Breakdown of marriage after 15 years - a bit of a shock.

[ChristyC]

My husband and I have been married for 15 years. We have 2 lovely children and a lovely home, he works hard, as do I and we've always had a lot of fun and laughs. The problem is, that when we socialise, he drinks so much and gets aggressive with other people and myself. He has never hit me, but been very intimidating, throws things around and quite frankly scares me. He has a reputation for being tough and not one to mess with and although the incidences are not particually frequent I know they are damaging. A couple of years ago he ended up in crown court after beating someone up and I stood by him over 10 long months when others didn't want to know. He promised then to not drink so much but since then there have been at least 4 incidences when he has and behaved really badly. He is a lovely man when sober, but the way he behaves when he is drunk is appalling. I am at a point now where I don't trust him not to do it again. 2 weeks ago he moved out and I have really enjoyed the time on my own. He has behaved badly when drunk for a long time - certainly since I have known him and as he barely remembers the next day, he can't seem to understand how crippling it is for me. I remember his face and eyes when he is drunk and how scared and angry I am and I think that each time over the years he has behaved like that a little piece of love for him has died. He has been coming back home to see the children but the pressure he is putting on me to work it out is really hard to deal with. I feel like I am bailing out, although he has been given so many chances I have never asked him to leave before. I think I am looking for someone out there who may have been in a similiar situation and can give me any advice or pointers as to where I go from here. Many thanks.

Hi Wildthings - has he tried AA?

Know what you mean about thinking it can't be me this is happening to - it's taken me a lot over the years to believe this and I still - even now- make excuses for him.

I'vr started to tell people I know what's going on - little by little because I can't face the sympathy - and have to keep telling myself that it's not my shameful secret.

Must go

Wildthings,

All of your writings are full of emotional pain.

"But I am at a loss as to what to do to save us, save him, save our wonderful life together. I know I cannot save him, but I want to try to".

Do you really have a "wonderful life" together or is this the denial voice in you talking trying to put a gloss on things?.

I am so sorry to write the following but you cannot try to save him for him. You do realise this even though you want to try. He has to want to address the issues re alcohol for his own self and be serious about doing so. He made a conscious choice to drink.

All you can do for your own self is to change your reactions to what he has done to you as a family. All he will do is drag you all further down with him if you choose to stay and he seeks no help.

An alcoholic's primary relationship is with drink - absolutely everything else comes a dim and distant second. You say that your children adore him. I would actually challenge that assumption - growing up in a household with a heavy drinker is no picnic at all for children. They may also go onto choose partners who drink heavily themselves or throw themselves into caring/rescuing type behaviours in relationships i.e trying to save others. Is this what you really want for them?. I think not.

If you really want to help him he will have to seek help on his own without contact from you. He will need to be serious about seeking proper medical help and get ongoing counselling for his drinking. It will be hard for him but he has to face it alone as these are his issues.

There are no guarantees here - he could lose everything and still carry on drinking.

I would urge you to talk with Al-anon; none of what you write would be seen as at all unusual to them. They've seen all this before. I will put up the details of Al-anon's website for you.

mmmmm, no he hasn't tried aa. I've nagged him for some time to get help, but he can't admit to himself that's it's got that bad. Even though deep down I think he knows that it has. I'm a naturally very forgiving person and usually happy, (don't know how I've managed it tbh!!)I'm also quite emotionally compicated and I'm drawn to complex people (friends too) ...
The 2 things that have tipped me over in to feeling utterly deperate were (big deep breath) one night I left him with dc for the evening (very rare that I do this but had a work meeting). When I returned, very late, dc asleep but dh almost unconcious with drink. I was totally livid. What if they'd woken up? There'd been an emergency? He felt very guilty. But then a week later dd fell out of bed, and dh was drunk and had a huge raging fit infront of her (she's 2) and me, blaming it all on me because I'd forgotten to put the matress on the floor to stop her hurting herslef. He called me every name, then crashed a chair around in the next room. Dd never seen him really drunk before, she was shaking with fear. I am heartbroken. I feel like a huge piece of me is dying. To top it all, 2 nights later he went out and bought a huge mount of alcohol. I hid it, and he called me controlling and tried to weedle me in to giving it to him all night.

Sorry to hijak your post Christy....I hope things are going well for you and that you're holding it all together and coping. I am thinking about all of you who are going through this. It sucks

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Wildthings,

"mmmmm, no he hasn't tried aa. I've nagged him for some time to get help, but he can't admit to himself that's it's got that bad".

Alcoholics are also very good at denial. He will not try AA or any other organisation till he hits his own personal rock bottom and even then he may not seek help. All you can do for your own self is to help both you and your child.

