/effects-on-differing-nd-levels.html
www.maxineaston.co.uk/cassandra/
I've probably missed some, but will try to gather them later and put in a comment for the next thread!

Previous threads:
1st thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3281058-Is-anyone-married-to-someone-with-Aspergers
2nd thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/3325419-married-to-someone-with-asperger-s-support-group-here

OP posts:
SalitaeDiscesa · 12/01/2019 09:54

Well I'm struggling again, after a Relate session when DH couldn't contribute at all, just said "I don't know" a lot.

Decided I need to focus on loving behaviour, not words. For now anyway. For him that's usually something practical like driving me somewhere. I need to think of things that signify love to me. Things he can actually do, which excludes saying 'I love you', buying cards and presents and many other obvious methods.

ThisWayDown · 12/01/2019 12:11

OMG “I don’t know” drives me crazy.
Along with, when I ask DH why he’s done something or has a certain opinion, he gets cross and says “I can’t answer why questions”. No dear, because that would involve some self-reflection ...

QueenieIsLost · 12/01/2019 19:41

Yep the ‘I don’t know’ drives me crazy too. I’m not sure I prefer the ‘I can’t remember’ from (ASD) ds either...

Salitae my way to cope has been to concentrate in myself. To do things that signify Love for myself rather than waiting for H.
So it can be buying some nice clothes (I usually don’t), going for massage (also for the touch side of things), doing something for myself that can sometimes feels like a bit of indulgence, or anything that brings me some joy.
It’s so easy to loose yourself. I know I did. And taking the time to find again who I am has been a very important part of the process of reclaiming who I am. Which then helps me cope with it all.

SalitaeDiscesa · 12/01/2019 20:18

Thank you @QueenieIsLost and @ThisWayDown. I've started to do that a bit. Joined a different choir, focused more on my close family and friends. You're right about reclaiming the self.

friendlygal79 · 12/01/2019 22:28

I’ve tried to have ‘the chat’ this afternoon. I had planned it extremely careful not to seem I was blaming or criticising him. I find it difficult that after a week of not communicating or getting on that he still continues as normal, making general convo, going about his daily routine totally oblivious that I am barely answering him with yes and no answers. I wanted to have ‘the chat’ to see if we could work out what is going on, him acknowledge some of his behaviour and see if there is any point in going on. However ‘the chat’ did not work. He swore, accused me of criticising him waved his arms in the air at the sheer mention of my feelings and left the room. Sat in the kitchen staring into space all night ! .... oh well what’s another evening on my own eh? 💁‍♀️💁‍♀️💁‍♀️

Peachsnowpop · 12/01/2019 23:35

OMG yes to the 'i dunno' responses ALL the time ..

Me to him:
'Is your dinner nice?' - I dunno
'Which paint colour do you like' - I dunno
'Which car do you like' - I dunno
'Hows your toothache now' - I dunno

AngryAngryAngry

SalitaeDiscesa · 13/01/2019 01:08

@friendlygal79 sorry I haven't managed to pick up your PM, will get it tomorrow when on desktop.

stardustandroses · 13/01/2019 09:31

Like @friendlygal79 I’ve done 40 years with what I am now suspecting is an AS husband. My mother, I realised a few years ago, was a raging narcissist so I was used to not being acknowledged and I grew up not even realising I had needs, let alone having them met! So I overlooked the nagging uncertainties I had about DH in the beginning and throughout our married life have felt that if I only tried a little harder, everything would be fine. Just as I did as a child. DH like so many on here is a good man. Practically he would do anything for anyone, but socially he’s a total embarrassment! Unlike many of the other ASHs here, he loves parties and being sociable, but I’m not sure why as he’s not interested in interaction, perhaps it’s some sort of validation as he holds the floor on politics, fires question after question at people without listening to the answers, interrupts, and talks over them. I have spent years trying to explain that conversation is a two way thing, to no avail. Luckily people who don’t have to live with it are fond of him as he’s like an eccentric child. He adores our children and grandchildren and seems to identify with them. I was the disciplinarian and he delighted in undermining me. Still does. Emotionally, like with my mother, I feel like a shadow person. He hasn’t a clue who I really am, rather projects onto me a sort of cross between a mother and a housekeeper. I totally went off sex years ago. Stupidly I thought if I guided him and showed him what I liked, he would catch on, but no. It was like food. He only eats what used to be called nursery food, and that’s for fuel. Sex was the same. Not something to be shared and enjoyed, but satisfy the urge and move on. He doesn’t seem that bothered not be doing it and he’s never asked what the problem is - or at least I’ve tried to tell him - even dragged him to Relate years ago - but I suppose it isn’t important enough to him. As well as work, he has an obsessive hobby which comes first on his list of what is important and thinks nothing of pursuing it ad nauseum, which means he’s out and away a lot. He just doesn’t get that relationships need nurturing and input from both partners. So I have made quite a separate life which suits him fine although I have to say doesn’t like being home on his own. It’s extraordinary to me that he can’t see what’s sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander but he really can’t. If I’d known at the beginning what I know now I would have run for the hills

