I now really dont believe that the majority of men are faithful

[isthismylifenow]

I know I am generalizing now, but once again I have had an "offer" from a married man.

I have posted frequently here, so maybe you remember me, but if not, separated for 6 months from a 20 year marriage.

I have been propositioned on a few occasions now, but this last one just takes the cake.

How offended on a scale of 1-10 would you be by this message..?

"If I were there right now, I would wine and dine you to your hearts content, then with your permission, would take you home and perform wild and wonderful sex bringing out the worst in you"

I reply in a joking manner (in your dreams...) as this is a friend I have know for some time, there has been banter in the past between us, but nothing more than a joke here and there.

His reply to that:

"I need something casual and safe, what do you say, are you keen to take it further"

WTAF! So I didn't even reply and now I am getting the "oh so ignoring me now messages"

I am upset. I don't think I am wrong in feeling upset. This has happened quite a few times now, in every case the man is 'happily' married.....well that is how it would appear when I was married and we were all mates. Now I am single, it seems like men think they have the right to treat me like a piece of meat, or 'ah its been 6 months, she must be gagging for it, so I will give her one'... its degrading and its making me start to dislike men. I am no man hater btw, but what gives them the fucking right to think that this is okay on any level.

I don't know if it matters any (it shouldn't, but maybe I have portrayed the wrong message) that since my separation I started going to gym (this was for me, somewhere to work out frustrations and clear my head, which is does and I enjoy going), and I think I probably look better than I have in quite some time.... I am eating better so my skin looks clearer, all things that have just given me a tiny bit of confidence, of which I had NONE at all before.

Now today I ate a big bag of crisps and don't even want to go to gym tonight, as I feel today I just want to put back on the weight.. but fuck them, why should I.. I am not boasting about losing weight, so please don't read it that way.....for once I tried to do something for me, and now I am being taken advantage of AGAIN, but in a different way now...

I don't go out of my way to flirt, as I said I had a bit of a banter with some friends for years, but nothing heavy. I didn't message him first, he messaged me about work stuff (I do work in a very male orientated industry) and then bam!

I am not over-thinking this am I???

Literally too many to count, Willow. Thousands.

No I don't agree with that. It goes by character not gender. Call me naive but I trust my husband 100%. I notice girls look at him but I'm not bothered as he is devoted to me and our young children.
If Kim Kardashian came on to him I'm 99.9% sure he would decline

Yeah, that's exactly exactly^ how I felt about my husband for 10 years, until I found out he'd had a 6 month affair. In fact I would have said 100%.

I've never been hit on at work. If someone was 'bantering' with me it would end after their opening line.

You can't play 'fun times friend' and not expect people to push the envelope. No one would dare to (or care to I expect), proposition me. I have a ball breaker reputation and it suits me just fine.

It must depend on the work environment and culture I guess. I work in a school and obviously you have to watch what you do and say all the time because you're setting an example and being professional. There is not much opportunity to build up close relationships with colleagues unless it's socialising outside of work, which a lot of people don't do because they are snowed under with marking etc and just want to get home. I have never witnessed any flirting, it would just be really frowned upon these days. Everyone is feeling the pressure from above and from the kids and we just get on with our job and go home at the end of the day. I just don't think there is any opportunity for anything to escalate. It's just a culture of teaching, prep, marking, meetings, planning, lunch duties etc etc.

I guess if you work in an industry which involves a lot of travel and hospitality then things could be different.

This makes depressing reading.

I have just read too much, seen too much to think that most people don't cheat at some point in their lives now.

I keep seeing it over and over again, recently with an old friend who you would never suspect of cheating. It's everywhere.

I am still going to trust my husband but I will never trust anyone 100%. I'm ok with that. He has never, ever given me a reason to not trust him but I've known too many people who trusted and got burnt, from people who were great partners and great people, until they suddenly weren't.

There are many nice happy married men, my DH is certainly one and I know a fair few others.

You think only horrible unhappily married people cheat?

'Not just friends' is a pretty eye opening book about how they often start.

Nice people cheat. Happily married people cheat.

My DF isn't a religious zealot. I don't know if he's had the opportunity or not, nor whether he is asexual or not. As I'm one of 5 children, I'm guessing not.

I guess I know because my parents joke about it. Also, there are no unaccountable hours. He's very open about where he is all the time and it's very easily checked. His phone is very easily checked if necessary. I don't think he could be bothered, tbh.

U2, it strikes me as ... childish to trust anyone 100%. It's a denial of human nature. Like unconditional love, unconditional trust is for children and pets, who need protection from adult human complexities.

