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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Advice for the OW

314 replies

babycow38 · 21/09/2018 02:32

I can only tell you about me and my husband and two beautiful daughter
We had a lovely llife, we did everything together. Does that make you stop and feel awful? You didn't give a crap about my children but I want to tell you about them
They love their life with Mum and Dad, they come home from school and feel happy, they do school work chat to mum and. Dad, they feel happy, secure, wanted. You come in their life? Other woman?? you hate the fact dad is in their life, you are jealous, dad distances himself to appease you , you have awfully messed up girls

OP posts:
LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 23/09/2018 11:11

Robin, the OW largely gets what she wants. If she gets 'crumbs' then she gets the choice ones. She has a life outside of your (generic) marriage.

The poor cheated-on wife gets the dirty pants and socks, the childcare, the residual family time, the taking for granted.

Please don't make the point about 'sloppy seconds' either because that door swings both ways, doesn't it?

I know you think that I'm defending OW; I'm not. I just can't budge from the position of knowing that if the married man respected his marriage, there would be no OW. You can reverse that for married women/OM obviously. It's indisputable but all of the blame is slapped on the OW and it's ridiculous.

Robin2323 · 23/09/2018 11:17

Also - I was an OW, I'm not now. I don't consider myself a scumbag, slut or any of those lovely terms you and others are so fond of using

Oh it all makes sense now.
You feel I'm personally attacking you.

As the ow I assume your end game was him to leave him wife for you.
This would involved heartache for another human being.

Doesn't matter what adults do unless it hurts someone else.
This is what I have issue with.

Friends husband has learnt his 'lesson'
We all make mistakes
But given half a chance ow would be back in there.
Funny her husband not bothered now.

Robin2323 · 23/09/2018 11:25

Robin, the OW largely gets what she wants. If she gets 'crumbs' then she gets the choice ones. She has a life outside of your (generic) marriage.

Ha ha

You lost all credibility when you said you were the ow.

You ware this with pride like a badge of honour.

And did you get what you wanted.

He obviously didn't leave his wife for you.

So you were just in it for Fun ?

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 23/09/2018 11:27

Of course I don't feel you're attacking me. What's to attack?

You assume wrongly. I think it's a habit because you have no idea what goes on in a marriage or how your friend, her husband or the OW feel about this.

You only have to read this board to see that men (and women) do leave their spouses, either because they've had enough, or because of an affair (decided to leave or been thrown out), or because they've met somebody else.

Stop speculating about other people, do.

BitchQueen90 · 23/09/2018 11:35

@Robin2323 the wife doesn't have the whole bread loaf. She's being lied to and made a fool of by someone who promised to love her forever. If she stays with her cheating husband she'll probably always have trust issues and feelings of hurt. And she'll often be judged by others as weak for forgiving him.

That's not a bread loaf. That sounds an awful life to me.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 23/09/2018 11:39

I've just seen your other post, Robin. Frankly, I don't mind if my credibility with you is lost as I don't have much time for your silly posts.

Keep your nosey beak out of other people's relationships and focus on your own if you have one.

GloomyMonday · 23/09/2018 11:43

I have to agree with lyin (unusually).

While the affair is ongoing the wife has half a husband, with his mind elsewhere. The ow gets snatched moments for sure, and it must be hard watching him leave to play happy families, but she's his main focus.

Once the affair is discovered, he generally throws ow under the bus because she's not worth giving up a whole life for. The bubble bursts and he sees her, and the affair, for what it was. But the wife doesn't win anything except a known cheat and liar.

Awful for everyone, with no winners. It's why I look down on those that orchestrate the situation, crossing their fingers that when the music stops it's someone else who gets hurt. Scum indeed.

Ivgotasecretcanyoukeepit · 23/09/2018 11:44

Lying as always you make great points but you’re wasting your time. Posters such as Robin and Gloomy would rather believe that poor helpless husbands are snatched and lured away by women who lack morals and humility. I forgot men just simply cannot chose to keep their cock in their pants Hmm

It would be great if @babycow38 could return to the thread she started regarding an affair her husband had 5 years ago and tell us why she can forgive her husband who made the marriage vows all of those years ago but yet she still utterly detests the OW who made no such vows.

ScattyCharly · 23/09/2018 11:53

What is wrong with people thinking OW have no reponsiblilty in these situations?

Yes man breaks wedding vows, total lack of human decency
But OW - total lack of human decency. This is somehow ok/blameless? No, sorry if you think this, your moral code is ropey.

Screaminginsidemeagain · 23/09/2018 11:54

To all you ‘all the blame is the husbands’- fuck the fuck off. It takes 2 to tango and to decent people marriage should mean off limits!

Our OW was my childhood best friend, god mother to my children. My confidant- she knew what he was like to me, everything g and she didn’t care.
They both lied for 8years, she carried on listening to my woes all that time.
She also had affairs with at least 2 other married men while being friends with their wives. She total deserves the blame.
Rot in hell you sociopath!

BrownPaperTeddy · 23/09/2018 11:59

What anyone feels about 2 different people is beside the point surely?

