At breaking point with my wife

[JamesTiberiusKirk]

This weekend was a culmination of fractures that have left me feeling that my marriage is in serious danger.

Firstly, it was our daughter’s birthday weekend, with a children’s party on Saturday, and a family gathering at our house on the Sunday. For the Sunday, my wife had promised my daughter a multi-tiered rainbow cake, not an easy endeavor to bake, and unfortunately it went wrong. I tried to reassure her that we could get a nice replacement (which I went out and bought) and that it was fine – baking something ambitious for the first time is always open to trouble, and I tried to make her feel better. The cake and hand mixer were violently dumped in the bin, and she proceeded to treat me like crap for the rest of the day – accusing me of not tidying / cleaning fast enough (I cleaned and tidied the entire house before our guests arrived.) and generally being really vile.

Secondly, it was, of course, mothering Sunday. I had bought cards over a week ago, and had planned to go into town on the Saturday afternoon to pick up some gifts. The plan changed slightly so I could go to Cribbs Causeway in Bristol. This was to get sandwich platters from the Marks and Spencer’s there, as well as to give me a better selection of shops to get her something from. She raised no objections to any of this on the Saturday. I got her a box of Chocolates from Hotel Chocolat, a bunch of blood-orange roses and a voucher to a beauty store that she likes a lot. I felt that was a nice package for her. I took the kids downstairs early on Sunday morning, so she could have a 3 hour lie-in. We all came up as a family to give her the gifts later on while she was in bed, and she seemed happy with everything. It was only later in the evening that she complained about what I had done. She said that the whole thing had been an afterthought, and then, most painfully, said that she felt I was buying her chocolates to sabotage her weight-loss efforts (she recently started dieting in advance of her friend’s wedding later this year). Suffice to say, that was not on my mind when I bought the chocolates.

This is not new behavior, having happened a number of time previously. The point of friction leads to days of silent treatment punctured by mono-syllabic responses. I find it all incredibly stressful and I end up just feeling very lonely. My wife struggles to talk about emotional issues like this, and it usually veers between silence or outbursts. We have talked about how unhappy I am with this before and either she promises to change, or she minimizes the issue, which makes me look unreasonable. I don’t want to be having the same conversation for the rest of my life. I feel like a punching bag and I am sick of it.

I am, of course, a long way from perfect. I have found the increased demands of two children hard to handle at times, and I get frustrated a lot and can be short-tempered. I am also significantly over-weight, as is my wife, and I think this is a major drag-factor on our general happiness. All that said, I don’t think (and have never been accused) of allowing this to devolve into cruel or abusive (emotionally) behavior, and this is where I feel we are now. When these kind of situations arise she behaves like a bully.

There is no pull-factor at play here, no other person I have an eye on. It is a non-factor here.

Am I being massively unreasonable here in my expectations of how a couple should work and communicate together? Are these Mother’s Day presents unacceptable?

Did you say she just went back to work full time after maternity leave? That is a big deal and she's likely to be stressed about child care, the effect of her not being around on your DCs, getting back into her job, her weight, the state of her relationship and probably a dozen other things. That's not to excuse her behaviour entirely but cut her some slack and be super supportive for a while. But above all, try and talk about it.

On the basis of the two things mentioned in your op I can sort of see where you dw was coming from. Buying chocolates for someone actively trying to lose weight could easily be seen as insensitive. "Baking something ambitious for the first time is always open to trouble" could be see as "I told you so". These could be the straw, with the return to work, two small children and PIL staying being the camel. Have you asked her specifically about why she reacted so badly?

I agree with this:

It sounds to me that she feels inadequate very frequently, and that when this happens, she vents it at you. The baking fail, eating all the chocolates - both seem to be triggers for outbursts that displace her anger and frustration at herself onto others. Rather than being spoiled and ungenerous, I would suggest the possibility that she's actually feeling terrible about herself.

Also if she just asked for a lie in she might be absolutely exhausted. This can lead to foul temper.

