House... Baby.. No ring.

[littlerabbitface]

Have nc'd for this.

I suppose this is like a WWYD.

Basically me and oh live together, own the house together, have a baby, own a car jointly, finances are pooled. You get the idea. We act like a married couple.

However we are not a married couple.

Not even engaged.

At first it never bothered me really, but now we have a baby and him and oh have the same surname and I have a different one, I'll admit it does really get to me that we aren't married. I feel like a bit of an idiot.

Before anyone says well why did you buy a house and have a baby with him, well because I thought we would get married and I wasn't bothered if that came before or after a baby!

Now I'm starting to doubt it'll happen. We've been together four years. Neither of us have been married before. He's in his early thirties, I'm in mid twenties.

I know there is no real rush, and realistically we couldn't afford a wedding for maybe a year or two. (Though I'd be happy with a registry office and a nice meal! He wouldn't!)

When I've spoken to him about it he mainly just says we will do it in time, we will get there eventually, not yet, or in a few years, or what's the rush it won't change anything (technically it won't I suppose, obviously legally but in terms of our relationship nothing would change as we're pretty much living as a married couple)

He thinks I want to rush into it and doesn't see why I'm so bothered about doing it because it won't change anything. I say that if it won't change anything then why not just do it instead of putting it off for years.

I guess I'm just a bit fed up and this is just a bit of a whinge. I don't want to leave over this obviously as we have a good relationship, but I want to be married to him and I don't want to have to nag about it.

WWYD in this situation. Can you change the mindset of someone who is not very bothered? He is quite laid back anyway so it comes as no surprise that he is in no rush to do this.

Should I bring it up? Should I forget about it? Should I resign myself to the fact it may never happen?

I am hoping he is secretly thinking about it but I doubt that very much.

I need advice!

OP, if your dp does not have an explanation in the face of your concerns, the reason is probably one he does not want you to know because you would leave him otherwise.

if your dp does not have an explanation in the face of your concerns, the reason is probably one he does not want you to know because you would leave him otherwise.

I don't think it's that complicated like any hidden reason. Some people just don't want to get married. They fear that it will change their relationship for the worse, or think as many say 'it's just a piece of paper' or they don't want the legal stress of a potential divorce.

I agree with blueshoes. The issue we are skating round here is that your DP perhaps does have some very definite, but not very palatable reasons for not getting married, and they are not the same profoundly considered, humanistic reasons that Bertrand has kindly outlined on this thread. Those seem perfectly acceptable, undertandable reasons.

The fact that he shuts you up and shuts down the conversation is not encouraging. In fact that's the worst bit about this thread. It does not bode well for discussing anything that is 'difficult' for him, in the future.

The fact is, it is unlikely that the DP in this instance has deeply held, finely-argued philosophical reasons for not wanting to marry the OP. He does not have his 'alternative option' ready. He is not suggesting another option to keep OP happy ('let's do all the legal stuff that will make you feel secure, my love'), he is merely trying to shut her up. This has had the desired effect so that OP now fears that she will be seen as a nag or desperate etc etc. She is already choosing her words carefully and limiting her behaviour because of his caustic and annoyed reaction when she raises a perfectly relevant topic of conversation. It is relevant to her and he should respect that.

So the fear with this one is the fact that he is either keeping his options open, doesn't want to commit himself legally because he can see himself ending their relationship, and/or doesn't want to commit himself financially because he doesn't want to share. He doesn't want all his worldly goods going to OP in the event of his death and he doesn't consider himself her next of kin or vice versa. All this implies that he is looking over OP's shoulder just in case the love of his life should walk in the room. Or perhaps he is merely a scratch-the-surface misogynist that believes OP will take him to the cleaners in the event of a divorce.

I think this will turn into a dealbreaker, because the partner's dismissal of OP's concerns will be the thin end of a wedge. It shows a lack of respect and will make itself apparent in lots of areas of their life as the years go by. He will shut her up whenever he feels threatened or wrong-footed.

He feels threatened over the marriage question because he has not been truthful with his excuses and will easily have his bluff called and found out. 'I don't see the point of it' won't wash. And he contradicts himself with the 'but I want a big poncey wedding that we can't afford.' He is wriggling.

Sorry OP, but you are peeling back the label on this one and finding a bit of the real him. All the stuff about changing your name or wanting a proposal is just chaff. If you asked him straight with a proposal of your own he would say 'no'. You know the answer but you, understandably, don't want to really know the reasons. I'm not going to LTB you, coz that would be frivolous, but the style of his response to you raising this issue in a heartfelt way is really not good enough and rightly leaves you questioning how much he really respects you.

And respect on both sides is an absolute necessity in a marriage. If it is one-sided then the whole thing flips over.

I would flip your question over. Does he deserve you as a wife? Stop questioning yourself over whether you are good enough for him. I would much rather you were wondering whether he is in fact worthy of you?

Hillfarmer, thank you for the post. That is exactly how I see it but could not type it

Pleasure all mine. Bit long tho!

When he says he can't see the point in getting married, ask him what's the benefit of NOT getting married.

If he doesn't want to get married that's his choice surely.

