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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

A thread to moan on until I’m rid of exP

999 replies

UnimaginativeUsername · 17/03/2018 20:30

(Ex)P and I are separating but we have to live together until we sell this house (due to finances). So I thought I’d start a thread to help me get through the next few months.

OP posts:
UnimaginativeUsername · 24/06/2018 09:24

We haven’t really discussed it. I’m fully expecting just that’s from him (but clearly DS2 will be bringing all his stuff to his main home). DS2 did say that he was allowed to take all ex’s consoles to my house.

Non-kids stuff, I’ve decided I don’t really care. I can buy my own furniture. Except he won’t have a house or anything sensible to take anything to.

I’m glad your 9 months in purgatory are now over @helpimgoingcrazyhere. Hopefully we’ll all be where you are soon.

OP posts:
shitwithsugaron · 24/06/2018 09:26

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

shitwithsugaron · 24/06/2018 09:29

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AsleepAllDay · 24/06/2018 10:39

You've gotten this far, of course you will cope! It'll be a shock - so long putting up with that arse and now he's out of your hair!

namechanged77 · 25/06/2018 09:46

I know I'm in Groundhog Day - and I have to find the courage to break out. But I just need to vent for now!!

DH has had a weekend of doing those little things that maybe aren't that terrible on their own but collectively they drive me round the twist...

Sat - DC1 had a concert. DH couldn't be arsed to go and see her at the interval... In the evening he fell asleep around 7.30, then woke up, complained the film was boring - then demanded to watch the football he hadn't said anything about wanting to watch before...

Sun - went to a National Trust place. He made both DCs cry (by telling them off unnecessarily harshly).

And I shouldn't be surprised - but we're doing Relate and I feel like I'm doing all the emotional heavy lifting - even having to make appointments for Conversations... The poor flake doesn't like not having any warning I'll bring things up. Last time he didn't talk to me for a fortnight..

Turnedovernewleaf · 25/06/2018 22:02

@namechanged77

My ex also does some of the things you have listed. It's just so infuriating Angry

I really dislike the way my ex just thinks about himself and the Dc come 2nd.
For example on occasion I have go to work of an evening and the next morning I'm always met with a similar story from Dc " we didn't have tea until 7:30pm "
" we told dad we were hungry but he said we have to wait because he was watching tv / playing on his phone / lying down asleep e.t.c "

Then, when he does get up he shouts about the mess they've created ( but to me this is them being self sufficient by building dens / using crafts e.t.c keeping themselves occupied while he can't be arsed). SO FRUSTRATING

He always puts his needs first before theirs.

Tonight they're hot, sweaty and had sun cream on all day. I'd given them there tea but was going out to work. So I say " could you give DC a bath or shower please because they're sweaty and covered in suncream. It'll make them feel fresher before going to bed. His reply :

" er no , don't think so. I need to enjoy the sun. I'm going in the garden to lie down"

So unhelpful Angry

Maelstrop · 25/06/2018 23:13

*’’er no , don't think so. I need to enjoy the sun. I'm going in the garden to lie down"

What a twat :(

Turnedovernewleaf · 26/06/2018 09:32

@Maelstrop

Agree with your response 100%

This morning he was 'on top form' for making everyone feel sad

@shitwithsugaron , I hope the first few days and nights have been good for you

@UnimaginativeUsername, how are things going with you

@namechanged77 keep strong I'm sorry that it feels like Groundhog Day for you

Turnedovernewleaf · 29/06/2018 20:27

@UnimaginativeUsername...... just checking in on you. How has your week been ?

Turnedovernewleaf · 30/06/2018 19:40

@UnimaginativeUsername

Hope you don't mind but need to write this down......

Earlier on Ex threw an absolute tantrum over not being able to find his running watch. He was shouting and yelling, banging and moving things around very abruptly.
My DC friends were here and my DC felt embarrassed and upset.
He thought I'd hidden it to stall him going out because he was going to pick up his latest conquest (unlucky for her) and stay in a hotel together tonight before they do a race together early tomorrow morning.