TBH I was a bit put out (but didn't show it) when my OH let me do the 5.30am early morning toddler thing on mother's day, then passed me some chocolates as if that was brilliant especially as he built it up a bit about my big surprise, TBH he would probably see me as hugely ungrateful when actually I'd far rather have had no present and the lie in.

NickyEds my thoughts exactly.

I don't think there's much communication and as I read it, albeit I might be projecting but I could SEE the 'I told you so, I'm saving the day' irritation possibility.
It would be interesting to hear both sides.

I think that buying the gifts the day before when you could well have run out of time due to getting things for the birthday gathering does seem to me like they were an afterthought.
It seems to me like after the first week back at work having people to stay was too much for her.

Your wife sounds very unhappy tbh and you sound keen to present yourself as the husband who has done everything possible and yet she is still unreasonable. Doesn't mean she isn't overreacting and taking her unhappiness out on you, but I'm sure this is deeper than you got her a predictable Mother's Day present and a cake went wrong.

If she's just gone back to work, she is possibly feeling guilty about leaving the baby in childcare, is knackered and is putting lots of pressure on herself to still be a perfect mother - hence the cake strop. She may also be down that you got her very traditional Mothers Day gifts rather than something she might want more and is less mumsy.

Is it your parents who are staying at the mo? If so, did your DW have any say in that? I'm sure having extra people around at is time isn't helping either.

My mother can be nasty to my father and give him the silent treatment for no other reason than she can be just plain nasty.
My father doesn't put a foot wrong. He really doesn't. That wasn't a very nice thing to imply sally that he was ducking out.
Newsflash...women are just as capable of shitty behaviour as men

NickyEds: I haven't had a chance to talk much as I don't really want to have that conversation while my parents are in the next room.

I totally recognise that the last week or two has been very busy and very stressful for her. Some of that, such as the return to work, is borne mostly by her, but a lot of it, such as the birthday parties, childcare etc is split equally between us. My wife does not have the majority of the childcare - we split it 50:50.

I try to be as understanding and supportive as I can - for the last week, whenever one of the kids is up in the night (which right now is every night) I have been doing all the put-downs so she can sleep. But I am not perfect, and I imagine there is always more I can do.

she is unhappy and angry for sure, and her behaviour is unacceptable. your gifts sound kind, and you made an effort

so YANBU and it sounds to me like you need to have a talk and let her know behaviour is NOT acceptable, and it cant continue- needs nipping in the bud. I also think her cake behaviour was OTT (and |I do sympathise)

maybe offer her some time to herself, say you are clearly stressed and get her to fuck for a bit and have some "thinking time"- make it very clear you want her to get some headspace and stop ruining weekends with her anger

but yeah unhappy or not, she is being a bitch

and as for:
I think the gifts sound dull and very stereotypical. Flowers, chocolates, beauty products
critical MUCH. jesus

I feel for you. It sounds to me as though your wife may be struggling and lashing out at you.

It's worth noting as well that anger and silence don't always mean emotional abuse.
I have been in abusive situations where they were my only outlet - the other person did-did-did, talked-talked-talked, gifted-gifted-gifted and utterly brainwashed and smothered.
Now I'm not saying that is happening here, what I'm saying is there are a few people including the OP who are jumping up at what sounds like an exhausted, depressed woman under pressure and decrying her as an abuser.

I think it's a breakdown in communication.
I think she feels ignored and powerless (e.g. if the present was clearly last minute, that would have stung. That's not being a 'princess' - under her circumstances, and established 2 parent family with a regular income - a thoughtful gift at this particular time might be reasonable to expect. She over reacted.). All the help in the world won't make someone feel better unless they feel listened to ... and writing her off as abusive, rude and a princess- on a forum might hint that she isn't the only "blamer" here.
Both are doing the same to each other - blaming and suspecting.

I don't think criticising your choice of mother's day treats is the point really. You both sound stressed out and maybe depressed. Not uncommon for parents of small children, but if you can't talk about it, you're doomed IMO. I'd be suggesting you went to counselling - jointly or separately.

You can't be understanding if you don't know what it is you're meant to be understanding.

