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Relationships

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you need help urgently or expert advice, please see our domestic violence webguide and/or relationships webguide. Many Mumsnetters experiencing domestic abuse have found this thread helpful: Listen up, everybody

Assistance required navigating convoluted family bollocks.

135 replies

CommanderDaisy · 26/12/2017 20:54

My Dad is in his 80's. He was a corporate Madmen type of guy before retirement- very successful but all his focus was on work 7-8pm days, lots of travel etc. He has no hobbies, won't join any groups etc and has no ability to entertain himself. His opinion is always right, and he finds offence very easily. He's bored as hell now, and I feel for him - but he won't take a look at himself to see what he's like and why people respond to him the way they do. He used to drink far too much, and never noticed everyone around him stopped drinking to cope with his giant strops and arguements when pissed. He has now been forced to not drink for medical reasons. ( Thanks be to whatever). Christmas is sober now.

My Mum is sweet and should have left him years ago but wouldn't and didn't. Her family is in another country, my father has no one left other than me, her and my children. I can't let his behaviour adversly affect her. She and I speak regularly and have a pretty good relationship. She's an awesome Nan to my boys.

I am an adopted only child who lives many miles away now. My childhood was fine but I was expected to perform and succeed .I did this in ways I am happy with, but it was not what my father wanted - this is tale for another thread.

My DH is a calm guy- slow to offend ,who has been wonderful coping with my controlling, grumpy ,drunk, bossy father. He is as stubborn as all hell though and once he decides something that is often it. We have been together for over 20 years. His family is very wealthy, very nice, a bit "high-society" but fairly kind and tolerant. He has several siblings.

Last year, my FIL died after a fairly awful battle with Alzheimers and alcohol induced dementia. Christmas was in the city where both sets of parents live, plus half husbands siblings. Our plans are usually breakfast at my parents where we stay ( no room at MIL) and lunch with husbands family. My parents have always come too as I feel I can't leave them alone on Christmas day with no grandchildren as I feel bad for my mother. My MIL intiated them coming along, and it has been this way for close to 15 years .

So FIL has died, it's the first Christmas without him - so quite sad for my DH's family.
One SIL really doesn't like my Dad and had asked ( after my parents were already invited by MIL) for him not to come. Cue much shit behind the scenes but MIL said too late, he's coming. To be honest, the behind the scenes stuff upsets me, as it's hard to hear my parents bad mouthed but I am very aware of how difficult my Dad is- so fair enough-ish. So they come along.

And.....my Dad chooses to take offence on the day that not enough fuss was made of him at MIL's lunch annd has a go at my DH. When my DH said thank you for coming to him, he got some response that was critical of the families hospitality and that he was treated like a guest ( ?), he wasn't treated with enough importance and family members didn't make enough effort. I wasn't there for the conversation but my DH came back white with rage and refused to stay at my parents place for the rest of the trip. It was awkward beyond belief. And left a stink in the air that has lasted almost all year. My DH expects my father to apologise, my father believes he has done nothing wrong. He's even gone as far as sending an email to my MIL telling her DH is causing a rift in the family.

My husband was big enough to visit him in hospital during the year( it was only by chance DH was in town when the hospitalisation occured and the visit was on my suggestion- it was major surgery and I was there to help my Mum), which eased unspoken hostilities but things between them are not good. If I join in and try to mediate, my fathers reaction will be ridiculous, martyred etc and will make my mothers life miserable. My involvement will not help.

We got through this Christmas at ours this year, it was definitely awkward - my father expects to not be treated like a guest, yet expects to be waited on/entertained etc ( FFS). We made it , through my DH regularly having to fix a fence at the arse end of our property etc.

BUT......

Next year it's a city Christmas again. and my DH has refused outright to let my father set foot at his MIL's house for Christmas. And refused to stay at my parents. And refuses to discuss it with my Dad.
My Mum will be mortified, there is no room to stay at MIL's as SIL who hates my Dad dominates all space at the house, and I'll be with the kids at my parents with no DH dealing with shit all week.

What do I do? No contact is not an option.

( and if you made it through this spiel , thank you enormously)

OP posts:
Graphista · 30/12/2017 01:07

Precisely so I can give my opinion as I choose

Lisette40 · 30/12/2017 01:26

I have parents who are very dysfunctional and emotionally abusive. On their last visit to stay, it was obvious that their marriage was in trouble but they were lashing out at me instead. I long to be close to them but they're not affectionate or loving. Their behaviour deteriorated over their stay and when I tried to insert boundaries they stormed out of the house and went back to Australia. That was 18 months ago. I was advised by one of my relatives to just put up with their behaviour because they are old. I just can't. My 8 year old was just bewildered by their behaviour. I don't want him to be around people who behave like that. It's just too damaging.

NotWeavingButDarning · 30/12/2017 01:54

OP please stop putting your DH so firmly behind your impossible sounding DF and your DM, who certainly is enabling him to the detriment of your relationship with your DH.

