"But we took you to Stately Homes" - survivors of dysfunctional and toxic families

[toomuchtooold]

It's November 2018, and the Stately Home is still open to visitors.

Forerunning threads:
December 2007
March 2008
August 2008
February 2009
May 2009
January 2010
April 2010
August 2010
March 2011
November 2011
January 2012
November 2012
January 2013
March 2013
August 2013
December 2013
February 2014
April 2014
July 2014
Oct 14 – Dec 14
Dec 14 – March 15
March 2015 - Nov 2015
Nov 2015 - Feb 2016
Feb 2016 - Oct 2016
Oct 2016 - Feb 2017
Feb 2017 - May 2017
May 2017 - August 2017
August 2017 - December 2017
December 2017 - November 2018

Welcome to the Stately Homes Thread.

This is a long running thread which was originally started up by 'pages' see original thread here (December 2007)

So this thread originates from that thread and has become a safe haven for Adult children of abusive families.

The title refers to an original poster's family who claimed they could not have been abusive as they had taken her to plenty of Stately Homes during her childhood!

One thing you will never hear on this thread is that your abuse or experience was not that bad. You will never have your feelings minimised the way they were when you were a child, or now that you are an adult. To coin the phrase of a much respected past poster Ally90;

'Nobody can judge how sad your childhood made you, even if you wrote a novel on it, only you know that. I can well imagine any of us saying some of the seemingly trivial things our parents/ siblings did to us to many of our real life acquaintances and them not understanding why we were upset/ angry/ hurt etc. And that is why this thread is here. It's a safe place to vent our true feelings, validate our childhood/ lifetime experiences of being hurt/ angry etc by our parents behaviour and to get support for dealing with family in the here and now.'

Most new posters generally start off their posts by saying; but it wasn't that bad for me or my experience wasn't as awful as x,y or z's.

Some on here have been emotionally abused and/ or physically abused. Some are not sure what category (there doesn't have to be any) they fall into.

NONE of that matters. What matters is how 'YOU' felt growing up, how 'YOU' feel now and a chance to talk about how and why those childhood experiences and/ or current parental contact, has left you feeling damaged, falling apart from the inside out and stumbling around trying to find your sense of self-worth.

You might also find the following links and information useful, if you have come this far and are still not sure whether you belong here or not.

'Toxic Parents' by Susan Forward.

I started with this book and found it really useful.

Here are some excerpts:

"Once you get going, most toxic parents will counterattack. After all, if they had the capacity to listen, to hear, to be reasonable, to respect your feelings, and to promote your independence, they wouldn't be toxic parents. They will probably perceive your words as treacherous personal assaults. They will tend to fall back on the same tactics and defences that they have always used, only more so.

Remember, the important thing is not their reaction but your response. If you can stand fast in the face of your parents' fury, accusations, threats and guilt-peddling, you will experience your finest hour.

Here are some typical parental reactions to confrontation:

"It never happened". Parents who have used denial to avoid their own feelings of inadequacy or anxiety, will undoubtedly use it during confrontation, to promote their version of reality. They'll insist that your allegations never happened, or that you're exaggerating. They won't remember, or they will accuse you of lying.

YOUR RESPONSE: Just because you don't remember, doesn't mean it didn't happen".

"It was your fault." Toxic parents are almost never willing to accept responsibility for their destructive behaviour. Instead, they will blame you. They will say that you were bad, or that you were difficult. They will claim that they did the best that they could but that you always created problems for them. They will say that you drove them crazy. They will offer as proof, the fact that everybody in the family knew what a problem you were. They will offer up a laundry list of your alleged offences against them.

YOUR RESPONSE: "You can keep trying to make this my fault, but I'm not going to accept the responsibility for what you did to me, when I was a child".

"I said I was sorry what more do you want?" Some parents may acknowledge a few of the things that you say but be unwilling to do anything about it.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate your apology, but that is just a beginning. If you're truly sorry, you'll work through this with me, to make a better relationship."

