Brave Babes are boinging into Spring..Join us here!

[dementedma]

We are a bus load of Babes all battling alcohol and trying to resist, reduce and get our lives back under control. Whatever you have to say, we will have heard it before and no-one will judge you. This is a warm, friendly,supportive place with tough love when needed ( slap round the face with a wet squid called Barrie). Join us here.

Hi checking in briefly. Sorry for being a bit absent on here- been reading but sort of have a bit of a mental block on actually posting anything for some reason.

Wanted to send margie a huge, huge hug though. So glad you are going to the GP- it's totally the right thing to do. Ditto to grief counselling. You have been through so much, and I can really identify with those thoughts. You've given me so much support and I genuinely can't think of any useful words for you, but I am thinking of you xxx

Margie we haven't spoken before but I'm thinking of you. It will be so much better to tell the GP what's going on. Your words about not being carefree really resonated with me, I felt like that in the worst moments of my drinking, about 4 years ago. It does get better when you get help. Life is wonderful, it's worth fighting for

I'm up at 3am because I drank a bottle of wine last night and woke up at 2 unable to get back to sleep. This is what happens. This is exactly why I stopped drinking for 3 weeks in Jan. And now I'm back here. I just started drinking a bit sometimes and then it spread outwards, like an amoeba, swallowing up non-drinking days.

I need to get drastic with this. I'm sick of the sheer amount of my time it's wasting: lost sleep, lost productivity, lost brainpower thinking about fucking wine.

I'm considering trying AA. Thing is I can't abide the Big Book, I have no intention of completing the steps and I don't want a sponsor. I'm not sure I even want to stand up and talk. I just want to hang out with like-minded people. AA-goers present and past, can I get away with that?

Right back to bed to attempt sleep

I've just looked at the meetings near me and it is so off-putting. Just the sight of a 'big book chapter and verse meeting' is making me think 'no'.

This is exactly the process I went through last time.

I just want something like the Bus, but in real life.

madein1995
I actually didn't get round to the hair dye. But this weekend! Unfortunately nothing crazy, not like my younger days when I had rainbow coloured dreads! Aldis red/ brown. Although now the grey is creeping in im thinking if some sort of low lights.
And Cornwall eh? You lucky thing. I'm originally from the West Country and miss it so much.
The flooding has subsided. We are on a hill but the village did get it a bit in their back gardens. One man has donkeys in his back garden so he has an open invitation to bring them up here . Last year it was chest deep for them.

margie yes that does sound like grief. How awful for those things to happen when your children are so little, must be exhausting. Hope you feel a little better today.must take issue with you for 1 thing though, you don't need to worry about 2 & 3 on your list. Please,please come and chat nonsense, like the rest of us, all the time. No guilt or judging allowed. Sometimes posting some nonsense helps to change a mood or sorts out something you're worried about.

AA - I totally agree, I wish that there was another organisation (well not really organised) where you could just go along and chat with other people who don't want to drink that night. Maybe meet in cafes. No big book, no sponsors, no rules (ok, no men).
I get why AA works the way it does and it helped me more than I can say, not just with getting sober. I thought of it as collaborative learning or counselling which helped reframe the bits I didn't like.
I didn't want to do it long term but it is a life changing experience. It stops you from drinking. It's free and anonymous.

Sorry to hear that some babes are having a crap time. Some days are just put one foot in front of the other and go to bed quick with a good book kind of days.

Morning mint 😎

Fairenuff bibbity Ruby Flora
I'm slowly phasing out friends too. These days they are more like frenemies ( I hate that word) and it's like being back in the playground. I don't need people like that in my life.

Waves at Ma
Any update on the funding?

Oppppps!

Thanks Elba. How you doing? How's the marathon training going? Think about you often .

I hear you on AA Guggs. I know it works but it feels too big and organized and committed, and in the end for me it just turned into another thing I had to do.

What I would love is what Flora says: "I just want something like the Bus, but in real life."