I did not take or move his watch anywhere as he has implied. I'm so angry that he has behaved that way in front of DC and their friends and the wild accusations he yelled AngryAngry

AsleepAllDay · 01/07/2018 00:00

@Turnedovernewleaf wow what a shithead he is Angry

Sounds like it's all 'me me me' and part of him can't accept that you don't care about him like you used to

Also it's a child who can't keep track of his belongings! And he's projecting his spite onto you, thinking you've hidden a sodding watch

UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 00:58

Hi all.

Hi need to catch up - I’ve had a hectic week or so. Lots to report, but I think I’ll read about everyone else first and then write an essay about my news!

I am, as always, delighted to have other people share their frustrations on the thread. It is most definitely our thread, not just mine.

OP posts:
UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 01:03

That is really frustrating @Turnedovernewleaf. I can imagine my ex doing that, right down to the accusing me of hiding it (or pasively aggressively implying it).

Like you’d want to prevent him being anywhere but where you are!

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UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 01:10

@namechanged77 Don’t put too much pressure on yourself. It’s really, really easy to say ‘leave’ from this side of the situation; not so much if you rewind the rest of us several months.

I was talking to friends tonight about how I should have just left years ago for various reasons but one of my friends pointed out that I was trying to save the relationship. That isn’t a failing of any kind and it’s absolutely reasonable that we do try before giving up.

In hindsight I can say that I should have done all sorts, but I was always trying to do the right thing at the time. None of us will judge you for hoping that you’ll find a way out of your Groundhog Day situation (but equally we won’t deny that it sounds really irritating - to put it mildly).

OP posts:
UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 01:11

@shitwithsugaron Have you managed to move past the feeling that you are living out the shawshank redemption yet?

I am loving the film comparisons on this thread!

OP posts:
UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 01:19

And so, my news...

I think the house move is nearly bookable. I’ve signed all my paperwork and provided proof of where my funds come from and it appears to be mostly a case of agreeing dates now. So hopefully I’ll escape soon.

My hatred for ex is not diminishing. He’s awful. I had a bit fight with him last weekend and kind of retreated into myself for a bit. I think I’ll write more about it - and the various seemingly petty but very significant irritations that comprise daily life with ex - tomorrow.

I am pretty tired tonight. Today has involved taking DS2 to snowboarding (and quietly admiring the instructor), then both DS2 and I going sea kayaking. And this evening I’ve been out for dinner and drinks with wonderful friends. So I think sleep now is the best plan of action.

The butter saga and ex’s martyr act can wait til tomorrow.

OP posts:
namechanged77 · 01/07/2018 09:10

Thank you @UnimaginativeUsername It's an added layer of shit I put onto myself - beating myself up for not calling it. But you're right - I am trying to fix it.

Counselling is tough - the poor diddums feels got at. But it's really good for recognising just how bloody angry I am - and that I have a right to be and he has to deal with it.

He's been away since Thursday, which is nice. But the DCs were really hard work yesterday - probably the heat! So hard.

I'm sorry it's been tough for you. Negotiating daily life with such a f**#wit is tough. But you're getting there - and it sounds like you've got good friends supporting you IRL. And us to vent to!!

UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 11:20

Ex and I did counselling years ago and one of the outcomes was that ex decided that I made the counselling all about him and it wasn’t fair. I didn’t - he just remembers it that way because the process didn’t 100% reinforce his victim/martyr self belief. In fact, the counsellor actually challenged him on some of his abusive behaviour (specifically around financial abuse), which clearly was just me manipulating the situation (or something).

About 2 years ago he suggested going for counselling again, but with a not subtle hint that it was ‘not to be all about him this time’. So he clearly planned to use it as a tool of abuse. And at that time I’d just started naming his rape/sexual abuse of me and he’d told me that I wasn’t allowed to tell anyone about it (apparently I should have known that wouldn’t have included a counsellor). But there’s no point in going to counselling with someone like him. It was so horrible the first time; I couldn’t face it when he’d clearly be going into it with a revenge motive.