"We did the best we could." Some parents will remind you of how tough they had it while you were growing up and how hard they struggled. They will say such things as "You'll never understand what I was going through," or "I did the best I could". This particular style of response will often stir up a lot of sympathy and compassion for your parents. This is understandable, but it makes it difficult for you to remain focused on what you need to say in your confrontation. The temptation is for you once again to put their needs ahead of your own. It is important that you be able to acknowledge their difficulties, without invalidating your own.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I understand that you had a hard time, and I'm sure that you didn't hurt me on purpose, but I need you to understand that the way you dealt with your problems really did hurt me"

"Look what we did for you." Many parents will attempt to counter your assertions by recalling the wonderful times you had as a child and the loving moments you and they shared. By focusing on the good things, they can avoid looking at the darker side of their behaviour. Parents will typically remind you of gifts they gave you, places they took you, sacrifices they made for you, and thoughtful things they did. They will say things like, "this is the thanks we get" or "nothing was ever enough for you."

YOUR RESPONSE: "I appreciate those things very much, but they didn't make up for ...."

"How can you do this to me?" Some parents act like martyrs. They'll collapse into tears, wring their hands, and express shock and disbelief at your "cruelty". They will act as if your confrontation has victimized them. They will accuse you of hurting them, or disappointing them. They will complain that they don't need this, they have enough problems. They will tell you that they are not strong enough or healthy enough to take this, that the heartache will kill them. Some of their sadness will, of course, be genuine. It is sad for parents to face their own shortcomings, to realise that they have caused their children significant pain. But their sadness can also be manipulative and controlling. It is their way of using guilt to try to make you back down from the confrontation.

YOUR RESPONSE: "I'm sorry you're upset. I'm sorry you're hurt. But I'm not willing to give up on this. I've been hurting for a long time, too."

Helpful Websites

Alice Miller
Personality Disorders definition
Daughters of narcissistic mothers
Out of the FOG
You carry the cure in your own heart
Help for adult children of child abuse
Pete Walker
The Echo Society
There are also one or two less public offshoots of Stately Homes, PM AttilaTheMeerkat or toomuchtooold for details.

Some books:

Toxic Parents by Susan Forward
Homecoming by John Bradshaw
Will I ever be good enough? by Karyl McBride
If you had controlling parents by Dan Neuharth
When you and your mother can't be friends by Victoria Segunda
Children of the self-absorbed by Nina Brown - check reviews on this, I didn't find it useful myself.
Recovery of your inner child by Lucia Capacchione
Childhood Disrupted by Donna Jackson Nazakawa

This final quote is from smithfield posting as therealsmithfield:

"I'm sure the other posters will be along shortly to add anything they feel I have left out. I personally don't claim to be sorted but I will say my head has become a helluva lot straighter since I started posting here. You will receive a lot of wisdom but above all else the insights and advice given will 'always' be delivered with warmth and support."

You are very right @AttilaTheMeerkat i always defend my dad even when hes in the wrong. I probably always will.
But i am starting to realise that he did enable her and still does because he wont stand up to her and say enough is enough. Its just i am not quite ready to go deeper with these thoughts so i shove them to one side.

Yeah his partner has a very lovely family, she has been more of a mother to me in the short time hes been with her than my own mother ever has!

Also very true about the guilt! On my good days i do think sod it on my bad days its very hard.

@unicornsandponies You will be surprised how good it feels not to

@Thisisthelaststraw Thank you 😊 i hope you have a lovely weekend too

Hi Munchkin (great username, I want to steal it!)

I've not been active on here the past few weeks and I'll apologise for not reading all your posts but this stood out:

But i am starting to realise that he did enable her and still does because he wont stand up to her and say enough is enough. Its just i am not quite ready to go deeper with these thoughts so i shove them to one side.