I'm seriously considering starting my own local support group.

Morning all. Grey and murky here today and I've got so much washing to get dry! House looks like a laundry.

I know someone (v v vaguely and not well enough to chat to about it) who goes to a group run by SMART recovery. I think they are free, open to all and the "therapy" (can't think of a better word) is practical, cbt based, in a group, with no mention of higher powers, God or any of that big book stuff. In other words, as I understand it, they are a viable alternative to AA to people who just have a problem with AA.

I think many people, myself included, have a problem with the starting point of AA which is that you have to accept you are powerless over alcohol. Eh?? Clearly that is not the case otherwise how could so many millions of people give it up and utterly transform their lives?

Having said that, of course we need AA because undoubtedly it does suit some people, especially, it seems, those who are at or near rock bottom.

That article by Virginia Ironside linked by LuxuryWoman2017 yesterday says more on this theme.

A wave to Elba and ma good to see you.
Margie yes the ADs are helping as I feel less low in mood and less anxious. I never had depression symptoms until in EA relationship - so life events - including bereavement - can certainly cause symptoms.
I feel a little bit "blunter" and more able to cope.
I don't feel tons better because (1) I only take a low dose otherwise I get jaw clenching and night sweats (!) and (2) difficult life situations persist (husband of one year is being pants) but I know from experience that this will help me get through this time and when I feel ready I will titrate down and come off. Maybe in a year. That's fine. ADs are not addictive like say Valium, but do need care to reduce and come off.
And so, the self medication doesn't feel quite so pressing every evening.
That said, I drank a bottle last night feel headachey.
AF today.
And on drinking days trying harder. I've been doing better but took eye off the ball last night.
Yes an AA made the way we want it would be excellent.
As a LP I couldn't come though, so I am so grateful for this bus.
Happy Wednesday all

Morning all,
what a wet and gloomy day. Hey Elba good to see you.

Margie I wrote a long post last night that I couldn't get to post up. Anyway, my partner takes AD's has for a long time and possibly will forever. Like you, his depression came about through circumstances. As our lovely 42 says they are not addictive and if the ones given to you aren't right you can ask for another type. I wouldn't hesitate to take them if I needed them, armed with info about possible side-effects and so on.
They just make my OH feel normal for want of a better word, certainly not spaced out or different, just able to cope with day to day life. Together with counselling they could make you feel a whole lot better.

Can I say a general hello to everyone else, must get on. Have a good day all.

Flora I'm with you on the AA thing too. I haven't been. What area do you live in? I'm North West. I think starting your own support group is a great idea. I'm thinking the same.

Mint playground is definitely the way it feels. I'm being excluded by mum's at school and it hurts. Certainly hasn't helped my drinking. The thing is one of them is a massive drinker but rarely the type to be blacking out. I've kind of admired her ability to drink and be fun but now I'm thinking actually, she's incredibly unreliable, selfish and only seems to want to meet to drink (although not with me but that could be cos I get plastered and fall over). She swaps plans depending on what seems more fun. I feel like an idiot for believing what she has said. It's all quite mental really. Eg I was round at hers one night drinking wine and she described me as one of her best friends and talked about another woman as thinking she was her best friend but isn't but in reality she doesn't mean that and hangs around with the other. What a load of complete bollocks. Writing this I feel embarrassed and like I'm about 7. When did I turn into this needy idiot

What's LP 42?

sorry Lone Parent

Hello, everyone. I had a difficult day yesterday - something to do with work that needs sorting out - but I didn't want to drink. I knew that wasn't going to help. This is brilliant for me!! Time was (really quite recently) that it would have been the perfect excuse/justification. Then I'd have woken up feeling uncomfortable about the problem (which I still am - but reckon I will sort it out one way or another) plus hungover. Great mix!

Can't believe being hungover was my normal for pretty much most of my adult life. Basically I got used to feeling majorly crap or slightly below par all of the time. Nice.