I have noticed, too, that demands for unconditionality are usually made by abusers. Mutual respect involves respecting the other's right to choose.

"can i ask anyone on this thread how many people you know married have had an affair in the marriage or vice versa?"

Married friends - none that I know of, but then I wouldn't know about would I unless the marriage ended or I was their trusted confidante.
However, when I worked on the boat, all but one of the men I socialised with (perfectly innocently!) were cheating or trying to. Most of them had partners who lived far away so they would not have been caught. The only one who didn't seem interested was a newly-wed.
So, you have to consider how you know people. If you are friends with both people in the couple, you're unlikely to know about it, more likely to find out if you only know one half of the couple.

CurlyhairedAssassin I've worked a lot in secondary schools and witnessed many affairs, from support workers through to head teachers. One married woman in particular was cheating with two different (married) men from the same school who didn't know about each other. One example of infidelity was a long term affair between two married teachers that most staff knew about but didn't really comment. It was strange. The man has a baby with his wife during this period as well. Wanker.

This is depressing reading. I would also say my DH is such a lovely, decent bloke that I trust him 100%. But of course I have no way of knowing for sure.
I did a graduate scheme for a big bank in my early 20's and my eyes were truly opened. 2 married colleagues in my team were openly having an affair (she had a baby, I assume with her DH, while I was working there). Another colleague was in a relationship with someone in another dept, she later fell pregnant (it was his) and he was often away from work accompanying his wife to chemo appts (breast cancer). I had always thought of him as a truly 'nice guy'. Office parties (paid for by the company, 100's of people in a pretty lavish venue) were basically just shag fests.

I agree, it is depressing reading.

What I know now though, is that if ever I do go into another relationship (not that I am looking for one) I know that I could never trust 100% again. I did trust my stbx 100%, and I am another one of those who couldn't believe it when it happened, not my husband, he wouldn't do that etc etc... but he did.

For those of you asking about the banter.. it was just that. And this is going back a few years anyway, I had no contact with him at all this year, until recently something work related came up, and I assume he found out via a mutual friend of my separation, and then these messages began. I don't want to out myself, but he gave me a nickname, my name with ding added to the end. Over time he then added on dong to that.. so if I had to get info from him (we work in same industry, but not the same place), we wouldn't say hello, but ding dong.. that sort of thing. I didn't interpret that as sexual, although he would send jokes at times, some a bit raunchy, some just silly. But he would send jokes to everyone, it was a bit of a standing joke,' oh xyz is at it today with the jokes again today, he must be bored'... I didn't respond to raunchy ones, but sometimes would reply with an equally silly thing. Maybe yes I was a bit more naïve then.... but in my eyes just being friendly with a friend. I cannot not talk to every married man I encounter during the day. That said, neither do I advertise myself as single, only my close network of friends know, as I haven't told anyone in my work circles.

I should have believed my father years back when I found out about dh affair and went to pieces, so badly so that I ended up 10kgs down and in hospital. His response, 'oh get over it, all men cheat'..... I was horrified, shocked and didn't speak to him for years until quite recently.

I think it's a good post OP & some good points have come out though, I don't believe it's as negative generally out there as its been portrayed. True, no one can say they know 100% that their partner has never cheated. However, that's where faith & trust come into things & I really do think (huge generalisation) but, I do feel this, if a person is getting all they need from a relationship, have an attentive, open, daring partner, they will not stray.

Maybe I'm naive but, the couples I know, who have great relationships, with ALL their needs being met seem solid. A woman I know, who's husband paid her no attention strayed, a guy I know had a cold partner, who suddenly hated being kissed & cuddled & eventually lead to zero intimacy, strayed. Both of these should have talked to iron out the issues and split if need be, there is never ever an excuse to cheat. But, there were underlying issues there. Both I think, wouldn't have even looked, if they were getting what they wanted

Nope, totally agree with you.

I noticed I got far more offers from sleazebags once I was married myself.
Pretty much always from men who also had wedding rings.

I was talking about it years ago to a male friend, who said it's a common tactic for married men to seek out an engaged or married woman for no-strings sex, because they equally stand to lose their marriage so won't tell anyone his wife about the cheating.
A spurned one-night stand might blab to his wife if she's single, a married woman would be discreet so you get away with it. That's the logic apparently.

I've posted this story before but here goes:

I've worked in a few male-dominated industries and one in particular (high-end car manufacturing) was the worst by far. I've never worked anywhere so testosterone-fuelled.