2 people have an affair.

We can judge those 2 people individually.

We can judge what the husband did (assuming he is the person having the affair) for what he has done to his wife, children, family

Then separately to the man we can judge the OW for her actions. I don't believe the OW entices, lures or kidnaps the MM. He can and should say no. But I do judge the OW for her actions.

Those of you excusing the OW by saying she isn't the one that has made vows - an affair doesn't just happen during marriage. If in a long term relationship one partner embarks on an affair is that ok because they haven't taken vows with their partner? Clearly it isn't ok.

Don't want to be judged as an OW? Don't be the OW.

Very simple.

GloomyMonday · 23/09/2018 12:04

"Robin and Gloomy would rather believe that poor helpless husbands are snatched and lured away by women who lack morals and humility. "

Don't put words in my mouth. Nothing poor or helpless about the men, 100% responsible for betraying their wives.

I hold a negative opinion of ow too though, for watching him betray his wife while simpering in his arms and thinking she's got herself a catch.

Robin2323 · 23/09/2018 12:12

Keep your nosey beak out of other people's relationships and focus on your own if you have one.

At least I'm not chasing married men.

fifizzz · 23/09/2018 12:13

I was an OW he was a serial cheat (I didn't know this until he told me later on and I ended it ) , his wife took him back 3 times, called the ows slags whore put a location tracker on his phone, called him 20 times a day, exposed him to family asked to check his bank statements, threatened to tell the kids about his cheating. I felt very sorry for the wife, that is no life for her constantly checking on her husband she will probably continue to take him back because she blames the slags & whores.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 23/09/2018 12:14

Thank you, Gloomy and Ivgotasecretcanyoukeepit (PLL reference?)

I can understand why babycow and other wives forgive their husbands their affairs. Long history, shared experience, joint mortgage and finannces, children together, family concept and perceived drop in 'position', wider friendship group and judgement... all of those points would have a bearing.

Love might also come into it but I don't think so, certainly not at the forefront. When somebody cheats, you can't love them in the same way that you did. I don't believe anybody who tells me otherwise because if it's such a wretched thing to do, to forsake your vows, then how can you ever get back to where you were before it happened?

For babycow and I guess for Robin, and any other poster who wants to vent their spleen at OW I will tell you that the experience is one that I will never repeat. It changed me, made me more tolerant of some things and less tolerant of others - but I don't see life in black and white and I believe to do so is a folly.

Having an affair was an insane thing to do and I regret it. I can see how easily it is to fall into having one and, if you don't understand what that 'falling in' is like then you'll have to take my word for it that this was what it was like for me. I was in his thrall. He was older (56) and in a position of power. I was 24. Old enough to know better but not wise enough to realise that or the implications. I never thought about his wife or his children, I was indifferent thinking that this was 'none of my business'. I thought I loved him and I still think that I did. I couldn't tell you how he felt as it wasn't something we discussed much.

Believe me when I tell you that it would be a rare OW indeed who comes out from an affair unscathed. I certainly didn't. I've said this before on another thread and it still sounds fanciful but I can't think of another way to describe it; it left a stain on my soul and I can't scrub that away. I can't put any of this right.

I can though post on threads where OW are and offer to talk them through getting out of the affair. And I do. I have talked to dozens of OW here, privately. At no point will I join in with a wish to 'keep the magic alive' at weekends and holiday periods, but I can empathise and understand, because I do.

This site could have and be a unique platform (away from relationships board) to talk about the realities of an affair, being in one, without glorifying it but laying it bare, warts and all - and the script. It's not the same script that is touted here and it is more like a 'play - with different endings - unfolding'.

I truly understand the irony here when I say that there are similarities with rats... you don't know how close you are to one. There are more OW out there (pending, existing and long-term) than anybody has any idea about. It's not going away and slinging insults won't achieve that.

Robin, you said in your post that I wear being an OW like a badge of 'pride'. Nothing could be further from the truth. I acknowledge that I did that, that it was a despicable thing to do.

Robin2323 · 23/09/2018 12:15

"Robin and Gloomy would rather believe that poor helpless husbands are snatched and lured away by women who lack morals and humility. "

Not true.
If a man strays he obviously unhappy.
Sadly instead of working on the relationship some men choose to be destructed by ow.
Seen it do many times.

GloomyMonday · 23/09/2018 12:48

You're right lyin all of those things come into any decision the wife makes to forgive her husband and stay in the marriage, it's a whole package of things to consider.

I wonder how many wives would forgive so readily if they didn't have children, or if they were financially independent.

I'm glad you recognise that your affair was despicable, because it was. I assume your 56yo affair partner had a 56yo wife? I expect she went quietly crazy as she felt the distance growing between them. Once the affair was uncovered I wonder if she stood naked in front of the mirror and cried because she couldn't physically compete with a 24yo? My sister did, and messages from ow saying 'he's mine now' and 'he's glad he doesn't have to sleep next to your wrinkly old body.'