So. The thorny topic of AA has raised its head again. It's such a personal decision. I totally hear everyone on the peculiarity of it, and the seeming outrageousness of Step 1. Oh and the bit about my life being "unmanageable". Er what? Have you SEEN what I've kept together in spite of my habit? What I've achieved?

But...

It IS a bit like this bus but in real life. I've kind-of shopped around and been to lots of different meetings. They have slightly different approaches/moods. There was one I went to which was the total stereotype of the dusty church hall and dishevelled people talking in hushed tones about the awfulness of their problems with alcohol - prison, divorce, lost jobs, homelessness...

If that had been my first meeting I doubt I would have gone back as I couldn't identify at all and found the whole thing demoralising. But most of the meetings I've been to are quite a laugh .

I also realise now that it helps me to have a support network of people who know exactly what it's like to battle with themselves daily over "will I have just white wine?" or "maybe I can stick to two?" or "what actually happened last night?" or "only on weekends" or ...

I've met so many different people through AA. One of the things I like about it is that it's a complete mix of people from all different backgrounds, all totally accepting one another and sharing their difficulties and their solutions. And some of the people I've met are scarily like me. That has made me feel less alone and less of a mess and has given me some hope back.

Some of the Big Book wording is unfeasibly grandiose, off-putting and old-fashioned IMO - but I can kind-of see where it's getting to (at least my interpretation of it). You're not alone. It's not your fault. Alcohol is addictive. We can help you - you don't have to struggle any more. Life can and will get much much much more peaceful. You will be back in control. The steps aren't rules - they are suggestions. You don't have to get a sponsor. You can get a cup of tea, sit at the back and listen. That's just fine.

Sorry if I sound like a mad harpy convert or something. I'm not. I still have some about bits of it - but if it helps me day by day to change my thinking and stay sober - that's good enough for me.

Just my four penn'orth!

And yes - if there was a SMART meeting near me I would try that out as well.

Oh and P.S. I've been on all sorts of antidepressants, ever since suicidal ideation with PND with both my children. Some work better than others. Definitely not addictive - but I've found them helpful.

LP - lone parent?

cross-posted with 42 - sorry!

Thanks everyone for your thoughtful responses about support groups.

I feel really equivocal. On the one hand I am an atheist and find the strong religious/evangelical feel of AA incredibly offputting. (I know your higher power can be anything, but let's face it, when the Big Book was written it was God. No bones about it). On the other I hear what people are saying about taking what you need from it, accessing the community support and discussion. And I think I need something like it IRL.

I may go and check out a meeting and see what the vibe is. Interesting what you say about different meetings having different moods elf - the last time I went I was living in a very depressed town and the meeting was pretty depressing too. Maybe here will be different.

I know AA is a thorny topic here and thank you to everyone for bearing with me while I talk aloud. I don't want to cause ructions, I'm just figuring it out.

Ruby I'm southwest.

I'm pretty sure I could set up my own 'sobriety cafe' or similar here; I've already set up a local arts event. Good points would be that it would be informal, probably just for women, no rules/religion/programme, just support and discussion: basically like this but IRL. Bad points are that it would mean a fair bit of work for me to organise and promote it, would be a big risk of no-one coming, not sure I'm equipped to deal with the issues we might encounter (e.g. drugs, domestic abuse, mental health problems), and I'd have to be 'out' as someone with a booze problem. I'm anonymous here. In my town, where everyone eventually knows everyone, there's a good chance I'd be outed as the person who runs the sobriety group.

What would you Babes who want a real life group look for in that group?

Would you like a cafe meet-up or church hall style thing?
Would you need a private space to feel comfortable?
Would you prefer structured sharing of experiences/strategies, or just a group chat? Or a bit of both?
Would you prefer a women-only group?
Would you join a group on Facebook for a 'sobriety cafe' thing, if that group was closed and hidden?

Feedback much appreciated sorry for the 20 questions.