My therapist told me that besides every narcissist is an, often passive, enabler. Someone who will do nothing to stop the actions and likely (in)voluntarily encourage and support the narcissistic behaviour. The men, and women, who adopt the enabler role are weak, and will watch over abhorrent behaviour without raising an eyelid.

I totally get your feelings, I get the FOG (fear, obligation, guilt) triad often and subconsciously follow it. Thanks to these threads over the past few years, and the amazing people here, I'm very slowly recognising the signs - even if I can't prevent myself from succumbing.

It's a long haul to challenge this behaviour when you've been conditioned throughout childhood. I've PTSD, and cPTSD from mine and often wonder just how many people are unknowingly carrying them, because their childhood was like a nightmare war zone.

Please be kind to yourself, none of what happened was your fault.

Bumping for anyone who needs it

Hi Steve

I have see a few of your posts and been wondering how you are. haha it was one of my more inventive moments!

These threads have helped me learn so much, its helped me view the while situation in a new light, just need to process it all now.

Thank you 😊 i need to keep remembering that! Just sometimes its hard

Hi January

What you forgot here re your children is that toxic parents more often than not turn out to be toxic as grandparents as well. You only in all likelihood got along well with them when you fully danced to their tune.

They won't precisely harm your children in the same ways as you were yourself harmed (and I would think you are still mired somewhat in fear, obligation and guilt re these two) but they will harm your children in other ways. How old are your DC now roughly?. Children generally are not great judges of character when it comes to relatives and so they rely on their own parents good judgment. That child certainly sees how you react to them.

You are protecting your children from bad things by keeping them away from your parents. Going no contact will not mess them up.
You are the parent. You get to make these decisions without apology or excessive justification. You can assure your children that you are making a wise and loving decision for them as well as yourself. I am not going to script what you should say because you are the only one who knows your children, but you must convey that this isn't up for negotiation. This is not a decision that the child gets to make. Yes, children usually love their grandparents. Children are often quite indiscriminate in their love which is why they need parents to guide them. Not every person is safe to have around and this is a good time to teach that important life lesson. The more matter-of-fact you are, the more matter-of-fact your children will be. When we act hysterical, they will usually reflect our hysteria. If you act anxious, they will act anxious. If you appear unsure, they will push. Model the reaction and attitude you want your children to adopt.

I would have no further contact with them whatsoever; they have proven to you time and time again that neither can be at all trusted. You as well as your children need emotionally healthy people in their lives and that does not include your parents here. She is disordered of thinking and probably has some form of personality disorder (she may well simply be using your children as something like narcissistic supply) and your father is her all too willing enabler and hatchet man who cannot be relied upon either. Controlling behaviours like they have and continue to show you are abusive behaviours and are all about power and control.

Would you have tolerated this from a friend, probably not. Your parents are no different.

If you have another set of grandparents in the picture then focus on them. It is rare that both sets of grandparents are nasty. Emphasize to your children how much we enjoy being around grandma and grandpa so-and-so (the decent and loving grandparents). Cultivate your children's relationship with the decent, loving grandparents. Teach your children to be grateful for the decent, loving grandparents. Gratitude is a highly effective antidote to loss. Focus them on what they have, not what they don't have. Model that attitude of gratitude.

You will find that the children will eventually stop mentioning the loss of the narcissist grandparent if you are not bringing it up. If you are talking about your parents in the hearing of your children then you are inviting them to keep talking about it, too. I can not over-emphasize the need for your explanation to a younger child to be calm, pragmatic, measured and short. Long explanations make you look defensive which will tend to peak the interest of the child and prompt him to push the issue. You can gauge what is appropriate information depending on the age of the child. If the child is older and has experienced or witnessed the grandparent's nastiness in action then you can say more.

Attila you've made me cry, I really appreciate you taking the time yo reply tome. I don't have time to respond properly now,kids are 7 and under.