Amicrazyornot · 14/01/2019 07:08

So I have made it very clear what I want (no relationship with him but for us to find a way to support the kids). He was surprised - which I can't actually believe as we have spoken so much about it this week. I have been very angry as he has been excellent with the kids - I'm angry because I have made excuses for him and picked up the slack for the last 6 years when he could obviously do it without too much effort. It makes me look a fool.
He asked me why am I doing it now when kids are young and why can't I wait until they are teenagers (10+years)!
Much like you @stardust I feel like a shadow person. I have minimised myself so much to fit in with behaviours, that I fear I won't ever become a person again.
It has put me off relationships and men for life. I won't ever be in this situation again that's for sure.
I am feeling terrified I am doing the right thing for the kids as he is certain what he knows is always right and I have spent so much of my life thinking he must be right.

whatamidoingwithmylife · 14/01/2019 09:31

I'm joining this thread (lurking) to see what I might be getting myself into with my partner.
He was diagnosed years before I met him but has hidden his diagnosis from everyone including family. I only found out because we had a night in with a few drinks and he ended up hammered, said something hurtful that upset me and then followed me round the house watching me cry but doing nothing to help. Never said a word and then sat down all stiff and unmoving, when I approached him he started shaking and couldn't stop. I ended up looking after him all night as his little tizzy after he told me about his Aspergers lasted about 6hrs.

Generally he's wonderful and seems to be able to get by in most situations. I thought he was just weird when I met him, in the same way as I am. Interestingly he thinks I also have Aspergers (he's not the first to say this to me).

He seems to be constantly worried I'm going to leave him or get fed up of his 'oddities' as he calls them. I do feel that since he told me, I let him off for behaviours I wouldn't normally tolerate. He can be very unfeeling and if I'm upset he won't reassure me, as to him that would be like telling me that my opinion/feeling is wrong (makes sense once he explained it to me but still made me feel like shit). He can't put into words anything he needs to tell me if he's upset/emotional and he very much comes across sometimes like he's acting and it's not the real 'him'. It never occurs to him to do something to help me unless I ask him and instruct him, he just says if I want help surely I'd ask for it.

He also has a teddy bear that he brings with us on holidays. I struggle with this and do take the piss out of him for it. Seems to be some sort of security blanket for him, which I think I also am to him. He can be quite childlike sometimes and needs mothering.
This isn't something he allows outsiders to see though, he holds down a serious job and is very professional.

He's incredibly affectionate but the sex feels very much like 'just sex'. There's no emotion there for him - he isn't interested in making love. I told him that I love him once in bed and he just stared at me and then carried on banging away. He once told me afterwards, but that was a one off. Outside the bedroom he tells me constantly how much he loves me but I think it's for the reassuring 'I love you too sweetheart' that he gets back from me.

He focusses on the negatives a lot, such as his lack of a sense of humour (which he knows is a strong need for me in a relationship) and he's always saying that one day I'll come to my senses and realise he's not worth my time with me being so wonderful and such a catch. I find this hurtful as he's an amazing person and anyone would be lucky to have someone like him.