The other outcome of the counselling was that ex realised that he just wasn’t committed to the relationship. Or the counsellor made it clear that was the case. So ex decreed that he ‘had made a commitment’ to me and the children repeatedly - usually with his favourite martyred tone - for years. In hindsight this choice of language was deliberate. He purposefully avoided saying that he loved me. He prides himself on never lying - despite him lying all the time - so it was a very calculated choice of words.

I don’t think he’s actually capable of loving another person - he has actually said that to me at least twice in the past (why didn’t I listen?) - and you cannot have a relationship where one person has not and will not love the other. One half of a couple cannot provide enough love to make it work. So I also could not face trying to pretend that ex reaffirming his choice to resign himself to putting up with me was actually a success (and that was pretty much the best case scenario).

However he now sees my not having organised counselling as evidence that I didn’t try and wasn’t willing to change. It’s so frustrating as all I’ve done is change in this relationship to the point that I completely lost myself. I spent a decade believing that I was irredeemably flawed and needed to change in every way in order to be good enough for him (and he was quite happy to tell me how arrogant and lazy and unattractive and untrustworthy and reckless etc I am throughout). But finally I have come to the conclusion that it wasn’t me; obviously I am as flawed as the next human being, but the problem was that he has never respected or cared for or even really liked me. And I deserve far better than that.

What I can’t quite work out is what he was doing in the relationship in the first place. Well, I have some thoughts on it but, because I am not a horrible sociopath I can’t really understand the motivation. All I can think is that he chose me because I was doing well and recognised as such. This had two advantages for him: 1. That he could use me to overcome his shortfalls and get where he wanted in life; and 2. That he could have the satisfaction of ‘putting me in my place’. Both worked out well for him.

And I don’t think it’s coincidental that he decided to end it only when he’d finally reached a point where he didn’t ‘need’ me to advance his career. I’d served my purpose and had made myself redundant by actually teaching him how to write while I edited and proof-read everything he wrote, and helping him to shape his ideas more effectively. And he’d also finally got a job at a university he thought was worthy of him (although he is still salty that the top university in the region, where he thinks he should be, have declined to employ him several times now) and he’s been promoted beyond me. So he was finally earning more than me and has just paid off his student loan, so he has no need of my money.

But, as I said, I find it all a bit perplexing because I just cannot understand going through life using someone in such a mercenary way.

OP posts:
shitwithsugaron · 01/07/2018 11:36

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 12:17

Last Sunday we had a fight, mostly because I had the temerity to be obviously unhappy at his unilateral decision that he was taking DS2 to the beach.

He had spent the first part of the morning with DS2 playing video games. Ex makes it obvious that I am not welcome and so I just stay away. Then I took DS2 to his swim training and we stopped by Aldi on the way home to grab something for lunch. The aisle of miraculous tat had children’s wetsuits so I bought one for DS2. He was delighted and we talked about going to the beach to try it out on the way home.

At home I made lunch and DS2 went to play more video games with ex (the me doing drudge work while he gets the fun stuff is an enduring feature of the family dynamic). I served lunch and while we were eating ex announce to DS2 that he was talking him to the beach. In my car. With my petrol. To try out the wetsuit I just bought. And with no discussion of this with me whatsoever.

Ex had decided that I had ‘had’ my time with DS2 (doing taxi service to swimming, waiting around while he swam, and going to Aldi to buy some cheese) and it was his ‘turn’. The hours he’d spent playing video games with him (and making it clear I was unwelcome) didn’t count. Obviously.

I’ve come to the conclusion that ex thinks of my time with DS2 using the same logic that means that men decide that women are ‘taking over’ whenever they reach some meagre proportion of the workforce (that’s still well below 50%) and that is fundamentally unfair to them. It’s fine with ex if I am doing drudge work on DS2’s behalf but how dare I expect to have any of the fun time? That’s clearly the reserve of super bloody dad.

