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Would this bother you or have I gone all feminist/sensitive/irritable

141 replies

whatsthatcar · 09/12/2018 10:00

Me and the man I am dating for the last few months both work in a similar industry, with slightly different jobs and completely different disciplines within that industry. He is paid better as he had been doing in a few years longer and he came from money. Let's call him John. That's the background.

This issue is not all job based, but it is the job thing that frustrates me most, so I will start with that. Obviously in real life I wouldn't say this (!!) but I am an intelligent woman and I have done well for myself. I love a good debate and learning new things and will always say if I don't know or understand something - I know I'm not stupid so I am comfortable doing this. John however thinks he knows everything about everything, including my job. Even when it is completely and utterly wrong. Last night he made a comment about how general people believe x and it is just crazy because it is so wrong. This is my 'area' of specialism and so I said actually it is like that, but the exception is y - not what he had said at all. He laughed at me in a sort of mocking way and just said "sweetheart it really isn't." He usually calls me sweetheart so that's normal but it felt hugely patronising.

I was furious! Luckily the food came that moment and I chose to not go into it as we have had real friction in the past over this sort of thing.

This happens regularly. I got into my job without any contacts, he got in through his Dad. This means he has essentially had all doors open to him from day 1 and (dare I say it!) he is intelligent but I often feel he doesn't always think about things with an open mind and often misses the point. I came from a privileged background too, but my (ridiculous) views from my early twenties are long gone - for instance he still thinks all homeless people are to blame for being homeless (you cant even discuss the wider possibilities here) and he blames my closest friend for never having a better paid job (she could work harder in fairness but equally she has not had anywhere near the opportunity me and him have had). These were views I had when I just left school - very narrow minded. They are not views I hold now and I can listen to another's point of view and properly consider it.

He thinks he knows everything. The drive between my house and his (I had done it nearly 50 times before he did - and he told me i was going the wrong way as his sat nav didn't go that route...obviously I am not an idiot and after so many times I had worked out the quickest route...)

Other times we will be chatting about something and I will mention a fact of interest about the topic where appropriate and he will exclaim "that's right! Well done sweetheart!" I honestly don't think he means to be rude here but I find it insulting.

The feminist point...he's made comments about men being better in his area than the women, it is "just a fact" because "women are too emotional." I think this may have stemmed from a chat we had once where I had said i think women can be emotional at work more than men (at least i can be!). However, saying women are not as good at their job as a general rule is rather different I think? (He's never criticised me and my ability).

What do you think? Am I being total idiot? Happy to hear that if that's the view...thanks for reading :)

OP posts:
Anniegetyourgun · 09/12/2018 13:21

IMO, to be fair, giving money in a patronising way to the homeless is better than not giving them any. At least somebody gets a meal out of it.

So yeah, he's not all bad. But does he have to be all bad in order to be too annoying to date?

consoleconfusion · 09/12/2018 13:29

He's a twat.

category12 · 09/12/2018 13:44

Afistfulofdolores, I think you're reaching a bit - we can't know his motivations or if he's deeply insecure. He might be. OTOH, he might be exactly as he seems.

Either way, it really doesn't matter - if he's not working on those issues, doesn't have the introspection to examine his own baggage - then he effectively is the persona. Understanding what's behind it wouldn't make it any more suitable to live with or bring up children with. Intent is irrelevant.

And even if he were working on himself, it still wouldn't be fair on the OP to expect her to stick around for it, and no guarantee he would successfully change.

category12 · 09/12/2018 13:45

You have to see people as they are, not as they could be.

TigsytheTiger · 09/12/2018 13:58

In all honesty OP with reference to your title thread I can think of very few women who wouldn't be bothered by his behaviour and attitude towards you.

I think you are unconsciously echoing his prejudices and beliefs by suggesting you may just be being a silly and emotional female and god forbid 'all feminist".

Be feminist, be proud and tell this misogynistic cock where to go.

Mookatron · 09/12/2018 14:06

I can't imagine this getting less irritating as time goes on. And I don't think it is something somebody would stop doing.

AndTheBandPlayedOn · 09/12/2018 15:52

Aww the old “you are being too sensitive” ...
Umm no he is being insensitive.

He totally invalidates your credibility and you mark it down to interesting debate?

Patronizing condescension is insulting.
An insult spoken kindly with a smile is still an insult.
Just as:
A turd rolled in glitter is still a turd.

I don’t think he is doing this accidentally (no self-awareness) or he would not have mentioned your salary. Did you offer that info or did he find out another way?

Imho, this is about the “fragile” male ego and he will be horrified if you surpass him professionally. He is competing with you and is undermining your confidence. This is very insidious, subtle, drip drip drip emotional abuse. (Some here may flame me for using the term, but it is what it is.)

As mentioned earlier, your professional job may be compromised if he/his father has the influence you have suggested.

Imho, you need to play a somewhat long game to gently, gently taper off. Do not get pregnant! It was mentioned to double up on contraception, yes. But it may also be time for a chronic uti, yeast infection, flu, you sprained your butt muscle to abstain by stealth. This might be a circumstance to let him decide to break up with you. Be less available on a sliding scale.

Emotionally detach. Raised eyebrows and “oh, really” is all the response his pontifications require.

LannieDuck · 09/12/2018 16:11

I couldn't be friends with someone like that, let alone in a relationship with him.

Would you ever consider saying to him: "it really isn't, snookums" or "that's right, well done hunny bunny". It's belittling and demeaning, and you just wouldn't.... would you?

Don't let him make you feel small as a way of making him feel big. Don't lessen yourself (e.g. let him tell you you're wrong when you're not) to assuage his pride.