"Even though deep down I think he knows that it has. I'm a naturally very forgiving person and usually happy, (don't know how I've managed it tbh!!)I'm also quite emotionally compicated and I'm drawn to complex people (friends too) ..."

That's an interesting statement you've made there; I am wondering if you grew up surrounded by all sorts of emotional chaos and relatives or parents who drank heavily themselves. You of course do not have to answer that but it may come to explain why you are yourself drawn to "complex" people.

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Hi GUM

I remember you from your own postings on this subject. How are you doing these days?. I hope you got support for your own self.

Am very sorry also to read about your splitting up. That day must have been very hard.

Mine has just announced he's not leaving after all has just announced that he will leave when we sell the house (first I'd heard)
I have been living for the middle of next month when we had agreed he would go'
I really am beginning to hate him

Hi GUM - I do remember you from an old thread - how is it without him?

From where I am at the moment anything would be better than this

Thank you ATM, I am going to get in touch with al-anon. Have you been through something similar? you seem to be so astute.

This thread has helped me to see a few things more clearly and I'm going to push hard for change now. Zookeeper, I hope you can sort things out and make things work in the way you want and need them to.

Thanks so much everyone for sharing x

Have had dh around at the weekend to be with the kids which was so good for them. I have told dh that there is no hope for our marriage and that he has to get some sort of proffessional help if he is ever to release his demons. He came back to the house tonight to see the kids and to have a shower and we talked for the first time in 3 weeks without shouting at each other. The kids have been told, as have their teacher, I think a way for me to make the whole thing more concrete in my mind. dh seems more accepting of the situation now so I am hoping for a calmer time coming up. Having said that, his boss came round this evening to let me know that if I need any help, then to give him a ring. Him, along with my mother, my MIL and SIL and friend all seem to under the impression that he may turn nasty and they are a bit concerned for my safety which doesn't bode so well. I am keeping the faith that DH will behave properly, if only for the sake of the kids. I hope to God he proves me right.

christy it may well get worse before it gets better but I think it's a very good sign that he's being ok now - it's very early days.

I think when a relationship breaks down you both have to go through the whole gamut of relief /pain/ fear/ grief / anger and not neccessarily in that order.

I do family law (the irony!) and ime the breakdown of a relationship is almost like a breavement wwith all the stages of grief that that entails.

All you can do is ride the storm, trust that you are doing the right thing (which you are) and look forward.

From what you have said it's taken you a long time to come to this decision and so you will have been thnking of it for months. For your dh, like my dp it is still very raw.

I'm at that awful stage where my dp says he will go then doesn't and is still here. I'm trying to follow my own advice!

Oh zookeeper, it must be very tough on you, having him around when you don't want him there. I am glad that my dh decided to move out and give me some space to think, although it hasn't benefited from it as I don't want him to return. I think it may have been different if I had asked him to leave, he may have dug his heels in more. Iswym about the grief aspect. For me, it feels like that and for him to and everyday is a whole new set of emotions in a completely different order. I plan to go to an Al-Anon meeting tonight which will hopefully help me to get things into perspective but I have to admit to being a bit scared about it

Hi christy and wildthings

christy did you go to Alanon? how was it?

Hi zookeeper,
No, I didn't get there in the end. DH was meant to look afetr the kids that evening for an hour or two, but came back home to have a shower and started drawing me in on how I could end it all just because of a couple of drinks and I got so mad I told him to leave, which he did. Oh well, maybe next week. How are you getting on?

Hallo Christy & the rest, just wanted to add my support. It sounds absolutely dreadful. My dp drinks (God, aren't we legion?) - he's in the theatre & there seems to be a culture of drinking - as they give up smoking, his friends seem to drink more. As a rule he doesn't get abusive or violent, but if he's depressed, it drives him deeper into the depression and he sits up most of the night alone, getting through a couple of bottles of wine (luckily doesn't like whiskey) and just being by himself. And I go to bed and feel SO alone . I know exactly what you mean about wanting to help them, but as Meerkat and others have told me also, we can't - they have to hit rock bottom themselves, and they may never get there... Perhaps yours will, if he misses you and your family enough, I hope so.

I haven't reached the point of wanting to split - and hope I don't as he's been the love of my life (ironically, exh was teetotal and I missed being able to share a drink with him - now I find that some evenings I don't even want a single glass!) Dp is fine when he's working and happy - we share a bottle or two and it feels like a normal happy relationship. It's just when he's unemployed and depressed - which has lasted the last 6 months - that I feel miserable.

Really hope things work out for you. Interested to see you do gardening - I suggested it to dp as a stress-buster or even a stopgap job when he's between plays - I love being in my little London plot even in the rain - but he's only just begun to be able to tell a pansy from a bindweed .

The pity of it is, these men are intrinsically nice guys - or we wouldn't have fallen for them in the first place. It's so hard to give up on them, and try not to feel like failures - but we AREN't failures - we are NOT responsible.