But I do worry about the lack of emotion and care he's displayed during the past year we've known each other. Surely this will only get worse and worse.

stardustandroses · 14/01/2019 15:26

I’m not sure it gets worse and worse, just that we get less and less able to deal with it! I thought my DH was an eccentric loveable boy when we first met and his oddities were refreshing and amusing. Sadly I grew up and he didn’t. I totally get the acting thing. Mine seems to put on personas he has found to work in a given situation, like acting the fool or becoming an old buffer (I suspect based on his father). So it’s like he’s a Peter Pan hiding behind these superficial characters and you never get to interact with a real person. The trouble is, as an empathetic person, you are aware of this child and feel you have to take care of him. Mine too thinks I’m absolutely wonderful and he is incredibly lucky to have me, but it’s like I’m a precious object he keeps in a cupboard while he does exactly as he pleases. It would never occur to him the object has needs and dreams. He would do anything for me (as long as it doesn’t interfere with what he wants to do) but has to be asked and instructed, as you say. I would definitely try and get him to ditch the teddy! Mine doesn’t have a teddy, but he is incredibly attached to his stuff and won’t throw anything away. If I secretly sling something he hasn’t looked at for ages, you can bet your life he’ll notice. On the plus side, he is incredibly faithful and loyal which is worth a lot these days.

whatamidoingwithmylife · 14/01/2019 22:14

@stardustandroses He would do anything for me (as long as it doesn’t interfere with what he wants to do)
This sounds exactly like my partner. He's always telling me he'd do anything for me (haven't actually seen much evidence of this) but I know he would end up transfixed by something or doing one of his many hobbies.
What you said about him not realising you have your own hopes and dreams rings true too as on our second date he told me he was looking for someone to fit exactly into his life and him not have to change at all. I told him then that he was selfish and he wouldn't meet anyone to fit that bracket.
He does try very hard not to do or say anything which might offend or upset me and he'd do anything to see a smile on my face. As you said, your husband is faithful and loyal, and I can see my partner being this way too - can't imagine him doing anything bad but he copies the way other people message him so his texts to other women are littered with pet names and kisses. Personally I find this to be unacceptable but as I've only seen it in passing on his phone, I can't speak to him about it without him thinking I've been snooping. I'm also aware of a girl staying over at his house which I do think he should have told me about (he doesn't know that I know) - especially as he doesn't have a spare room for people to be staying over!! I'm guessing he doesn't feel he needs to tell me as it was innocent.
Overall, I think he's a better partner than most guys I've had relationships with in the past. It just remains to be seen whether I can continue to cope with his way of dealing with things.
As for the teddy, I think I'd be hard pressed to get him to give it up. I don't think he does anything weird like sleeps with it, but he takes it places such as holidays etc. I thought he was joking until it appeared out of his bag when we went away together - he told me he had to bring him as he's been on every holiday. Apparently ex gf's haven't had an issue with the teddy, they thought he was cute for having one Hmm

stardustandroses · 15/01/2019 08:21

@whatiamdoingwithmylife. Nothing is ever going to be perfect, it seems to me. Otherwise the divorce courts wouldn’t be so full. We are bombarded with all the stuff about romance and soul mates and we get carried a way with it all. At the beginning you wondered what you might be getting yourself into with him so ask yourself what it is you are looking for. While I get really frustrated with the lack of empathy, if I’m honest with myself, my upbringing made me such a mess that I needed security more. Do you want children? Would he make a good father do you think? Or would his life not accommodate them? It might be an idea to observe him with children - mine adores them as he’s a child himself! But if he seems awkward around them or actively doesn’t like them much, that would be a red light if you really want them. Are you a sociable person and is he? If that’s a mismatch it could signal problems. Are you happy to pursue your own career and hobbies? If you are looking for a sharing relationship that too might be a problem unless you like the same as him! What about if you’re ill? Mine is useless. He would call an ambulance if I was having a heart attack (if he noticed) but anything your mum would do for you - can’t be doing with it. Having said that he is very good about visiting people in hospital - practical again you see!

ChangerOfNameAspieThread · 15/01/2019 08:58

Hi everyone. Had a bit of a break because while I find these threads reassuring that this isn't just me (although I wouldn't wish this on anyone), they are also confronting sometimes. In order to deal with DH without getting hurt, I have to shut myself down, make myself numb. When I read the threads there are bits that remind me of things I deal with (like walking too fast and not waiting for me, not responding to me in pain etc) that I temporarily forget and are brought back.