Cambionome · 09/12/2018 16:15

Why do you want to be with someone who makes you feel this way? Confused

ChrisTheCat · 09/12/2018 16:57

I don't know but as I was reading your OP I pictured you jamming your fork in his eyeball! What an odious little toad.

halfwitpicker · 09/12/2018 17:03

Fuck me the darlings and sweethearts would drive me loopy

ravenmum · 09/12/2018 17:12

What nice things could you possibly do to make a woman stay ten more minutes with you despite this shite?

pallisers · 09/12/2018 17:20

Plus, dating isn't about making a scrupulously fair judgement on every man you encounter, it's about finding someone who you love spending time with and feel valued by (and want to shag senseless).

This. You don't have to be "fair". You just have to figure out if he is someone you want to potentially commit to. My mother's advice was pick someone whose worst fault you can live with. I could not live with a man who thought he was better than me (he does by the way) and definitely would be out of there at his attitude to homeless people - his values would not be my values (and I suspect they are not yours but for some reason you think you should accept that as normal - it isn't).

I wouldn't be arsed with the tapering off etc. Simply tell him you think that he is an exceptional man and some woman will be lucky to have him some day but you aren't the right one for him - he needs someone who understands his background more and can be a real support to him. You do hope you can remain friends as he has been a real positive influence in your life (let yourself really go with all this palaver - it could be fun). His ego will love it and you'll be on your way to find someone you actually respect and who respects you.

M4J4 · 09/12/2018 19:13

@C0untDucku1a

I think youre sexist as well tbh. You said women are more likely to be emotional at work? A male colleague of mine was in tears last week. You didnt challenge him properly over YOUR JOB! And your thread title is appalling.

OP didn't say that, she said I think women can be more emotional at work than men. That's just her opinion, she didn't say they ARE more emotional.

TemptressofWaikiki · 09/12/2018 19:24

He'd be WEARING dinner if he had spoken to me in this patronising tone.

whatsthatcar · 09/12/2018 19:37

I only posted this today and apparently i am adamant to stay with him?! Is it not possible to talk something through...

Anyway. Appreciate the posts and theyve reinforced what i felt and thought originally.

it isnt really as simple as just writing someone off immediately with a flaw - though i accept that for many people this would be a red line. When pushed he is not a complete dickhead and i do think that in time he would start to realise that some of his attitudes arent attractive. the question is can i be bothered for a man to grow up in that way. probably not.

OP posts:
whatsthatcar · 09/12/2018 19:38

*bothered to wait

OP posts:
WhendoIgetadayoff · 09/12/2018 19:45

Why you with him? Sounds awful. This isn’t someone you want to get serious with so get rid. He’s patronising and right wing and you’re not. Get rid.

category12 · 09/12/2018 19:48

Thing is, you shouldn't go into something thinking "this'll work if he changes in such & such a way".

It's not fair on you - and it's not fair on him either.

If you met someone who was overweight and thought this'll be perfect if I only I get him to diet and exercise - that'd be massively unfair. What if they're happy the way they are? What if they can't conquer their habits? What if they try and fail? What if they don't particularly want to change?

It may be an unchangeable facet of his personality. It may get worse as he gets older instead of better. If you don't like him as he is, don't think you can train him out of it to suit you.

JennyHolzersGhost · 09/12/2018 19:49

Oh you’re going to try and change him ! Because that always works.

Yohooo · 09/12/2018 19:54

Everyone has flaws. I certainly do and my husband has a fair few too but there are flaws and the. there are flaws. It's up to you what you are ok with.

You've only been dating for a few months. I'm not sure I could be bothered with him. I also suspect that it would be a mistake to think he was ever going to 'grow up'. He already considers that he has extremely emotionally intelligent.

Lookatyourwatchnow · 09/12/2018 20:04

'Sweetheart, it really isn't' made me want to teleport through my phone to the moment that he said that to you and slap him across the back of his head. That sentence really tells me everything I need to know about him. He's big, you're little, he's smart, you're dumb, he's right, you're wrong. Oh, and he's a man and you're just a little woman. And he would think that if you were several pay grades above him too.

pallisers · 09/12/2018 20:56

it isnt really as simple as just writing someone off immediately with a flaw - though i accept that for many people this would be a red line. When pushed he is not a complete dickhead and i do think that in time he would start to realise that some of his attitudes arent attractive

First of all adults rarely change - they really don't so you'll be waiting a very long time for him to change the values and opinions he has already expressed to you very clearly. He is already grown up. Lots of grown ups have the same attitude to women and the homeless as he does. It isn't a question of maturity - it is a question of beliefs and values. In some ways you are actually patronising him because what you are saying is "oh those funny little attitudes you have, never mind, when you are mature like me, you won't think like that, you'll agree with me instead". He is a successful adult - this is who he is. take it or leave it.

Second, and this is something I think women should be taught about in relationships. It is actually perfectly simple to write someone off (as in break up with them) because of a flaw. That is what people are supposed to do when dating. They figure out who they are compatible with - including flaws. They know their own values and opinions and when they meet a man who doesn't share them - even if he is perfectly nice otherwise - they say "no, this won't work".

The only way this relationship will work, OP is if YOU change - you become the kind of person who thinks it sweet when a man wants to be bossy and patronising or thinks the same as he does about homelessness and privilege etc. Because he will not change.

AFistfulofDolores1 · 09/12/2018 22:28

category12 - I believe all twatdom is essentially compensatory in nature.

BlokeHereInPeace · 09/12/2018 23:47

You sound nice. He sounds like a knob.