OH is coming back home tonight to spend some time with the children, so I plan to visit a friend for a while. Yesterday was the first day I didn't cry and I have managed to talk to a relative today without breaking down so possibly a sign of getting stronger? Haven't seen OH since Tuesday, so that could be the reason, but definately feeling more upbeat and positive for the first time in a month. Family members have told me that for the best part of this year I have seemed very down, stressed and introverted, which is not like me really. Am loving the peace at night-time and don't feel that I need anyone around, but that could change as time goes on, who knows? My hope is that OH will be reasonable and not drink and force my hand in calling for back-up should he get aggressive. Children are doing well and looking forward to Daddys visit later. Still feel in a state of limbo until I know what OH plans to do long term, paperwork and finances still need to be sorted - a job for Sunday evening I think. Love and hugs to you all have have given great words of support. xx

DH had the children today - took them off for a few hours, came back and I find myself being drawn into the same converstation which is really beginning to tire now. Its the usual 'I don't know how you can end it just like that - you must be seeing someone - I know I have a problem but its a sickness and i can't believe you aren't going to help me through it, you're my wife, our vows said in sickness and in health and you're walking away now instaed of helping me, blah de blah de blah'. I said, 'yes you do have a sickness and you need to sort it out, so you can be happy, but it won't benefit us as a couple because I don't want it anymore', he said 'well theres no point in me sorting out my problem then, is there?'. Just have to ask, is it me or is he not getting the point? Hysteria is setting in now, and when I replay the conversation in my head I keep laughing my socks off! DH also said that he had kept away for a month and really he was expecting to be back home by now, despite the fact he has done absolutely NOTHING to show me how serious he is about adressing his problem. GRRRRRRR! Feel better now!

Hi all - been away for the weekend to a wedding - alone in what felt like a sea of happy couple - got a bit down really as everybody was so loved up.

christy you sound as though you're doing well - the fact that he's saying that he may as well not address his drinking without you says it all really - my dp came out this weekend when I got home and blamed me for being paranoid about drink as though it was my problem.

Hi Tanee, my dp sounds like yours in that he gets withdrawn and depressed and we too have lived through redundancies brought about, I suspect - although he would never admit it- by his drinking.

The irony is is that he has stopped again and I know he hasn't touched a drop recently but I'm bloody bored of dealing with it . I'm also very angry at the years it has blighted our relationship and now finally killed it, which is a bit unfair on him but how I feel.

I never seem to have the time to post properly but this thread is comforting - I hope you all carry on contributing

Hi zookeeper, sorry to hear you didn't have a ball at the wedding. I turned down an invitation to a wedding recently as I knew I wouldn't be able to smile stupidly throughout, if you're feeling down they can be really depressing!!

You are right though, after they have stopped drinking, the effects fade even quicker for them and they just don't see the impact - I really relate to your feelings of anger - how the same issue can keep cropping up and you know that at some point in the future it WILL rear its ugly head again and you WILL have to deal with/go through the same emotions and like me, I think you are at the point where you say, No, enough is enough, I'm too tired to think of it anymore, let alone do anything about it.

Plus of course, they have to offload some guilt, and because of the type of person you are, you find yourself accepting some of the guilt or thinking you should and round you go again. My OH had the nerve to say yesterday, that if in 9 months I was with someone else, he would know that the person I was with was the person I was having an affair with and he would be as mad as hell, because he would have had to carry the guilt when really it would have been my fault. Can't reason with that!

I do hope you are OK zookeeper - keep the anger for the moment and remember the reasons if it helps you to stay strong. xx

Hi Christy,

If he's intent on believing you only want out because you're seeing someone else, that really shows that he doesn't REALLy want to face up to his illness - it's easier to blame you. If you really have reached the end of the line with him, just ignore this emotional blackmail. You'll need to be tough - even though it tears you up inside.

Zookeeper, sorry your dp's the same. Mine is actually fine when he's working - in fact, things have been much better this past week because he starts work next Monday. We had a really nice weekend, but I do dread the next time. We did a lot of talking on Saturday night and he admits the last months have not been good for the relationship - the trouble is, when the depression hits, he's not logical and slides into despond again. We've only lived together for the past year though we've known each other for almost 20 years, so it remains to be seen how well I can stand up to the future.

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Hi GinnedUp, don't kick yourself too much. If he's being good, I'd do the same. Trouble is, we do love these reprobates, because they're great guys when they're not ill. I'd do the same - but yes, we then have to live our lives dreading the next episode.

Wish you luck, and let us know how things go.

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I suppose its down to where you see yourself in say 10 years. I realised that my situation is unlikely to be any different, only I will be feeling more bitter and resentful and I actually feel that I am worth so much more.