Hi Flora
Would you like a cafe meet-up or church hall style thing? Don't mind but would not want to be overheard (café)
Would you need a private space to feel comfortable? Yes
Would you prefer structured sharing of experiences/strategies, or just a group chat? Or a bit of both? Bit of both.
Would you prefer a women-only group? Yes
Would you join a group on Facebook for a 'sobriety cafe' thing, if that group was closed and hidden? No cos have this bus. Not keen on FB.

Hello lovely babes - long time no see! Well that's not true because I'm always watching and reading and following your stories. But I bit off more than I could chew over the past few months - work-wise and supporting a friend in need and I've been burning the candle at both ends trying to get back on an even keel. Let that be a lesson to me - I am NOT superwoman!

Like several others on here AA is not my natural place and I would disagree with many of its messages. I don't go to any meetings theses days and I certainly wasn't a regular when I was stopping drinking but I did find it was a physical place to go, where there were real people, who understood how it felt to pace the aisles of the supermarket picking up a bottle, putting it down, picking it up again, putting it down.... never really certain which way it would end - the willpower (rarely) or the inner urge for a drink (usually).

I created my own interpretations of "powerless over alcohol" and "higher power". For me the powerlessness is true of alcohol in that, as much as I would have liked it to be true, I was powerless over the pharmacological effects of alcohol. So in much the same way as I am powerless over bacteria in food, or the effects of paracetamol, I could not prevent alcohol from having an impact on my body. I could not prevent it from being processed in my body (resulting in long term hypertension), I could not prevent my body from adaptive responses so that it took more and more to make me feel drunk, I could not prevent my systems from loving the initial rush of dopamine with the first cold gulp.

I really love chicken but there's no way I'd eat it off a barbeque if I though it wasn't cooked - because I'm powerless over bacteria. If I've got a migraine I know co-codomol will knock out the pain but I wouldn't take too many because I know the risk of overdose and I'm powerless over whether it would harm me. None of that 'logic' helped me to stop drinking, it just helped me to rationalise the powerless over alcohol bit of AA.

And for the 'Higher Power' I turn to Jiminey Cricket. There is a 'something' inside me that does know right from wrong. For me it's not in religion but it still exists. And the added advantage of the Jiminey Cricket approach is that you can't really drink while you're whistling
When you meet temptation and the urge is very strong, give a little whistle! Give a little whistle! Not just a little squeak, pucker up and blow, and if your whistle's weak, yell Jiminey Cricket. Give a little whistle! And always let your conscience be your guide.

the Jiminey Cricket approach

flora answers to your (very good) set of questions.
Definitely a café, lounge, luxury relaxed seating - I hate the crappy church hall vibe, sitting on hard chairs round a table (or no table). After all, I'm doing this to be good to myself, not as an act of penance. I'd love it to be a mainsteam, big bold front door entrance too, not creeping up the back entrance in shame.
Private space - yes
Structured - oh yes. I think there needs to be someone who 'holds the space' and a process so that everyone gets a chance to speak if they want, that the space isn't hogged by the same one or two people, that there are some 'rules' (see example at end of post), and that there is some mechanism for suggesting / supporting referral if there are issues that are beyond the scope of the group - e.g. unstable mental health concerns, disclosure of abuse etc.
Woman's group - I'd prefer that, but I've been in mixed groups which have been brilliant, so as long as I knew which I was going to I'd be OK.
Facebook - no. I wouldn't interact on fb and I think it would serve to make me feel excluded if others in the group were on it and having 'conversations' that I couldn't keep up with.

rules I'd like to know what expected behaviour was - confidentiality, respect etc. Also is it a 'talking stick' kind of thing - where if one person is speaking they are speaking and others are quiet, or is it a conversation where other put there two-penny worth in? (I'd hate that). I went to an informal group once and it rapidly moved from people telling sharing their experience aka AA to 'I can tell a funny(?) drunker story than you' kind of competitiveness.

Apologies for long answer. Well done you for thinking about this.