Going out of my mind, husband leaving/left/thinking/pissing about PART 2

[garlicbreathing]

Follow on to my first thread about the lead up to the leaving, to the conversation to the aftermath. And it's a big aftermath.

First Part here- www.mumsnet.com/Talk/relationships/2622798-Im-about-to-lose-my-mind-here-I-think-DH-is-going-to-leave-me-tonight

Am I the only one who see's the 'wash your hands' thing as an intentional dig and personal insult. OP has gone from shock to anger, these outbursts are to be expected especially as they're living together!
Garlic next time he knocks on your door ignore it! These confrontations are only making things worse and, more importantly, slowing your recovery! Keep interactions to a bare minimum. Stop asking questions because it's not making you feel better is it?

Get one of those "Please wash your hands" signs for the back of the bathroom door. That's really unpleasant.

Ok, I will reword it, you can have a say, but you can't make him do anything in respect of his own hygiene, ie. tell him to go and wash his hands.

I think in shared space one party has every right to comment on the lack of personal hygiene of the other, especially when it comes to potentially spreading germs and fecal matter. At 30-something, that fact he didn't wash his hands after using the bathroom is just lazy at best, and disrespectful to the person you live with too.

rockabilly I think it's inevitable that there are going to be jibes and digs at each other for a while, at least.
The OPs H may have 'not washed his hands' to make a point, and the OP reacted to that with a point of her own.

When I separated, my counsellor referred to "hooks" that me and ex would each throw at each other - things we used to hurt each other, or draw the other into conflict. Because we knew each other so well, we both knew what would work best to "hook" the other.

It was really helpful to recognise that - both being able to see if what ex was saying to me was a "hook", but also recognising when I'd done it to him, too.

Divorce is an adversarial process - it's incredibly hard to avoid the dynamic that places you and your spouse on opposite "sides". Psychologically, counselling helped me reflect on how I was responding to that and recognising when the adversarial environment was influencing my behaviour.

TBH, the hands being clammy, having a 'weird' poo, feeling dizzy are all physical signs of very high stress. So I would gather that the discussion made him feel very uneasy.
It could be because he hates confrontation and let's be honest, the situation must be stressful for him too.
It could be because what he said to his parents is quite different from the reality/what you told your mum so them meeting up might not go down so well!

I agree with some PP re the washing his hands. You might have been able to mention it when you were together but now, it does look controlling and a 'I know better than you' attitude.
Besides, if he hasn't washed his hands now, I suspect he hasn't washed his hands when you were together either.

I was just about to say the same thing the weird poo was probably anxiety. He is not handling this very well and isn't going as smoothly as he initially thought it was going to. He has made this life changing announcement without really having any valid reasons to back it up. Trying to keep an open mind but still wouldn't be surprised if he is hiding something.

Garlic, I don't see you being controlling I see you as a pro active person, you probably have lead most of what has needed to get done but because it's probably the only way anything ever happens. But you haven't lead anything that wasn't agreed or his suggestion in the first place, certainly not on the major stuff anyway.

Honestly, I don't think he can think of any other excuse to end the marriage.

Have you told your Mum what has been said?

Have you decided to keep the main bedroom? I think you should reconsider that. Allow him the main bedroom and the en suite, then you won't have to even know about his disgusting personal hygiene (or lack thereof) habits.

Also, when I had lodgers in my home, I did have to put up not-very-subtle notices around the place re. peeing on seats etc. (nearly all my lodgers were male, and a couple were barely house-trained, it seemed ) so since you're now in a "flat-share" situation, it's something to consider, if things get too out of hand.

I admire how well you've been coping, I really do. But I wouldn't ask someone if they've washed their hands, I'd say 'let's continue this conversation another day' probably. I wouldn't say you seem controlling, maybe bossy but so am I! He has surely known that for a good few years??? He probably is finding it difficult too, he's been with you a long time, it will require adjustment for both of you. Maybe he thought he'd get to keep the flat and hardly see you. Which is obviously not fair, it's both of your two's flat, you both have every right to be there too. Hopefully things will work out okay soon and you'll be able to live civilised and without too much conflict until something is sorted living wise for one of you or both of you. I'd tell him from now on you don't need to know about his poo, or anything personal for that matter! As for your mum and his mum, maybe his mum sees it as wanting to plot to get you back together? Her son comes first and she'll be checking he's okay first, she may get in touch with you at a later date, maybe not. But I can see while things are still so raw and nothing is yet sorted properly why she would feel uncomfortable and I do think that for now your mum should possibly respect that. X

And also sorry it's one big paragraph, my phone doesn't work too well! X

You've handled this with so much dignity Garlic. He sounds like a complete prick who won't know what he's lost until you are happily ensconced in a new relationship whilst he'll be playing the field but being without the true affection that someone like you will find.

Be prepared to be bowled over by different emotions in the weeks to come though. Anger, grief etc, they'll all hit at some point.

Trying to keep an open mind but still wouldn't be surprised if he is hiding something.

Yes, I agree.

He's asking to be 'mummied' though, isn't he? Telling you he felt 'faint and dizzy' and then had an upset stomach? If that happened to me, at, say, a friend's house, I'd just make my apologies, go home and have a lie down, not describe the symptoms!

Sorry garlic but he's sounding more and more like a man-child. I was married to one and had very similar treatment when he left. He wanted to 'stay friends' (because all his had abandoned him) and kept phoning to ask me to go to the pictures with him, or what should he do about a bill? I so desperately wanted to stay friends (and for him to come back - was I mad??) that I kept up the 'friends' thing for a few weeks, until it dawned on me that he was using me as a substitute friend and thus stopping me from moving on.