Actually you know my first response is really i'm allowed to cut contact? surely it's not that bad? what about my poor mother? shakes head at self will be back after work

Not even sure wether what i want to ask fits in here. But i'll try.
I am NC with my family dmum and dsis at the centre of this.

i've held this in for a very long time but i just have to ask:

Is it normal for mothers to make up stories about things that never happened giving a thorough account of something you've done, backed up by a sister but, that never actually happened?

There are several incidents that have been recounted that actually never happened that i am accused off. I don't know wether its me losing my mind or suffering some form of amnesia but absolutely certain these things have NEVER happened. They are awful things that have been told round the family and anyone who will listen as to why they are upset/angry/ etc.

What i don't understand is why would two people sit down together to plot a silly but really awful story against another family member? why would you both hate the person so much? your own daugther /sister?

Hi Successa

Welcome to the stately homes thread. Hopefully you will find it helpful.

You are wise indeed to have no contact with both your mother and sister (she is probably a carbon copy of your mother) here.

What you write of is called gaslighting and its something that narcissists and their followers do. Gaslighting is a form of psychological abuse.

While narcissists often strive to make themselves seem superior and “special” by showing off, bragging, taking undeserved credit, and other forms of self-aggrandizement, gaslighters tend to concentrate on making you feel inferior through false accusations, constant criticism, and psychological intimidation. Both narcissists and gaslighters can be adept at distortion of facts, deliberate falsehoods, character assassinations, and negative coercions. One key difference is that while the narcissist lies and exaggerates to boost their fragile self-worth, the gaslighter does so to augment their domination and control.

Many narcissists and gaslighters have thin skin and can react poorly when called to account for their negative behaviour. When challenged, the narcissist is likely to either fight (e.g., temper tantrum, excuse-making, denial, blame, hypersensitivity, etc.) or take flight (bolt out the door, avoidance, silent treatment, sulking resentment, or other forms of passive-aggression). The gaslighter nearly always resorts to escalation by doubling or tripling down on their false accusations or coercions, to intimidate or oppress their opponent. Many gaslighters view relationships as inherently competitive rather than collaborative; a zero-sum game where one is either a winner or a loser, on top or at the bottom. “Offense is the best defense” is a mantra for many gaslighters, which also represents their aggressive method of relating to people.

Gaslighters conduct psychological manipulation toward individuals and groups through persistent distortion of the truth, with the intention of causing their victims to question themselves and feel less confident. In personal and/or professional environments, they manipulate by micromanaging (controlling) relationships, including telling others how they should think, feel, and behave under the gaslighter’s unreasonable restrictions and scrutiny. They often become critical, angry, intimidating, and/or hostile toward those who fail to bow down to their directives. Gaslighter manipulation is often highly aggressive, with punitive measures (tangible or psychological) executed toward those who fail to recognize and obey their self-perceived authority.

Perhaps the biggest distinction between narcissists and gaslighters is that narcissists use and exploit, and gaslighters dominate and control. While the narcissist does so to compensate for a desperate sense of deficiency (of being unloved as the real self), the gaslighter does so to hide their ever-present insecurity (of being powerless and losing control). Both of these pathological types betray an inability and/or unwillingness to relate to people genuinely and equitably as human beings. They become “special” and “superior” by being less human and by de-humanizing others.

Attila I don't who you are or what you do in real life but your analysis of the whole situation is so spot on its quite frigthening. The controlling behaviour, wanting to control every single detail of my life that i couldn't cope with it anymore. Anger because i made simple decisions personal to me, that they seem to think i should have run by them.
Everytime someone has intervened to try and resolve some of the alleged issued, another 'story' pops up from nowhere and we are back to square one. Over the yrs those trying to intervene have got fed up and left us all to it. Its like a bottomless pit of offences that never gets full.

What is also strange is they will both at various times recount strange events 'reminding' me of how i behaved, and i am mostly because i don't know what they are talking about. Or they will flat out deny a major incident and say they have no memory of it. Even when there is evidence, when I point out the evidence they clam up and refuse to engage or just change the subject. But who is really lying? could i have really forgotten some of these things, really? i can't recount them here as dsis might be on here.