I worked in the marketing department with over 90 men and in the space of two years, they'd all cheated on their wives/girlfriends - even the nice ones you'd never think and a lot had had affairs leading up to the breakup of their marriages too. I was asked out by about ten people but only dated one. The worst were the older (50s) married ones who would often have multiple girlfriends as well as their wives and one night stands.

I've also found that most of my boyfriends cheated too, even the nice ones. It seems ingrained in male culture to a certain degree that they deserve it.

ReallyNoEyeDeer

There are many nice happy married men, my DH is certainly one and I know a fair few others.

Naïve. Naïve. Naïve.

So true in my experience. I'll never forget joining Friends Reunited and Facebook and the amount of sleazy messages I got from old school friends (male), now supposedly happily married with children. Their public image is very important but behind the scenes - business as usual.

I was at a wedding reception at the weekend of a couple who married after an affair...she was engaged when they met (to someone else) and he was married. He is much older than her, overweight, bald, unattractive with grown up children (and a grandchild) but well-heeled. She is young and beautiful. They married overseas about a month ago and this was the 'back home' party that I attended. It couldn't have been a more beautiful set-up with lights, projected photos of gorgeous beaches and white dress, a tower of cupcakes - the bride was absolutely stunning. The groom was hardly visible all night, bragged about not dancing and seemed to be more interested in looking down the barmaid's top. I suppose some guys feel that once they've landed a prize trout and looked at it a few times, taken its picture and showed it off to their mates...it's time to dip the rod back in.

I was married a year before my ex began an affair with a work colleague.

Before that point I was one of the 'he would never do that' people. I would have read this thread and thought 'my OH would never cheat on me!' Everyone else also thought the same of him, and everyone was completely shocked.

It's certainly opened my eyes to never ever be so naive again! There's a lot of people cheating, and even the people you think are the most unlikely to.

For every man or woman that cheats there are millions more that don't. Not all men are cheats or all women just because you got burnt in one relationship don't judge a whole sex based on that.

I work in what was a very male dominated industry when I started my job 20 years ago and I never had one married guy come on to me, but lots of single men have been very sleazy over the years.

I will always trust the partner I have 100% because you can't live your life well I got burnt before so what if it happens again. I wouldn't want to live my life like that.

When married of course you are still attracted to people and there's nothing wrong with that, but to me if you are happy and in love with & respect your partner you exercise self control. In all my years I have never cheated on anybody because I have always had respect for my partners. I know of both married men and women that have cheated and they feel no guilt whatsoever.

I wish I knew the 'answer' - but the only good one is to eradicate patriarchal entitlement!

In my first marriage I was commendably (I think) laid back about H's infidelities. He was often in situations where it was on a plate - horrid expression; a woman is not a canapé - and would tell me if I asked. Mostly, I didn't: it was upsetting.

Then he started being nastier to me, doing the sleeping on the edge of the bed and all that, and finally revealed he was in love with his goddamn secretary of all the clichés.

In marriage #2, I took the zero-tolerance position, but that merely made me look an idiot. It was blatantly obvious he was screwing around (we worked in the same industry and gossip filtered back.) He wasn't a nice man and made a huge deal of the "trust" issue. The marriage didn't last long.

Throughout my sexually active life, I went for a full STD screen every year. This makes people go and caused a few relationship problems re "trust", but what are you gonna do? Risk pelvic inflammatory disease or worse for the sake of a "trust" you can't trust?

Not all men are cheats or all women

I fully agree :) But, short of keeping a detective on retainer, how do you know?

i know steak.

i suppose you might never really know if you have a situation where say one partner is away with work at say a corporate hospitality event where loads of staff from different companies also attend and has a ONS with a random just because they can and the other partner has absolutely no contacts or links with their work/work colleagues so would never be told.

this is my paranoid mind as my dh only really goes to pub with his mate or mates who live beside us and knock our door for him and to work.

Depressing reading indeed.
All you can ever do is trust 100% but the the saying (which applies to so many different aspects of life) still holds true

'Never say never'

Agree with
'Never say Never'
A friend of mine who is married to a wonderful man has been cheating with a work colleague. The irony is that she is happily married and loves her dh.

Agree with 'Never say Never'. I often wonder whether the posters who categorically state how much their husband really loves them (to the moon and back and more), actually believe that he would never cheat on them? A unshakeable faith in your partner is not some kind of anti-cheating talisman.

People who want to cheat will always find a way to cheat and I reckon that most affairs are not discovered. We only ever become aware of the ones that are...