Theory on spotting an abuser vs partner with Aspergers

On here and other threads there's often confusion (well, to be fair, less confusion here) about whether a partner is abusive or has Aspergers. I've been thinking about this and I'm not sure if others agree - I'd be interested to hear - but I think a quick way to tell is not the hurtful actions but the remorse. If someone is manipulating you, they'll often have grandiose displays of remorse. Everything will become wonderful, he'll be sweet and loving again and then will at some point snap. And the pattern will repeat. Partners with Aspergers wouldn't tend to do those grandiose displays because there's no need. The controlling side of Aspergers is focussed on keeping their world safe, not a power play specific to keeping us small or on the back foot. The result on us may be similar, but to tell if it's intentional abuse, I think how remorse is displayed or not may be a key.

Having Aspergers tends to mean people can't fake things, or not the grandiose ways that intentional abusers can. They couldn't change from being horribly mean to affectionate and sweet and loving in minutes. Profuse apologies and promises to change don't seem to crop up in our discussions here.

Masking could be seen as manipulative, but is something that I think happens without the Aspergers partner's full a) intention or b) awareness. I don't think it's a case of "I'm going to appear affectionate until I get married to her then job's done and I can ignore her". It's not manipulative, because it's not a game, its not a plan, it's not like a "player" with a game plan for "scoring". And I think many of us sensed our partners weren't like that, which we found an attractive quality.

I think instead of grandiose shows of remorse, we tend (from these threads) to see:
a) denial they've done anything wrong
b) confusion and lack of understanding of what we're talking about when we try to explain it
c) when our partners do understand and feel bad it's very obvious, but there's an element of not quite knowing what to do (unless there's a script if "buy chocolates" etc) - similar to the way a child realises they've done something wrong but doesn't know how to make it better.
d) they're may be some remorseful action but it would be small/moderate/practical. Nothing overly large or public and no giant promises.

I realise there's some generalisation going on here, although I've tried to avoid it. But there are traits amongst groups of people (hence diagnoses). I'm merely trying to use the experiences from over 2000 posts to find a quick way to a) help people understand their own situation and b) cut the crap when elsewhere someone posts about an emotionally abusive partner and people reply with "It sounds like my friend's sister's husband who has Aspergers". Nope, he's an abusive asshole!

The impact on us may be similar to being in a long term emotionally abusive situation, but that's a different issue. One thing at a time!

OP posts:
stardustandroses · 15/01/2019 09:24

Yes! And for a comparison between for example, narcissism and Aspergers here’s an interesting link:

www.goodtherapy.org/blog/narcissism-vs-aspergers-how-can-i-tell-the-difference-1114174

ThisWayDown · 15/01/2019 09:29

Hi @ChangerofNameAspieThread good to see you, I was wondering how you are.

I think your theory is excellent. Certainly plays out from where I’m standing.

For me, a crucial factor is intention. I know from my diagnosed child too, a lot of the time - the hurt/inconsideration caused really isn’t intended. Thinking about it, something I find very frustrating is the outrage when I’m bothered or offended by something my DH or child did or said and say so. It’s often regarded as me “accusing” them of something that is apparently scandalous because I think they meant C when of course they meant Y. A lot of the timesin my house this can be resolved after a laborious discussion about wording and the precise meanings of things, and once the “right” wording and interpretation has been found, there’s no issue. I doubt very much that’s usually the case with partners who are emotionally abusuvr and controlling.

TimeIhadaNameChange · 15/01/2019 10:03

That's really interesting, Changer, and I think you're on to something there with the lack of remorse. I know there have been times when I thought that if I explained what DP did without bringing the Asperger's into the conversation it would be seen as abusive, but it really isn't. To be abusive the abuse would be the intention rather than a consequence (IYSWIM).

Is mine the only DP here who loves a crusade? We seem to be embroiled in a parking war with a neighbour and DP loves it. Was getting quite excited last night that things could get nasty, and apologised as he may be away next week and therefore I'd be left on my own to deal with the consequences (not for the first time). But he's still talking about escalating things if our neighbour doesn't back down.

We could deal with it subtly, as we've been doing, but no, DP wants to force the issue. He's enjoying it. I'm not!

midcenturylegs · 15/01/2019 12:58

@ChangerofNameAspieThread I was also wondering how you were.
That is a great theory you've written. It doesn't absolve the behavioural impacts it has on us but will definitely stop people confusing the behaviour of someone who is just basically arsehole with someone who has ASD.

@TimeIhadaNameChange Nope, my ex also loved a crusade. As did his whole family. Seemed to take real delight in things like that.
Also extolled their virtues of most of them having AS and how it was great because they were all so intelligent and as they didn't get emotionally involved were able to deal with things like parking issues so well.