Successes after years of gaslighting - probably from when you were a small child - it's not surprising that you doubt your own perceptions. But honestly, the simplest explanation here is the best. Have you ever experienced this with anybody else, that they remembered an event that you don't remember happening, or that you remembered an event and they swear blind that it didn't happen? Or do you only experience this phenomenon with your mother and sister? Just with them, right? So it is far more likely that they're lying. Of course, they say they're not lying - but they would say that, because they are lying. Good luck proving any of this to anyone else - people who pull this stuff depend on the fact that it's your word against theirs and that as they've probably been complaining about you for years ("imaginative", "troubled","unstable"), for your other family members to turn around and support you would mean having to admit they've been wrong all these years. And people don't like admitting they've been wrong. This is one of the really hard but important bits of recovery from this sort of family abuse - if you can accept that you are probably not going to be believed by family and mutual friends, and are going to have to rely on your own perceptions - which are perfectly good, but which you have trouble trusting due to a lifetime of being gaslighted.

@Successa I hear you
When confronted with any difficult truth :
It didn't happen
I don't remember
You're lying
It's your fault
You're twisting things

Name change for this, just wondering if anyone else has been/ is in my position.
Dysfunctional family means I grew up being the family joker, my role was to distract and lighten the mood. I’ve realised quite late on in life that I do this instinctively as an adult, to the extent that lots of people treat me with little respect and feel they can speak to me in a scathing/ sarcastic manner they don’t use with others.
The problem is I don’t see myself this way; in my mind I’m a hard nosed survivor 😂The chasm between my perception and reality is huge!
Has anyone else been through this and how have you managed to get people to not treat you with the same respect they afford others?

In my experience you only need to call people out once, calmly, for them to alter how they treat you.
Basically I have discovered that people will only value you as much as you value yourself.

The people I refer to above are 'normal' people.

This approach is VERY UNLIKELY to have anything other than a nasty reaction from toxic /self absorbed/ narcissistic person etc... unfortunately.

Thanks fc , I normally laugh off / ignore jibes and digs as I find confrontation difficult - I’m ok shouting/ swearing ( haven’t done that for years) but oddly find calm confrontation a lot more threatening. Not wanting to sound silly but how do you calmly confront someone, I think poor body language is one of my issues, do you have any tips? Thanks.

@Realisation47

In my workplace, I had to make unpopular decisions and communicate them to confrontational and, sometimes even violent, people on a daily basis. While I am not for one minute suggesting that this describes the people in your life(!), here is what I learned about projecting a calm but assertive demeanour:

Keep your back ramrod straight. Hunching over makes you look smaller and defensive.

Keep your hands loosely in your lap or, if standing, loosely at your sides. Absolutely do not cross your arms! It's a classic defensive posture.

Keep your head up and make direct eye contact. If this is too difficult, focus your gaze instead on the tip of their nose. Seriously. They can't tell it's not actually eye contact. I use this one all the time.

Keep your voice measured and calm. Say what you want to say once. Firmly. But do not raise your voice - once you do, you've lost the argument.

Whatever argument they use to try and counter what you've already said, listen calmly and politely without interrupting, until they run out of steam and then say "That's as may be. I meant what I said. Now I'd like you to think it over".

Then leave the room. Use "just putting on the kettle" or "just going to the loo" as an excuse if you don't want to seem impolite but whatever you do, don't return to re-open the discussion. They need time to reflect. Although, as fc301* rightly pointed out, self-reflection is not something narcissists do!

Hope that helps in some way. Good luck!

Hmm well I'm no expert but I'll give it a go.
Direct unapologetic language.
"Wow, that was really rude"
"I find that hurtful"
"You may mean it as a joke but I'm not laughing"
"I'm not ok with that"

Hello .