Just one of many reasons why 'ow isn't to blame' boils my piss as an argument. Not to blame, but not acting with integrity either.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 23/09/2018 13:07

Gloomy it was a despicable act, I'm not a despicable person - and I wasn't then either. I was still the person that I was but I did a dreadful thing and I have no excuse for it. I'm not going to talk about his wife. I didn't then and won't now, it's not anybody's business.

I've read posts here from TheFormidableMrsC and what her ex husband and the OW put her through are abominable. That takes a special brand of spite and it's one that your sister's ex's OW seems to share. I would not have done that, I don't understand the need to rub somebody's face in it just to hurt them.

I really don't understand that level of vitriol, I can only think that this nonsense is what husband told OW and she's glorying in it, forgetting that she too will age and, if there isn't something stronger than her perfect body that is the basis for their relationship, then she too could find herself in your sister's position. I personally think that comments such as this OW made come from a position of insecurity. If you are secure in your relationship, you have no need to compare yourself favourably or otherwise, with the ex.

Your last sentence though... I just don't agree with it. The OW/OM isn't to blame, the errant spouse is. That doesn't mean that the OW/OM aren't behaving in a disgraceful manner.

Robin2323 · 23/09/2018 13:09

Your poor sister Thanks

AynRandTheObjectivist · 23/09/2018 13:16

So if I was to text your dp constantly. Pay him loads of attention. Even steal a friendly kiss - you'd be ok with it???

It would depend entirely on how he responded to you. If he told you to back off, he's married, I'd be fine and just feel a bit sorry for you. (You think nobody's ever hit on my husband?) If he was receptive to you, then I would be very angry with him. I wouldn't think much of you as a person but I wouldn't share my ire between the two of you. He's married to me, he has a family with me, he's the one shirking his responsibility. You wouldn't matter.

As we ascertained - if he showed keenness and willingness to cheat on me, it wouldn't matter whether an OW even existed.

Not disproportionate. You should hear the language I reserve for the men.

Then why aren't we hearing it? Why are you instead so much more passionate about defending your right to pour ire on OW?

It's as LyingWitch said...there's this overtone of getting a bit of lip service out of the way regarding the MM, purely to start an inferno over the OW. Look at the OP. Husband shits all over the family, and the person OP wants to question about kids and guilt is the mistress!

Sadli · 23/09/2018 13:23

I don't think there's any excuse for anyone to knowingly be the OW, it is vile and degrading.

However I wouldn't blame an OW for ending a marriage she was never in, it is the man who does that. I don't see husbands as poor pathetic creatures duped by OW, a man makes his choices just as a woman does.

It's the man who is cruel to his family. Though obviously sometimes a wife can do things that encourage a man to cheat same way an OW can encourage the cheating.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 23/09/2018 13:47

Robin2323 Sun 23-Sep-18 12:12:00
At least I'm not chasing married men.

I was 24 and he was 56, Robin. It might suit your narrative to picture me stalking, lassoing and finally pinning my quarry to the floor... but do you really think that's how it was?

There has been an awful lot of pointed remarks about OWs pursuing, stealing, taking away the poor husbands involved and I really think this is what many cheated-on spouses believe. To their detriment.

If you keep your focus on the OW rather than on your spouse then you're giving the person who should have been loyal to you, the message that it's fine - there's someone else in the picture - and they can take the heat - because you are proprietorial about a man that you mistakenly believe you own and refuse to accept has betrayed you.

OW/OM is wrong, wrong, all shades of wrong - no argument there. Your (generic) husband is half of that duo - and they made vows to you.

They are not part of your marriage and shouldn't be, either.

AynRandTheObjectivist · 23/09/2018 13:47

My sister did, and messages from ow saying 'he's mine now' and 'he's glad he doesn't have to sleep next to your wrinkly old body.'

Well that is vileness beyond the affair itself. Obviously the OW is responsible for any taunts or abuse she sends to the wife.

That's not LyingWitch though. No affair is honourable, but not all affairs are the same.

AynRandTheObjectivist · 23/09/2018 13:57

At least I'm not chasing married men.

Somehow I doubt that the 24 year old LyingWitch had to do much chasing of the 56 year old MM. And we know she wouldn’t do it now.

The invective towards her is making me very uneasy. She did something wrong many years ago, she knows it, she is sorry, she will not do it again. It’s worth remembering that if the man who actually made a vow had kept it, then none of this would have happened.

I don’t understand what sort of moral superiority people think they are getting out of implying that LyingWitch is, today, a harlot who eats married men for breakfast or somehow comparable to a nasty little slimebag who sends abusive messages to people. Affairs are never right, but neither are they always a case of two irredeemably evil people who deserve eternal hellfire.

Robin2323 · 23/09/2018 14:00

I said before my best friend was very angry with her husband.
She did not see him as defenceless and told him he should have back off, from ow when thinks got into inappropriately territory.

She also felt very sorry for the ow as the husband had no intention of leaving his wife for this emotional / non physical affair.

But she does blame her, the ow for 'trying' to prove to the husband , that she , the ow was the one he should be with not his wife.