So ex decided that we needed to talk about this, and sent DS2 to his room. The talk involved him responding to any of the perfectly reasonable points I made passive aggressively. He just does this martyred sigh and mutters about how there’s no point talking to me about any of this (because I’m so unreasonable and abusive).

Also I have no right to be annoyed about the finances because he has made it very clear several times that I should just tell him what I’ve spent on petrol or things for DS2 and he’ll transfer the money to me. I am being completely unreasonable for not wanting to report (and have to justify as a result) my spending to him. He in no way accepts that there is any legacy of financial abuse in the relationship (or that his attitude is an example of it continuing).

He has completely rewritten the history of the relationship using the logic that I am intrinsically financially incompetent and untrustworthy (whereas he is totally wonderful and so generous because he used his inheritance for the whole family, and didn’t begrudge it going to DS1 too - except he did!).

Apparently my organising a joint account with him when we first moved in together was because I was too irresponsible and needed him to manage the money. It wasn’t because I was the only one of us with a job and I didn’t want to be a financially abusuve arsehole who withheld money from him. No. It couldn’t be that.

Obviously I was the financially irresponsible one (who, when he met me at 27, had just started a permanent academic job before finishing my PhD, who owned a flat and paid the mortgage on it reliably, owned a car, and had just paid off my student loan) and he was a model of financal responsibility who needed to sort me out (a 4th year PhD student living off savings because you only get 3 years of a stipend, who lived in a room in a shared flat and owned no assets whatsoever, and had £15k or so of student loans that he hadn’t even started paying off).

We moved in together because of an unplanned pregnancy. Ex didn’t have a job so I was willing to financially support us all and to return to work after 5 months of maternity leave (because we couldn’t afford to drop down to SMP) while he tried to find an academic job. I didn’t suggest he just look for any job or anything - I was totally supportive of his career. He (magnanimously) was going to look after DS2 while I worked.

A few weeks before I was due to return to work, ex managed to get himself a temporary job in the university I worked at. (He’d never have even known about it been considered for it if I hadn’t worked there). So I had to find childcare for little tiny DS2 and still go back to work because there was no suggestion that actually we could now afford for me to take the full year. No. That was never a vague consideration. (And in hindsight I realise that ex was being a selfish shit).

Anyway, he got the job and decided that he would be paid into his sole account, which he had retained (along with not sharing any of his savings). I only had a joint account, so I was paid into this, and all the bills and spending came out of it. If funds were running out in there, ex would transfer the minimum he could get away with into it. He’d also question my spending all the time - I’d have to explain why I’d spent £90 in the supermarket rather than whatever figure he’d decided it should be (without actually doing the shopping and knowing how much things cost, of course).

But this wasn’t financial abuse; it was him being responsible and looking after the finances. This shitty pattern (including him keeping all the savings in his name) continued until the counselling where the counsellor made it clear that if we were going to pool finances they should all be shared accounts. But, ex decided he still needed to use his ISA for savings because that’s financially prudent. (Splitting them equally between two ISAs was as much not a consideration as him supporting me to have more maternity leave had been). Even then, it was clear which of the one joint accounts was his and which was the ‘main’ one. I have never had a debit card for ‘his’ account and wouldn’t have dared to use it if I did. But he was totally fine to use the ‘main’ account.

Getting back to the actual story... this is just another example of him gaslighting me. Apparently I’m abusive towards him, and ‘we just have very different perspectives’ on the relationship. Except that the bare facts about the organisation of accounts above make it clear that he is financially controlling. And his narrative that I couldn’t be trusted and needed him to organise the finances is exactly the logic a financial abuser would use to justify it.

Because he’s so determined to use abusive tactics (including telling me that it’s my fault for upsetting DS2 when he’s the one who decreed we must ‘discuss’ it - all because I refused to find the suncream like a good little woman so he could take DS2 to the beach) the conversation went nowhere. He took DS2 to the beach with a threat/promise that we’d finish the discussion later.