I strongly suspect that your DH has suggested that he stays on the sofa at his mum's next Christmas as a slightly martyrish and passive aggressive way of getting you to finally take his feelings about your DF seriously.

Don't underestimate the long term damage that your behavior will have on your marriage.

Sack off the whole extended family and stay at home next year. There's NOTHING wrong with that.

blackdoggotmytongue · 30/12/2017 02:24

I’m really confused. Why don’t you just alternate christmases with each side of the family? One year you go to DM and DF and stay, and the next year you invite MIL and SIL to your place (as they don’t have accommodation for your family).
This is surely a really ordinary situation? (Not DF’s behaviour - but an inability to spend Christmas with both sides of the family).
Your actual levels of contact are very high with both sets of parents - the grandchildren aren’t going to suffer for spending Christmas alternately (and as long as you time one of your visits to DM and DF close to Christmas when it isn’t ‘their’ year, no bother.)
I wouldn’t bother to be trying to please both sides of the family every year - you have your own family and frankly incompatible commitments to each, so everyone will have to get used to the new normal.
(Easy for me to say - we emigrated. No one gets to pop round unannounced and the grandkids get to spend quality time with one side of the family at a time.)
I get that MIL’s reaction will probably be to try and force the status quo - but frankly that won’t fly with either DH or SIL. And DF and DM can just be told that due to DF’s behaviour you will be alternating christmases from now on.
It’s a shame, especially with MIL widowed, but your DF cannot be allowed to ruin Christmas for the entirety of your family, DH’s family, and his wife. That’s just not fair. He made his bed. Time to deal with the consequences. With no discussion.

CommanderDaisy · 31/12/2017 00:48

blackdog the way it works is one Xmas home with my parents visiting, one year combined MIL visit and staying at my parents with the 5 of DH's siblings and partners for lunch, with SIL who also lives away always staying in the MIL's house. ( always alternate years). The location in the city may change between siblings and MILs house but it's always the same collection of individuals,and o ngoing for a number of years.
There is no question of DF joining Xmas celebrations at MIL's in my DH's mind and I accept that, the question is how to disinvite him and navigate the upcoming shenannigans without kicking off WW3.

While Smiftt has received a bit of a hammering, the comment about having to operate in gray area, and the only child, only relatives part is spot on for me - as was their initial post. Both my husband and I understand the toxic nature of my father- discuss it when necessary and have chosen to work together to deal with it - neither of us know quite what words to use in this situation. And while his refusal to accomodate( get a rental) next Xmas is vastly irritating , it is also absolutely fair enough in my mind. I need help finding wiggle room and a miraculously tidy way for working this for this event. I was hopeful, but I guess there isn't one.
thank you all.

OP posts:
another20 · 31/12/2017 01:24

the question is how to disinvite him and navigate the upcoming shenannigans without kicking off WW3.

You are STILL enabling his bad behaviour by tap-dancing around him, looking for some convoluted, complex solution to sooth him. WHY?

It is very simple.

Just tell him the brutal truth, expect him to kick off (WW3), put on your tin hat and just let it wash over you.

Short pain, long gain. He will soon get the message.

Rent somewhere, even if your DH chooses not to stay with you so that you are showing solidarity to your DH and sticking two fingers up to your DF.

Do something honest and truthful for once.

NoMudNoLotus · 31/12/2017 02:05

@another20 this is not your life - it is OPs.

She needs to come to a resolution whereby she has no regrets , a resolution that fits best for her family.

You are extremely judgmental and lacking in compassion and empathy .

OP needs to resolve this so that she has the outcome she needs - if that involves not challenging DF then so be it as long as she has the outcome that she wants , which may be different from what you'd want in this situation.

Joysmum · 31/12/2017 02:55

the question is how to disinvite him and navigate the upcoming shenannigans without kicking off WW3

And the answer to that is that you can’t. Whatever you do, an unreasonable and badly behaved person will always be so.

Looking for wiggle riom doesn’t just give you wiggle room, it gives them wiggle room to continue to make your life harder. That’s why ripping off the plaster is easier in the long run as another20 quite rightly says.

Pannacott · 31/12/2017 03:18

'Mum and Dad, I know this is going to be disappointing, but I wanted to let you know now that we need to rethink plans for Christmas next year. Everyone felt it didn't really work out very well at MIL's this year, so they've decided to just stick with their immediate family next Christmas.'

You can spin it with 'they can't cope, too much for them to manage' / 'it's because you're a nasty bastard' as you see fit.

Personally I don't see the rush, I'd hold off til early summer, there might be some genuine crisis by then, and tempers will have cooled. It's more temporally distant. You can then add in details at that point... 'I'm not sure about DH... oh I've spoken to him now, he feels he needs to support MIL. Think I'll move between the two of you during the day'.

RunRabbitRunRabbit · 31/12/2017 11:20

WW3? A war needs two sides engaging. You don't have to engage. That would transform it from WW3 to monster tantrum. Can you weather a big man tantrum?

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