Gosh Oddsocks I think you've cracked it!

Very funny.

Instead of all this does he, doesn't he?

Why not just make your own decision.

The problem with your posts Bertram is that you're coming at this from a position where you've been honest with your partner, you've laid out your stall and explained why it's not for you. That's what decent people do and fair play. Decent people do not say, "Yeeeeah, one day babes, when we have more money/the kids are older/I get that promotion" and let their partner make major life decisions on the basis of that conscious misrepresentation.

OP I have no idea what you should do longer term, but I do think counselling would be a good option for right now. Completely aside from the marriage thing, his reaction to you bringing this topic up and how he conducted his side of the discussion isn't a good sign for you two.

Defo do not change your name. It a) reeks of desperation even if that's not your intention, b) he'll think you'll be satisfied with that, and c) it will be endlessly cringey when people ask, "oh when did you get married? Congratulations!" and you go, "er, haven't actually, just wanted to match DP". You're a family, not a set of curtains. You don't need to all match. I'd try to convince him to DB your son but that's just me.

He doesn't see the point, he doesn't want too = he doesn't want to tell you the real reason he doesn't want marriage with you.

He either should marry you or have all your main assets and accounts in joint names and sign a bloody will. As in, go on the internet NOw and research a local will writer.

You are totally unprotected in case of divorce or death.

Excellent post Hillfarmer.
I also agree with TheCraicDealer.

Having been in this exact same situation, I would say you might just have to suck it up.

I guess it's different for me in that I felt better once we bought a house together and had a child. And I could see he was totally committed to me. As I got older it seemed less of a deal.

We have been together 19 years and will be be getting married next year in a quick ceremony abroad.

My partner has been a support and such an asset to my life, despite us not being married. I have watched many relationships come and go in this time.

If it's how he feels, now, then you could try accepting it.

OP The fact that you have a stepson, who is non-resident, adds another aspect to the considerations to getting married. Does your DP know this?

If something were to happen and your DP dies while you are unmarried, you would have no automatic right to apply to court for a family arrangements order to maintain contact with your stepson, your DCs half sibling. Your stepsons mum could block contact and you'd be facing a prolonged legal battle.

If you are married, you would have an automatic right to apply for an arrangement order; so securing contact between you, your DC and your stepson should your DP die.

There is no other way of gaining this legal protection - marriage is the only option.

You need to talk to him again about the wills!
I owned my house with my partner as joint Tennant's. Well I thought I did!
He had a heart attack and died suddenly aged 39! It turned out the solicitor had not answered any letters from Land Registry so they had registered it as Tennant's in Common!
His share of the house passed to his children of a previous relationship. I had to sue the so!icitor, it took 7 years to sort it all out and cost me a fortune! All when I was shell shocked & devastated over the loss of my partner!
Do NOT let this go!

If he is refusing to put practical and financial measures in place to protect you, then he is being entirely unreasonable and you should take a very hard line on this. I am only on his side in not wanting to get married.

"I'm in a new relationship so don't expect marriage any time soon my dp and I already love together and have a baby due Christmas day "

Its great you and DP are happy - but why is marriage a bigger commitment than having DC? Im not anti single / unmarried parents in ANY way at all, but surely having a child together is the biggest thing you can actually do (happy to be corrected of course)

I suspect he does not realise the effect it would have on his first son should he die.

I did some reading and I also suspect that he doesn't realise that if he dies first the house is mine, and then if I die without a will it will automatically go to my child. His son would have to put a claim in on my estate and wouldn't necessarily get his 'fair share'. I suspect he would do something about it if he knew that.

But then I feel like well fuck him if he doesn't see the point then I won't bother.

But that's spitting his child rather than spitting himself and I don't want to do that! It's not his child's fault he's a selfish tit!!

Okay I won't change my name because you're right is is a bit desperate.

I'm just fucked off with the whole scenario. Like I said I don't want this to be a deal breaker, but the more I think about it the more hurt and unimportant I feel.

Thinking about it alone is probably going to ruin my relationship sooner or later.....

I also think having a child is a commitment definitely, but it's a commitment to the child and at least be civil to me until the child is 18. It's not really a commitment to me iyswim!

"Like I said I don't want this to be a deal breaker, but the more I think about it the more hurt and unimportant I feel."

I think you really need to separate marriage and the legal situation. If he won't do anything about the legal situation then you absolutely must reconsider everything. Marriage? Not so much.

Can you make an appointment with a solicitor and get them to lay the legal position on the line to him?

Yes I suppose I could do that. Like I say as much as he 'doesn't see why it's important' I think he'd sign whatever I asked him to.

Except a marriage register

What happened when you decided to live together/buy a house/buy a car/have a child? Did he raise any of those himself or was it all you?

The reason I ask is that I bet he had plenty ideas/input/discussion then, but when it's something you want he refuses to discuss or get involved. It's like "I'm alright, got what I wanted, so I won't even listen to my partner now".

Toad... They were all mutual decisions we didn't make any spur of the moment decisions we had many discussions about the house the car and the baby.

But yes he has got what he wants, so why would he marry me.