When he did come back the discussion was lots more of the abusive gaslighting and martyr act but there was an agreement that, until the move happens, we’d each take one day of the weekend and it would swap around so that one of us (me, obviously) didn’t end up with swimming duty and not a full day while the other (him, inevitably) got to have a whole day to do what they like.

So we come to this weekend and it starts with ex asking me to confirm that I was having DS2 on Sunday. No. I did Sunday last week, so I was having Saturday this week. I had a lovely day yesterday with DS2. I took him to his snowboarding lesson and then we went sea kayaking (really fun, but I am achey today). Ex couldn’t sneak in a morning of video games with DS2 because we left the house at 8.15. After sea kayaking I took DS2 to Nando’s (DS1 wanted to stay in bed so he got leftover curry for lunch instead) and then we can’t home.

Ex was out and DS2 and I watched minecraft shite on amazon prime in the living room. At about 5 ex came back and, while I was making tea for the boys, persuaded DS2 that he wanted to watch stuff on an iPad sitting on exes bed. This is classic ex; he refuses to see this as a power play to prevent me spending time with DS2. Not is he willing to understand that it’s not acceptable on my day.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 01/07/2018 12:38

Well there is your proof he is a narcissist, please do everything you can to protect DS from him, minimise contact because his only interest in DS is to make him look good Thanks

UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 12:41

I’m really glad you’re getting settled in @shitwithsugaron. It’ll be an adjustment, but it sounds like you and your DD are doing brilliantly.

It is scary thinking about useless and incompetent exes looking after the children. Hopefully it’ll be ok. You are doing the right thing in being supportive, however much you have to grit your teeth, for DD’s sake.

I hope your solicitor can get the finances sorted quickly. My friend was telling me last night how much divorce solicitors cost. Shock I am perversely glad that my ex was never quite committed enough to marry me (despite his oft-repeated claim to have ‘made a commitment to me’) because at least I only need one solicitor.

Good luck with the benefits claim. And really don’t worry about cat’s bum mouthed neighbours; anyone who thinks like that is doing you a favour by letting you know that you should not waste your time on them.

OP posts:
UnimaginativeUsername · 01/07/2018 12:55

You will despair over the ongoing butter affair @RandomMess. It’s so frustrating and does make me fear for DS2’s health when he’s with his father.

Ex is buying his own food. It is always gluteny food. He only appears to be able to eat bread based meals. Or, more accurately, he’s unwilling to eat non-bread based ones.

But he refuses to understand that buying your own food also means buying boring basics like butter, oil, ketchup, salt and pepper. These aren’t somehow communal things that just appear; I buy them. They belong to me.

The butter, in particular, drives me mad because of the possibility of gluten contamination. DS1 and I are eating gluten free at home with DS2 to make sure that we don’t accidentally cross-contaminate his food. But ex is refusing to do so.

This week I have told him several times that he cannot use the butter on his bread. The first time he pretended that he’d never intended to butter it at all Hmm. Yes, ex, I believe your plan was to have dry bagels with scrambled egg. The next two times he got annoyed and told me that he would be putting the butter onto a plate before spreading it.

But (even setting aside the fact that it’s MY butter) I do not trust him not to dip his gluten-contaminated knife into the butter. Nothing about his behaviour suggests that he’s taking the coeliac disease appropriately seriously (except when he sees it as an opportunity to be controlling and ask me if I’ve checked anything I feed DS2 is gluten free). I really worry about the outcome when he’s feeding DS2 in his own kitchen.

At this point I’m actually hoping that ex chooses to feed DS2 pretty much exclusively on domino’s pizza (which comes in GF), Nando’s and chocolate rice pops. It’s bad when you’re hoping that your ex will feed your son a diet of exclusively takeaway food.

OP posts:
RandomMess · 01/07/2018 13:05

You can buy lockable cage things for shared fridges...

RandomMess · 01/07/2018 13:07

£30 Lockabox!!!

Please do it, DS can take it to uni with him Grin