The thing that jumps out at me from your posts OP is that you have a 9 month old. That was definitely the worst time for me with both my dc. Add into the mix parties, inlaws, going back to work full time..... I know you said this isn't the only time it's happened but that's a full on week right there.

I'll tell you how i felt during the 9 month phase. My DH didn't seem to get how much everything had to change and how full on/full time the whole childcare/housework stuff was. He'd do something like the dishes then couldn't understand why i was still upset that the place was a mess, we need bottles sterilising, a wash needed doing...yadda yadda yadda.

Part of it was that i was at home so had to live in the house and having everything just right made looking after a 9 month old bareable. I'm not saying you don't do your bit but you and your wife will have different perspectives on it i think.

This doesn't excuse how you're being treated but trying to see through the other person's eyes might help 'the talk' be more productive and less accusatory?

I'd also recommend making time for yourselves if possible....can you organise childcare for a night out together even if it's just a couple of drinks locally or something? You both need time out from the home i think.

I wonder if you are both unhappy. Communication - after the in-laws have gone and in a more peaceful moment - is the main thing. It sounds as though there were far too many expectations for the w/e and that she put a lot of pressure on herself trying to get it 'right' - and unfairly took it out on you when it went wrong.
You need to find out, as gently as possible, how unhappy she is. You sound like a caring man who deserves consideration too. Could you perhaps work on weight-loss together?

I imagine if this was written by a woman talking about her DH on Father's Day everyone would be like 'LTB'. Throwing a tantrum about her presents (which sounds very generous to me!), throwing out the handmixer, the silent treatment and stroppiness etc - and the fact that this sounds like relatively common behaviour to me smacks of emotional abuse/bullying.

I think the gifts you bought were lovely and thoughtful. Even the chocolates were fine imo, even when you are on a diet you can have a treat - she could've shared the rest out amongst what sounds like a large number of guests visiting that day.

If the underlying cause of her 'issues' is pnd or being overwhelmed at life in general (totally understandable in her circs) she still has a responsibility to herself and others to do something about it. I don't think she can use these as excuses for her behaviour, and I don't think the OP should put up with it.

Definitely sit her down and have a chat with her about how her behaviour makes you feel and the long term repercussions it will have on your relationship if she doesn't sort it out. You will then have stated your position clearly and then the ball will be in her court to sort out her problems.

I do think the OP has had a hard time about the presents - a 3 hour lie in, an offer of breakfast in bed, posh chocs, a beauty voucher and flowers is stuff that only some of us can dream of! What a bunch of princesses!

But Mothers Day is not Christmas. Or a wedding. It requires a nice little gift - a token of your esteem for your mother. Flowers if she likes them. Or chocolates if she likes them. Or a handmade squiggle from your children and cup of tea and a lie in. It's not something to plan weeks in advance and a requirement to get the most original, least traditional, most spontaneous yet thoughtful gift ever.

It's really depressing - this relentless Facebooky one-upmanship of every single day in the calendar. New Year, Valentines Day, Pancake Day, Mothers Day, Halloween, blah blah blah. Every one has to be more personal, more imaginative, more thoughtful and impressive than the last. It's not the route to happiness. If OP's wife has bought into that idea then that's part of the problem.

Sorry for derail but it just struck me that it's really a shame that this amount of effort and expense can be taken as in any way an explanation for this behaviour.

I agree that OP's wife might be overwhelmed and unhappy for other reasons. But if she genuinely is unhappy with her present haul ....well, it's not a good look.

Squizita:

I tried to minimise the cake issue, in an attempt to make her feel better, but I don't think that helped. There wasn't any "told you so", and certainly not any "saved the day" gloating - I managed to find a decent substitute purely through luck rather than anything else...

Hiccupgirl:

I have tried to do everything I can to help support her this week, but I have already made it clear that I am far from perfect - I am not trying present a saintly image - I am a long way from that.

Your post, at 15:23, second para. You need to say that to her.

I am not trying present a saintly image - I am a long way from that.