Hi all,

I have been NC with Narc mother since January as advised by this group after writing my story. Only ended up NC because she never replied to my message about how unkind I felt she was to me. I still held on to hope that she may realise her wrong and apologise. I said to myself that by March by my children's birthday if she decided not to acknowledge the day I would use this as the absolute final straw and stick with it. Well, the day came (these are her first grandchildren-twins ) and late in the day she sent a message with a drum emoji a pregnant emoji and a firework emoji. There were no words written and she did not call which led me to believe it was a conscience clearing message just to say she sent something in case anyone asked.

By her Sending something so stupid obviously triggered me because I still can not believe because she is upset with me she would not check on her grandkids or wish them a happy birthday. Anyhow I sent her a strongly worded message addressing that she didn't wish them a birthday and sent confusing emojis. I also let her know that they deserve an interested grandparent that's invested and I won't allow anything but this. I then blocked her so I wouldn't see her reply and get clawed back as this is now the final straw!

Today my friend messaged me and said that in error my mother had sent her some horrible messages in error that were intended for me but I told her that I didn't want to know what they said and that I had blocked her (which she won't know) and that I won't receive the messages she has sent. My friend said that my mother has asked her to call -obviously to slander me and get her story out there. I am glad I don't know why she said. But now as always I have let her get in my head and become consumed by the situation and now all I have done the past weekend is constantly be haunted by it all. How long does it take for NC to feel good? I just feel guilty. Lastly, she has moved in with my grandmother and now when I return to visit on holiday (as I moved away) I feel I will be compelled to avoid visiting my grandmother to avoid her. How can I get around this?

Ashparo I am so sorry you have such a pathetic grandmother for your twins.

🎂 from me to them 🍰

If you wish to see your GM how about you meet her at a restaurant or a shopping centre or park? You can still see her without having to see your mother?

Stay strong.

You sent a strongly worded message to your mother; that was the trap that you fell into. Such disordered people like your mother want a response, that to them is the reward. You gave her a response and now she has gone for your friend as she realises that you have blocked her. Radio silence therefore has to be maintained. No contact is precisely that; there is nothing from you at all.

Deal with your own FOG (fear, obligation and guilt) re your mother through seeing a therapist (and one at that who has no familial bias about keeping families together) and this will also help you feel stronger. BTW she does not feel one ounce of guilt re how she has treated you.

Would also suggest you read up on triangulation and divide and conquer parenting.exposed/tag/divide-and-conquer/; two strategies that the narcissist further employs. Reading the website "out of the fog" could help you too.

As your mother could not get to you she then went for your friend. She has tried to use this person as a flying monkey here for her own ends. Those messages from your mother were not sent to her in error at all, they were meant for her to pass onto you and your friend did unfortunately tell you about these. I would tell your friend if you have not already done so that you do not want to hear about any communications via her from your mother. If your friend does continue to tell you anything about your mother contacting her then she should be ignored by you.

Hi,
I'm having a hard time and not really enjoying life at the moment. I've NC because my name was identifying, I don't think many have heard my background story.