He didn't get what he wanted once from a call to his bank, and, knowing that customer service can't hang up on a customer he sat there and read a few chapters from a Harry Potter book. That's the story he dines out on .

Daftasabroom · 15/01/2019 13:25

Undiagnosed DW has never apologized for anything in 20 years.

whatamidoingwithmylife · 15/01/2019 19:13

@stardustandroses I also have childhood issues that lead me to need more security (and reassurance etc). I've also been lied to and treated badly by ex partners so maybe I look for the bad stuff in this relationship too.
Children are a sore point for us as he dislikes them intensely. I used to feel the same but have changed over the last couple of years. I was recently pregnant and he had zero interest in the situation. There were other issues why it wasn't possible to keep it but his insistence that it didn't follow 'the plan' was a factor in us choosing to terminate.

Neither of us are social - we both prefer our own or each other's company to that of others and actively avoid other people. We also have a lot of shared interests. We're incredibly similar (so much so that we've both said if he hadn't grown up a long way from where I grew up, we'd be considering a dna test to make sure we're not related). It helps that we're both a bit boring and old before our time - as that can be off-putting to a lot of people in a new relationship but it suits us fine.

Moffa · 15/01/2019 22:08

Changer - I agree with what you’ve written. My H would NEVER show a grandiose display of remorse/love/affection. To be honest, our arguments are generally unresolved where we either agree to disagree or life just moves on.

I feel sad at the thought he is unknowingly ‘trying to keep safe’ as it makes me feel awful about thinking (or dreaming) about leaving him. But I just hate how he is as a father & husband. Someone on another thread had written that the best thing you can do for your children is choose a great daddy. I haven’t given them that & it kills me.

ChangerOfNameAspieThread · 16/01/2019 06:50

Thanks for the replies. Sorry, I can't tag as I'm on phone and in a rush with hungry kids baying for their breakfast! Smile

In response to intention.

I am looking at it from a different angle. When you're in an emotionally abusive relationship you don't know which way is up. The same (for me) in my relationship before I made an emotional split from him - and even now it takes a lot of energy to not fall over against his steadfastness. When you're in that state of mind, intention is really difficult to define. I couldn't tell if he had a bad intention or if I was thinking in "the wrong way". As he was always so clear in being right, and equally clear that I was wrong - always - I couldn't be sure what was real. I was looking for a kind of litmus test that could make it instantly clear and didn't depend on the confused non-Aspergers (or abused) partner relying on the mind that they often doubt (their own).

As I was writing yesterday, I started thinking about partners with anti-social personality disorder (psychopaths). They don't do empathy or remorse and the difference in their response would be, I think, that they get back into manipulation, something people with Aspergers generally don't - or can't - do. They would never, ever, ever, display signs of knowing they've hurt someone close to them and then confusion of not knowing what to do to fix it. They always seem to have a plan for getting themselves off the hook.

OP posts:
Amicrazyornot · 18/01/2019 07:32

Can anyone tell me about experience with counselling and their OH?
Had a very unsuccessful first appointment yesterday (think retreating into himself, scrunched face, eyes closed and fists, legs fidgeting around and barely responding to counsellor). & when he did finally speak a few words, just focused on one thing I mentioned.
When we got home, speaking to his parents who babysat like nothing had happened.
I am sure that it is not ASD anymore, but would like to ask anyway

stardustandroses · 18/01/2019 08:27

*@Amicrazyornot
Oh dear. He probably hates the idea of being exposed but if the counsellor is any good he/she will have had experience of that kind of behaviour and with any luck will eventually be able to gain his trust. It’s a huge step that he actually agreed to go so don’t give up hope. At the very least you can feel validated that someone has seen what you have to deal with.

Amicrazyornot · 18/01/2019 10:48

Thanks @stardustandroses
Yes, counsellor was very kind and understanding.
Issue is he is normally NOT like that - very articulate, runs rings round me and repetitive. I am completely overwhelmed a lot of the time in talks or arguments we have had. It makes me feel like I am going a bit crazy as I did not recognise him in that meeting at all - when I KNOW him to be very different.
& I don't think that is ASD (I think I'm clinging to that in the hope that he doesnt realise he does the things he does)

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