The problem is that while you say this, your OP makes you sound saintly. So ... well ... lots of us feel you're not telling the whole story.
People don't just get that angry for nothing.
Have you really no idea why she feels such seething resentment? Has she had any major set backs career wise for kids, or something that would make her feel that you would do something like sabotage a diet? It cannot just appear from nowhere.
I'm not saying anything deliberate on your part - but some clue...

OP you made an effort. Don't beat yourself up about that.

Sounds like she's got problems (anger, depression, self-esteem etc) and takes them out on you. Its emotional abuse.

I can't help but think if the roles were reversed there would be a lot of LTB on here?

And as for the chocolates issue that quite a few posters seem to be latching onto...seriously. If you are running around, trying to resolve the cake issue and living in fear of Mt Etna erupting again, you picked up chocs. Big effin deal. She threw a mixer in the bin. Honestly, why do people expect men to be mind readers when it comes to mother's day gifts? Its not as if the shops are full of variety and inspiration.

It seems like quite a volatile household and that's no good for any of you, children included. You need to get help, counselling and it can get better, but it needs a big mind shift from her. It sounds like you are a caring husband and want to help, that's great and you were honest enough to admit that you don't know enough about PND to comment.

Speaking from personal experience, I tried to be Mrs Perfect and failed spectacularly, made the household miserable and ended up on anti-depressants and had counselling. I realised the problem was me, not everyone else. DS has not yet had a home made birthday cake (that's what Tesco is for). I might never fit into my size 14 jeans ever again and my floors might only be steam cleaned once a week (I will not mention the oven). But I have learned that actually, as long as we are all ok, we all make it to the end of the day and everyone is much happier, then that's ok for me.

squizita do you say that to the women who post about their unreasonable husbands and their angry outbursts? "You must do something to make this happen. Are you actually really annoying?"

We never hear both sides of the story on MN but unless obviously misleading we normally take the OP at their word.

She sounds depressed, because I've been similar to that when depressed - snappy, critical and disappointed. I can tell depression is getting worse when I'm more angry but recognising this has stopped me acting on it, particularly with DH. It took a while to admit I had depression and put two and two together. I'm more likely to withdraw now, not amazingly healthy but less destructive to my marriage. Counselling really helps, individual rather than couples. Honest and open communication is very important but you can force her to communicate.

Right now life is really hard, two kids and juggling work, housework, social commitments and a marriage, something has to give and it's OK to put the marriage on the back burner sometimes, take the pressure off and understand you'll both stick around knowing it will get better - and if you get through this bad patch it will make the next one easier to ride out because you know it's worth it. It's not ok for her to be like this but you owe it to her to put up a bit of a fight to get back on track before giving up. But ultimately it's for her to act on this and for you to stand besides her as a team mate - losing weight together could be a great bonding experience, a project to work on and achieve something as a team. So go ask if she'd like to find a local counsellor, or try the NHS if money is tight, and tell her you want her to be happy and you will be there as her partner. Give it time and if it doesn't change you can leave knowing you tried.

Husbands/wives commonly take out their anger/exhaustion/frustration out on each other - it's a safe, place to do so - the problem occurs when they are stuck in a repeating pattern and not resolving anything.

OP there is a lot of very identifying detail in your OP. Does your DW use MN?

Presumably you didn't marry a bitch so how she's behaving isn't how she used to be.

I'd raise her behaviour at the weekend and stress how it's unlike her so you can see she's struggling to cope with the changes and how understandable that is. That you just want to support her to get back to feeling happier again.

I'd raise the point of the chocolates and say that you were very hurt at the implication that you were trying to sabotage her and ask if she meant it? That whatever she thinks, you just want her and the kids to be happy but that whatever happens in future, you will not stand for that in future.

Then acknowledge that you can see she's struggling atm and suggest that you both simplify your lives for a while to take the pressure off.

You could get a cleaner in for 1.5 hours a week and suggest that one day of every weekend you have quality family time where you can all enjoy being together.

Come up with a few ideas to take the pressure off, ask her to have a think and that you should both discuss in a few days the changes that could be made to make life happier.