My parents were EA. I took myself off to a psychiatrist at 17 after feeling suicidal with my lot in life, parents, just been dumped by my first slightly physically abusive boyfriend etc.
She confirmed EA told me she wanted me on AD but needed my parents permission and would have talked to SS if it wasn't for my age. So she advised me to wait a few months til I was off to University and to never come back.
The AD fell through as she called my parents to explain everything to them and they refused saying I'd get hooked.
There were instances of Physical abuse from my Dad too. It wouldn't be often but he'd have a look in his eye and would just hit me constantly while I cowered. The last time he attacked me was 9 years ago when I was pregnant with my first. My Mum shouted a question from the kitchen and I answered from the sofa. She didn't hear me and shouted for me to answer when I got up to say I did... My dad had that look in his eye grabbed my hand and twisted it behind my back.
I told my Mum, Nan (who I ran off to) and my ex (who was my bf at the time we have 2 kids)... No one seemed to care... My mum said half heartifly "don't do that she's pregnant".
Speaking of pregnancy I did what a lot of people with a crappy family situation do. I was desperate for my own little family so I went to Uni to find a husband. Said Ex was in my course; we had a nice year together before he cheated on me. Fearful of failing my course or not having a partner at the end of my course and ending up back with my parents and, not writing this lightly, killing myself. I begged and begged him to give it another go. He had a dysfunctional family set up and really wanted to be a dad too. So we tried for a baby and I got pregnant a few months later in my final year.
When I called my parents, after the 3 months scan, after telling nearly everyone else, they flipped as expected. Hung up the phone. Called me the next day and told me how disappointed they were with me and that they couldn't talk with me for a while. Ended up being 3 months, I went to collect a pram and on the way went to show my Nan the scan picture. My dad turned up nice as pie and asked why I hadn't said anything and to go see my mother... This is how contact resumed.
Anyway after university I moved up with said Ex and his family over 4 hours drive away.
Life was shit with him as expected but better than being at my parents. We had 2 lo who I continue to dote on. He cheated again when youngest was 1. I was scared of being alone, I didn't have much self confidence or worth.
I had a breakdown between babies and panic attacks/agrophobia that CBT and the councillor did wonders for and I will always be thankful for.
We tried a session of relate. But he said "I want EThreepwood to find a step dad and I just provide financially" That was the final straw for me. Hurt me but not my babies. So I ditched him and got myself a council property in the same place... I wasn't going back to my parents.

Now after that my issue. My Mum is terminal and in a lot of pain. She was diagnosed with a rare cancer in 2015 and now she had the nothing that can be done talk in November. She's getting tired and breathless because it's spreading everywhere and especially in her lungs.
She is a brilliant GM to my LOs. Can't fault her. But I still can't shake the thought in my mind that I'm not close to her. Even with so many days left I still forget to text her everyday... she's not on my mind. I hate the guilt. I've cried about it now and again but possibly not as much as a should have? Will I have regrets? I don't know.
I think my Dad is going to use the insurance money to try to move up to me. I like my distance with him. After a few days I'm done with him. The sly digs bring me into a huge defence mode and I can feel the stress on my muscles physically too...

I don't know what I want from this post it was quite therapeutic writing it all down. I'm struggling with exhaustion right now. I'm a single mum, working FT in a stressful job trying to keep it all together. Can't even have a good night sleep because youngest keeps waking up and screaming...

I suspect that for everyone, Ashparo, the decision to go NC is a journey and that no one can tell how long that journey will last.

For me, the first three or four months were the worst. There were days when I felt crippled by the grief: because it is a form of grieving, a sorrow for the mother/daughter relationship you should have had but was denied to you. Days like those I would engage in manic activity in an attempt to distract and displace. I would put on loud cheerful music in the kitchen and furiously chop my way through a mountain of veg and batch cook. In fact, you could pretty much tell the state of my mind by the contents of the freezer. It was stuffed to bursting. The times when the bursts of activity didn't quite do the trick, I would retire to bed and cry till I was all cried out. That's when keeping a journal helped.

I knew the FOG was lifting when I started to have more good days than bad (although I was still vulnerable to unexpected side-swipes). Now, six months in, I only have the occasional wobble and I have strategies in place to deal with those when they happen.

You've only been NC for a short while so it's early days still. I would say be patient and give it more time. Your decision to go NC was not made lightly - you agonised over it (because you are a normal and reasonable person) - but try to remember why you did it. And above all, remind yourself that you are protecting your children from your mother's toxic influence. You are breaking the cycle of abuse - and that means you are stronger than you think.

EThree - what a survivor you are. You have nothing to feel guilty about re your mother and if your father moves to be beat you you can always move.

I'm struggling as I need a friend, support, help, advice but can't risk it.