Beware the knocks on the door asking your opinion on things, telling you things (like the mum-to-mum phone call) that he should be sorting out. He's leaning on you. But as soon as he has his feet under him, he'll be off and running, so don't read anything into it (like that he's regretting his decision). Separate. Detach. Leave him to it.

He's asking to be 'mummied' though, isn't he? Telling you he felt 'faint and dizzy' and then had an upset stomach?

Completely disagree. Stating you are ill or telling someone you are ill does not equal 'want to be mummied'.

If the dizziness and sickness comes on suddenly, in the middle of a difficult conversation where he is being asked to rationalise his behaviour and is struggling to answer, and then disappears once the difficult conversation is over, then I think OP can confidently feel it was a load of BS!

Whether it's wanting to be mummied or not (more likely it was simple diversion and sympathy seeking), it's clearly a load of shit. Yes perhaps there is a chance it's genuine and has been brought on by the stress he is also under, but he has NOT behaved well and is now blaming OP for the fact he was too gutless to do this years ago. Personally I wouldn't give a shit if he expired right in front of me.

But it wasn't BS was it? OP herself said she heard him have a "weird poo". And any normal human being, if suddenly feeling ill during a conversation would voice that, wouldn't they?

And why should he being asked to rationalise his behaviour now? They are separated. He doesn't have to answer to OP. Much the same as she doesn't have to answer to him so if he approaches her again, she should ask him to leave her alone.

There's a difference though isn't there for different situations or with different people. At work with colleagues or with an acquaintance or not close friend you'd probably say you felt ill and we're going home/ for a lie down. At home with a spouse or your own parents or with a very close friend or sibling you'd be more likely to say exactly what your symptoms were and want them to look after you a bit. It shows more that he still has OP in the "DW should look after me" box rather than the "we're not together because I don't want her so we're just flatmates" box

Well a lot of people will have the runs, sweaty palms and be light headed just before doing a presentation in front of 100 people (esp if it's that important for them).
Sating that their physical symptoms are just BS doesn't sit well with me.
Nor does it sit well when talking about the OP's H.

It does demonstrate though that it's not as plain sailing as he makes it to be and that he might have something to hide, eg that he squarely out all the responsibility of her shoulders when he spoke to his parents and that his ';lies' would be exposed if her mum speaks to his mum.
Or it might be thjat his mum is just as 'involved' as her mum and he is dreading that too.
Or a millions of other possibilities.

It doesn't mean that he behaved well and is the victim or whatever either. You can be a*hole and be stressed out by the situation you created!

And it's all very well laying it all on the husband, but without even meaning too, the OP has shown traits of her personality that a lot of PPs see as controlling. If the husband doesn't like conflict then it's not unreasonable to think that he's backed away from voicing his concerns re the wedding in the run up, particularly as he thought it might have just been cold feet.

At least he has done it before they had kids.

She was just asking him to explain the controlling thing, I think. It's been cited as a reason for the ending of the marriage; she is entitled to ask him to explain that before it becomes set in stone (because that's what he will be telling people). And he approached her last night, and brought up the controlling thing himself (but saying it about her family as well as her, or certainly implying it with the mum thing). So it was perfectly appropriate for her to ask him to elaborate. Is she supposed to just sit there and nod?

(That said, I agree OP should tell her mum to stay out of it and that she should not engage in any more conversation with him).

On the poo, a bit of a runny shit isn't necessarily 'ill' IMO. And the timing was immensely convenient. How does he appear to be feeling today OP? Absolutely fine is my bet.

I don't necessarily agree petals. I imagine if he'd have just said "I don't feel well, I'm going for a sit down" people would have found fault with that. Calling him out on BS and asking I he said what was wrong. Conversely if he hadn't have said anything and left the conversation because he felt poorly, then he would've been labelled rude and a sh**bag. The husband couldn't have done right in that situation as far as a lot of people are concerned.

It was unnecessary to have him include so much detail,
I do have the main bedroom, it is working out well, it is the better bedroom. He uses the toilet in the main bathroom, but the shower in the ensuite. He went to the main bathroom yesterday for his weird poo,but as he didn't close the door I heard it. His symptoms weren't made up, but I do agree there is a lot of stress involved. I had this all last week. If he doesn't bring up our conversation again, then I don't think I will. I suspect he won't bring it up, why would he, he doesn't want to have the conversation.

dilys that's why I suggested if he approaches her she should tell him to leave her alone. Neither of them has to answer to the other now, it's only going to cause more conflict.

offside, if he felt ill, why approach OP in the first place? He knocked on her door and it seems they had a shortish conversation where he accused her family as well as her of being 'controlling.'

Then when she turned the tables and said 'how?' And by the way, 'how am I controlling?' he came over all queer.

If he had kept himself to himself and stayed away feeling ill, none of it would have happened.

Maybe it came on all sudden like but my H used to do this kind of thing and could conjure up some pretty convincing physical symptoms to go with it. It depended really on how happy he was and how his affair was going. I didn't know this at the time.

Anyway, I am investing too much into the particulars of this poo exchange I think! Just had an abscess removed from my neck in hospital and just sat around bored! Might belt up now X

It was strange. But I'm not going to think too much into it. I believe I perhaps did come across as controlling when I asking him to wash his hands. I thought I did put it across as more caring, I didn't snap at him, I asked him to please consider that he is living with me and that's just basic hygiene standards.
Hope your feeling okay dilys